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View Full Version : Why Not FRUCTOSE In Carb-up Meal.. ?



MonStar1023
03-05-2002, 08:29 PM
I was curious as to why fructose wouldnt be a good choice for a carb-up meal? I mean fructose refills liver glycogen am I correct? Wouldnt it be best to refill muscle AND liver glycogen or no?

:confused::confused:

Cackerot69
03-05-2002, 08:51 PM
Nope. It *preferentially* fills liver glyco.

the doc
03-05-2002, 08:52 PM
:withstupi

MonStar1023
03-05-2002, 08:53 PM
:confused::confused:

... What does that mean in English? I am totally lost here sorry guys.

Cackerot69
03-05-2002, 08:55 PM
If you eat some fructose, and glucose is needed in both your muscles and liver (even if your muscles need it more) that glucose is going to your liver...leaving your poor muscles deprived.

MonStar1023
03-05-2002, 08:57 PM
So I guess this is why its best to simple and starchy carbs during a carb-up and avoid fructose? Also how BAD is fat really in a carb-up meal. I eat 2 carb-up meals back to back every few days and together they total around 30g of fat.

:cool::cool:

Cackerot69
03-05-2002, 09:00 PM
Ya, stick with glucose based carbs.

15g of fat in each is a lot....I'd go with more like 5g or less in a carb loaded meal.

MonStar1023
03-05-2002, 09:04 PM
Cackerot69-
Really? Damn bro thats REALLY hard though. I mean the littlest things in the world have a gram or 2 of fat. Like 2 oz. of pasta, etc.

:eek::eek:

Qea
03-05-2002, 09:24 PM
Originally posted by Cackerot69
Nope. It *preferentially* fills liver glyco.

meaning if liver glycogen stores are full, it goes to your muscle glycogen stores?

out of curiosity, how much would that upper limit for liver glycogen be anyways?

Cackerot69
03-05-2002, 09:25 PM
Meaning if liver glyco is full, it goes to fat and maybe a small % goes to muscle.

The liver can hold approx 75-100g of glucose.

Qea
03-05-2002, 09:47 PM
ah

Par Deus
03-06-2002, 12:13 PM
You do not need or want to avoid it entirely, just do not overdo it (keep it to 50-100 grams per day, depending on size and activity level).

Wizard
03-06-2002, 12:20 PM
Right. If you perform many anaerobic activities, your intake can easily be greater than 50 grams.

Blood&Iron
03-06-2002, 12:44 PM
Originally posted by Par Deus
You do not need or want to avoid it entirely, just do not overdo it (keep it to 50-100 grams per day, depending on size and activity level).
I'm trying to figure out if you're referring to fat or fructose. I would assume fat, 'cause I can't imagine how one would end up eating 100g of fructose unless you just bought it in crystalline form. Although, sucrose is roughly 50% fructose so I guess you could get that much if you ate a ton of sugar.

As to pro/cons of fructose I refer, as is my custom, to Saint Lyle of Leptin:



> What you just said seem to imply that one should avoid >fructose if noting else , but because of poor insulin raise that it >creates.

Yes and no. Fructose is still important in the overall picture, that is refilling liver glycogen will make you more overall anabolic during the refeed, although it won't contribute taht directly to the leptin aspect of it. But, refiling liver glycogen ensures that other dietary carbs go into the bloodstream to do their insulin jacking up/leptin upregulating magic.

So, its more accurate to say that a refeed of ONLY fructose would suck. The combination of fructose, sucrose, glucose and whatever other high GI **** you could throw in there would be muy excellente, senor. Luis se gusta candy.

Par Deus
03-06-2002, 11:16 PM
I agree with him.

There is also an in vitro study that suggests it might increase substrates going through the hexosamine pathway (which stimulates leptin) -- either by providing them itself or shifting glucose metabolism in that direction.

So, nothing wrong at all with getting some fructose.

MonStar1023
03-07-2002, 05:15 AM
Par Deus-
Are you saying that fructose (in the fruit or juice form?) would be beneficial in the carb-up meal.

:cool::cool:

MonStar1023
03-07-2002, 06:47 AM
I still dont understand. Is fructose beneficial!? In a carb-up meal? What form?

:help::help:

Wizard
03-07-2002, 07:09 AM
Huh? What form????

Try to avoid fructose when you carb up. Avoid fructose and fat and focus on glucose. That's simple.

Podium Kreatin
03-07-2002, 07:13 AM
insulin is fructose-independent, so fructose is strictly for energy; it will not get u fat or bulk u up, or become glycogen (not really sure on th glyco, but im sure on the previous 2). hope this helps

Wizard
03-07-2002, 07:23 AM
it will not get you fat if your liver is not full of glycogen as it fills liver glycogen stores,only...

irish mike
03-07-2002, 08:05 AM
the livers stores of glycogen are used to supply sugar for your blood so wouldnt it eventually make its way into your muscles.it could get used for energy but with NHE it would be eaten later in the day so at night it would be slowly released to stabilize blood sugar,right?im not claiming to know it justs sounds logical

syntekz
03-07-2002, 08:53 AM
We've got two contradicting opinions. Will glucose fill up liver glycogen stores?

Par Deus
03-07-2002, 09:43 AM
Glucose will eventually fill up liver glycogen (after it has filled mucle glycogen).

I think a small amount of fructose is beneficial for carb-up meals/refeeds. Take 50-100g of fructose, use half of it in your first one or two carb-up meals, then divide the rest equally among your remaining meals.

Cackerot69
03-07-2002, 11:48 AM
I agree with cack.

MonStar1023
03-07-2002, 12:15 PM
Par Deus-
Okay bro thanks Ill try that. Maybe 25g fructose per carb-up meal. See how things go.

:cool::cool:

MonStar1023
03-07-2002, 02:02 PM
Par Deus-
I am wondering bro in what way would 25-35g of fructose be beneficial? And also what form would you recommend? Actual fruit or pure fruit juice or does it matter?

:cool::cool:

body
03-07-2002, 02:55 PM
i would not take 25-35 grams of fructose.
there are better choice as cack said.
you would have to drink like a litre of orange juice to get 35 grams of frucotse.

MonStar1023
03-07-2002, 06:07 PM
body-
A liter of orange juice to get 35g of fructose? I think you must be confused bro my orange juice is 28g fructose for every 8 oz. Also according to Par Deus fructose (fruit) is beneficial in a carb-up. Not in huge quantities though.

:cool::cool:

Blood&Iron
03-07-2002, 09:00 PM
Originally posted by MonStar1023
body-
A liter of orange juice to get 35g of fructose? I think you must be confused bro my orange juice is 28g fructose for every 8 oz. Also according to Par Deus fructose (fruit) is beneficial in a carb-up. Not in huge quantities though.

:cool::cool:
The sugar in fruit is not pure fructose. It is partially glucose as well. Hence my previous comments about 100g of fructose being a sh*tload. You'd have to eat an ungodly amount of fruit to get that much. You *can* buy crystalline fructose at regular grocery stores as an alternative sweetener. Sucrose is roughly 50% fructose as well, so that's probably the easiest solution. Eat a bunch of sugary/high-fructose corn syrup sweetened stuff.

Par Deus
03-07-2002, 09:18 PM
Eat some kids cereal. I am having Oreo cereal which now comes with marshmellows, and it is about the best damn thing I have ever tasted.

body
03-08-2002, 11:52 AM
Originally posted by MonStar1023
body-
A liter of orange juice to get 35g of fructose? I think you must be confused bro my orange juice is 28g fructose for every 8 oz. Also according to Par Deus fructose (fruit) is beneficial in a carb-up. Not in huge quantities though.

:cool::cool:

i have no idea how liquid 8 oz is in litres?

But fructose make up like 1/3 of the carb content of oranges.(does vary on season and orange)
so you would probably have to drink 3 times that to get 28 grams of fructose.

Podium Kreatin
03-08-2002, 05:25 PM
what do u mean by "carbup"? is that teh same as bulking, or carb-loading? if it is, then fructose is not good, b/c it has no effect on those two.
im not sure how well fructose becomes glycogen, but i am sure that fructose converts to usable energy very quickly, and is not stored much b/c it is used up very quickly

Blood&Iron
03-08-2002, 05:44 PM
Originally posted by Par Deus
Eat some kids cereal. I am having Oreo cereal which now comes with marshmellows, and it is about the best damn thing I have ever tasted.
Dood, it can't possibly be better than Count Chocula.

the doc
03-08-2002, 07:32 PM
or life

body
03-09-2002, 03:37 AM
doc- thats highly rated product, or your life is very poor!

the doc
03-09-2002, 10:25 AM
he he

Life cereal is really yummy and i'm sure its a high GI food