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View Full Version : is a 405lb bp respectable in powerlifing for a 250lb'er?



Sumorai
10-07-2007, 09:57 PM
Sumorai has been thinking...(and doing, for that matter)

but Sumorai has been thinking a bit about his goals. His strength goals, weight loss goals, and general "physical achievement" goals. Sumorai thinks the weight he would like to drop down to eventually is 250lbs(from over 320lbs). He knows this will be difficult, but he believes strongly that it is possible. He has been really thinking about his strength goals at this weight. Sumorai would like to be able to bench 405lbs(1RM). Sumorai has some questions though about his goals and how realistic they are. First of all:

1. Is it an unrealistic thought for someone who is 6'4" with a 77.5" wingspan, and at 250lbs to be able to bench 405lbs?

2. If the above is a realistic goal, would a 405lb bench be non-laughable for a 250lb'er in a small time powerlifting competition?
Sumorai would imagine many 250lb powerlifters would be benching much more, but they most likely have not long arms to contend with.
Sumorai is aware that muscle mass is a significant factor, so for the sake of his exploration, please assume that the muscle mass is fairly close to optimal for a 6'4" 250lb'er with normal, or slightly subnormal genetic potential for developing muscle mass.

Sumorai does not expect to win as a powerlifter. Sumorai just wants to improve and reach Sumorai's full potential. He wants to compete and try, but Sumorai does not expect to win in a weight class. But Sumorai would like to try, and also to improve himself. Sumorai has much work to do, to accomplish his strength and body weight goals and he imagines to reach the above goals, will take several years of hard work. Sumorai is trying to set realistic goals, that he can aspire to and reach for. What does one think of Sumorai's above questions/concerns?
Are his goals realistic? What should Sumorai expect?
Sumorai does not like putting limits on himself nor on others, but Sumorai would like some realistic numbers to aim for. Furthermore, he requests some realistic numbers to expect in regards to squats and dlifts too considering the above factors(6'4", 77.5"wingspan, and @ 250lbs).

Sumorai expresses great gratitude for one's reading and effort with this post, and thanks one for one's patience as Sumorai explores and experiments with a different communication paradigm(third person. he has used this before, but only rarely, and not here. Sumorai does enjoy writing and speaking in third person sometimes and he is considering employing third person more often to obtain more stoic detachment, objectivity, and lucidity in his writing and speech.)

deeder
10-07-2007, 10:06 PM
It's bad enough that you wrote that all in the third person... The fact that you're actually thinking about speaking in the third person scares me.

As for the 405lb bench press. If that were raw then yes, I'd say 405lbs is a pretty respectable bench press for any weight. If you plan on wearing a bench shirt 405lbs at 250 isn't all that impressive...

Sumorai
10-07-2007, 10:17 PM
It's bad enough that you wrote that all in the third person... The fact that you're actually thinking about speaking in the third person scares me.


Referring to oneself in third person is perhaps highly desirable:
Has one considered that perhaps:
It can help one achieve more objective introspection?
(This can be especially helpful when speaking in the context of one's goals an aspirations such as Sumorai is doing in his thread)
It can provide one with a more objective perspective in general?
It can increase one's awareness and lucidity?
These are things that have been considered by Sumorai. Those things are quite desirable, and Sumorai searches for knowledge and suspects that third person references of self may actually be quite beneficial and conducive to reaching those goals.

For when one detaches from the concept of self, one realizes one's True Self, which is in fact, One and can be viewed objectively and consequently then one will subjectively experience Self/Oneness, and this is highly desirable. Sumorai is very spiritual and is always on the lookout for new approaches and methodologies.



As for the 405lb bench press. If that were raw then yes, I'd say 405lbs is a pretty respectable bench press for any weight. If you plan on wearing a bench shirt 405lbs at 250 isn't all that impressive...

Sumorai is glad to have learned of this knowledge you have given him. And yes, Sumorai did mean "unshirted". Sumorai did not really consider shirted weights. What would be a more respectable weight for a shirted 250lb'er?


btw: you did not say whether or not you thought Sumorai's goal was realistic considering the factors(6'4", 77.5" wingspan, possible weight of 250lb's with near optimal muscle mass with normal or even slightly subnormal genetic potential).

SW
10-07-2007, 10:17 PM
But in a PL competition, RAW would def yield some respect, and nobody would down you/whoever anyway.

Sumorai
10-07-2007, 10:20 PM
Your contribution is also appreciated Mr. Hatfield. Do you think Sumorai's strength goal is reasonable considering the aforementioned factors?

Cards
10-07-2007, 10:24 PM
dude serious, i'm going to have to agree with deeder on this one. Talking in third person is weird and scares me aswell.

1mmort4l
10-07-2007, 10:27 PM
Reading that from your 3rd person made my brain hurt!

6'4 250lbs with a bench of 405 raw is respectable IMO.
Good luck.

SW
10-07-2007, 10:34 PM
Your contribution is also appreciated Mr. Hatfield. Do you think Sumorai's strength goal is reasonable considering the aforementioned factors?

Of course I do. With determination, I wouldn't put much past anybody. Sounds to me like if you were able to get to around 250 @ say 20% bodyfat you'd be in great shape to reach that goal with some powerlifting training. Not much to it, but effort and being relentless (or callahaness lol).

Sounds to me like the biggest and first objective is weightloss from your stats though. But a longterm goal like that is respectable and sounds like a plan to me.

Sumorai
10-07-2007, 10:39 PM
hmmm......
since there is strong objection to my use of third person on this thread I will refrain from using it on WBB.(except in the case of PM's if I first ask if they would mind if I spoke in third person before I did so).

but anyway, back to my goals:
Considering consistent work, when can I expect to reach 405?(I ask this, regardless of what my BW is.)

If I had to guess.....five to six years maybe? I will be excited about smaller goals along the way too. For example, I am really hoping to pass the 200lb mark on bench by the end of this year(I am at 185lbs 1RM right now, if that puts things in perspective as to how weak I am and how far I would have to go)

edit:
Thanks Nick. Very encouraging post.

SW
10-07-2007, 10:47 PM
Well, I saw in a post that your wrists hurt badly when benching. IMO, this is due to 2 things: you're not used to it, so mild pain is possible. The other being from the slightly flawed ;) drawing you presented, that your wrists are bent backwards. This is a terrible idea, keep your wrists straight at all times.

As far as a timeline, I honestly have no idea. I don't think anyone does. But I do know you have goals to shoot for. Considering you having no to slight injuries, you could be expected to make serious newbie gains and progress soon. If you work hard, eat right, sleep enough and stay active (100%) on target with your training i.e. not skipping it, giving it all you've got, you should blow 200 out of the water by the end of this month.

redFury
10-07-2007, 10:51 PM
You can definitely hit 405... maybe in less time that you think. Though some of it comes down to genetics, good form and a ton of hard work can get you far. Start with some good intermediate goals and make progress. 200, 225,250, etc... I'm currently on my path for a 300 bench, but I have to get to 280 first. Best of luck man!

Sumorai
10-07-2007, 10:57 PM
Well, I saw in a post that your wrists hurt badly when benching. IMO, this is due to 2 things: you're not used to it, so mild pain is possible. The other being from the slightly flawed ;) drawing you presented, that your wrists are bent backwards. This is a terrible idea, keep your wrists straight at all times.

I appreciate that you remembered my post. But it wasn't my wrists that were hurting. It was like some triceps-tendon-elbow thingy, thing. :) I think the problem there was with me not being slid up far enough on the bench. I need to put something behind it to rest my noggin' on. I have read that the bar should be even with your eyes when you bench. I can definitely see the bar without tilting my head back(I paid attention last time i benched! :D), but the bar is still further back than my eyes. So my arms were definitely not in the right position. I slid up quite a bit and let my head head off then bench by a little bit, and it felt better on my arms. But I seriously need to put something there underneath my head(like a chair or a stool or something with a cushion on it).


If you work hard, eat right,...

I was counting calories for a little bit(not ALL calories though...but most of them, enough to know I was on a substantial defecit :) ) and I was on a caloric defecit. But I have stopped counting calories and worrying about diet for now. I am just thinking about strength gains right now. I am probably still eating below maintenence however. But I just do not think I know enough at this point to really be playing too much with my diet. I mean, I do not even know my exact weight(this is my fault, I will remedy this soon), I do not know my BF% and therefore do not know how much muscle mass I have, how much muscle mass I should put on, whether or not I should put on the muscle I want, and *then* cut as opposed to cutting, and then putting on weight again to gain muscle, and then cut, yet again, let alone do I know how many calories I should be consuming to increase muscle mass, or lose body fat while maintaining the muscle mass that I have. Diet seems to me to be a really complex thing at the moment. I know that I have been eating A LOT of peanut butter sandwhiches lately...and I guess that is good right for protein right?



....you should blow 200 out of the water by the end of this month.

wow, that would be awesome! thanks for the encouragement man!


edit:
Thanks redfury! good post!

smokinHawk
10-08-2007, 07:47 AM
yes please no third person talkings... you arnt bob dole..

anyways not to many people can bench 405 raw, so at a 6'4" frame would defiantly be respectable. NO one at my gym has got it there yet (strict anyways, i have done it not strict), there are even guys there that are 300+lbs around 5'10" that think they are hot stuff, but cant bench more then 380lbs. only one guy in a past gym has gotten 400+ and everyone looked at him like a beast.
in the raw world not to many locals will get 400, and even less at 500 raw.

Sumorai
10-08-2007, 01:51 PM
Thank you for your reply Hawk. I value your opinion.

I need to revise my goals drastically. I should not have focused so much on what is "respectable" but on what is "reasonable" or "possible".

Guido
10-08-2007, 02:38 PM
"Reasonable", "possible", and "respectable" are all very different things. This is why I find it best to evaluate where I am and what are realistic short and long term goals for myself. Some of that is learned through experience, some by comparing to people who are similar to yourself in strength, background, or potential (hardest to gauge). I find that concentrating on myself and my goals in the sport allows me to achieve the most satisfaction in it, and also the most success.