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CleverName
01-03-2008, 01:46 PM
Finally my gym let me record myself! Here's me doing mostly 185lbs.

Sorry about the bad camera angles, but I was trying to do it quickly and couldn't spend too much time getting the best shots... but you can see most of it.

If there are any form recommendations, please share! I'm really trying to get the form down. One thing I notice for sure is my heels aren't always staying on the ground.

Tilt your head for this first one!

135lbs
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185lbs

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ak5rJU6IdeA
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Snatch: 135lbs

Form is TERRIBLE! I really need to work on these.

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JHarris
01-03-2008, 07:56 PM
Here's a few things I see off the bat. I'm just going to deal with the biggest problems as you can only fix so much at once, and further some of the smaller problems might be caused by these bigger problems:

1. Get your shoulders over the bar more and keep the bar closer. Its hard to tell in the video, but it seems like you are letting it get a few inches away from your body right off the floor. It should be literally on top of your body till you jump, and when you jump it should be coming off the tops of your thighs/bottoms of your hips. You are a lot more likely to stay back on your heels if the bar is not pulling you forward.

2. Keep your arms straight until after you jump and shrug. You are bending them way too much and you are arm pulling a great deal. Practice doing clean pulls with a shrug at the top while keeping your arms completely straight. I can't emphasize enough how much you ought to want to break this habit.

3. This goes for the clean, jerk and snatch - keep your head neutral. Pick a spot straight ahead and keep looking at it. Dont let your head bob around or go down - this will cause the weight to follow.

4. On the jerk, you are putting way too much weight on your front foot. The weight should be evenly dispersed between your legs which means that your front toe should be the same distance from your hips as your back heel. Get a piece of tape or something and mark the floor with even lengths and try to hit that.

5. More leg drive all around. These are leg explosion lifts, not upper body muscle lifts. You are not getting to full hip extension on anything.. standup and jump and then worry about getting underneath it.

Your flexibility looks pretty good on the clean and the jerk, and I'm guessing your shoulder flexibility is alright for the snatch (hard to tell with the powersnatch/pressout). Try working some overhead squats to get you more used to being in that position.

Lastly.. I'd ditch the belt if I were you. People will cry about this comment and all, but you'll make better advancement in the sport without it. Sure, a few top level guys use a belt in meets, but you won't see them put it on until a maximal lift. Learning to activate your abdominals to stabilize without assistance is important and you'll be very happy that you dropped using a belt in 6 months if you continue to pursue the olympic lifts.

Let me know if I can help you out anymore. Are you in DC or the state? Either way, there are a few places in both that you can get free coaching on the lifts.

KingWilder
01-03-2008, 08:54 PM
the main thing I noticed was already mentioned

make sure to keep your arms straight and shrug before you bring your elbows around and under the bar

CleverName
01-03-2008, 09:48 PM
Wow, alright... thanks very much, I didn't know I had that many problems, but that's why I posted the videos. ;) I've mostly watched videos and tutorials on YouTube to help with my form, but this advice also helps much more.

This is an important lift for me and I want to get it right so I can do as much weight as possible. I'll be practicing the suggestions without weight until I hit the gym next time.

1. I do try to keep my shoulders over the bar, but having the bar super close to me seems uncomfortable. The last time I did that I ended up scraping my knees. The hip movement I'm still trying to get the hang of.

2. Will definitely be doing some clean pulls in the future.

3. Simple enough!

4. On the split jerk, you basically JUMP first then split your legs? I've been doing it as one movement. I think I get what you mean though.

5. Hmm, okay, think I know what you mean... will try to apply.

I live in Washington state, yeah, I've searched Craigslist for coaches but didn't really find anything. Tried Google but it isn't too helpful. :scratch:

JHarris
01-03-2008, 10:28 PM
It'll take a lot of time and effort - they are high lifts to master. I'm glad to hear its important to you though; they pay some of the highest dividends of anything you can learn in the gym.

As far as it scraping your knees, this is usually due to pulling with your back too early. The main idea of the first pull (from floor to about the knees) is just to get the bar in position to explode. Essentially you set your back and push the floor away with your legs and keep the same angle of your back. This is one of the biggest mistakes people make - thinking that its a fast deadlift. Its definitely not.

Yeah, everything is a jump. I've never missed a jerk when I had good leg drive. I've had remarkably bad splits and catches, but if the drive is there I've always been able to recover.

Check out this website:

http://www.msbn.tv/usavision/

I found this under contacts - local committees:

Washington

Al Reed-Costa
16603 35th St., Ct. E
Sumner, WA 98390

253/350-8462
USAWAthletesrep@
yahoo.com

You can check under registered clubs, too.. they are probably a few but I'm not on a computer with Microsoft Excel at the moment to look myself. I know Calpians is in Washington somewhere, and John Thrush is the head coach of that team. He's one of the top coaches in the country.

Oh.. lastly, if you find yourself really getting into weightlifting, get some weightlifting shoes from Adidas, Werksan or DoWin.

monstermax
01-06-2008, 03:39 PM
Good work

Built
01-06-2008, 03:48 PM
1. Think "J-shaped" movement. You get the shoulders over the bar like JHarris said, then kinda "scoop" the weight as you get ready to get under it. I'm probably not explaining this very well. Jharris, care to translate this into a more comprehensible form?

JHarris
01-07-2008, 09:53 AM
1. Think "J-shaped" movement. You get the shoulders over the bar like JHarris said, then kinda "scoop" the weight as you get ready to get under it. I'm probably not explaining this very well. Jharris, care to translate this into a more comprehensible form?

I think what you are talking about is the knee rebend after the bar passes the knees and is somewhere around midthigh? I've heard it called the scoop too, but if I'm wrong in my guess, let me know.

In some ways, the pull for the clean or snatch mimics an RDL. You first push the floor away with your legs, keeping your back angle the same. Once your knees are nearly straight, you 'RDL' the weight to get the bar up higher on our thighs before you rebend your knees for the explosion. One of the biggest mistakes new and intermediate lifters make is rushing the knee rebend, trying to jump just as the bar passes their knees. This is another way of saying keep your shoulders over the bar as long as possible.. when you keep them over the bar, your knees have not rebent.

While it is slightly worse biomechanically to do this as far as a deadlift goes, it keeps the bar closer during the explosion which allows for a much better force transfer. It also helps keep the bar from going forward or backward on you since you don't separate from it as much. Ideally, you want the center of mass of you and the bar to be right over the middle of your foot. If you are lifting weight over your bodyweight and the bar is at all forward, the center of mass will drift forward which causes all the problems I listed above.

Built - I really hope I explained what you were getting at here and didn't miss your point.

KingJustin
01-07-2008, 11:09 AM
I don't think you are getting nearly enough out of the second pull.

AFAIK, there's some debate among high-level Olympic lifting coaches, but I've always had the best luck by keeping my hips back a little bit when finishing the first pull, and then throwing them through really hard on the second.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wt423i1w6vs&mode=related&search=

Fuzzy
01-07-2008, 04:24 PM
PRactice pulls and hip extensionbefore trying the full/power variations.

Built
01-07-2008, 11:19 PM
JHarris, that's what I meant, I think.

It's so friggin' hard to deconstruct a clean. I do 'em by feel, yanno?

CleverName
01-07-2008, 11:21 PM
Thanks for all the advice... I tried a few of the things suggested last time I went in, just gotta make it more natural. Going back in tomorrow and will be doing these for a good while. :D

Fuzzy
01-07-2008, 11:57 PM
JHarris, that's what I meant, I think.

It's so friggin' hard to deconstruct a clean. I do 'em by feel, yanno?

Miss, I've found the best way is to teach people how to do the Olympic pulls.

I teach the extension, bar brush and shrug before anything.

At the same time I work on wrist flexibility and racking with front squats.

Once I'm confident in both those factors, I get them to do hip extension from the hang position and catch it in their normal front squat position.

Two weeks spent doing the two ends of the power clean make it much much easier to teach then the hole thing. Its too complex otherwise.

Once the hip extnesion is mastered, it's cake from there.

Too many people ignore the extension completely and pic on the arms 'wrestling it up' OFCOURSE YOUR ARMS WILL WRESTLE IT UP IF THERE IS NO DRIVE FROM THE HIPS

http://i212.photobucket.com/albums/cc73/kevbw14/cleannn.gif

CleverName
01-08-2008, 12:13 AM
So is the hip extension you teach the one where they're lying on the floor and put their leg and hips up? Like this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQwpw0-gLdU

Fuzzy
01-08-2008, 01:23 AM
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These arent the best but everyone on youtube has shocking form and uses too much weight.

Note how the quads HIT the bar, there is contact, at the time of the conact shrug UP.

Built
01-08-2008, 07:37 AM
Fuzzy, that's great advice. The hardest thing to teach people is to NOT try to curl the weight up.

ZenMonkey
01-10-2008, 08:54 PM
hey fuzz and the op we wear the same shoes i think... puma fuego?

CleverName
01-10-2008, 09:15 PM
I wear Puma Roma. :D My favorite kind of shoe.

Sensei
01-10-2008, 09:56 PM
I think everything's pretty much been said, but I'd sum it up with this:

I don't think you are getting nearly enough out of the second pull.I didn't watch every video, but it looks like your upper body is still over the bar until you bring it to your shoulders... Drive to the moon and blast those hips! There are a lot of great videos on YouTube and CrossFit that you can reference. Do a search and I'll try to post links later when I can.

Fuzzy
01-11-2008, 04:11 AM
hey fuzz and the op we wear the same shoes i think... puma fuego?

So THATS what they are!!!

I just got tese given to me as my first pair till I could get something better.

**** those were messed up.