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Slim Schaedle
03-22-2008, 02:09 PM
From Lyle McDonals's The Protein Book


Early research suggested that consuming carbohydrate immediatey prior to training hurt performance by causing blood sugar crash due to and insulin spike

This is not universal

Athletes prone to sugar crashing may want to delay the consumption of their immediate pre-workout nutrients until they are already into their warm-up.

With regards to strength/power athletes, some research has suggested a benefit of pre-workout carbohdrates and a recent study found that consuming 1.0g/kg (.45g/lb) carbohydrates before, and an additonal .5g/kg (.22 g/lb) during workout, significantly reduced the decrease in muscle glycogen from training. Limiting muscle glycogen depletion can be important from a performance standpoint, especially for athletes who train twice daily.

Using a rapidly digesting carbohydrate source such as dextrose or sucrose makes the most sense here as well, although, again susceptible athletes should watch for signs of a blood glucose crash.

Prior to power/strength training, I recommend an intake of 0.3-1.5g/kg (0.13-0.22g/lb) of carbohydrate with an equalamount of protein roughly 30 minutes before training.

This should optimize blood glucose levels and provide amino acids during the training session.


So, what does glucose do for you?

BFGUITAR
03-22-2008, 04:15 PM
I always have my carbs a well half hour before training. Never had any food during a workout.

Slim Schaedle
03-24-2008, 08:37 AM
Berardi...

Of course, his recommendation includes protein or AAs, but the advantages pertaining soley to glucose are mentioned.



Advanced Workout Nutrition: Why Are You Still Drinking Gatorade?
By Dr John M Berardi
First published at www.t-nation.com, July 24, 2006.

Too Many Pucks to the Head

Standing in front of 30 NHL draft picks, I asked a no-brainer question:

“So – during practices, training sessions, and games – how many of you drink sports drink? You know, like Gatorade, Surge, Endurox, etc. How many of you drink something like that?

Only two hands go up.

Shocked, I repeat the question:

“You mean to tell me that only 2 of you drink anything other than water during training?”

Uh huh.

“Well, uh, then how many of you drink water during training, practice, or games?”

Only twelve of the thirty hands go up. Anticipating a long day ahead, I agonized:

“Oh boy…we’ve got our work cut out for us…”

Although I’ve been around the block, working with clients at all levels – from recreational exercisers to the most elite athletes in the world – I’m sad to say that I continue to remain frightfully unprepared for the level of inattention to detail and the sheer ignorance of many of athletes when it comes to nutrition and supplements.

Only 7% (2 athletes) of these 30 NHL draft picks were using some form of energy drink! And only 40% (12 athletes) of these 30 were even drinking water!

So, what do we have left? Well, we’ve got over half of the athletes in the room (53% of these NHL draft pics) drinking NOTHING during training and competition. Unbelievable; especially considering the huge body of literature demonstrating the benefit of drinking something during training. Now, add some carbohydrate to that something and athletes can expect to see:

-Improved aerobic and anaerobic endurance during training, practices & games

-Decreased stress response to training, practices and games

-Improved immune function post training and competition

-Decreased acute phase inflammatory damage after training, practices & games

-Improved whole body rehydration

-Improved muscle and liver glycogen resythesis

That’s a pretty impressive laundry list of benefits, isn’t it? We’re now talking athletes who have better staying power, better hydration, less likelihood of overtraining, fewer colds, and more overall energy.

However, while carb drinks during and after training are good - athletes shouldn’t be stopping with carbs – they should be adding protein. Oh, I know, I know. Gatorade and Powerade have convinced you that carbs alone are the way to go. They’ve also told ya that the extra protein is either useless of will build bulky muscles.

Well, frankly, that’s nonsense.

What you’re witnessing are the attempts of companies selling carb-only drinks to justify their existence. The longer they keep the wool over your eyes, the more profits they can make from inferior carb-only drinks before their product becomes obsolete. After all, the writing is on the wall. Enlightened athletes are starting to realize that if they want to really supercharge their nutrition and recovery, they need to go the next step. And the next step is using targeted workout and post workout recovery drinks that include both carbohydrate and protein.

Why protein? Well check out this list of benefits:

-Increased muscle protein synthesis

-Better and faster recovery from endurance, strength, & interval training

-Reduced muscle soreness and perception of fatigue

-Decreased muscle protein breakdown

-Further enhanced glycogen resynthesis vs carbohydrate alone

-Further enhanced immune function vs carbohydrate alone

-Increased use of fat for energy at rest as well as during training and competition

Now, at this point, we’re talking about athletes with more muscle strength, less body fat, an even stronger immune system, and the ability to train at higher intensities, more frequently. If you can’t see the benefits associated with this approach, you’d better get your head examined.

Getting back to our hockey players, the hockey-specific benefits of carb-protein drinks taken during training and practice have already been documented. Research presented at the 2004 ACSM (American College of Sports Medicine) annual conference demonstrated that liquid protein/carb supplements taken during practice can acutely produce the following results:

-Decreased reaction time for goal tenders

-Increased skating speed during timed shift-simulation exercises

-Increased shot and scoring accuracy

As these data are more than 2 years old, it leads me to ask the question – where the heck have these NHL athletes have been? Maybe all those hours in sub-zero arenas have frozen parts of their brains? Maybe they’ve taken too many slap shots to the noggin? Or maybe their coaches, trainers, and therapists aren’t sharing the right information with them.

Either way, it’s high time that athletes graduated from the primitive nutritional practices of the past and started moving into modern-day nutrition.

Not Just For Hockey Players

Of course, although I started this article off discussion hockey players, the huge list of benefits associated with carb-protein nutrition doesn’t extend only to these stick wielding athletes. In fact, real, measurable benefits associated with carbohydrate-protein nutrition have also been demonstrated in the following:

-Endurance Cyclists

-Endurance Runners

-Triathletes

-Weight Lifters

-Alpine Skiers

-Marine Recruits during basic training

The amazing thing is that most of these sports are suffering from the same ignorance (or brain injury) that plagues my NHL draft picks.

To illustrate this point, just a few weeks after my NHL presentation, I had the opportunity to visit with two other elite teams – one group of elite triathletes and one group of elite track cyclists. Guess what happened when I asked the same questions as above…

Although these athletes averaged a little better on the “you’d better be drinking something” scale, there were still athletes skipping the workout nutrition. About 95% of the triathletes were taking in at least water during all training sessions. And 50% were taking in at least a glucose/electrolyte drink like Gatorade. Yet less than 20% of them were taking in carbohydrate and protein nutrition, as discussed above. That’s absolute madness considering the research discussed above.

So if you’re an athlete, let me pose this question to you – what are you drinking during and after training?

And coaches, the same question applies – what are your athletes drinking during and after training?

If it’s either water-only or water plus carbs, let me ask the next question – how long is going to take before you realize that the addition of protein to your traditional carb drink can absolutely supercharge performance while improving recovery and training adaptation curves?

3rd Grade vs PhD Level Sports Nutrition

Although I’ve got a PhD in the area of Exercise and Nutritional Biochemistry and am a faculty member at the University of Texas at Austin, I also happen to direct the sports nutrition programs for the following elite sports teams:

-The Canadian National Cross Country Ski Team (Cross Country Canada)

-The Canadian National Alpine Ski Team (Alpine Canada)

-The Canadian National Canoe/Kayak Team (Canoe/Kayak Canada)

-The Canadian National Bobsleigh/Skeleton Team (Bobsleigh Canada Skeleton)

-The Spike Professional Racing Team (USA Track Cycling)

In addition to these teams, I also consult with the Toronto Maple Leafs, the University of Texas athletic department, the Canadian National Speed Skating Team (Speed Skating Canada), a host of individual high performance athletes in the NHL, NFL, CFL, and more.

Now I don’t list these credentials to brag. (Well, maybe a little.) Rather, I list them to demonstrate that the combination of academic knowledge and real-world experience has enabled me to see the differences between what scientists think athletes should be doing and what they’re actually doing. It also enables me to see the differences between what athletes are actually doing and what I think they should be doing. Sometimes these gaps are quite large.

Sure, there are a lot of both strength/power and endurance athletes out there that know the recommendations – they know that they should be taking in some carbohydrate during and/or after training. However, even the ones diligent enough to take their carbs are often using the wrong ones, in the wrong amounts, and at the wrong times.

For example, when I talk to my athletes about workout nutrition, the ones who actually do use glucose electrolyte drinks often have absolutely no idea how much carbohydrate or how many calories they’re taking in per drink or per training session. All they know is that they drink a bottle of Gatorade or similar drink during training. Whether that Gatorade has 10g of carbohydrate or 100g, they don’t know.

They also don’t know the following:

-Whether that Gatorade has any protein in it

-Whether to drink the Gatorade before, during, or after training

-How many grams of carbohydrate and protein they’re getting/hour of training

-How to adjust their carbohydrate and protein intake based on body type

-How to adjust their carbohydrate and protein intake based on duration or intensity of effort

And, truth be told, these are all huge problems – especially for elite athletes – both of the endurance and the strength/power persuasion.

After all, knowing to drink some energy during training isn’t advanced nutritional knowledge – it’s primitive nutrition; what I’d call 3rd grade level nutrition. (And just because an athlete’s peers are at the kindergarten level doesn’t mean their 3rd grade nutrition is advanced.) I can’t state it any more clearly than this - if an athlete wants to compete at an elite level, they’d better strive for more than the 3rd grade practice of nutrition. Seriously, imagine if more athletes graduated from the 3rd grade nutrition level and ended up with the equivalent of a Masters or PhD-level nutritional intake. I tell you, the entire culture of sport would be transformed.

But hell, maybe it’s actually better if most of the athletes out there ignored this information. If they did, the gap between them and my athletes would grow even wider, bringing my athletes more even more Gold Medals, National Championships, Super Bowls, and Stanley Cups!

Practical Workout Nutrition

At this point, I’d like to share with you some of the workout nutrition protocols I use and find most effective with my strength/power and endurance athletes. (Remember, when I use athlete in this context, I’m talking about competitive athletes who train a few hours per day). That’s right, here’s where it gets really practical.

Workout Nutrition - Baseline

As a baseline, start by ingesting 30g carbohydrate and 15g protein (in 500ml water) per hour of training. This means if you’re training for one total hour, you’re sipping your 30g carb and 15g protein drink during that hour. And if you’re training for two hours, you’re sipping your first 30g carb and 15g protein drink during the first hour and your second 30g carb and 15g protein drink during the second hour. And so on…

Then, once your workout is done, you’ll have a whole food meal within an hour or two of training.

Workout Nutrition - Customization

For most athletes, the baseline recommendations above should do the trick. However, there are a few situations that may require special attention:

First, if you’re an athlete who naturally has a very ectomorphic body type and tends to have a very difficult time maintaining body mass during high volume and/or high intensity training blocks or during competition periods (World Cups, etc), follow the strategy above and then, immediately after your workout, add another drink containing 30g of carbohydrate and 15g protein. After this drink, within 1-2 hours post exercise, have a whole food meal.

Further, if you’re this type of athlete and you still need more recovery power and total dietary energy (after trying the above strategy), add an additional 15g of carbohydrate per training hour. This means each of your drinks would contain 45g carbohydrate and 15g protein per hour of training.

Second, if you’re an athlete who naturally has more of an endomorphic body type and tends to gain weight easily or tends to gain fat during competition periods (World Cups, etc) when eating a higher carbohydrate diet, you’ll want to half the recommendation above by ingesting 30g carbohydrate and 15g protein for every 2 hours of training. Therefore you’d be averaging 15g carbohydrate and 7.5g protein for every hour of training.

In addition to this, you’d add BCAA(branched chain amino acids) into your workout drink at a rate of 5g BCAA per hour of training. Therefore you’d end up with 15g carbohydrate, 7.5g protein, and 5g BCAA for every hour of training.

Of course, all of these strategies work best as part of an all-round good nutritional plan. So don’t take these suggestions in isolation and think they alone are going to revolutionize your recovery. Sure, they’ll help. But you’ve gotta make sure you’re feeding well during the other 20+ hours of the day. And for more info on how you can do this, check out the Precision Nutrition program here.

At this point, one question I’m often asked is this:

“Can’t we just have a big post-exercise recovery drink? Why recommend a certain amount of workout drink per hour of training?”

The answer to the first question is no. The answer to the second is below.

First of all, having high blood concentrations of glucose (from the carbohydrate) and amino acids (from protein) during exercise is advantageous as the blood flow to working muscles is highest at this time. So, with a lot of nutrient-rich blood flowing to your working muscles, those nutrients will be best used for performance enhancement and recovery. Simply put, carbohydrate protein drinks are more effective when ingested during exercise vs after exercise.

In addition to the physiological reasons above, there’s a very practical reason for recommending a certain amount of workout nutrition per hour of training – this recommendation helps you easily and efficiently regulate your daily energy intake such that it mirrors your training volume.

For example, if you’re training 1 hour per day, you’ll need less total dietary energy than if you’re training 4 hours per day – but more dietary energy than if you didn’t train at all. So rather than trying to tinker around with your staple meals on a day-by-day basis, trying to eat “bigger” meals when you’re training more and “smaller” meals when you’re training less (these strategies being imprecise and difficult to objectively apply), all you have to do is have a few more or a few less workout drinks and your daily calorie intake upregulates or downregulates. Watch how this works:

Training Volume*
Energy From Workout Drinks**

0 hours of training (day off)
Baseline intake + 0 extra calories

1 hour of training
Baseline intake + 180 extra calories

2 hours of training
Baseline intake + 360 extra calories

3 hours of training
Baseline intake + 540 extra calories

4 hours of training
Baseline intake + 720 extra calories

*Of course, intensity of training can also be taken into account, however this is beyond the scope of this article and, to be honest, this level of detail isn’t necessary for a large percentage of my athletes.

**These calorie calculations assume the athlete is using the baseline recommendation of 30g carbs and 15g protein per hour of training.

Finally, another question I’m often asked is this:

“This applies only to strength and power athletes, right? After all, everyone knows endurance athletes shouldn’t eat all that protein.”

Once again, nonsense. This information is applicable to all types of hard training high performance athletes. In fact, these recommendations were derived from a combination of a) my PhD studies, done with endurance cyclists and triathletes, b) my early coaching work with the Canadian National Cross Country Ski Team, and c) my early coaching work with the US National Bobsled Team. And these recommendations continue to work with all my athletes – from short burst, speed/power athletes (the Spike Cycling Team and Bobsleigh Canada Skeleton) to intermittent, anaerobic athletes (The Toronto Maple Leafs), to long duration cyclists and skiers (Cross Country Canada).

Slim Schaedle
03-24-2008, 02:54 PM
From www.EliteFTS.com

Retrieved from Dave Tate's training log.

Question and Answer by Justin Harris.




Justin Q and A

Here are some of the questions I have asked Justin since the last update.

Exactly how soon before training should I drink the pre-training

drink and why?

I drink it on the way to the gym. The nutrients in the pre-workout drink are designed around the low osmolality of waxy maize. What this means is that all the nutrients are pulled through the stomach to the small intestine very rapidly. There is no stomach distention or bloating. You can drink it DURING your first set and have no troubles. That's the beauty of Anatrop and waxy maize. There are no stomach problems, so instead of slamming a post workout drink hoping to REPLACE nutrients after your workout, you're actually already providing the correct nutrients for after the workout...BEFORE the workout.

How soon after training should I have the post-training drink? I do cardio after I train. Should I drink it between the two?

Take the drink immediately after cardio. You want to replenish nutrient levels in the muscle as soon as possible after training. Your body is low in muscle glycogen and most of the circulating blood aminos are going to be converted to glucose. This means that your body is craving nutrients. If there is little glycogen, and lowered levels of blood sugar and blood aminos, the body begins breaking down muscle tissue to provide those needs. Ingesting the drink as soon as possible after the workout provides as little lag time as possible when this is going on.

This is more important in the offseason. In the dieting phase, our nutrition is designed not to load blood nutrient levels, but to keep them steady. So, the low GI carbs, essential fatty acids, and whole food protein from the meals before your training will be broken down slowly. This means that you SHOULDN'T be overly deficient in blood aminos and blood sugar after your workout.

Wait until after cardio, though. The post-workout drink will flood your body with nutrients and raise insulin levels. Insulin blunts fat loss via an enzyme that shuttles fat to the mitochondria. When insulin is bound to a receptor, it tells that cell NOT to burn fat. We don't want that while doing cardio.

In simple English, what is the waxy maize doing?

Preventing muscle loss and fueling muscle growth. In plain terms, it gets to the muscles faster. It doesn't sit in the stomach. Instead, it goes directly to the bloodstream and directly to the muscles.

It’s a lower GI carb. People don't understand why this is good. People know dextrose spikes insulin, and know that WAS good. The problem is that dextrose - or any sugar - DOES spike insulin WHEN it gets to the blood. But if it's sitting in the stomach for twenty minutes before it gets to the bloodstream, what good is that? By that time, waxy maize has reached the blood, combined with water and sodium, and has been taken up to the muscle.

The body produces roughly the same amount of insulin for the amount of carbs you eat. If you have 100g of waxy maize, or 100g of dextrose, it doesn’t matter. The body produces the SAME amount of insulin. The dextrose insulin spike is higher, but that’s because it all rushes to the blood at the same time - well after the waxy maize has already been trickling into the blood stream for some time.

Can I replace the pre-training drink with a Monster drink on days where I

need a pick-me-up?
You can combine the pre-training drink with a SUGAR FREE Monster drink. Pre-workout energy drinks contain stimulants. They're actually GOOD for fat burning, IF THEY HAVE NO SUGAR OR CARBS.

Caffeine works by blocking adenosine receptors. Adenosine is the body's "sleepy" receptors. By blocking those, the body can't create the "sleep." So, there are more "wake wake" receptors active compared to "sleep sleep."

Caffeine breaks down to about 85% paraxanthine. The xanthines are stimulants in their own right and have some unique properties. Additionally, one of the metabolites of caffeine is one of the "feel good" products of chocolate. All of this increases lipolysis, which in plain terms means that caffeine burns fat. It's good when dieting.

But again, the energy drink has to be SUGAR FREE.

What about Gatorade on high days? It seems to fit the profile of

high carb, low fat and tons of sodium, correct?
The carbs are all monosaccharides, which are simple sugars. On pre-contest high days, I prefer complex carbs - mostly for hunger reasons. In the offseason, however, the goal is to eat carbs, minimize fat, and raise insulin. Insulin is raised all day so there really isn't a major need to distinguish between simple carbs and complex carbs.

How can I cook Chicken so it doesn’t taste like hell?

Poach it. Cut it up, coat a pan with soy sauce and any other spices you like. Put the chicken in, then fill the pan with water until the chicken is covered. Cook on medium heat until the water is mostly cooked off. The chicken will be very moist.

Can I replace my post-training shake with the same amount of carbs

from sources like papaya, pineapple, oranges, grapes or Dr. Pepper?

This would not be all the time but could be used as a break from sucking on the shaker cup with the pink liquid. I wouldn’t do this if you want to be at your best. These aren't bad, but they all contain fructose - and in the case of Dr. Pepper, high fructose corn syrup. I won't go too in-depth about fructose, but it isn't the most efficient carb source for restoring glycogen in the muscles.

Fructose can be stored as muscle glycogen, but it tends to go to restore liver glycogen first. There's a reason waxy maize and certain carbs are used. It’s because they work better.

When you're near 300 lbs in the offseason, it's tough to maintain that muscle mass. At that point, the little things become more and more important to continue making gains. If you're 135 lbs and 6'2”, the focus isn't on the little things - it's on getting some f-ing nutrients down.

What's the deal with Metabotrop? You get me addicted and then pull

it away from me! Just kidding. I stocked up. When is the best time to take it, and why?

The loss of Metabotrop will be worth the wait. We’re bringing back the Metabotrop with the addition of another ingredient. We’re also coming out with a stimulant-free fat burner that you can take any time of the day, and as many times during the day as you want. We also have a VERY strong stimulant product coming out, and a neuro-enhancement stimulant as well.



So, the wait will be worth it.

The ingredients in the new product are designed to stimulate the release of fatty acids into the bloodstream while minimizing appetite. The best times to take it are first thing in the morning and either early afternoon or pre-workout later in the day. This provides a steady stream of thermogenesis and helps burn fat through the fatty acid release the product causes.

Should I take Anatrop before, during and after cardio on the days

I’m not training (cardio-only days)?

You can take it before and after cardio on any day. It is VERY anti-catabolic and will help prevent muscle loss during the cardio session. It does contain calories, though, and these need to be accounted for, but they’re calories specific to the mechanisms of muscle building/sparing. So yes, it will be quite beneficial to take it with cardio. I wouldn't take it during cardio, as I like the cardio to be 100% about burning fat. Because of this, I would leave out any calorie sources during the cardio.

What exactly do you mean by “cheat meal?” Is this a healthy cheat? Is there a time limit to this?

If you're eating junk, you're shutting down fat burning. Even a mild "cheat" meal is going to be hypercaloric and switch the body from fat burning to nutrient storing, so you might as well go all the way. Load up on whatever you want. I've considered a whole large pizza an appetizer when close to a show.

The huge influx of calories will restore muscle glycogen (you may already be as much as 1,000 calories depleted there – that’s 1,000 calories worth of glucose you can almost eat freely), aid in shutting off hunger hormones (reducing appetite), restore any vitamin/mineral/nutrient deficiencies the limited food options may create, and boost your metabolism. The metabolic boost from the huge calorie intake will make the following day especially effective for fat burning.

Also remember that all the neurotransmitters in the brain that are derived from dietary nutrients (the mono-amines, dopamine, serotonin, nor-epinephrine and epinephrine) are all derived from L-tyrosine and L-tryptophan (for serotonin). Imbalances in these can cause forms of depression, fatigue, malaise, reduction in "predatory behavior," and other things that you don't want to deal with when dieting. The mega-influx of calories and protein offers the potential for better production of these neurotransmitters.

Slim Schaedle
03-24-2008, 03:12 PM
From Paper to Iron Mike: Mike Stuchiner’s Journey to Elite
By Myles Kantor
For www.EliteFTS.com


Mike Stuchiner is a paragon of tenacity. In 1991, the native of Long Island, New York entered his first powerlifting meet. On August 18, 2007, he earned his first elite total at the Cincinnati Pro Am with a 775-lb squat, a 555-lb bench press, and a 620-lb deadlift in the 275-lb weight class. Mike owns Tuck’s Nutrition in Plantation, Florida and is a member of Southside Barbell in Lake Worth, Florida.


MK: Do you follow a certain nutritional program in terms of macro-nutrient percentages, meal timing, etc.?

MS: In terms of percentages, no, but pre- and post-training meals are very important to me as well as a meal at bedtime. My pre-workout meal is higher in carbohydrates, and my post-training meal is really rich in protein and carbohydrates. As far as the foods that I eat, I’m a believer in a whole food diet, and my food choices tend to be calorie-dense and nutritionally rich. For example, I eat eggs, nuts, fruits and veggies, meats like bison, avocados, and oats. All of these food are rich in calories, EFAs, carbohydrates, and protein.

MK: You have clearly spent much time studying nutrition. When did you become interested in this subject?

MS: I became interested in alternative medicine about the time I was 17 years old.

MK: What does your meet day nutrition look like?

MS: My pre-meet meal is something light like eggs and oatmeal or grits. Throughout the meet, I will eat bars, nuts, and fruit. I also keep my fluid levels up.

Slim Schaedle
03-24-2008, 04:11 PM
A Powerlifter’s Guide to Making Weight
By Matthew Gary
For www.EliteFTS.com




Immediately after weigh-ins, start drinking water again. Drink at least 16 ounces of water. Then eat some high energy foods. Focus on quality carbohydrates like oatmeal, apples, apple sauce, or bananas on meet day. Include foods that you enjoy because they are easier to get down if you’re nervous. I love peanut butter and jelly sandwiches on wheat bread. They taste delicious and they’re jam packed with calories including carbohydrates and fats for energy. Avoid sugar-filled and high glycemic carbohydrates like grapes, watermelon, candy, and fruit juices. This will spike insulin levels and lead to a crash. You want carbohydrates that will provide sustained energy.

You can eat a candy bar when you get ready to deadlift if your energy levels have dipped and you need a quick boost. There’s no need to concern yourself with protein on meet day. It takes too long to digest and can slow you down. Lastly, it’s important not to change too much on contest day. If you’re not used to eating pancakes with syrup, then don’t all of the sudden eat a short stack before you lift. This could potentially wreak havoc on your stomach. Eat foods that are familiar.

Slim Schaedle
03-24-2008, 04:19 PM
Sports Specific?
By C.J. Murphy, MFS
For www.EliteFTS.com
http://www.elitefts.com/documents/sports_specific.htm


“Sports Specific” is a term that you always hear and seems to be the catch phrase amongst all coaches. If you aren’t sport specific, you are wrong. But what is it? Is it inventing exercises to do that mimic the athlete’s sport? Or is it using ridiculous contraptions that resemble a hockey stick or tennis racket with rubber bands attached to them?

Well, sadly, this can be found in today’s commercial gyms. Go to any commercial gym and look at who is training some of our athletes and see what they are doing. It amazes me to see what people will pay some buffoon for ‘professional services’.

Team Darkside discusses topics like this all the time and we seem to agree that the job of a strength and conditioning coach is two fold: (1) to make your athlete stronger and (2) to get them in proper condition for their sport.

It sounds simple but it goes over the head of so many people. Nowhere did you see in the above job description to have an athlete stand on a stability ball while doing one-legged squats while swinging a tennis racket that is anchored to a doorway with a piece of rubber tubing!

So if we only focus on the simple (get strong, get into shape), what can we expect?

Getting stronger will do several things. It will make you more resistant to injury, it will give you the ability to develop more force that can be used as your sport requires, and it can make you faster when trained appropriately.

Getting in shape will do one major thing for you – it will allow you to finish the game and if you did your job in the gym, you’ll win!

Here is where many people miss the boat so I’m going to explain it in English (which should be the official language of this country but I have to press #6 to get it on the phone) not Guru Techno Speak. Anyone who has read articles by me in the past has probably heard this: You need to train the correct energy pathway. If some of you are saying to yourselves “What is he talking about?” STOP training athletes NOW until you understand - because you are who I am writing this about and for!

We use three energy pathways when living, training and competing. They are ATP/CP, Glycolitic and Oxidative. I’ll explain.

ATP/CP: ATP is Adenisone Tri Phosphate and CP is Creatine Phosphate. This is the first fuel used for muscle contractions and is used primarily in explosive movements. ATP/CP runs out, in the average person, in a little over a second and a half. ATP/CP will be regenerated by the body during rest where it can begin to be restored in as little as 30 seconds.

Glycolitic: The Glycolitic energy pathway picks up where ATP/CP leaves off. It’s time frame is activities lasting roughly 2 minutes to 20 minutes. This energy system is fueled by glycogen, or sugar. Your body breaks down carbohydrates and stores them as fuel (glycogen) in the muscles and the liver. This is the most common energy pathway.
Oxidative: The Oxidative pathway is aerobic while the other two are anaerobic. This means that the Oxidative pathway uses oxygen for fuel. This pathway kicks in after about 20 minutes of sustained activity.

So where am I going with this?

It’s pretty simple. As strength and conditioning coaches, we need to determine our athletes’ strengths and weaknesses then take steps to maximize their strengths and eliminate their weaknesses. We then need to determine what kind of shape they need to be in and why.

A boxer does not need to run for hours because that’s how they did it in the old days. A marathon runner doesn’t need to get all jacked up in a double-ply metal suit and do heavy max effort doubles either. If your athlete’s sport is 1 minute of play with 2 minutes of rest, train them that way. Train them to bring their heart rate down to its normal resting level during the rest period. If you athlete competes for 25 minutes with no rest, train them that way! Get the idea?

All athletes need to strength train and we need to determine how to design effective, safe programs for them. Our program design needs to incorporate all of the energy pathways to some degree with the most attention devoted to the energy pathway that is dominant in the athlete’s sport.

A powerlifter uses primarily the ATP/CP pathway and so the majority of his training needs to be done this way. Does this mean that they should not do any work in the other pathways? The success of the Westside program proves that they should.

G.P.P., or General Physical Preparedness, is a very important part of this type of training. Sled dragging is one of the most common types of G.P.P. that Westside followers use and for good reason. Increasing G.P.P. (work tolerance) allows the athletes to perform better. It raises the amount of work the body can handle in a manner that doesn’t place unneeded stress on already stressed athletes.

Simply walking forwards and backwards with a weighted sled builds the athletes conditioning in an acceptable way. A side benefit of sled dragging is that it also helps speed recovery. This adds up to a stronger powerlifter.

In the same vein, if you look at training tapes and journals of Eastern Block Olympic powerlifters from the 60’s, you will see they did a lot of non-stressful GPP such as calisthenics and pick-up basketball. Who today would think that playing hoops for fun would build a bigger clean and jerk?

Marathon runners, on the other hand, are a totally opposite type of athlete and for many years their coaches shied away from weight training because they felt it was unnecessary. As we all know, weight training benefits all athletes. It’s how you train them that makes all of the difference. Though a distance runner definitely needs to spend the bulk of their time pounding the pavement, they also need to spend some time in the weight room as well.

So, I’ll put it all together for you in plain English:

Determine athletes needs:
Strengths/Weaknesses?
How much/what type GPP or conditioning do they need?
Primary energy pathway used and how long is each rest/play period?
How fast/explosive does the athlete need to be?
How “strong” do they need to be?
Train them according to what you have determined.
It’s as simple as that! Now go throw your Bosu balls away and do some REAL sports specific training work!

Lift heavy stuff!

C.J. Murphy, MFS


Copyright© 2005 Elite Fitness Systems. All rights reserved.
You may reproduce this article by including this copyright
and, if reproducing it electronically, including a link to
www.Elitefts.com.

Slim Schaedle
03-24-2008, 04:31 PM
Bodybuilder Nutrition Roundtable
By Josh Beaty
For www.EliteFTS.com




A. Aragon: The bodybuilding population as a whole is carbophobic. And I’m talking about carbs in all forms. Don’t get me wrong. In the event that calories must be reduced or reduced to a heightened degree such as pre-contest, it is plain stupid to incur a protein deficiency. But in general, bodybuilders are just plain afraid of carbs. Hell, only a small percentage of bodybuilders are up on the science of the matter so the rest are victims of the asinine mass media just like every other layperson. Would it alarm you to know that the majority of “serious” recreational and competitive bodybuilders are literally afraid to have carbs in their final meal? Imagine that. They’re mortally afraid of muscle loss while simultaneously being afraid of a key tactic that can enhance lean mass preservation. True story.

On those same lines, you have the carbophobes who have a mortal fear of insulin, yet megadose on highly insulinogenic branched chain amino acids (BCAA) during training. Oh, no glucose generated there. None at all, ha ha… What many folks don’t realize is that BCAA is approximately twice as insulinogenic as a solution of pure glucose.

Alan Aragon has over 13 years of success in the fitness field. He earned his bachelors and masters of science in nutrition with top honors. Alan is a continuing education provider for the Commission on Dietetic Registration, the National Academy of Sports Medicine, the American Council on Exercise, and the National Strength and Conditioning Association.



Copyright© 2006 Elite Fitness Systems. All rights reserved.
You may reproduce this article by including this copyright
and, if reproducing it electronically, including a link to
www.Elitefts.com.

Slim Schaedle
03-24-2008, 04:59 PM
Elements Challenging the Validity of the Glycemic Index

By Alan Aragon © 2006





Another Magic Bullet is Bound to Ricochet



To this day, many bodybuilding, health, & fitness enthusiasts stake their entire moral judgment of carbohydrate foods based on their glycemic index (GI). A considerable set of confounders challenges its validity & strict application. Becoming blindly enamored with something that may enhance our physiques &/or health is natural, and something we've all been guilty of. But alas, the GI data is neither perfect nor consistent, nor is it free of bugs. Consider the following facts, and re-think the dogma surrounding GI, & reassess what you think you know about GI.



A Possible Definition Shift



The simplistic definition of GI is a food's ability to raise blood sugar, which almost automatically is regarded in terms of glucose entry into the blood. However, recent eye-opening research by Schenk & colleagues clearly showed that the rate of disappearance of glucose from systemic circulation is an important determinant of GI - not just glucose's rate of entry into circulation [1]. They found that the lower GI of bran cereal was due to a quicker/sooner surge of insulin sweeping glucose out of circulation - not a slower appearance/entrance of glucose as once assumed. Although strictly speculative at this point, this phenomenon may have possible performance detriment implications (ie, rebound hypoglycemia) in sensitive individuals if meals of this nature are mistimed relative to training.



Determination Vs. Applicability



GI values are determined in an overnight-fasted state using isolated foods. This is not a reflection of real life, where the digestion/absorption of previous meals, as well as the context of the carbohydrate food can drastically alter GI.


Affecting Factors



The interplay of many variables can either raise or lower GI, and are often difficult to control. Increased acidity, the presence of fiber, fat, and certain protein foods can lower glycemic response. Reduced particle size, greater ripeness, and heat in cooking can raise glycemic response.



Glycemic Load Disparity



Glycemic load (GL), which is the amount of carbohydrate per serving or unit of volume, is not always directly proportional to GI. For example, watermelon has a GI of 72, which is considered high. Low-GI advocates have vilified watermelon without realizing the fact that it has a relatively low glycemic load, approximately 6g carbohydrate per 4oz serving. The same disparity of GI & GL applies to carrots, potatoes, and even sports drinks such as Gatorade.



Satiety Index Disparity



Lower-GI foods have been associated with greater satiety, but most of this data comes from single-meal experimental designs. Longer-term studies on GI & satiety are conflicting, and not always controlled for energy intake and energy density of the test meal [2]. In the longest study to date on GI & satiety is an ad libitium 30d crossover design where Kiens & Richter observe no difference in amount of consumption [3]. In this metabolic study, a LOWER resistance to insulin was seen in the high-GI group at the end of the trial. GI does not reliably correspond with satiety index (SI). White rice, wheat bread, and potatoes all have high GIs, but rank among the top of the list for delaying the onset of hunger. In fact, Holt's team found that potatoes had by far the highest SI of all the foods tested [4].



Insulin Issues



As a classic example of chaos physics, the typical rules that predict GI do not necessarily help in predicting insulin response. Unfortunately for GI-conscious people, insulin is usually what they are trying to control. Despite having a very low GI of 15-36, milk and yogurt have a high insulin index equivalent to that of the high-GI white bread [5]. Baked beans, another low-GI food, have a very high insulin index of 120. Cheese, beef, and fish have II's that are comparable to many carbohydrate foods.



Coingestion of fat with carbohydrate slows gastric emptying and thus the release of glucose into the blood, ultimately lowering GI. While this is usually true for GI, the degree of insulin response evoked by this combination is determined by the degree of the fat's saturation. For example, Collier & others observed that butter coingested with potato not only fails to lower postprandial insulinemia, it actually causes a synergistically heightened insulin response, even in healthy subjects [6,7].



Foods that should have a low GI due to their high fat content do not always have a low GI. Examples are fries, cookies, croissants, and doughnuts. Incidentally, these foods also have a high insulin index, presumably because their fat is mostly saturated. As of this writing, full-fat ice cream (low GI of appx 37) has not been tested for II, but it's safe to assume that it probably has disparate GI & II values.



Rasmussen & colleagues observed no increased insulin response with the addition of 40g or 80g olive oil, but saw a significant increase with 50g & 100g butter [8]. Joannic's team observed a coingestion of carbohydrate with fats of increasing degree of unsaturation having a corresponding decrease in insulin response [9]. A more recent study by Robertson & colleagues compared the effect of MUFA, PUFA, & SFA coingestion with carbohydrate and observed SFA's superior ability to raise postprandial insulin levels [10].



Coingestion of protein with carbohydrate is often recommended to lower GI. However, this doesn't necessarily lower insulin response. Carbs combined with protein in solution can pretty reliably raise insulin response synergistically. Gannon & Nutall's research on type-2 diabetics showed that coingested cottage cheese & glucose raised insulin levels beyond either food separately, indicating a synergistic effect [11]. Van Loon & colleagues saw a similar phenomenon when comparing the insulin effect of various carb-protein/amino acid and carb-only solutions in normal subjects [12]. Those containing free leucine, phenylalanine, & arginine, and the drinks with free leucine, phenylalanine, & wheat protein hydrolysate were followed by the largest insulin response (101% and 103% greater, respectively, than with the carb-only solution). These are only a few examples of many.



GI & Obesity - Slim Chance For Correlation



A systematic review of human intervention studies comparing the effects of high and low-GI foods or diets arrived at the following results [13]:

• In a total of 31 short-term studies, low-GI foods were associated with greater satiety or reduced hunger in 15 studies, whereas reduced satiety or no differences were seen in 16 other studies.

• Low-GI foods reduced ad libitum food intake in 7 studies, but not in 8 other studies. In 20 longer-term studies (<6 months), weight loss on a low-GI diet was seen in 4 and on a high-GI diet in 2, with no difference recorded in 14 studies.

• An exhaustive assessment of these human intervention trials found no significant difference in the average weight loss between low & high GI diets. in conclusion, the current body of research evidence does not indicate that low-GI foods are superior to high-GI foods in regard to treating obesity.



More recently, Raatz & colleagues conducted a parallel-design, randomized 12-week controlled feeding trial, testing the effect of GI and GL on weight loss [14]. The controlled period was followed by a 24-week "free living" phase, in which subjects were instructed to continue their respective dietary treatments outside of lab-supervised conditions. Manipulation of GI & GL failed to make a dent in both experimental phases. As a result of the 36-week trial, the researchers conclude: "In summary, lowering the glycemic load and glycemic index of weight reduction diets does not provide any added benefit to energy restriction in promoting weight loss in obese subjects."



Conclusions (For Now)

GI is gives us clues to the behavior of certain foods, but that's exactly the main point of this article. Clues; mere hints are all we get from our current knowledge of GI. Successful application of GI is most consistent when we use higher GI sources to enhance the speed of postworkout glycogenesis, and that's about it. Carb foods are better judged on the basis of degree processing, refinement, or alteration/removal of micronutrition -- NOT on the basis of GI, or even GL. This is as good a time as any to crush the folly of what I call "food discrimination". A prime example of this is cutting out potatoes on the basis of GI. This happens all the time, & the dieter takes pride in thinking he/she is being prudent. Well, the critical thing to realize here is that all food species in nature have unique nutrient profiles. Therefore, unique nutritional benefit can be derived from each species. The natural matrix of plant &/or animal tissue cannot be duplicated in the lab, & hence there are many unidentified beneficial agents in, say, the humble potato. As a matter of trivia, it surpasses bananas in potassium & vitamin C concentration. Not to mention, it provides default hydration, and of course is a great whole-food source of starch. The list goes on & on.

Satiety, micronutrient density, insulin response, & surrounding factors altering glucose kinetics are all much like a roll of the dice in terms of bottom-line certainty & reliability of GI. Like all things in science - especially the deep bubbly cauldron that is applied nutritional science - it ain't all that simple. All avenues in this area are winding & complex.





References:


Schenk S, et al. Different glycemic indexes of breakfast cereals are not due to glucose entry into blood but to glucose removal by tissue. Am J Clin Nutr 2003;78(4):742-8.
Pi-Sunyer FX. Glycemic index and disease. Am J Clin Nutr 2002 Jul;76(1):290S-8S.
Kiens B, Richter EA. Types of carbohydrate in an ordinary diet affect insulin action and muscle substrates in humans. Am J Clin Nutr 1996;63:47-53.
Holt SH, Miller JC. A satiety index of common foods. Eur J Clin Nutr 1995 Sep;49(9):675-90.
Ostman EM, et al. Inconsistency between glycemic and insulinemic responses to regular and fermented milk products. Am J Clin Nutr 2001; 74(1):96-100.
Collier G, et al. The effect of coingestion of fat on the glucose, insulin, and gastric inhibitory polypeptide responses to carbohydrate and protein. Am J Clin Nutr 1983;37(6):941-4.
Collier G, et al. The acute effect of fat on insulin secretion. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1988;66(2):323-6.
Rasmussen O, et al. Differential effects of saturated and monounsaturated fat on blood glucose and insulin responses in subjects with non-insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus. Am J Clin Nutr 1996 Feb;63(2):249-53.
Joannic JL, et al. How the degree of unsaturation of dietary fatty acids influences the glucose and insulin responses to different carbohydrates in mixed meals. Am J Clin Nutr 1997 May;65(5):1427-33.
Robertson MD, et al. Acute effects of meal fatty acid composition on insulin sensitivity in healthy post-menopausal women. Br J Nutr 2002;88(6):635-40.
Gannon MC, et al. Metabolic response to cottage cheese or egg white protein, with or without glucose, in type II diabetic subjects. Metabolism 1992;41(10):1137-45.
van Loon LJ, et al. Plasma insulin responses after ingestion of different amino acid or protein mixtures with carbohydrate. Am J Clin Nutr 2000;72(1):96-105.
Raben A. Should obese patients be counselled to follow a low-glycaemic index diet? No. Obes Rev. 2002 Nov;3(4):245-56.
Raatz SK, et al. Reduced glycemic index and glycemic load diets do not increase the effects of energy restriction on weight loss and insulin sensitivity in obese men and women. J Nutr. 2005 Oct;135(10):2387-91.

Paul Stagg
03-24-2008, 05:25 PM
I've read these.

Tell me, in your own words, your take on the matter. Encourage some discussion if it's warranted.

Slim Schaedle
03-24-2008, 10:31 PM
I've read these.

Tell me, in your own words, your take on the matter. Encourage some discussion if it's warranted.

In a nutshell, I wanted to post some opinions, practices, preachings, of commongly known respected writers, researchers, and athletes.

I also want to encourage others to provide their first hand experience.

As far as my personal opinion, beliefs, and knowledge of fact....

I have utilized many pre and post workout supplement and meal protocols.

For a considerable amount of time, my practice was an immense amount of dextrose and some protein before and after training.

The amount commonly consisted of in upwards of 150g for both, while including several other meals consisting of anywhere from 70-100g carbs. This practice dates back to 2003.

The pre-meal certainly provided benefit for myself, and many others who I have helped (not for pay).

As far as post-sugar lethargy or tiredness, we know this is a fact for some people due to the rise and fall of insulin. I have experienced this first hand, although it may not occur every time. I certainly combat this with caffeine and have done so since the inclusion of pre-wo dex drinks.



I have avoided posting studies because of recent study-war that has begun, and the many weaknesses they have, can have, or have been accused of having.


We can examine pre-wo carbohydrate supplementation from many angles.

- substrate-level phosphorylation vs. oxidative phosphorylation
- Thermodynamics.
- Put more energy into a system and what happens?
- basic nutriton and biochemistry including the above energy systems outlined in the articles and under what cicrumstances they occur
- glycogenolysis
- glycogenesis
- glycolysis (and let's not forget, there are aerobic and anaerobic pathways for this)- the immense capacity for glycogen storage in muscle
- the liver's limited glycogen storage and the fact that it is depleted throughout the day due to an imense requirement to synthesize numerous enzymes and substrates for basic functions, pathways, etc.
- the fact that mainatining maxed glycogen stores is extremely hard to do and takes in excess of ~1,000g carb/day for the everage athlete.
- pre-dex (or similar carb polymer drink) acts to top off liver glycogen and contribute to muscle glycogen even after periods of extreme carbohydrate loading. (even Lyle recomends to supplement with pre-wo carbs directly before the power workout after achieving 2 days worth of glycogen supercomposition.)
- morning workouts in which liver glycogen will be very low and muscle glycogen will have been slowy used throughout the night for various purposes (glycogen is not ONLY used during exercise)
- evening workouts after several hours in which a person works a day job, possibly being very strenuous, utlizing much of the stored glycogen.
- The amount of carbohydrate included in the diet on a day by day basis vs. the amount included in the pre-wo drink.


Basically, using the term "normal diet" does not mean anything.

To really determine if a pre-wo carb drink will be beneficial, one has to look at the details of their diet, to include macros, their amounts, timing, use of pre-wo stimulants, etc.

One could include many carbs in their diet, but let's say they wait a few hours until after their last meal to train, and their blood glucose has fallen. Their head gets fuzzy, they feel like ****, and even picking up the 45lb plates to add to the bar starts to get a little hard. Add some pre-wo dex, and at the very least, your brain feels better since it has some glucose to feed it. The brain certainly does not pull glucose from the muscle to feed itself.

As I said before, exercise is not the sole way of depleting glycogen. The major means of forming ATP from ADP is oxidative phosphorylation. All we have to do is look at the importance of ATP (very basic biology) (aside from exercise), starting with its importance as the major supplier of energy in metabolism. And then trace ATP formation through the electron transport chain, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. (obviously, if dieting, the primary goal is to utlize fatty acids for these functions. However, the argument strictly pertains to glucose and its role and benefit for energy, strength, etc....not alternative methods of ATP production)

Advantages of carbohydrate in the diet, and supplementing that amount, is in no way limited to endurance training.

Obviously different people will feel and "handle" carbohydrates differently due to insulin sensitivity, etc. etc.

So, this is what this thread is for.

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 03:27 AM
Ok, I changed my mind about not using a study :)

Well, actually a review article. Not to be used as proof, but to reinforce discussion.



Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research, 2003, 17(1), 187–196
q 2003 National Strength & Conditioning Association

Brief Review
Carbohydrate Supplementation and
Resistance Training

G. GREGORY HAFF,1 MARK J. LEHMKUHL,2 LORA B. MCCOY,2 AND
MICHAEL H. STONE3

1Human Performance Laboratory, Midwestern State University, Wichita Falls, Texas 76308; 2Exercise Physiology
Laboratory, Appalachian State University, Boone, North Carolina 28607; 3Sport Science, United States Olympic
Committee, Colorado Springs, Colorado 80909.

ABSTRACT
There is a growing body of evidence suggesting that the
performance of resistance-training exercises can elicit a significant
glycogenolytic effect that potentially could result in
performance decrements. These decrements may result in
less than optimal physiological adaptations to training. Currently
some scientific evidence suggests that carbohydrate
supplementation prior to and during high-volume resistance
training results in the maintenance of muscle glycogen concentration,
which potentially could result in the maintenance
or increase of performance during a training bout. Some researchers
suggest that ingesting carbohydrate supplements
prior to and during resistance training may improve resistance-
training performance. Additionally, the ingestion of
carbohydrates following resistance exercise enhances the resynthesis
of muscle glycogen, which may result in a faster
time of recovery from resistance training, thus possibly allowing
for a greater training volume. On the basis of the
current scientific literature, it may be advisable for athletes
who are performing high-volume resistance training to ingest
carbohydrate supplements before, during, and immediately
after resistance training.

Key Words: resistance training, glycogen, glucose, glycogenolytic,
glycogenolysis
Reference Data: Haff, G.G., M.J. Lehmkuhl, L.B. Mc-
Coy, and M.H. Stone. Carbohydrate supplementation
and resistance training. J. Strength Cond. Res. 17(1):187–
196. 2003.

Introduction

Resistance training has become an integral part of
the training practices of most athletes. With the
increasing popularity of resistance training, many ergogenic
aids and nutritional strategies have been employed
in an attempt to improve performance or increase
muscle growth. Many of these potential aids
have not demonstrated any ergogenic effects.
Carbohydrate
supplementation is one ergogenic aid that is
not often associated with resistance-training performance
and muscle growth. Traditionally, carbohydrate
supplementation is associated with aerobic exercise
performance. In this context, carbohydrate supplementation
has been shown to increase the amount of work
that can be performed (37, 61, 79) as well as increase
the duration of aerobic exercise (20, 80). The elevation
of blood glucose (BG) associated with supplementation
is suggested to improve aerobic performance
through reduction of muscle glycogen use (3, 5, 80) or
through the use of BG as a predominant fuel source
as glycogen becomes depleted (14, 35, 61).

Evidence presented in the scientific literature suggests
that intermittent activities can stimulate signifi-
cant glycogenolytic effects (6, 70, 78). Because typical
resistance training is intermittent in nature, a similar
effect on muscle glycogen concentration might be expected.
Recently, several studies have reported that resistance-
training bouts can significantly decrease muscle
glycogen stores (25, 54, 67, 72, 73). These investigations
suggest that muscle glycogen is an important
fuel source during resistance-training activities. In
fact, reductions in muscle glycogen concentration have
resulted in accentuated exercise-induced muscle weakness
(80), decreased isokinetic force production (40),
and reduced isometric strength (36). Theoretically, the
implementation of a carbohydrate supplementation regime
may prevent decreases in performance and stimulate
an increase in muscle glycogen resynthesis (65).
This may allow athletes who are performing resistance
exercises to train at higher intensities or perform more
work, thus potentially enhancing the physiological adaptations
that are associated with resistance training.
The purpose of this review is to explore the physiological
and ergogenic effects of carbohydrate supplementation
on resistance-training exercise and identify
future areas of investigation.

Resistance Training and Glycogenolysis
Traditionally, it has been thought that short-duration
high-intensity exercise is primarily supplied with energy
from the muscular stores of phosphagens (adenosine-
triphosphate phosphocreatine system), with glycogenolysis
and glycolysis supplying minimal
amounts of energy (55). Recently, glycogenolysis has
been demonstrated to be an important energy supplier
during high-intensity intermittent exercises, such as
resistance training (54, 67, 72, 73).

Recently, Haff et al.
(26) reported that 3 sets of isokinetic leg extensions
performed at 1208·s21 can reduce the muscle glycogen
content of the vastus lateralis by 17%. Additionally, in
the same investigation a multiple-set resistance-training
session (back squats, speed squats, 1-leg squats)
performed at 65, 45, and 10% of 1 repetition maximum
(1RM) back squat resulted in a 26.7% decrease in muscle
glycogen of the vastus lateralis. Tesch et al. (73)
have also reported a 40% reduction in muscle glycogen
in response to the performance of 5 sets of 10 repetitions
of concentric knee extensions performed at 60%
of 1RM. A 30% decrease in the muscle glycogen content
of type IIab and IIb fibers in response to this protocol
was also reported (73). Muscle glycogen concentration
was also reported to decrease by ;20% in response
to the performance of 5 sets of 10 repetitions
at 45% of 1RM. Similarly, Robergs et al. (67) have
shown that 6 sets of 6 repetitions of leg extensions
performed at 70 and 35% of 1RM can elicit a signifi-
cant glycogenolytic effect resulting in 39 and 38% reductions
in glycogen, respectively. Type II fibers were
also demonstrated to have a greater glycogen loss
when compared with type I fibers (67).

Tesch et al. (72)
also reported that a 26% decrease in the muscle glycogen
content of the vastus lateralis can occur in response
to a resistance-training regimen consisting of
5 sets of front squats, back squats, leg presses, and
knee extensions. One set of 10 repetitions of biceps
curls can also reduce muscle glycogen by 13%, whereas
3 sets of 10 can result in a 25% reduction in muscle
glycogen (54). Pascoe et al. (65) have reported a 31%
reduction in muscle glycogen content in response to
leg extensions performed to muscular failure (sets: 8.0
6 0.7). The results of these studies indicate that muscle
glycogen is an important fuel source during resistance
training and suggest that glycogen depletion is dependent
upon the total amount of work accomplished.

Resistance-training sessions that center on higher
repetition schemes (8–12 repetitions) and moderate
loads such as those utilized during the hypertrophy
phase of many athletes and bodybuilders may have a
greater effect on muscle glycogen concentration than
those of lower repetition schemes. However, very little
research has been conducted examining the glycogenolytic
effect of low-volume, heavy-load resistancetraining
protocols.

Typical high-volume resistance training,
which involves moderate to heavy loads,
seems to preferentially deplete type II fibers. Because
type II fibers usually express higher glycolytic enzyme
activity than do type I fibers, a preferential depletion
of muscle glycogen may not be totally unexpected (23).
The preferential depletion of type II fibers during
high-intensity exercise (24, 78), such as resistance
training, may compromise the performance of highintensity
exercise and ultimately lead to a decrease in
performance.

Muscle Glycogen and Carbohydrate Consumption
Reduction in muscle glycogen can potentially result in
reductions in performance. Decreased isokinetic force
production (40), reduced isometric strength (36), and
accentuated muscle weakness (80) have been reported
in the scientific literature in response to reductions in
muscle glycogen. The implementation of a carbohydrate
supplementation regimen may reduce the muscle
glycogen loss associated with resistance-training
bouts. Only 1 published investigation to date has explored
the effects of carbohydrate supplementation on
muscle glycogen loss during a typical resistance-training
bout (26). Haff et al. (26) report that the consumption
of a carbohydrate beverage prior to and during
an acute resistance training bout can attenuate muscle
glycogen loss. In this investigation a carbohydrate beverage
was ingested prior to and every 10 minutes
throughout a free-weight resistance-training bout that
took ;39 minutes. The training bout consisted of 3
sets of 10 repetitions of back squats (65% of 1RM),
speed squats (45% of 1RM), and 1-leg squats (10% of
1RM) and elicited a 26.7% decrease in the muscle glycogen
content of the vastus lateralis with the placebo
treatment. However, the training bout only elicited a
13.7% decrease in muscle glycogen content when a
carbohydrate supplementation regimen was employed.
This decreased rate of glycogenolysis seen with the
carbohydrate treatment may be related to an increased
glycogen synthesis during the rest intervals of intermittent
exercise (52). The results of the study by Haff
et al. (26) suggest that carbohydrate supplementation
prior to and during resistance training can maintain
muscle glycogen stores. Additionally, the inclusion of
a carbohydrate supplementation regimen of the type
used by Haff et al. (26) may be beneficial in the maintenance
of daily glycogen levels, which could potentially
accentuate the benefits of training.The daily maintenance of glycogen stores appears
to be directly related to the carbohydrates in the diet
(12, 13, 39). The consumption of carbohydrates during
and after exercise will increase the glycogen synthesis
rates following exercise.

Costill et al. (13) have reported
that minimal glycogen synthesis occurs after exercise
when no carbohydrates are consumed. The
amount of muscle glycogen synthesis in the 24-hour
period postexercise is also directly correlated
(r=0.84) to the amount of carbohydrate ingested and the
timing of that ingestion. During the 6 hours postexercise,
a diet consisting primarily of simple carbohydrates
appears to induce a greater glycogen resynthesis
rate. In fact, relatively little glycogen resynthesis
occurs when no carbohydrates are consumed after exercise
(38, 39, 56). When carbohydrates are given immediately
after and 1 hour after resistance exercise, the
muscle glycogen content of the vastus lateralis is returned
to 91% of resting values compared with 75%
of pre-exercise values in 6 hours when only water is
given (65). Thus, delaying the ingestion of carbohydrates
after exercise by as little as 2 hours can significantly
decrease the amount of glycogen resynthesis.
This decrease may be of particular interest to athletes
who perform multiple training sessions on one day. If
the athlete can increase the amount of resynthesis between
exercise bouts, an increase in performance may
occur during the second bout of exercise on a given
training day.

Resistance Training and Blood Glucose
A reduction in blood glucose concentration is not normally
experienced during a typical resistance-training
session (26, 28, 43, 58, 67, 75). Keul et al. (43) investigated
the metabolic response of 15 resistance-trained
subjects to a 1-hour training session consisting of the
bench press, deadlift, and squats. No significant
changes in blood glucose levels were noted in response
to the training bout. Similarly, Haff et al. (26) have
reported no significant alterations in blood glucose
levels in response to a 40-minutes free-weight resistance-
training session. Additionally, Haff et al. (28) report
no alterations in blood glucose levels in response
to 57 minutes of isokinetic leg exercise.
Conversely, Vanhelder et al. (75) found that blood
glucose concentration increased in response to 7 sets
of full squats performed at 80% of a 10RM. Haff et al.
(27) have also reported that blood glucose concentrations
increase in response to a resistance-training session
lasting approximately 1 hour. Robergs et al. (67)
examined the metabolic effects of 8 male subjects performing
6 sets of knee extensions at 35 and 70% of
their 1RM. It was determined that following the sixth
set, blood glucose concentration was significantly elevated
when compared with resting values. Two hours
after exercise, blood glucose returned to resting values.
However, blood glucose concentrations at rest, after
the sixth set, and 2 hours after exercise were found to
be similar when accounting for the plasma volume
shift. Additionally, McMillan et al. (58) have reported
that blood glucose concentrations increase as a result
of a resistance-training bout. Similarly, Conley et al.
(11) suggest that blood glucose concentrations were
significantly (p 5 0.001) elevated immediately after exercise,
in response to a resistance-training session. The
blood glucose increases found in these resistance training
studies were similar to those reported for
high-intensity aerobic exercise (80–100% V˙ O2max) (19,
22) and anaerobic cycling (44).

Blood Glucose Response to Carbohydrate Supplementation
There is substantial evidence in the literature to suggest
that the consumption of carbohydrate beverage
before and during resistance training results in elevations
in blood glucose levels during and after the
training bout (11, 26, 28, 29, 51). Haff et al. (28) investigated
the effects of carbohydrate ingestion on 16 sets
of 10 repetitions of isokinetic leg extensions and flexions.
Significantly higher blood glucose levels were
seen at set 8 and immediately after the resistancetraining
bout when subjects consumed a carbohydrate
supplement (20% maltodextrin and dextrose solution)
10 minutes before and after sets 1, 6, and 11 of exercise.

Similarly in another investigation Haff et al. (26)
observed higher blood glucose levels pre-exercise and
immediately after exercises when subjects consumed a
carbohydrate solution (20% maltodextrin and dextrose
solution) 10 minutes before and every 10 minutes during
a resistance-training session. Additionally, Haff et
al. (29) report significantly higher blood glucose concentrations
immediately postexercise, 1 hour postexercise,
and 2 hours postexercise when subjects consumed
a carbohydrate solution (20% maltodextrin and
dextrose solution) before and after every other set during
the performance of back squats at 55% of their
1RM until voluntary failure.

Conley et al. (11) examined the effect of carbohydrate
ingestion on the performance of multiple bouts
of back squats at 65% of 1RM to voluntary failure.
Blood glucose was found to be significantly higher
during the carbohydrate supplementation (20% maltodextrin
and dextrose solution) trials for the pre-exercise
(p 5 0.036), immediately after (p 5 0.031), and
2 hours after exercise (p 5 0.026) when compared with
the placebo trials.

Lambert et al. (51) examined the effect of carbohydrate
ingestion on the performance of multiple
bouts of leg extensions at 80% of the subject’s 10RM.
Blood glucose was significantly higher (p , 0.05) in
the carbohydrate supplemented (10% glucose polymer)
trials after the seventh set and at failure, when
compared with the placebo trials (51).

It is likely that the elevations in blood glucose seen
with the varying supplementation protocols in the literature
result in either a reduction in muscle glycogen
utilization (3, 5, 80) during the exercise bout or a faster
glycogen resynthesis rate after exercise. When the carbohydrate
supplement is consumed prior to and during
the resistance-training bout, it appears that BG
plays a critical role in fueling glycolysis (51). Additionally,
it is likely that elevations in blood glucose directly
affect the hormonal response to resistance training


Hormonal Responses to Carbohydrate Ingestion
The hormonal responses that occur in response to
acute and chronic resistance training are currently being
investigated (7, 30–34, 50, 58). The addition of a
carbohydrate supplementation regimen to a resistance-
training program may result in an enhanced anabolic
environment. The enhancement of the anabolic
environment could potentially increase muscle hypertrophy
and ultimately increase resistance-training performance.

Insulin. Insulin is a polypeptide hormone that is
produced in the b-cells of the islets of Langerhans in
the pancreas. This hormone functions to (a) lower
blood glucose level by enhancing cellular uptake, (b)
enhance the storage of glycogen, (c) enhance fat storage,
(d) enhance cellular uptake of amino acids, (e)
increase the synthesis of proteins, and (f) suppress the
catabolism of proteins (48, 49, 66).

Typically, increases
in the concentration of plasma insulin occur in response
to elevations in glucose, amino acids, and fatty
acids (57). Thus, the consumption of a carbohydrate
supplement before and during resistance exercise
might be expected to significantly increase insulin
concentrations. Fahey et al. (18) have demonstrated
that the ingestion of a liquid meal (13 g protein, 32 g
carbohydrate, and 2.6 g of fat) 30 minutes before and
during exercise can significantly increase insulin levels.

Chandler et al. (8) have also reported that the ingestion
of a carbohydrate beverage immediately before
and 2 hours after a resistance-training bout resulted
in significantly higher insulin concentrations when
compared with a placebo beverage. These rises in insulin
theoretically should result in increases in muscle
glycogen stores, protein anabolism, and muscle hypertrophy.
Increases in postexercise insulin levels in
response to carbohydrate ingestion may result in enhanced
glycogen synthesis and an anabolic hormonal
state that potentially could result in an ergogenic effect.

Currently, very few studies have investigated this
potential ergogenic effect, and further research is warranted.
Research exploring postexercise carbohydrate supplementation
has suggested that myofibrillar protein
breakdown can be decreased (69). In one investigation
subjects consumed 1 g glucose per kilogram of body
mass immediately after and 1 hour after exercise. The
addition of the carbohydrate supplement resulted in a
significant increase in plasma insulin and glucose concentrations
when compared with a placebo. This finding
was associated with the carbohydrate treatment
eliciting significantly less 3-methylhistidine and urea
nitrogen excretion, which suggests less amino acid
transamination and oxidative deamination occurred.

Additionally, the carbohydrate treatment resulted in a
slightly increased fractional protein synthetic rate. Increases
in insulin are often associated with increases
in amino acid delivery that potentially stimulate increases
in fractional muscle protein synthetic rate and
whole body protein synthesis rate (4). In the study by
Roy et al. (69) the combination of increases in insulin
concentration and fractional protein synthetic rate and
decreases in 3-methylhistidine and urea nitrogen excretion
suggest that carbohydrate supplementation can
result in a reduction of muscle protein degradation after
resistance training.

Recently, Tipton et al. (74) have reported that the
timing of the consumption of a carbohydrate plus amino
acid beverage (CAB) can significantly alter insulin
levels and muscle protein synthesis rates. When the
CAB was ingested prior to the resistance training bout,
significantly greater net protein synthesis and higher
insulin levels were seen when compared with postexercise-
only consumption. This suggests it is possible
that limiting carbohydrate supplementation to the
postexercise period slows net protein synthesis. It is
possible that this effect on net protein synthesis will
be magnified if carbohydrate supplementation is undertaken
before and during the resistance-training
bout. However, no research to date has explored this
hypothesis.

On the basis of this limited research it appears that
the inclusion of a carbohydrate supplementation regime
may enhance protein synthesis or decrease muscle
breakdown and ultimately enhance the effects of
resistance training. This may be of particular importance
to the strength athlete who is attempting to promote
muscle growth and possibly enhance overall
muscular strength. Additional research is necessary to
develop a complete understanding of the effects of carbohydrate-
induced insulin increases on muscle hypertrophy
and resistance-training performance.

Growth Hormone. Growth hormone is a polypeptide
hormone that is involved with the growth process of
skeletal muscle and other tissues (49). Increases in
amino acid transport and protein synthesis have been
reported as being stimulated by elevations in growth
hormone (46, 47). Artificial elevations of growth hormone
levels coupled with heavy resistance training are
often associated with increases in lean body mass and
decreases in fat mass (15). Additionally, elevations in
growth hormone levels can be stimulated through the
induction of hypoglycemia by insulin (68). Therefore,
carbohydrate-induced insulin spikes may potentially
lead to increases in growth hormone that may enhance
hypertrophy induced by resistance training.

Chandler
et al. (8) have reported that supplements that promote
the greatest insulin spike postexercise lead to signifi-
cantly higher growth hormone levels 5–6 hours postexercise.
These higher levels of growth hormone only
occurred in carbohydrate and protein-carbohydrate
treatment groups. Additionally, Kraemer et al. (50)
have also reported that growth hormone and insulin
were significantly elevated after day 1 of a 3-day carbohydrate
supplementation and heavy resistancetraining
regime. The combined data of these investigations
lend some support to the concept that insulin
may induce elevations in growth hormone postexercise.
The elevations in growth hormone stimulated by
carbohydrate supplementation may ultimately lead to
increases in muscle hypertrophy and enhanced resistance-
training performance. In order to fully understand
these potential ergogenic effects, additional research
exploring the interactions of carbohydrate supplementation,
insulin, and testosterone are warranted.
Cortisol.

The steroid hormone cortisol is classified
as a glucocorticoid. This specific glucocorticoid is considered
a catabolic hormone in skeletal muscle (49). As
a catabolic hormone, cortisol stimulates muscle protein
degradation and inhibits protein synthesis in both
type I and type II muscle fibers (41). Cortisol appears
to be highly catabolic in type II fibers and less catabolic
in type I fibers (42). Chronically elevated levels
of cortisol can lead to muscle atrophy and loss of contractile
proteins, which ultimately could reduce
strength levels (21). These negative effects on muscle
fibers may predominate in athletes who perform explosive
strength-training exercises (i.e., power snatch,
power clean, etc.) or participate in sports that require
strength, power, and speed because there is a reliance
on type II fibers (71) in these activities.
Generally, it is believed that the myriad of catabolic
effects stimulated by cortisol occur in order to stimulate
gluconeogenesis (57). The inclusion of a carbohydrate
supplementation regimen may result in a decreased
demand for gluconeogenesis and a concomitant
decrease in cortisol levels. Additionally, it has
been demonstrated that the lowering of cortisol levels
enhances the release of growth hormone in response
to growth hormone–releasing hormone (17). As stated
earlier, increases in growth hormone may lead to increases
in muscle hypertrophy and resistance-training
performance. Despite these potential benefits, very few
studies have attempted to elucidate the effects of carbohydrate
supplementation on postexercise cortisol
levels. Several studies have demonstrated that the consumption
of carbohydrates during aerobic exercise reduces
postexercise cortisol levels (2, 16, 59). Similar
cortisol responses to carbohydrate supplementation
and resistance training may also be expected. Kraemer
et al. (50) have reported suppressed cortisol levels in
response to 3 days of carbohydrate supplementation
and a heavy resistance-training regime. Additionally,
increases in growth hormone were reported in conjunction
with these suppressed cortisol levels. This
suggests that insulin-mediated suppression of cortisol
may result in increases in growth hormone concentration
and thus lead to an ergogenic effect.

The effects of glucose ingestion during prolonged
endurance exercise on cortisol levels have also been
shown to counteract negative immune changes (63).
Elevations in cortisol levels stimulated by exhaustive
endurance exercise appear to suppress the functioning
of the immune system through a cytotoxic effect on its
cells. Lymphocytes have been shown to be degraded
in the presence of cortisol (10). Additionally, cortisol
has been shown to decrease nucleic acid and protein
synthesis in thymocytes (10). A similar effect might be
expected with high-intensity resistance exercise. In
fact, Nieman et al. (64) have reported that back squats
performed to muscular failure can result in an immune
response that is very similar to that seen with
endurance exercise. Recently, Koch et al. (45) have reported
that the ingestion of a carbohydrate beverage
during a 20-minute resistance-training bout stimulates
a minimal influence on immune response and no effect
on cortisol response when compared with a placebo
treatment. These authors suggest that the short duration
of the training bout induced a stimulus that was
insufficient to significantly elevate cortisol and thus
impact the immune system’s functioning. When contrasting
the cortisol and immune responses of the
studies by Koch et al. (45) and Nieman et al. (64), it is
clear that longer-duration resistance protocols (.35
minutes), such as those that are typically undertaken
in an attempt to induce hypertrophy and are marked
by large training volumes, are needed to significantly
affect cortisol levels and thus the immune system.
The suppression of the immune system may be a
critical issue in the body’s response to muscle damage.
Typically, muscle damage is accentuated by exercises
that have large eccentric muscle action components,
such as resistance training (62). The suppression of the
immune system may increase the recovery time as a
result of an increased time needed to repair muscle
damage. Therefore, the negative effect of cortisol on
the immune system blunted by carbohydrate supplementation
may reduce the time needed to recover
from a typical resistance-training bout. Currently, no
research exists exploring this hypothesis, and further
investigation is needed to fully understand the effects
of carbohydrate supplementation on cortisol and its
relationship to the immune system during resistance
training.

Carbohydrates and Resistance-Training Performance
Research examining the effects of carbohydrate supplementation
on resistance-training performance is
limited and presents conflicting results. Recently, Haff
et al. (26) have reported that carbohydrate supplementation
does not enhance or maintain isokinetic leg exercise
performance. In this investigation, 3 sets of 10
repetitions were performed at 1208·s21 prior to and after
a free-weight resistance-training bout and were
used as a marker of performance. Even though significant
resistance-training regime, the addition of a carbohydrate
supplementation (prior to and every 10 minutes
during the resistance-training bout) did not elicit an
ergogenic effect. However, this result may potentially
be a product of the performance test selected. Recently,
Leveritt and Abernethy (53) have reported that low
levels of glycogen seem to impair the performance of
back squats but have no effects on isokinetic leg exercise.
Thus, it is possible that the maintenance of muscle
glycogen reported by Haff et al. (26) with carbohydrate
supplementation would have resulted in an enhancement
of performance if a different performance
test had been employed.

Increases in resistance-training performance with
carbohydrate supplementation have been reported in
3 investigations presented in the literature. Lambert et
al. (51) have reported that carbohydrate supplementation
prior to and during resistance training can enhance
the performance of sets of 10 repetitions of leg
extensions performed at 80% of 10RM to muscular failure.
In their study each subject participated in 2 testing
trials where they consumed either a placebo or carbohydrate.
The carbohydrate treatment elicited an increased
number of sets (12.7) and repetitions (120).

Similarly, Haff et al. (28) have reported that carbohydrate
supplementation can increase the amount of
work that can be performed during 16 sets of 10 repetitions
of isokinetic leg extensions performed at
1208·s21.
Additionally, it was reported that significantly
greater torque was generated by the quadriceps when
the carbohydrate supplement was consumed.

Recently,
significant increases in resistance-training performance
after carbohydrates are consumed during and
between multiple training sessions in one day have
also been reported (29). Two treatment sessions were
conducted in this investigation, in which a carbohydrate
or placebo beverage was consumed. Subjects ingested
these treatments during a 1-hour morning
training session, 4-hour recovery period, and an afternoon
performance test consisting of sets of 10 back
squat repetitions performed at 55% of the 1RM to volitional
failure. The carbohydrate supplementation protocol
used in this investigation resulted in significantly
more repetitions (167.7) and sets (17.4) and greater
exercise duration (131.6 minutes) during the afternoon
performance test. The results of these 3 investigations
seem to support the hypothesis that carbohydrate
supplementation enhances resistance-training
performance. However, it is important to note that all
these studies required the subjects to perform a resistance-
training session that required the performance
of high volumes of work similar to those performed
during the hypertrophy phase of a periodized program
or the typical training of many body builders.
Contrarily, 2 additional investigations have reported
that carbohydrate supplementation does not elicit
an ergogenic effect during resistance training. The first
study, by Conley et al. (11), explored the effects of carbohydrate
supplementation on the performance of sets
of 10 repetitions at 65% of 1RM to volitional failure. A
carbohydrate beverage was consumed 15 minutes before
and after every successful set during testing.
There were no significant differences in the number of
sets or repetitions or total work observed between the
2 treatments. Similarly, it has been reported that carbohydrate
supplementation immediately before a freeweight
resistance-training session consisting of 8 exercises
does not result in an enhanced performance of
isokinetic leg exercise after exercise (76).

The discrepancy between these investigations is
presently unclear. Several distinct possibilities exist for
these differences. The most notable difference between
the studies is the duration of exercise activity. The
studies by Lambert et al. (51), Haff et al. (29), and Haff
et al. (28) showed ergogenic effects when the exercise
bout lasted 56 minutes, 77 minutes, and 57 minutes,
respectively. In contrast, the studies that failed to demonstrate
an ergogenic effect lasted 35 (11) and 39 minutes
(26). Thus it is possible that the duration of the
activity influenced the ergogenic effectiveness of the
carbohydrate supplement.

Anantaraman et al. (1) have
reported that exercise bouts lasting less than 40 minutes
primarily rely on muscle glycogen as a fuel
source. Thus, as the duration of activity increased, a
greater reduction in muscle glycogen and a greater reliance
on exogenous blood glucose may have occurred.
Secondly, the volume of work performed may be a significant
factor mediating the ergogenic effect of the
carbohydrate supplementation. It is possible that high
volumes of work performed for a duration greater than
40 minutes stimulate a greater stress on the glycogenolytic
system. The 3 studies that demonstrated an ergogenic
effect of carbohydrate supplementation all
lasted longer than 55 minutes and required the subjects
to perform high-volume work with moderate
loads over that time frame. The consumption of a carbohydrate
supplement during this scenario could possibly
spare muscle glycogen (3, 5, 80) or result in BG
becoming the predominant fuel source as glycogen becomes
depleted (14, 35, 61). Thirdly, the exercise test
selected may have resulted in the lack of an ergogenic
effect. Two of the studies that reported no ergogenic
effect utilized an isokinetic performance test. The
study by Vincent et al. (76) utilized a protocol that
required the subjects to perform 3 sets of 15 repetitions
of isokinetic leg exercise at 758·s21 before and after a
free-weight training program. Similarly, Haff et al. (26)
used a testing protocol that required subjects to perform
3 sets of 10 repetitions at 1208·s21 before and after
a free-weight training program. It is possible that the
potential ergogenic effect of carbohydrates would have
been clearer if a different testing protocol had been
employed.

Evidence of a lack of impairment in isokinetic
leg exercise performance has been reported in
response to decreased levels of muscle glycogen (53).
Impairments in exercise performance were also seen
in the performance of back squats in the same study.
The only other study to employ an isokinetic testing
bout did, however, exhibit an ergogenic effect (28).
Therefore, the major difference between this study and
those that did not demonstrate an ergogenic effect is
that the study lasted ;59 minutes and employed a
protocol that required ;130 more repetitions. Thus the
increased duration of activity and volume of work may
have mediated the occurrence of an ergogenic effect.
Another explanation for the lack of an ergogenic effect
during isokinetic testing bouts may be that this is a
result of less work being performed during the isokinetic
bout. This may occur because isokinetic devices
are not really isokinetic and force is only applied during
a relatively small range of motion (9, 60). This potentially
could decrease the amount of work performed
and result in a masking of the ergogenic benefit
of carbohydrate supplementation. Additionally,
large-mass exercise may stimulate a greater amount of
glycogen loss in a number of muscles (not just the
prime movers), allowing for an increased ergogenic
benefit from carbohydrate supplementation.

There is limited research exploring the effects of
carbohydrate supplementation on resistance-training
performance. To our knowledge, these are the only investigations
that have attempted to explore the relationship
between carbohydrate supplementation and
resistance-training performance. The data in the literature
seem to suggest that carbohydrate supplementation
has some ergogenic benefits for athletes who are
using high-volume resistance-training protocols similar
to those typically used in the hypertrophy phase
of a periodized training program. However, due to the
limited number of investigations in the literature, this
relationship is still unclear. Further research is necessary
to establish a clearer understanding of this relationship.
Additionally, more research is needed to elucidate
the effect of carbohydrate supplementation on
different types of resistance exercise (i.e., large mass,
small mass, isokinetic, isometric, and isoinertial).

Directions for Future Research
The present body of scientific knowledge suggests that
carbohydrate supplementation can generate several
potential ergogenic benefits for resistance exercise and
training. At present there exist only a few empirical
studies supporting the use of carbohydrate supplementation
in conjunction with resistance training.
There are several areas related to carbohydrate ingestion
and resistance training that merit further investigation:
1. What is the effect of carbohydrate supplementation
on ability to perform work at different intensities?
Under what conditions will increases in work be
manifested?
2. What is the relationship between different program
variables (sets, repetitions, and rest intervals) and
modes of resistance training (isotonic, isokinetic, eccentric,
concentric, and isometric)?
3. What are the effects of acute and chronic carbohydrate
supplementation on hypertrophy, body composition,
and athletic performance?
4. What is the effect of carbohydrate-induced insulin
increases on muscle hypertrophy and resistancetraining
performance?
5. What are the relationships between carbohydrate
supplementation and the anabolic hormonal environment?
6. What is the potential mechanism for the ergogenic
effects of carbohydrate supplementation during resistance
training?
7. What is the relationship of high-glycemic carbohydrate
supplements to the occurrence of obesity and
diabetes mellitus?
8. What are the effects of high-glycemic carbohydrates
supplements on glucose sensitivity of athletes?

Conclusions

Current research strongly suggests that resistance
training, especially using large–muscle mass freeweight
exercises performed with high training volumes
with moderate loads, is partially dependent
upon muscle glycogen stores. The amount of glycogen
used in these exercises also appears to be related to
the total amount of work accomplished and the duration
of the resistance-training bout. The ingestion of
liquid carbohydrates prior to, during, and after exercise
may serve to promote a faster recovery, which may
enhance subsequent exercise and training sessions.
Additionally, the implementation of carbohydrate supplementation
prior to and during a resistance-training
session appears to offer some ergogenic benefit,
through increasing work output when the athlete is
performing high-volume training with moderate
loads. The ingestion of a carbohydrate beverage prior
to and during a resistance-training bout may ultimately
effect the overall net protein synthesis rate
postexercise, which could magnify the hypertrophic
response to training. These potential ergogenic effects
may ultimately result in improved performance during
daily training sessions, which could ultimately enhance
performance in power sports such as football
and weightlifting.

Practical Applications

The literature reviewed suggests that muscle glycogen
plays an important role as a substrate in high-intensity
anaerobic exercise bouts such as resistance training.This role may be magnified when multiple high-volume
bouts of anaerobic exercise are performed in the
same training day or athletes are participating in a
comprehensive conditioning program that requires intense
exercise on multiple days. The daily maintenance
of glycogen stores may be of crucial importance for
maximizing the performance gains associated with resistance
training or conditioning programs. One potential
mechanism for maintaining daily glycogen
stores is the implementation of a carbohydrate supplementation
regimen. The consumption of a liquid carbohydrate
supplement immediately prior to, during,
and immediately after daily training sessions may offer
some ergogenic benefits to athletes who perform
resistance-training exercises or multiple anaerobic
bouts in the same training day (i.e., morning resistance
training and evening football practice) or over a training
week. These benefits may include increases in
work output during training, increases in rates of recovery
between training sessions, increases in protein
synthesis rates, maintenance of muscle glycogen
stores, and creation of an anabolic hormonal environment.
All of these benefits could ultimately result in
enhanced muscular strength and hypertrophy, which
are of particular importance to athletes who compete
in sports that require enhanced strength and size, such
as American football. Additionally, the effects of a carbohydrate
supplement’s ability to decrease stress on
the immune system may be of additional benefit to
anaerobic athletes. Therefore it may be advisable for
athletes who are participating in resistance-training
programs for high school, collegiate, and professional
sports to implement a carbohydrate supplementation
program on a daily basis in conjunction with a healthy
diet. This supplementation program should center on
consuming liquid carbohydrates prior to, during, and
immediately after the resistance-training session,
whereas the remainder of the carbohydrate consumption,
from the healthy diet, should focus on low-glycemic
carbohydrate sources (fruits, vegetables, and
grains) (77). It is important to make sure that athletes
do not consume the majority of their carbohydrates in
their diet from high-glycemic sources (sugars, candy,
soda, sports drinks, etc.) because this practice may
have some adverse effects on health such as increased
risk of obesity and diabetes mellitus (77). Ultimately,
the implementation of a carbohydrate supplementation
regimen in conjunction with a healthy balanced diet
may result in the enhancement of competition performance
as a result of daily improvements in work output
during training sessions.

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jdeity
03-25-2008, 11:40 AM
Fantastic Jeff!!!!!!

Damn, I've gotta admit I never really knew pre-workout carbs were *that* important! I typically 'try' to make sure I'm going through a solid gatorade/whey shake maybe half an hour out, but it's never a very high dose of gatorade, and gatorade's not pure dextrose/malto anyways.


I'm def gonna have to grab some malto and start tracking training responses!

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 11:48 AM
Fantastic Jeff!!!!!!

Damn, I've gotta admit I never really knew pre-workout carbs were *that* important! I typically 'try' to make sure I'm going through a solid gatorade/whey shake maybe half an hour out, but it's never a very high dose of gatorade, and gatorade's not pure dextrose/malto anyways.


I'm def gonna have to grab some malto and start tracking training responses!

Well, I certainly think it's an individualistic thing.

Obviously, we see concrete physiological benefit and importance.

Just like we know the importance and roles that adequate fats play, some people do better with low fat.


One could certainly avoid eating several hours prior and pound the caffeine and any other powerful CNS stimulant and they could be on cloud 9 for their entire workout.


If someone knows their body and realizes that they do well using fats for daily energy, and their body conserves glycogen well, then they might not take particular notice to a pre-wo carb supplement.

I know for a fact (and have worked with others) that my body utilizes glycogen very efficiently throughout the day so the benefits are like a slap in the face.

Jacob
03-25-2008, 12:06 PM
Would it be better to eat oatmeal or dextrose before working out?

WORLD
03-25-2008, 12:23 PM
Slim, with all this research you could write your own paper! You definately have enough references to list. I'm saving this and reading it bit by bit, there's a lot of stuff to read here.

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 01:34 PM
Slim, with all this research you could write your own paper! You definately have enough references to list. I'm saving this and reading it bit by bit, there's a lot of stuff to read here.

Built wrote an article for this site that I contributed to and was quoted in, if you want to dig through her Iron Geek stuff.

I did alot for various college courses too.

I had begun taking immense pre and post shakes back in 2003 before actually starting school after the air force.

It wasn't until getting into the nitty gritty biochemsitry stuff after I had started school that I began to look at what I was doing and realize the sense in it.

So, sort of like reverse research, haha.

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 01:36 PM
Would it be better to eat oatmeal or dextrose before working out?

In my opinion, it really depends on the timing.

I wouldn't suggest a bunch of dextrose a few hours prior.

And I wouldn't suggest oatmeal 15-30 minutes prior, although there wouldn't be any harm

You could even do both depending on how you plan your meals.

Built
03-25-2008, 03:20 PM
In my opinion, it really depends on the timing.

I wouldn't suggest a bunch of dextrose a few hours prior.

And I wouldn't suggest oatmeal 15-30 minutes prior, although there wouldn't be any harm

You could even do both depending on how you plan your meals.

This is exactly what I consider when I'm planning my pre-workout meal.

For me, because my appetite outstrips my needs (which explains my former weight problem) I don't like to drink my calories - I prefer to chew them.

I almost always eat one of my oatmeal/cottage cheese/egg white waffles (http://builtblog.wikidbody.com/2007/04/30/protein-waffles/)as a pre-workout meal. Now the carb source IS oats, but ground so it digests fairly quickly, and the waffle is very low in fat so there's nothing but a little bit of fibre to slow down the carbs.

If I have this half an hour before I train, I'll drizzle honey or put a bit of jam on it, maybe eat a half and apple with it or something.

If I have it an hour before, I slow it down with a little peanut butter along with the honey, maybe eat a little cottage cheese along with the chunk of apple.

See, it's just a logistics problem - making sure you have an available pool of amino acids along with glucose to stimulate insulin so you can take advantage of the preferential insulin sensitivity you'll have post-workout and shuttle nutrients into the newly-damaged tissue.

It doesn't need to be a SPIKE - not unless you messed up and didn't get in your pre-workout carbs. In that case, the faster you get the insulin going, the faster you initiate repair to the microtrauma from your workout, so the old standby of "whey and dextrose" is indeed prudent.

jdeity
03-25-2008, 03:20 PM
Built wrote an article for this site that I contributed to and was quoted in, if you want to dig through her Iron Geek stuff.


heh, diggin's not fun ;)

http://www.wannabebig.com/article.php?articleid=274

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 03:22 PM
The Top 10 Post Workout Nutrition Myths
by Dave Barr


2. Pre workout Nutrition will divert blood flow away from muscles during the workout.

One of a plethora of excuses made in an attempt to resist preworkout nutrition; this myth actually makes a lot of sense…until you become familiar with the physiology of hormones. Looking deeper, we can find that the insulin stimulated by food intake, actually enhances blood flow and subsequent nutrient delivery to muscles (Coggins et al., 2001).

Applying this principle, liquid pre workout meal consumption dramatically increases muscle blood flow and protein synthesis (Tipton et al., 2001). This elevation in muscle growth is at least twice that observed with the same drink taken post workout (Tipton et al., 2001)! In fact, this effect even lasts for an hour after the workout, so it’s like having 2 drinks for the price of 1! If you want more detail on this topic check out the article on Arginine blood flow stimulators.

Fortunately, early resistance to this research is falling by the wayside, and people are finally starting to reap the benefits that this practice has to offer. While "pre workout nutrition" just doesn’t sound as sexy as "post workout nutrition," actually doubling our muscle growth should seem pretty damn sexy to everyone!



3. The post workout meal is the most important meal of the day.

I have to admit that with all the hype on post-workout meals over the past few years, I got tangled up in this myth, too. Realistically though, as great as they are, a single post-workout meal will have minimal impact compared to what can happen if your nutrition is completely optimized. Of course it’s heresy to say that these days, but that’s a result of the myth building on itself more than any factual data. For example, as discussed in the myth #2, pre-workout meals can be 200% more effective for stimulating muscle growth compared to post-workout (Tipton et al., 2001).

Perhaps even more important than the pre-workout meal is the old standard: breakfast. No this article isn’t part of a conspiracy by MABB (Mom’s Against Bad Breakfasts) to promote the importance of this meal. Just think about it: being essentially fasted for 8-10 hours is incredibly destructive for muscle -yes even if you eat cottage cheese before bed.

This is especially true in trained individuals like us, because we have higher rates of muscle breakdown (Phillips et al. 2002) The faster we can stop this catabolism once we wake up, the better. In fact, one could even argue that the amount of muscle protein spared from this first meal would be equal to, or even greater, than that gained by a post workout meal.

Also, consuming a high quality slow protein before bed, like Low-Carb Grow! with micellar casein, will largely mitigate the catabolic effect induced by nocturnal fasting. Taking this one step further, nighttime eating will actually put your muscle into anabolic overdrive, by supplying even more amino acids to stimulate this metabolic process.

Finally, a second post workout meal can be even better for protein synthesis than the first, but I’ll get to that one in a bit.

Mini-Summary: Nocturnal feedings, breakfast, preworkout meals, and multiple post workout meals can be more beneficial for muscle growth than a single post workout meal.

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 03:31 PM
This is exactly what I consider when I'm planning my pre-workout meal.

For me, because my appetite outstrips my needs (which explains my former weight problem) I don't like to drink my calories - I prefer to chew them.

I almost always eat one of my oatmeal/cottage cheese/egg white waffles (http://builtblog.wikidbody.com/2007/04/30/protein-waffles/)as a pre-workout meal. Now the carb source IS oats, but ground so it digests fairly quickly, and the waffle is very low in fat so there's nothing but a little bit of fibre to slow down the carbs.

If I have this half an hour before I train, I'll drizzle honey or put a bit of jam on it, maybe eat a half and apple with it or something.

If I have it an hour before, I slow it down with a little peanut butter along with the honey, maybe eat a little cottage cheese along with the chunk of apple.

See, it's just a logistics problem - making sure you have an available pool of amino acids along with glucose to stimulate insulin so you can take advantage of the preferential insulin sensitivity you'll have post-workout and shuttle nutrients into the newly-damaged tissue.

It doesn't need to be a SPIKE - not unless you messed up and didn't get in your pre-workout carbs. In that case, the faster you get the insulin going, the faster you initiate repair to the microtrauma from your workout, so the old standby of "whey and dextrose" is indeed prudent.

To be honest, it was your inital posts here on WBB that woke me up several years ago.

When I started this it worked so well for me and others, I almost got stuck in the 1980's carb craze, lol.

Not to mention, it was this very site that introduced me to dextrose and maltodextrin and EVERYONE was promoting it when I first joined.

Since then I have really opened up my mind and examines different methods and tricks.

Right now I leave plenty of room for my stims to do their job because I started to find that food (even straight dex) will impair their effect.....well, I should say the actual stimulatory effect your can literally feel.

Built
03-25-2008, 03:35 PM
"Building better bodies since 2005."

;)

TopCat
03-25-2008, 04:14 PM
From personal experience, I believe proper pre-workout nutrition can make a good training session an excellent one. Some of my best gains and workouts were when I had a solid meal 3-4 hours prior, a small protein/dextrose drink 30 minutes prior and then sipped on a diluted version during my training.

Now, it is hard to separate the placebo type effect but once I stopped being aware of my pre-w/o nutrition and didn't sip on something throughout my sessions I noticed my lifts did suffer, especially towards the end. As I am sure someone might ask why I stopped it is because my gym kind of cracked down on their 'no gatorade/protein shakes' policy.

I've been tempted to go to another gym when I am not dieting so I can sip on something. I suppose getting a non-clear water bottle would be the easier solution though :evillaugh:

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 04:17 PM
From personal experience, I believe proper pre-workout nutrition can make a good training session an excellent one. Some of my best gains and workouts were when I had a solid meal 3-4 hours prior, a small protein/dextrose drink 30 minutes prior and then sipped on a diluted version during my training.

Now, it is hard to separate the placebo type effect but once I stopped being aware of my pre-w/o nutrition and didn't sip on something throughout my sessions I noticed my lifts did suffer, especially towards the end. As I am sure someone might ask why I stopped it is because my gym kind of cracked down on their 'no gatorade/protein shakes' policy.

I've been tempted to go to another gym when I am not dieting so I can sip on something. I suppose getting a non-clear water bottle would be the easier solution though :evillaugh:

Dude, when you graduate, I am totally hittin you up for an intravenous glucose drip.

Well, as long as you have your conversions down good. So, I am going to need to review your exams.

bjohnso
03-25-2008, 04:40 PM
I suppose getting a non-clear water bottle would be the easier solution though :evillaugh:

Yeah, that's what I'm going to do. I've done that in the past, and no one has bothered me about it.

jdeity
03-25-2008, 07:01 PM
Right now I leave plenty of room for my stims to do their job because I started to find that food (even straight dex) will impair their effect.....well, I should say the actual stimulatory effect your can literally feel.

slim - could you explain that impairment? Could that simply be corrected by varying your stim's moa? For an extreme example, I guess I just don't see how a dex shake pre-w/o would have any effect on your, say, caffeine, if you just snorted the caffeine. Not that I'd wish the feeling of snorted caffeiene on my worst enemy, but you get the idea. Messing around with methods of admin for the stim should be able to negate that issue, no? (hell, just timing it differently could be great, caffeine has a half life of maybe 3 or 4hr iirc, so if you dropped, waited like 20-30m, then went for the dex, wouldn't that have no/negligible impact upon the caffeine?

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 09:03 PM
slim - could you explain that impairment? Could that simply be corrected by varying your stim's moa? For an extreme example, I guess I just don't see how a dex shake pre-w/o would have any effect on your, say, caffeine, if you just snorted the caffeine. Not that I'd wish the feeling of snorted caffeiene on my worst enemy, but you get the idea. Messing around with methods of admin for the stim should be able to negate that issue, no? (hell, just timing it differently could be great, caffeine has a half life of maybe 3 or 4hr iirc, so if you dropped, waited like 20-30m, then went for the dex, wouldn't that have no/negligible impact upon the caffeine?

At first, I would pound caff (actually, a product called diesel fuel, by diesel nutrition) on my way from from class, and then drink a shake when I got home before heading to the gym.


When I discovered NO products (and the fact that taking the dex shake after caff led to a slight crash b/c of obvious reasons), I started doing the shake 1.5 hours prior, with the AAKG 1 hour prior, and then caff 30 minutes prior.

This always worked great and really allowed me to pump up the dex amount.

If I am just eating food beforehand, like tonight since I am doing UD2, I really have to make sure I leave enough time between eating and taking the pills, or else I won't feel a thing.

I started a thread about injecting caffeine a while back, but no one really had much to say. I am still wondering if caffeine anhydrous could be disolved in a few mLs and be delivered intravenously.

Built
03-25-2008, 10:43 PM
My first thought with the impairment was actually related to insulin resistance: ephedrine for example increases insulin resistance.

Is this what you meant, Slim?

Slim Schaedle
03-25-2008, 10:46 PM
My first thought with the impairment was actually related to insulin resistance: ephedrine for example increases insulin resistance.

Is this what you meant, Slim?

Not really, lol.


I really don't have an explanation for it other than as soon as food hits my stomach, my caff buzz goes bye bye.

Not just carbs either.


Although that does make sense in light of crashing post workout from post dextrose.

Beholder
03-26-2008, 06:44 AM
This whole pre-wo meal is my issue right now. I have never trained in the mornings until 6 weeks ago. I love it, but I am having such a hard time getting a legitimate meal that will help me train in the AM. I get up at 6:30ish and I am in the gym by usually 7:45ish.

It just seems wrong to have a dextrose or WM shake first thing in the morning. Followed by a high carb/protein drink for post-wo. Now not saying that I wont do that. But I need the justification.

Looking at how my body is during the AM though, I have a hard time eating anything until an hour or so of being up. Oatmeal or even a whole wheat bagel w/ peanut butter takes me some time to get down, plus I feel full through the whole meal.

Soooo think it would be a good idea for me to try a WM post-wo?

jdeity
03-26-2008, 08:57 AM
I started a thread about injecting caffeine a while back, but no one really had much to say. I am still wondering if caffeine anhydrous could be disolved in a few mLs and be delivered intravenously.
You can shoot caffeine, I'd just wanna verify water is the proper solution (almost positive it is but you'd know that part better than me - an annhydrous will dissolve in water rigth? Or annhydrous is no water, so it could dissolve in ethanol/h20 or lipids? Meh I'm sure you'd be able to find a suitable solution). Oral bioavailability seems close to 100% anyways so your dosages would be about the same too (http://www.springerlink.com/content/g4204112562h13k6/).

Everything said there is me making my best assumptions lol, please nobody go shooting caffeine based on anything I wrote here lol!! Slim if you want I know someone who I *think* could explain exacts on that, filters/solutions/etc, pm me if you want me to.

jdeity
03-26-2008, 09:00 AM
I'm a lil confused slim - you're separating the pills from the food, but unless I'm just completely misreading what you wrote (possible, been some crazy past days what with my ID theft experience!), it seems you're going food then caffeine pills. Have you messed with the pure anhydrous powders? I use those and they come up REALLY fast, and if it's near food in your stomach, no doubt that some powder dissolved in a couple ounces of gatorade will have like, what, a million times the surface area to digest? The powder's good stuff, essentially free it's so cheap, just a pita to measure and disgusting to drink!

bjohnso
03-26-2008, 09:03 AM
Have you messed with the pure anhydrous powders? I use those and they come up REALLY fast, and if it's near food in your stomach, no doubt that some powder dissolved in a couple ounces of gatorade will have like, what, a million times the surface area to digest?

Wut?

jdeity
03-26-2008, 09:11 AM
he's taking pills that need to break down, and has issues because they're not hitting fast enough and he has to time his food around it to make it work. I'm suggesting a pure caffeine powder dissolved in liquid. A caffeine powder dose is scary small, 200mg is a *quarter* of a *quarter* teaspoon, so if he were to do it as I do and dissolve a caffeine powder into gatorade, it'd digest much faster if food is in the equation when compared to simply eating a couple pressed caffeine tablets - the surface are of caffeine in a liquid makes it far more competitive with the food. (and snorting or injecting the powder would bypass the digestive tract and negate the issue completely - but only the most professional of folks can shoot caffeine w/o looking bat-**** crazy lol)
(kinda like how hard liquor shots are more effective on an empty stomach, and beers are more effective on a full stomach - because the beer has much more surface area to compete for digestion. I hate using the alcohol example because the body will preferentially digest ethanol as it cannot store ethanol, but the general point still stands, if you have a full stomach and want an orally-administered product to react quicker, you'd want to increase the surface area to a certain degree.)

bjohnso
03-26-2008, 09:31 AM
he's taking pills that need to break down, and has issues because they're not hitting fast enough and he has to time his food around it to make it work. I'm suggesting a pure caffeine powder dissolved in liquid. A caffeine powder dose is scary small, 200mg is a *quarter* of a *quarter* teaspoon, so if he were to do it as I do and dissolve a caffeine powder into gatorade, it'd digest much faster if food is in the equation when compared to simply eating a couple pressed caffeine tablets - the surface are of caffeine in a liquid makes it far more competitive with the food. (and snorting or injecting the powder would bypass the digestive tract and negate the issue completely - but only the most professional of folks can shoot caffeine w/o looking bat-**** crazy lol)
(kinda like how hard liquor shots are more effective on an empty stomach, and beers are more effective on a full stomach - because the beer has much more surface area to compete for digestion. I hate using the alcohol example because the body will preferentially digest ethanol as it cannot store ethanol, but the general point still stands, if you have a full stomach and want an orally-administered product to react quicker, you'd want to increase the surface area to a certain degree.)

I use powdered caffeine occasionally, and I have the same problem as Slim - when I take it immediately before or a while after eating, it will have no effect. So are you saying that dissolving caffeine anhydrous in gatorade (or dextrose) will increase it's surface area, thereby making it digest faster? How long does that take (ballpark figure)?

Invain
03-26-2008, 09:45 AM
I know lots of people around here preach about pre-workout nutrition, but has anybody else tried not doing anything before workouts and not noticed a difference? I know it can vary between people, but I took dextrose right before and during my workouts for a few weeks a while ago and to be completely honest noticed absolutely no difference. Before then, and since then, I eat a big dinner probably 3 or 4 hours before I lift and don't really have anything else between then and my workout.

I admit I have a very weak stomach and there's no way I could attempt to eat something, such as a protein shake before my workout. I actually wait 3 or 4 hours after my meal to lift for that reason, so my stomach has time to settle down. I've eaten dinner around 5 or 6 and puked while working out at 10 or 11 more than once.

Slim Schaedle
03-26-2008, 10:31 AM
I'm a lil confused slim - you're separating the pills from the food, but unless I'm just completely misreading what you wrote (possible, been some crazy past days what with my ID theft experience!), it seems you're going food then caffeine pills. Have you messed with the pure anhydrous powders? I use those and they come up REALLY fast, and if it's near food in your stomach, no doubt that some powder dissolved in a couple ounces of gatorade will have like, what, a million times the surface area to digest? The powder's good stuff, essentially free it's so cheap, just a pita to measure and disgusting to drink!

I've used powder, not enteric coated, enteric coated, and just about every other combination you can think of aside from injecting and snorthing.

I've done food or dex prior, as well as caff then dex.

I have no problem with the powder, although I know some people who were lazy on the measurements and took almost 2 grams at once.

Slim Schaedle
03-26-2008, 10:36 AM
This whole pre-wo meal is my issue right now. I have never trained in the mornings until 6 weeks ago. I love it, but I am having such a hard time getting a legitimate meal that will help me train in the AM. I get up at 6:30ish and I am in the gym by usually 7:45ish.


I'm not sure what you mean by "wrong."

I think what you said is perfect.

But, that is also because it was my method for many years, especially when I was in the air force and deployed b/c I would have really crazy sleep schedules....if you could call it a schedule.

jdeity
03-26-2008, 02:17 PM
I use powdered caffeine occasionally, and I have the same problem as Slim - when I take it immediately before or a while after eating, it will have no effect. So are you saying that dissolving caffeine anhydrous in gatorade (or dextrose) will increase it's surface area, thereby making it digest faster? How long does that take (ballpark figure)?

Taking almost any solid pill and breaking to powder will make it digest faster, and just dropping it into liquid (juice or water, not milk or anything with stuff like casein protein, fats, fiber, etc, because those'll slow it a lot) accomplishes this well.

Time for onset, and duration, seem to be very varied with caffeine specifically iirc, but for me maybe 10-15m if I had to guess (that'd just be for when I start feeling it, unsure how long to peak levels or anything but slim may know).

jdeity
03-26-2008, 02:19 PM
I've used powder, not enteric coated, enteric coated, and just about every other combination you can think of aside from injecting and snorthing.

I've done food or dex prior, as well as caff then dex.

I have no problem with the powder, although I know some people who were lazy on the measurements and took almost 2 grams at once.

2!!!!!! What!? holy jesus, I would've sworn ld50 on that would be less than a friggin gram!

Slim Schaedle
03-26-2008, 03:20 PM
2!!!!!! What!? holy jesus, I would've sworn ld50 on that would be less than a friggin gram!
Poison control said there is no established lethal dose.

Basically, the only amount "eastablished" as lethal is the dose that actually kills the person, haha.

But yeah, the first time my buddy apparently mistook arginine or citrulline malate for the caffeine and took like a tablespoon.

Second time, the other guy was just too lax when measuring.

Come to think of it, I know smeone else who took a ton after they had started drinking.

That stuff is dangerous, haha.

jdeity
03-26-2008, 07:08 PM
wow! Now I don't feel so bad about my mini-od on it lol!!!

I think there is an ld50 on that, I'm like 99% sure there is one out there. Can't imagine anyone really cares, but I'm almost positive there is a value. But if you dose properly it's irrelevant anyways haha! I hate it because I only have a 1/4tsp measurement as my lowest, so I have to eye out a 1/4 of that, so when I'm aiming for 200 and get 400, it can really make the day suck!

Slim Schaedle
03-26-2008, 07:11 PM
wow! Now I don't feel so bad about my mini-od on it lol!!!

I think there is an ld50 on that, I'm like 99% sure there is one out there. Can't imagine anyone really cares, but I'm almost positive there is a value. But if you dose properly it's irrelevant anyways haha! I hate it because I only have a 1/4tsp measurement as my lowest, so I have to eye out a 1/4 of that, so when I'm aiming for 200 and get 400, it can really make the day suck!

Tell ya what, when I was using Diesel Fuel (won't post link out of caution) I would open the capsules and carefully transfer some more anhydrous powder into the extra space, and then close the capsule back up.

Worked great

Slim Schaedle
03-26-2008, 11:54 PM
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov.proxy.libraries.uc.edu/pubmed/12580676?ordinalpos=9&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum


J Strength Cond Res. 2003 Feb;17(1):187-96.Links

Carbohydrate supplementation and resistance training.

Haff GG, Lehmkuhl MJ, McCoy LB, Stone MH.

Human Performance Laboratory, Midwestern State University, Wichita Falls, Texas 76308, USA. haffgg@appstate.edu

There is a growing body of evidence suggesting that the performance of resistance-training exercises can elicit a significant glycogenolytic effect that potentially could result in performance decrements. These decrements may result in less than optimal physiological adaptations to training. Currently some scientific evidence suggests that carbohydrate supplementation prior to and during high-volume resistance training results in the maintenance of muscle glycogen concentration, which potentially could result in the maintenance or increase of performance during a training bout. Some researchers suggest that ingesting carbohydrate supplements prior to and during resistance training may improve resistance-training performance. Additionally, the ingestion of carbohydrates following resistance exercise enhances the resynthesis of muscle glycogen, which may result in a faster time of recovery from resistance training, thus possibly allowing for a greater training volume. On the basis of the current scientific literature, it may be advisable for athletes who are performing high-volume resistance training to ingest carbohydrate supplements before, during, and immediately after resistance training.
PMID: 12580676 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 12:32 AM
The copy/paste got a little messed up in places due to the tables and graphs....which aren't there.



Timing of amino acid-carbohydrate ingestion alters
anabolic response of muscle to resistance exercise

KEVIN D. TIPTON,1,2 BLAKE B. RASMUSSEN,1,2 SHARON L. MILLER,1,2 STEVEN E. WOLF,1
SHARLA K. OWENS-STOVALL,1 BART E. PETRINI,1 AND ROBERT R. WOLFE1,2

1Department of Surgery, University of Texas Medical Branch, and 2Metabolism Unit,
Shriners Hospitals for Children, Galveston, Texas 77550
Received 5 September 2000; accepted in final form 6 March 2001
Tipton, Kevin D., Blake B. Rasmussen, Sharon L.
Miller, Steven E. Wolf, Sharla K. Owens-Stovall, Bart E.
Petrini, and Robert R. Wolfe.

Timing of amino acid-carbohydrate
ingestion alters anabolic response of muscle to
resistance exercise. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab 281:
E197–E206, 2001.

—The present study was designedto determine
whether consumption of an oral essential amino
acid-carbohydrate supplement (EAC) before exercise results
in a greater anabolic response than supplementation after
resistance exercise. Six healthy human subjects participated
in two trials in random order, PRE (EAC consumed immediately
before exercise), and POST (EAC consumed immediately
after exercise). A primed, continuous infusion of L-[ring-
2H5]phenylalanine, femoral arteriovenous catheterization,
and muscle biopsies from the vastus lateralis were used to
determine phenylalanine concentrations, enrichments, and
net uptake across the leg. Blood and muscle phenylalanine
concentrations were increased by ;130% after drink consumption
in both trials. Amino acid delivery to the leg was
increased during exercise and remained elevated for the 2 h
after exercise in both trials. Delivery of amino acids (amino
acid concentration times blood flow) was significantly greater
in PRE than in POST during the exercise bout and in the 1st
h after exercise (P , 0.05). Total net phenylalanine uptake
across the leg was greater (P 5 0.0002) during PRE (209 6 42
mg) than during POST (81 6 19). Phenylalanine disappearance
rate, an indicator of muscle protein synthesis from blood
amino acids, increased after EAC consumption in both trials.
These results indicate that the response of net muscle protein
synthesis to consumption of an EAC solution immediately
before resistance exercise is greater than that when the
solution is consumed after exercise, primarily because of an
increase in muscle protein synthesis as a result of increased
delivery of amino acids to the leg.
muscle protein synthesis; muscle protein breakdown; stable
isotopes; supplementation

BOTH EXERCISE AND NUTRITIONAL SUBSTRATES play important
roles in muscle protein metabolism. An acute bout
of resistance exercise increases muscle protein synthesis
more than breakdown, so that net muscle protein
balance (synthesis minus breakdown) is increased (5,
19, 20). Hyperaminoacidemia at rest has similarly
been demonstrated to increase net synthesis of muscle
protein, primarily by stimulating muscle protein synthesis
(1, 6). After intense resistance exercise, increased
amino acid availability via intravenous infusion
was shown to increase the rate of muscle protein
synthesis above levels observed with amino acid infusion
at rest (6). Thus exercise and amino acids seem to
have complementary effects on muscle protein synthesis.
Furthermore, the normal postexercise increase in
muscle protein breakdown was attenuated when
amino acids were infused after an exercise bout. Synthesis,
in this case, exceeded breakdown, resulting in
net muscle protein synthesis. Subsequently, we demonstrated
that a solution of amino acids given orally
was just as effective as intravenous amino acid infusion
for developing net muscle protein synthesis after
resistance exercise (27).

A combination of amino acids, to increase amino acid
availability, and carbohydrates, to stimulate insulin
release, should be a potent stimulator of net muscle
protein synthesis. We recently demonstrated that
ingestion of a bolus of 6 g of amino acids combined
with 35 g of carbohydrates at both 1 and 3 h postexercise
resulted in muscle protein anabolism (21).
During an exercise bout, there may be a net loss of
muscle protein, because protein synthesis is either
decreased (8) or unchanged (9), whereas protein
breakdown is generally considered to be elevated (22).
Although muscle protein synthesis is increased after
exercise, it appears that this response is not stimulated
until some time after the exercise bout (17). Hyperaminoacidemia
from ingestion of amino acids during
the exercise bout, as opposed to after exercise, may
counter the net loss of muscle protein, thereby creating
a more favorable situation for muscle growth. The
purpose of the present study was to determine whether
ingesting a combination of amino acid and carbohydrate
before exercise is more effective in stimulating
net muscle protein synthesis than ingesting the mixture
after exercise.

Address for reprint requests and other correspondence: K. D.
Tipton, Metabolism Unit, Shriners Hospital for Children, 815 Market
St., Galveston, TX 77550 (E-mail: ktipton@utmb.edu).
The costs of publication of this article were defrayed in part by the
payment of page charges. The article must therefore be hereby
marked ‘‘advertisement’’ in accordance with 18 U.S.C. Section 1734
solely to indicate this fact.

Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab
281: E197–E206, 2001.
0193-1849/01 $5.00 Copyright © 2001 the American Physiological Society http://www.ajpendo.org E197
on March 26, 2008 ajpendo.physiology.org Downloaded from

METHODS

Subjects
Six healthy volunteers (3 females, 3 males) were studied in
the postabsorptive state. The study design, purpose, and
possible risks were explained to each subject before written
consent was obtained. The Institutional Review Board and
the General Clinical Research Center (GCRC) of the University
of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston approved the
study protocol. All subjects were healthy, nondiabetic, and
normotensive. They had a normal cardiac rhythm with no
abnormalities, as judged by medical history, physical examination,
resting electrocardiogram, and laboratory blood and
urine tests. Subjects were recreationally active and were
instructed to refrain from physical exercise for $24 h before
being studied. Mean (6SE) age was 30.2 6 3.1 yr, height was
1.71 6 0.03 m, weight was 66 6 6 kg, body mass index was
22 6 1 kg/m2, and leg volume was 9.78 6 0.61 liters. At least
1 wk before the initial infusion study, each subject was
familiarized with the leg press and leg extension machine,
and their one-repetition maximum (1RM, the maximum
weight that can be lifted for one repetition) was determined
on each. Mean 1RM for the leg press was 122.9 6 12.8 kg and
for the leg extension was 92.3 6 13.7 kg.

Experimental Protocol

The protocol was designed to determine whether an oral
amino acid-carbohydrate solution (EAC) would be a more
effective stimulator of muscle protein anabolism if given
immediately before or immediately after a resistance exercise
bout. Each subject participated in two trials in random
order. The response of muscle protein metabolism was determined
during and after an intense resistance exercise bout
while each subject consumed, on separate occasions, a bolus
of EAC immediately before exercise (PRE) or immediately
after exercise (POST). Study days were separated by $2 mo.
Subjects were instructed to maintain a consistent dietary
intake pattern throughout the duration of the study. One
female subject completed only the PRE trial; thus all data
reflect means of six subjects for PRE and five subjects for
POST. A schematic representation of the study protocol is
shown in Fig. 1.

Subjects reported to the GCRC on the evening before each
study day and began fasting at 2200. After the overnight fast,
at ;0600, an 18-gauge polyethylene catheter was inserted
into a large peripheral arm vein for the infusion of stable
isotopic tracers of amino acids. Catheters were inserted in
positions to prevent occlusion by bending of the arms. Subjects
were subsequently transported to the Exercise Metabolism
Laboratory in the Shriners Hospital for Children,
Galveston. After background blood samples were taken, a
primed, continuous infusion of L-[ring-2H5]phenylalanine
was started at ;0630 and continued throughout the protocol.
The priming dose was 2 mmol/kg, and the infusion rate was
0.05 mmolzmin21 zkg21. Catheters were then placed in the
femoral artery and vein, as well as a second peripheral arm
vein contralateral to the infusion site. The femoral arterial
catheter was also used for the continuous infusion of indocyanine
green (ICG).

After 2 h of infusion to establish an isotopic steady state,
resting measurements were made of amino acid concentrations
and enrichments in the femoral artery and vein, as well
as muscle. Three blood samples, separated by ;10 min, were
taken from the femoral artery and vein for the measurement
of plasma arterial and venous amino acid enrichments and
concentrations. Blood samples were immediately placed into
preweighed tubes containing 1 ml of sulfosalicylic acid per
milliliter of blood and tubes containing lithium heparin. Leg
blood flow was measured by the dye-dilution technique during
this time (4). Briefly, ICG (0.5 mg/ml) was infused (60
ml/h) into the femoral artery. Blood samples were simultaneously
taken from the femoral vein and a peripheral vein to
measure ICG concentration. The ICG infusion was briefly
halted and then quickly resumed to allow sampling from the
femoral artery for isotopic measurements. Immediately after
the blood sampling, a percutaneous muscle biopsy was taken
from the vastus lateralis. Muscle biopsies were taken from
the lateral portion of the vastus lateralis with sterile technique.
The skin and subcutaneous tissue were anesthetized,
and an ;6-mm incision was made in the skin and muscle
fascia. A 5-mm Bergstro¨m biopsy needle (Depuy, Warsaw,
IN), with the cutting window closed, was advanced 3–5 cm
through the fascia deep into the muscle. With suction applied,
the cutting cylinder was opened and then closed 2–3
times. A sample of ;50 mg of mixed muscle tissue was
obtained with each biopsy. Each sample was quickly (within
1 min) rinsed with ice-cold saline, blotted dry, and frozen in
liquid N2.

Immediately after the first muscle biopsy, subjects performed
an intense leg resistance exercise bout. Before initiation
of the resistance exercise routine, subjects consumed
either a 500-ml bolus of the EAC solution (PRE) or a placebo
solution (POST). The exercise bout consisted of 10 sets of 8
repetitions of leg press at 80% of 1RM and 8 sets of 8
repetitions of leg extension at 80% of 1RM. The rest interval
between sets was ;2 min, and the entire exercise bout was
completed in ;45–50 min. Blood samples were taken from
the femoral artery and vein after the 4th and 8th sets of leg
press (;10 and 20 min from the beginning of the exercise)
and the 2nd and 8th, or final, sets of leg extension (;30 and
45 min from the beginning of the exercise). A second muscle
biopsy was taken in the rest interval between the 7th and 8th
sets of leg extension. A second bolus drink, placebo for the
PRE trial and EAC for the POST trial, was consumed immediately
after exercise and the final blood draw. A series of
arterial and venous blood samples and two muscle biopsies
were taken in the 2 h after exercise. Blood samples were
drawn at 10, 20, 30, 45, 60, 90, and 120 min after exercise.
Fig. 1. Schematic representation of the study protocol. Time values
are in minutes from the end of exercise. AV, arteriovenous; EX,
exercise; EAC, essential amino acid-carbohydrate (supplement); ring
d5-Phe, L-[ring-2H5]phenylalanine.
E198 ANABOLIC RESPONSE OF MUSCLE TO SUPPLEMENT TIMING
AJP-Endocrinol Metab • VOL 281 • AUGUST 2001 • www.ajpendo.org
on March 26, 2008 ajpendo.physiology.org Downloaded from
Muscle biopsies were taken at ;55 and 115 min after exercise
and the ingestion of the 2nd bolus drink.
EAC Solution

Each subject consumed two 500-ml bolus drinks during
each trial. The order of the trials was randomly selected.
During the PRE trial, the EAC drink was consumed immediately
before initiation of the exercise bout, and the placebo
was consumed immediately upon cessation of the exercise
bout. For the POST trial, the order was reversed. The EAC
consisted of 6 g of essential amino acids, in amounts designed
to increase muscle free intracellular amino acid levels in
proportion to their respective requirements for protein synthesis,
and 35 g of sucrose in 500 ml of deionized-distilled
water. The amounts of essential amino acids in a 500-ml
bolus EAC solution were (mg and mmol, respectively) histidine
0.65, 4.2; isoleucine 0.60, 4.6; leucine 1.12, 8.5; lysine
0.93, 6.4; methionine 0.19, 1.3; phenylalanine 0.93, 5.6; threonine
0.88, 7.4; and valine 0.7, 6.0. Additionally, 0.0605 g of
L-[ring-2H5]phenylalanine was added to the solution to maintain
isotopic steady state. A small amount of artificial sweetener,
containing aspartame, was added to the EAC to improve
palatability. The placebo solution was composed of
deionized-distilled water and an artificial sweetener containing
aspartame. The placebo contained ,200 mg of phenylalanine.

Analysis of Samples

Blood. Amino acid enrichment and concentration of phenylalanine
in whole blood were measured by gas chromatography-
mass spectrometry (GC-MS; model 5989B, Hewlett-
Packard, Palo Alto, CA) (18). Upon thawing, 500 ml of the
sulfosalicylic extract was passed over a cation exchange column
(Dowex AG 50W-8X, 100–200 mesh H1 form; Bio-Rad
Laboratories, Richmond, CA) and dried under vacuum using
a Speed Vac (Savant Instruments, Farmingdale, NY). To
determine the enrichment of infused amino acids in whole
blood, the tert-butyldimethylsilyl (t-BDMS) derivative of each
amino acid was made according to previously described procedures
(5, 18, 19). Isotopic enrichments were determined by
GC-MS (model 5989B, Hewlett-Packard) and expressed as a
tracer-to-tracee ratio (t/T) (16). Concentrations of free amino
acids were determined using an internal standard solution,
as previously described (4, 5, 18, 19). The internal standard
used was L-[ring-13C6]phenylalanine (50 mmol/l) added in a
ratio of ;100 ml/ml of blood. Because the tube weight was
known, the amount of blood could also be determined, and
the blood amino acid concentration was determined from the
internal standard enrichments measured by GC-MS on the
basis of the amount of blood and internal standard added (4,
5, 18, 19). Appropriate corrections were made for overlapping
spectra that contributed to the t/T (23). Additionally, m15
enrichments were corrected 6% for contributions from m16.
Leg blood flow was determined by spectrophotometrically
measuring the ICG concentration in serum from the femoral
and the peripheral veins, as described previously (4, 5, 19).
Leg plasma flow was calculated from steady-state values of
dye concentration and converted to blood flow by use of the
hematocrit (4, 5, 18). Plasma insulin levels were determined
by radioimmunoassay (Diagnostic Products, Los Angeles,
CA). The intra-assay coefficient of variation (CV) was 1.45%.
Muscle. Muscle biopsy tissue samples were analyzed for
mixed protein-bound and free intracellular amino acid enrichment
and concentration, as previously described (4, 5, 18,
19). Tissue biopsies (;50 mg) of the vastus lateralis were
immediately blotted and frozen in liquid N2. Samples were
then stored at 280°C until processed. Upon thawing, the
;25–30 mg of tissue were weighed and protein precipitated
with 0.5 ml of 10% perchloric acid. The tissue was then
homogenized and centrifuged, and the supernatant was collected.
This procedure was repeated two more times, and the
pooled supernatant (;1.3 ml) was processed, as were the
blood samples described above in Blood. To determine intracellular
enrichment of infused tracers, the t-BDMS derivative
was prepared as previously described (4, 5, 19) and
analyzed by GC-MS. Intracellular enrichment was determined
by correction for extracellular fluid on the basis of the
chloride method (2). Muscle free amino acid concentration
was measured with the internal standard method, with corrections
for the contribution of extracellular fluid and for
overlapping spectra, as described previously (4, 5, 18, 19).
The remaining pellet of muscle tissue was further washed,
twice with 0.9% saline and three times with absolute ethanol.
It was then placed in an oven and dried at 50°C overnight.
The dried pellet was then hydrolyzed at 110°C for 24 h with
6 N HCl. The protein hydrolysate was then passed over a
cation exchange column and dried by Speed Vac derivatized
with t-BDMS, as described in Blood. Enrichment of proteinbound
L-[ring-2H5]phenylalanine was determined by GC-MS
(model 5973, Hewlett-Packard) with a splitless injection and
positive electron impact ionization. Mass-to-charge ratios
(m/z) 338 and 341 were monitored. These ions are the m13
and m15 enrichments, respectively, where m10 is the lowest
molecular weight of the ion. The ratio of m15/m13 was used
because it is more sensitive than the traditional m15/m10
(used for blood samples). Enrichment from the protein-bound
samples was determined with a linear standard curve of
known m15/m13 ratios and corrected back to the absolute
change in m15 enrichment over the incorporation period.

Calculations

Chemical net amino acid balance (NB) across the leg was
calculated from the difference between the femoral arterial
and venous concentrations multiplied by the blood flow. Thus
NB 5 ~Ca 2 Cv! z BF
where Ca is arterial amino acid concentration, Cv is venous
amino acid concentration, and BF is leg blood flow.
Area under the curve was used to calculate total, as well as
essential and nonessential, amino acid uptake (mg) across
the leg for a given time period. The resting value was used as
baseline, so that all values reflected the uptake due to ingestion
of EAC. The amount of phenylalanine that was taken up
by the leg and utilized for protein synthesis was calculated by
Cm4 2 Cm1 5 Cm42m1
where Cm4 and Cm1 are the phenylalanine concentrations in
the intracellular pool of the final (4th) and initial (1st) muscle
biopsy. Cm4-m1 is the amount of phenylalanine remaining in
the muscle at the end of the study.
Cm42m1 z LV z 0.6 5 total Phe
where total Phe is the total amount of phenylalanine remaining
in the leg at the end of the study, LV is leg volume, and
0.6 is the volume of leg that is muscle (10).
uptake 2 total Phe 5 Phe for MPS
where uptake is uptake of phenylalanine across the leg, and
Phe for MPS is the amount of phenylalanine taken up by the
leg and utilized for muscle protein synthesis.
Because phenylalanine is not metabolized in muscle, muscle
protein synthesis and breakdown can be estimated using
the NB across the leg and the arterial and venous enrichments
of L-[ring-2H5]phenylalanine blood (26, 29). The rate of
appearance (Ra) and rate of disappearance (Rd) of L-[ring-
2H5]phenylalanine were calculated as estimations of muscle
protein breakdown and muscle protein synthesis, respectively,
from plasma amino acids in the blood (25, 29)
Ra 5 ~Ea/Ev 2 1! z Ca z BF
where Ea is arterial enrichment of L-[ring-2H5]phenylalanine,
Ev is venous enrichment, and Rd is NB 1 Ra.
Ra, Rd, and NB were calculated for four time periods by
combining the individual measurements within each period
and using the mean values in the calculations.

Data Presentation and Statistical Analysis

Data are presented as means 6 SE. Results across time for
phenylalanine concentration were compared by one-way
ANOVA, with significance set at P , 0.05. When the overall
P , 0.05, Dunnett’s post hoc test was used to detect individual
differences between rest and each time point. Differences
between PRE and POST for each time period and for total
phenylalanine uptake were detected with Student’s t-test
with unpooled variances, with significance set at P , 0.05.
Leg blood flow, phenylalanine enrichment, Ra, Rd, NB,
delivery to the leg, and muscle concentration are presented
as means of four periods: Rest, Exercise, Hour 1 Postexercise,
and Hour 2 Postexercise. The model used to determine statistical
differences for each of these variables (except for
muscle concentration) is of the form
Ys,Tr,t 5 Ss 1(
j 5 1
3
ATr,tt j 1 error
where s is 1,2,. . .,6 (Ss is the effect of subject s), Tr is 0,1 (Tr
is the treatment, 0 is PRE, 1 is POST), t (the time period) is
1, 2, 3, or 4.
For muscle concentration, the model (which requires deletion
of the one subject who did not participate in the POST
part of the study) is
Ys,Tr,t 5 Ss,Tr 1(
j 5 1
3
ATr,tt j 1 error
This change was made because of the apparently large
change in baseline between PRE and POST studies for some
of the subjects. The object of the analysis is to determine in
which, if any, time periods (t 5 1, 2, 3, or 4) the conditions
(
j 5 1
3
A0,tt j Þ(
j 5 1
3
A1,tt j
are satisfied, and for
Tr 5 0, 1 and t
which of the following hold
(
j 5 1
3
ATr,tt j Þ(
j 5 1
3
ATr,tt j
and in those cases to obtain some idea of the magnitudes of
the change from the first to the second term. A general linear
model program was run with the measured data to address
these questions.

RESULTS

Blood Phenylalanine Concentrations
and Enrichments
Ingestion of EAC resulted in significant hyperaminoacidemia
in both the PRE and POST trials (Fig. 2).
Mean phenylalanine concentration increased by ;67%
in the first 10 min of exercise and was significantly
increased over resting levels by 10 min after exercise
during the PRE trial. Phenylalanine concentration increased
further after cessation of exercise and peaked
;30 min postexercise at levels ;135% above basal.
Phenylalanine concentration declined from 30 min postexercise
until 120 min postexercise. During POST,
mean phenylalanine concentration was unchanged
during exercise, increased significantly at 20 min postexercise,
peaked at ;130% of resting values 30 min
postexercise, and then declined steadily until 120 min
postexercise.

Mean enrichments of L-[ring-2H5]phenylalanine are
presented as means of the four time periods in Table 1.
Arterial enrichment was decreased from rest during
exercise in both trials and in the 2nd h postexercise in
POST. Arteriovenous difference in enrichments was
decreased during exercise during both trials and during
the 1st h after exercise during PRE.
Fig. 2. Arterial and venous phenylalanine concentrations over time
for PRE trial (EAC before exercise, top) and POST trial (EAC after
exercise, bottom). *Significantly different from resting levels (time
255), P , 0.05.
E200

Muscle Phenylalanine Concentrations

Muscle intracellular free phenylalanine concentrations
are summarized in Fig. 3. Phenylalanine concentrations
in muscle were significantly greater at rest
during the PRE trial than during POST. During PRE,
muscle phenylalanine concentration was increased
46% by the end of exercise and was further increased to
86% above basal levels 1 h after exercise. Two hours
after exercise, and thus 3 h after ingestion of EAC,
muscle phenylalanine concentrations were 65% above
basal. During POST, muscle phenylalanine concentrations
were not increased during exercise but were significantly
elevated above rest and exercise levels at 2 h
postexercise, i.e., 2 h after ingestion of EAC, respectively.
When the differences in resting values are accounted
for, muscle phenylalanine concentration was
not significantly different between PRE and POST at
any time point.

Blood Flow and Phenylalanine Delivery to the Muscle

Blood flow to the leg at rest was not different between
treatments (Table 2). Resistance exercise significantly
increased leg blood flow by ;324% during PRE
and by ;201% during POST. In the 1st h after exercise,
leg blood flow was still significantly elevated
above rest during both trials, but there was no difference
from rest during the 2nd h. During exercise and in
the 1st h after exercise, leg blood flow was significantly
greater for PRE than for POST.

Amino acid delivery to the leg (Ca 3 BF) at rest was
not significantly different between trials (Table 2).
During exercise, delivery was increased by ;650% in
the PRE trial and by almost 250% in the POST trial.
Delivery remained elevated above resting levels during
the 1st h after exercise for both trials but was not
increased in the 2nd h postexercise. Phenylalanine
delivery to the muscle was greater in PRE than POST
during exercise and the 1st h after exercise.

Plasma Insulin

Arterial insulin values for each time period are
shown in Table 3. Insulin levels significantly increased
after EAC consumption in each trial, i.e., during exercise
for PRE and immediately after exercise for POST.
Insulin remained elevated during the 1st h postexercise
in PRE and returned to resting levels by the 2nd h
postexercise in both trials.

Phenylalanine Uptake Across the Leg
Figure 4 shows the net phenylalanine uptake across
the leg measured over 3 h for the PRE and POST trials.
Net uptake of phenylalanine was ;160% greater in
PRE than in POST during the entire 3 h. The percentage
of ingested phenylalanine that was taken up by the
leg was almost threefold greater (P 5 0.01) during PRE
(21 6 4%) than during POST (8 6 2%), or 42 6 8 vs.
16 6 4% for PRE vs. POST, respectively, for both legs.
More phenylalanine remained in the muscle intracellular
pool of the leg at the end of the study in POST
than in PRE (P 5 0.04; 24 6 3 and 42 6 8 for PRE and
POST, respectively). Thus, over the 3 h of the study,
180 6 50 mg of phenylalanine were taken up and
incorporated into protein during PRE and 39 6 18 mg
during POST (P 5 0.02).

When these values are calculated for only the final
2 h of each trial, the differences narrow from the full
3 h and do not reach statistical significance, but the
trend for PRE values to be greater than POST remains.
Phenylalanine uptake for only the 2 h postexercise was
243 6 120 mg phenylalanine for PRE and 130 6 45 mg
phenylalanine for POST (P 5 0.19). The mean percentage
of ingested phenylalanine taken up by one leg in
the final 2 h postexercise only was 80% greater during
PRE (25 6 12%) than during POST (13 6 5%; P 5
Table 1. Mean arterial and venous phenylalanine enrichments and arteriovenous difference in enrichments
in PRE and POST trials

Rest Exercise 1 H Post-Ex 2 H Post-Ex
Artery PRE 0.088460.0134 0.072460.0084* 0.069160.0092 0.075960.0126
POST 0.088660.0165 0.068760.0108* 0.066460.0117 0.069160.121*
Vein PRE 0.065560.0087 0.068060.0078 0.064160.0079 0.066760.0092
POST 0.065660.0118 0.064360.0099 0.059860.0106 0.060160.0100
a-v Difference PRE 0.015160.0072 0.004460.0011* 0.005460.0018* 0.009260.0038
POST 0.023060.0049 0.004460.0010* 0.006760.0011 0.009060.0022
Values are enrichments 6 SE, expressed as tracer-to-tracee ratio (t/T). a-v, arteriovenous; PRE, value when essential amino acidcarbohydrate
(EAC) drink was consumed before exercise. POST, value when EAC was consumed after exercise. Rest, mean value for resting
time period. Exercise, mean value during exercise bout. 1 H Post-Ex, mean value for samples taken 0–60 min after exercise bout. 2 H Post-Ex,
mean value for samples taken 60–120 min after exercise bout. *Significantly different from Rest, P , 0.05.
Fig. 3. Muscle free intracellular concentration (IC) of phenylalanine
for 4 muscle biopsies during PRE and POST trials. *Significantly
different from biopsy 1 (rest), P , 0.05.
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0.20). Similarly, the mean amount of phenylalanine
taken up during the final 2 h after EAC ingestion (i.e.,
during exercise and the 1st h after exercise for PRE
and the 2 h after exercise for POST) in each trial was
195 6 37 mg for PRE and 130 6 45 for POST, P 5 0.14.
Phenylalanine Kinetics
Figure 5 summarizes phenylalanine Ra, Rd, and NB
for each time period during PRE and POST trials.
Phenylalanine Ra did not change significantly from
resting levels during or after exercise in either PRE or
POST. PRE and POST Ra values were not statistically
different at any time point. Rd increased from Rest in
the hour immediately after EAC consumption by 216%
during PRE (exercise) and by 60% during POST (1st h
after exercise) trials. PRE Rd was significantly greater
than POST Rd during exercise and in the 1st h after
exercise. Rd was not different for PRE and POST in the
2nd h after exercise.
During PRE, NB changed from negative at rest to
positive values during exercise and the 1st h postexercise.
During POST, NB was negative at rest and during
exercise but increased to positive values after exercise,
when the EAC drink was consumed. NB during POST
immediately returned to zero in the 2nd h after exercise.
NB was significantly greater during exercise and
in the 1st h after exercise in the PRE trial than in the
POST trial.

DISCUSSION

This study was designed to determine whether the
response of muscle protein metabolism to an EAC
solution was different if consumed immediately before
resistance exercise rather than immediately after resistance
exercise. Ingestion of EAC changed net muscle
protein balance from negative values, i.e., net release,
to positive net uptake, in both trials. However, the
total response to the consumption of EAC immediately
before exercise was greater than the response when
EAC was consumed immediately after exercise. Furthermore,
it appears that the change from a catabolic
state in the muscle to an anabolic state was primarily
due to an increase in muscle protein synthesis.
In the present study, the effectiveness of the drink
appeared to be greater when it was consumed immediately
before exercise (PRE) compared with immediately
after exercise (POST). Approximately 209 6 42
mg of phenylalanine were taken up across the leg in
the PRE trial, whereas only 81 6 19 mg of phenylalanine
were taken up during POST. Whereas the response
of muscle protein metabolism increased dramatically
and then declined within 1 h to basal levels
after EAC consumption in the POST trial, the response
was sustained in the PRE trial. Net balance increased
during exercise, declined slightly, and then increased a
second time after exercise when the drink was consumed
before exercise. The length of the effect, plus
higher blood flow during exercise in the PRE trial,
resulted in significantly greater total uptake over the
entire study period.

In this study, the primary end point was to examine
the impact of the timing of EAC ingestion in relation to
resistance exercise on net muscle protein synthesis
and, as a result, the accretion of muscle. Thus the
response over the entire 3-h study period is the most
appropriate to compare between trials. On the other
hand, it could be argued that the results are biased
toward the PRE trial by calculating the data over the
entire 3-h study period. During PRE, the entire 3 h
follows the consumption of EAC, whereas during
POST, only 2 of the 3 h follow EAC ingestion. As a
result, we also calculated the uptake across the leg
over only the final 2 h after exercise of each trial, i.e.,
the 2nd and 3rd h after EAC ingestion during PRE and
the 1st and 2nd h after EAC ingestion during POST.
Calculated this way, the gap between the trials narrowed,
but the mean uptake across the leg was still
*Significantly different from POST (P 5 0.013).

Table 2. Mean blood flow and delivery of phenylalanine to the leg for PRE and POST trials
Rest Exercise 1 H Post-Ex 2 H Post-Ex
Blood flow, mlzmin21 z100 ml LV21 PRE 4.5960.58 19.4662.24* 7.6461.73* 5.1460.74
POST 3.6760.46 11.0561.28*† 4.7260.36*† 3.3560.32
Phe delivery, nmolzmin21 z100 ml LV21 PRE 253632 1,8906396* 8286129* 539680
POST 191628 654680*† 506697*† 341659
Values are means 6 SE. Delivery of phenylalanine to the leg is calculated by blood flow 3 arterial concentration. LV, leg volume.
*Significantly different from Rest, P , 0.05. †Significantly different from corresponding PRE value, P , 0.05.
Table 3. Mean arterial insulin levels during 4 time
periods for PRE and POST trials
Rest Exercise 1 H Post-Ex 2 H Post-Ex
PRE 4.560.5 18.565.7 22.066.2 6.262.0
POST 4.160.8 8.562.4 27.065.8 6.661.2

Values are means 6 SE, expressed in IU/ml. Both PRE and POST
were significantly different across time, but individual significant
differences were not identifiable.

E202
80% greater for PRE than for POST (244 6 120 mg vs.
130 6 45 mg, respectively), although the difference did
not reach statistical significance (P 5 0.09). If anything,
comparing only the final 2 h of each trial biases
the results toward favoring the POST trial, because the
1st h after consumption of EAC during PRE is ignored.

Nonetheless, it is still evident that consuming EAC
before exercise is more effective than after exercise.Fig. 5. Muscle phenylalanine rate of appearance
from muscle (Ra), phenylalanine uptake from blood
(Rd), and net phenylalanine balance across leg
(NB) for 4 time periods during PRE (open bars) and
POST (solid bars). Rest, mean of 3 resting values.
Ex, mean of 4 samples taken during resistance
exercise. Hr 1 PE, mean of 4 samples taken during
the 1st h after exercise. Hr 2 PE, mean of 3 samples
taken during the 2nd h after exercise. *PRE
significantly different from POST, P , 0.05.
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on March 26, 2008 ajpendo.physiology.org Downloaded from

Effectiveness of the timing of EAC ingestion is supported
by comparing the amount of phenylalanine
taken up by the leg to the amount ingested in each
trial. During PRE, ;21% of ingested phenylalanine
was taken up by the leg, thus ;42% by both legs. The
proportion was much lower during POST, ;8% across
one leg or 16% for both legs. When EAC was consumed
1 h after exercise, ;125 mg of phenylalanine were
taken up across the leg (21), or about one-half of the
value found when EAC was consumed before exercise.
This represented ;11% of the ingested phenylalanine
for one leg, or 22% for both legs. When amino acids
were infused over a 3-h period after exercise, ;34% of
the infused amino acids were taken up across both legs
(6). Clearly, EAC consumption before exercise is more
effective than after exercise.These data do not allow us to determine definitively
the reasons for the greater response of net muscle
protein synthesis to consuming essential amino acids
plus carbohydrates immediately before exercise rather
than after exercise. However, it is likely that the
greater delivery of amino acids to the muscle during
PRE accounts for the greater net uptake than during
POST. During exercise in the POST trial, net muscle
protein balance, as well as phenylalanine Rd, an index
of muscle protein synthesis, was unchanged, whereas
in the PRE trial, phenylalanine Rd and NB were increased.
Consuming a source of amino acids before
exercise increases amino acid availability. Providing
amino acids at a time when blood flow is elevated, such
as during the exercise bout, maximizes delivery to the
muscle. Previous studies have demonstrated that muscle
protein synthesis is related to amino acid delivery
to the leg (5, 6, 27). Phenylalanine delivery during
exercise in the PRE trial was increased 6.5-fold over
resting levels and was more than twice that of POST.
Furthermore, delivery remained elevated after exercise
during PRE to a significantly greater extent above
that during POST. Similarly, in our previous study,
amino acid delivery was increased by EAC ingestion at
both 1 and 3 h postexercise (21) to levels comparable to
those obtained when EAC was consumed immediately
after exercise. Thus consumption of amino acids before
exercise results in greater amino acid delivery than
when they are consumed at various time points after
exercise, likely accounting for the greater response of
net muscle protein synthesis demonstrated during the
PRE trial.

Previously, we showed that hyperaminoacidemia
elicited by intravenous infusion of mixed amino acids
(6) and oral ingestion of both mixed and essential
amino acids (27) resulted in net muscle protein synthesis
after resistance exercise. In these studies, ;40 g of
amino acids were provided steadily over a 3-h period.
We also demonstrated that nonessential amino acids
are unnecessary to stimulate net muscle protein synthesis
at rest (28) or after exercise (27). Subsequently,
we examined the response of muscle protein metabolism
to ingestion of a smaller amount of essential
amino acids plus carbohydrates (21) identical to the
one used in the present study. Similar levels of net
muscle protein synthesis resulted when subjects consumed
the bolus amino acid-carbohydrate solution at
both 1 and 3 h after exercise (21). Taken together with
the present results, it is clear that a relatively small
amount of essential amino acids, combined with carbohydrates,
is a potent stimulator of net muscle protein
synthesis when given either before or at various times
after resistance exercise.

It is not possible to delineate the effectiveness of the
separate components of the drink from this study. We
have previously demonstrated that muscle protein synthesis
is stimulated by essential amino acids alone (27,
28). Even single essential amino acids in a flooding
dose may stimulate muscle protein synthesis (24). It is
more difficult to assign a role to insulin in the change
from net negative protein balance to positive protein
balance. After exercise, insulin seems to be necessary
for protein synthesis to occur (11, 12, 14), yet increased
insulin does not stimulate muscle protein synthesis (7).
However, elevated insulin after resistance exercise
does diminish the increase of muscle protein breakdown
in response to exercise (7). Consistent with this
notion, during the present study, phenylalanine Ra, an
index of muscle protein breakdown, did not increase
after exercise in either trial. Thus stimulation of muscle
protein synthesis by essential amino acids, in addition
to inhibition of the normal postexercise rise in
breakdown, likely accounts for the effectiveness of the
EAC drink for stimulating net muscle protein synthesis
after resistance exercise.

Determination of the response of the muscle in the
present study is based primarily on uptake of phenylalanine
across the leg. It is assumed that phenylalanine
uptake corresponds to accretion of muscle protein.
However, it is possible that all of the amino acids taken
up by the muscle are not incorporated into protein, but
instead some fraction of the uptake simply expands the
muscle free intracellular pool. The amino acids could
then be released at some time after the conclusion of
the measurements, without ever being utilized for
muscle protein synthesis. Thus it is possible that net
uptake overestimated the extent of net muscle protein
synthesis. However, even if we assume the unlikely
circumstance that all of the phenylalanine remaining
in the muscle intracellular pool at the conclusion of the
study would be subsequently released, the amount
does not appear to be a substantial proportion of that
taken up by muscle, especially in the PRE trial. During
PRE, 24 6 3 mg of phenylalanine were taken up by
muscle but not utilized for protein synthesis, in contrast
to 42 6 8 mg during POST. Thus the total amount
of phenylalanine taken up by the leg and utilized for
protein synthesis was ;180 mg (;86% of total uptake)
during PRE and ;39 mg (;48% of total uptake) during
POST. Clearly, even with this conservative estimate, a
large proportion of the phenylalanine taken up by
muscle was, in fact, utilized for muscle protein synthesis
during the study, further supporting the notion that
the EAC solution is an effective stimulator of muscle
protein anabolism.

In the fasted state, muscle protein breakdown exceeds
muscle protein synthesis, resulting in a net negative
muscle protein balance. Net positive muscle protein
balance can result only from an increase in muscle
protein synthesis and/or a decrease in muscle protein
breakdown. Resistance exercise alone has been shown
to increase muscle protein synthesis, but breakdown is
also increased, such that net muscle protein balance
remains negative (5). Additionally, net muscle protein
synthesis as a consequence of hyperaminoacidemia after
resistance exercise is primarily due to increased
muscle protein synthesis (6, 27). In our previous study,
increased muscle protein synthesis was responsible for
the change from a catabolic to an anabolic state after
ingestion of EAC at both 1 and 3 h postexercise (21).
Similarly, in the present study, it is likely that the
increase in NB from negative to positive after EAC
consumption in both trials was also primarily due to an
increase in muscle protein synthesis. Mean Rd, i.e.,
uptake of amino acids from the plasma pool, increased
dramatically (216 and 200% for PRE and POST, respectively)
after ingestion of EAC. The fact that phenylalanine
Ra, an indicator of muscle protein breakdown,
did not change in response to EAC ingestion
further supports the notion that the change of net
muscle protein balance from positive to negative is
primarily due to an increase in protein synthesis.
In the present study, our arteriovenous tracer methodology
has quantified only the fate of blood-borne
amino acids (25, 29). Because the incorporation of
amino acids from the EAC solution into muscle protein
was of primary interest, Rd and Ra calculated using
blood-borne amino acids seemed the most appropriate
measures. In past studies we have utilized a threecompartment
model of muscle protein metabolism to
describe the effects of nutrition and exercise on muscle
protein synthesis and breakdown (3, 5, 6, 14, 15, 27).
However, in the present study, the combination of
sampling in close proximity to exercise and a bolus
ingestion of amino acids has made the use of that
model problematic. That model requires an isotopic
and physiological steady state, as well as a measurable
gradient between blood and intracellular phenylalanine
enrichment. Instead, we calculated Ra and Rd by
use of data only from blood (25, 29). Whereas care must
be taken in interpreting Ra and Rd values from this
model (3, 30), it is the appropriate model to use in the
present study. The importance of the plasma amino
acids as a source for muscle protein synthesis is emphasized
in this study. Therefore utilization of Rd was
the appropriate parameter with which to compare the
effects of the timing of ingestion of the EAC drink.
Moreover, utilization of the blood-borne precursor for
measurement of Rd allows us to relate these values to
net muscle protein synthesis determined by phenylalanine
uptake.

The ingestion of a relatively small amount of essential
amino acids, combined with carbohydrates, is an
effective stimulator of net muscle protein synthesis.
The stimulation of net muscle protein synthesis when
EAC is consumed before exercise is superior to that
when EAC is consumed after exercise. The combination
of increased amino acid levels at a time when blood
flow is increased appears to offer the maximum stimulation
of muscle protein synthesis by increasing
amino acid delivery to the muscle and thus amino acid
availability.

We thank the nurses and staff of the General Clinical Research
Center (GCRC) at the University of Texas Medical Branch in
Galveston, TX. We also thank Dr. J. Rosenblatt for statistical assistance,
and the volunteers who participated in the studies for their
time and hard work.

This work was supported in part by Grants 8940 and 15489 from
the Shriners Hospitals for Children and National Institutes of
Health (NIH) Grant R01–38010. Studies were conducted at the
GCRC at the University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston,
which is funded by a grant (M01 RR-00073) from the National Center
for Research Resources, NIH.

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Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2006 Nov;38(11):1918-25. Links

Effects of supplement timing and resistance exercise on skeletal muscle hypertrophy.Cribb PJ, Hayes A.

Exercise Metabolism Unit, Center for Ageing, Rehabilitation, Exercise and Sport; and the School of Biomedical Sciences, Victoria University, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia.

PURPOSE: Some studies report greater muscle hypertrophy during resistance exercise (RE) training from supplement timing (i.e., the strategic consumption of protein and carbohydrate before and/or after each workout). However, no studies have examined whether this strategy provides greater muscle hypertrophy or strength development compared with supplementation at other times during the day. The purpose of this study was to examine the effects of supplement timing compared with supplementation in the hours not close to the workout on muscle-fiber hypertrophy, strength, and body composition during a 10-wk RE program. METHODS: In a single-blind, randomized protocol, resistance-trained males were matched for strength and placed into one of two groups; the PRE-POST group consumed a supplement (1 g x kg(-1) body weight) containing protein/creatine/glucose immediately before and after RE. The MOR-EVE group consumed the same dose of the same supplement in the morning and late evening. All assessments were completed the week before and after 10 wk of structured, supervised RE training. Assessments included strength (1RM, three exercises), body composition (DEXA), and vastus lateralis muscle biopsies for determination of muscle fiber type (I, IIa, IIx), cross-sectional area (CSA), contractile protein, creatine (Cr), and glycogen content. RESULTS: PRE-POST demonstrated a greater (P < 0.05) increase in lean body mass and 1RM strength in two of three assessments. The changes in body composition were supported by a greater (P < 0.05) increase in CSA of the type II fibers and contractile protein content. PRE-POST supplementation also resulted in higher muscle Cr and glycogen values after the training program (P < 0.05). CONCLUSION: Supplement timing represents a simple but effective strategy that enhances the adaptations desired from RE-training.

PMID: 17095924 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 01:08 AM
Obviously, the relevant application of what is discussed below, depends on the degree of glycogen maintained by the athlete. (amount of lean body mass vs. overall consistent carbohydrate intake)


J Sci Med Sport. 1998 Dec;1(4):195-202.Links

1997 Sir William Refshauge Lecture.

Skeletal muscle glucose metabolism during exercise: implications for health and performance.
Hargreaves M.

School of Health Sciences, Deakin University, Burwood, Australia.

Skeletal muscle glucose uptake and metabolism are major determinants of whole body glucose metabolism in response to exercise and insulin stimulation. An understanding of the mechanisms responsible for increased muscle glucose uptake under these conditions is crucial for identifying strategies that enhance insulin action and exercise performance. Regular exercise, by favourably influencing the intramuscular determinants of glucose uptake, enhances insulin action. For this reason, it is recommended in the prevention and management of disease states that are characterised by insulin resistance ("metabolic syndrome"). Increased skeletal muscle glucose uptake, as a consequence of carbohydrate ingestion, maintains carbohydrate supply to contracting muscle, at a time when glycogen levels are reduced, and is associated with enhanced performance. Thus, both health and exercise performance are influenced by the metabolism of glucose within skeletal muscle.

PMID: 9923727 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 01:17 AM
Food for thought...


Sports Med. 1998 Jan;25(1):7-23.Links


Human muscle glycogen metabolism during exercise. Effect of carbohydrate supplementation.

Tsintzas K, Williams C.

Department of Physical Education, Sports Science and Recreation Management, Loughborough University, Leicestershire, England. O.K.Tsintzas@lboro.ac.uk

Carbohydrate (CHO) ingestion during exercise, in the form of CHO-electrolyte beverages, leads to performance benefits during prolonged submaximal and variable intensity exercise. However, the mechanism underlying this ergogenic effect is less clear. Euglycaemia and oxidation of blood glucose at high rates late in exercise and a decreased rate of muscle glycogen utilisation (i.e. glycogen 'sparing') have been proposed as possible mechanisms underlying the ergogenic effect of CHO ingestion. The prevalence of one or the other mechanism depends on factors such as the type and intensity of exercise, amount, type and timing of CHO ingestion, and pre-exercise nutritional and training status of study participants. The type and intensity of exercise and the effect of these on blood glucose, plasma insulin and catecholamine levels, may play a major role in determining the rate of muscle glycogen utilisation when CHO is ingested during exercise. The ingestion of CHO (except fructose) at a rate of > 45 g/h, accompanied by a significant increase in plasma insulin levels, could lead to decreased muscle glycogen utilisation (particularly in type I fibres) during exercise. Endurance training and alterations in pre-exercise muscle glycogen levels do not seem to affect exogenous glucose oxidation during submaximal exercise. Thus, at least during low intensity or intermittent exercise, CHO ingestion could result in reduced muscle glycogen utilisation in well trained individuals with high resting muscle glycogen levels. Further research needs to concentrate on factors that regulate glucose uptake and energy metabolism in different types of muscle fibres during exercise with and without CHO ingestion.

PMID: 9458524 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 11:35 AM
....


1: J Appl Physiol. 2007 Apr;102(4):1604-11. Epub 2007 Jan 11. Links
Influence of preexercise muscle glycogen content on transcriptional activity of metabolic and myogenic genes in well-trained humans.Churchley EG, Coffey VG, Pedersen DJ, Shield A, Carey KA, Cameron-Smith D, Hawley JA.
1School of Medical Sciences, RMIT University, Melbourne, Australia.

To determine whether preexercise muscle glycogen content influences the transcription of several early-response genes involved in the regulation of muscle growth, seven male strength-trained subjects performed one-legged cycling exercise to exhaustion to lower muscle glycogen levels (Low) in one leg compared with the leg with normal muscle glycogen (Norm) and then the following day completed a unilateral bout of resistance training (RT). Muscle biopsies from both legs were taken at rest, immediately after RT, and after 3 h of recovery. Resting glycogen content was higher in the control leg (Norm leg) than in the Low leg (435 +/- 87 vs. 193 +/- 29 mmol/kg dry wt; P < 0.01). RT decreased glycogen content in both legs (P < 0.05), but postexercise values remained significantly higher in the Norm than the Low leg (312 +/- 129 vs. 102 +/- 34 mmol/kg dry wt; P < 0.01). GLUT4 (3-fold; P < 0.01) and glycogenin mRNA abundance (2.5-fold; not significant) were elevated at rest in the Norm leg, but such differences were abolished after exercise. Preexercise mRNA abundance of atrogenes was also higher in the Norm compared with the Low leg [atrogin: approximately 14-fold, P < 0.01; RING (really interesting novel gene) finger: approximately 3-fold, P < 0.05] but decreased for atrogin in Norm following RT (P < 0.05). There were no differences in the mRNA abundance of myogenic regulatory factors and IGF-I in the Norm compared with the Low leg. Our results demonstrate that 1) low muscle glycogen content has variable effects on the basal transcription of select metabolic and myogenic genes at rest, and 2) any differences in basal transcription are completely abolished after a single bout of heavy resistance training. We conclude that commencing resistance exercise with low muscle glycogen does not enhance the activity of genes implicated in promoting hypertrophy.

PMID: 17218424 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 11:51 AM
Untrained subjects...but yeah....



1: Metabolism. 2006 May;55(5):570-7. Links

Liquid carbohydrate/essential amino acid ingestion during a short-term bout of resistance exercise suppresses myofibrillar protein degradation.

Bird SP, Tarpenning KM, Marino FE.

School of Human Movement Studies, Charles Sturt University, Bathurst, NSW 2795, Australia. sbird@csu.edu.au

A number of physiological events including the level of contractile activity, nutrient status, and hormonal action influence the magnitude of exercise-induced skeletal muscle growth. However, it is not the independent action of a single mechanism, but the complex interaction between events that enhance the long-term adaptations to resistance training. The purpose of the present investigation was to examine the influence of liquid carbohydrate (CHO) and essential amino acid (EAA) ingestion during resistance exercise and modification of the immediate hormonal response on myofibrillar protein degradation as assessed by 3-methylhistidine (3-MH) excretion. After a 4-hour fast, 32 untrained young men (18-29 years) performed a single bout of resistance exercise (complete body; 3 setsx10 repetitions at 75% of 1-repetition maximum; 1-minute rest between sets), during which they consumed a 6% CHO (n=8) solution, a 6-g EAA (n=8) mixture, a combined CHO+EAA (n=8) supplement, or placebo (PLA; n=8) beverage. Resistance exercise performed in conjunction with CHO and CHO+EAA ingestion resulted in significantly elevated (P<.001) glucose and insulin concentrations above baseline, whereas EAA ingestion only increased the postexercise insulin response (P<.05). Time matched at 60 minutes, the PLA group exhibited a peak cortisol increase of 105% (P<.001) with no significant change in glucose or insulin concentrations. Conversely, the CHO and CHO+EAA groups displayed a decrease in cortisol levels of 11% and 7%, respectively. Coinciding with these hormonal response patterns were significant differences in myofibrillar protein degradation. Ingestion of the EAA and CHO treatments attenuated 3-MH excretion 48 hours after the exercise bout. Moreover, this response was synergistically potentiated when the 2 treatments were combined, with CHO+EAA ingestion resulting in a 27% reduction (P<.01) in 3-MH excretion. In contrast, the PLA group displayed a 56% increase (P<.01) in 3-MH excretion. These data demonstrate that not only does CHO and EAA ingestion during the exercise bout suppress exercise-induced cortisol release; the stimulatory effect of resistance exercise on myofibrillar protein degradation can be attenuated, most dramatically when the treatments are combined (CHO+EAA). Through an "anticatabolic effect," this altered balance may better favor the conservation of myofibrillar protein.

PMID: 16631431 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 12:02 PM
Uses cyclists, but interesting nonetheless......


1: Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2005 Oct;37(10):1768-73. Links

Effect of carbohydrate and prolonged exercise on affect and perceived exertion.

Backhouse SH, Bishop NC, Biddle SJ, Williams C.

Carnegie Research Institute, Carnegie Faculty of Sport and Education, Leeds Metropolitan University, Leeds, United Kingdom. S.Backhouse@leedsmet.ac.uk

INTRODUCTION: It has been reported that perceptions of exertion are attenuated during prolonged cycle exercise, following CHO ingestion. However, no studies to date have examined the influence of such feedings on psychological affect during prolonged exercise, even though affect and perceived exertion are different constructs. PURPOSE: To examine the influence of regular CHO beverage ingestion on affect (pleasure-displeasure) and perceived exertion during prolonged cycle exercise. METHODS: In a randomized, double-blind, counterbalanced design, nine endurance trained males cycled for 2 h at 70% VO2max on two occasions, separated by 1 wk. On each occasion, they consumed either a water placebo (PLA) or a 6.4% carbohydrate-electrolyte solution (CHO) immediately before they cycled (5 mL x kg(-1) body mass) and every 15 min thereafter (2 mL x kg(-1) body mass). Pleasure-displeasure was assessed before, during, and after the prolonged bout of cycling. RESULTS: During exercise, reported pleasure initially improved and was subsequently maintained in the CHO trial, in contrast to a decline reported in the PLA trial. Ratings of pleasure-displeasure were more positive during recovery in the CHO trial compared with the PLA trial (P < 0.05) and the only significant increase (P < 0.05) in pleasure occurred 15 min postexercise in the CHO trial only. RPE increased (P < 0.05) over the course of the bout of cycling and was lower (P < 0.05) 75 min into exercise in the CHO trial. Immediately postexercise, plasma glucose concentration was higher in the CHO compared with the PLA trial (P < 0.05). A main effect of trial was found for plasma cortisol concentration, with higher values reported in PLA trial. CONCLUSION: Results suggest that CHO ingestion enhanced feelings of pleasure during and following prolonged cycling and highlighted the importance of assessing not only "what," but also "how" a person feels.

PMID: 16260979 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

jdeity
03-27-2008, 12:06 PM
hmmmmmm, slim you'd know the ins and outs on this I think - would carbohydrate influence endorphins/endogeneous opiod peptides? Or is it a completely different mechanism than the traditional, supposed anyways, understanding of the 'runner's high'?

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 12:09 PM
Post-exercise glucose....



J Strength Cond Res. 2004 Feb;18(1):174-9.Links

Effects of liquid carbohydrate ingestion on markers of anabolism following high-intensity resistance exercise.

Thyfault JP, Carper MJ, Richmond SR, Hulver MW, Potteiger JA.

Department of Physiology, Brody School of Medicine, East Carolina University, Greenville, North Carolina 27858, USA. thyfaultj@mail.edu.edu

We examined the effects of liquid carbohydrate (CHO) supplementation on markers of anabolism following high-intensity resistance exercise. Nine resistance-trained men consumed either CHO or placebo (PLC) 10 minutes before and immediately following 2 resistance exercise sessions. Cortisol (CORT), insulin (INS), ammonia (AMM), and glucose (GLU) were measured before, immediately after, and 1.5 and 4 hours after exercise. Urinary nitrogen (NH(+3)) was measured 24 hours before and after exercise. There was a significant difference in INS levels immediately after exercise and 1.5 hours after exercise. No significant differences were observed for CORT, AMM, GLU, or NH(+3)between treatments. Significant within-group differences were found for the PLC group: CORT before compared with immediately after exercise; INS before compared with immediately after exercise and before compared with 1.5 hours after exercise; and AMM before compared with immediately after exercise and before compared with 1.5 hours after exercise. Significant within-group differences were found for the CHO group: CORT immediately after compared with 1.5 hours after exercise and immediately after compared with 4 hours after exercise; INS before compared with 1.5 hours after exercise; and AMM before compared with immediately after exercise. Liquid CHO ingestion leads to a more favorable anabolic environment immediately following a resistance exercise bout; however, our indirect measures of protein degradation were not altered by CHO ingestion.
PMID: 14971964 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 12:29 PM
High Glycogen, Intermittent running, additional carbohydrates



Carbohydrate Availability and Muscle Energy Metabolism during Intermittent Running.
M
ed Sci Sports Exerc. 2007 Dec 4; [Epub ahead of print]

PURPOSE:: To examine the influence of ingesting a carbohydrate-electrolyte (CHO-E) solution on muscle glycogen use and intermittent running capacity after consumption of a carbohydrate (CHO)-rich diet. METHODS:: Six male volunteers (mean +/- SD: age 22.7 +/- 3.4 yr; body mass (BM) 75.0 +/- 4.3 kg; V O2max 60.2 +/- 1.6 mL.kg.min) performed two trials separated by 14 d in a randomized, crossover design. Subjects consumed either a 6.4% CHO-E solution or a placebo (PLA) in a double-blind fashion immediately before each trial (8 mL.kg BM) and at 15-min intervals (3mL.kg BM) during intermittent high-intensity running to fatigue performed after CHO loading for 2 d. Muscle biopsy samples were obtained before exercise, after 90 min of exercise, and at fatigue. RESULTS:: Subjects ran longer in the CHO-E trial (158.0 +/- 28.4 min) compared with the PLA trial (131.0 +/- 19.7 min; P < 0.05). There were no differences in muscle glycogen use for the first 90 min of exercise (~2 mmol of glucosyl units per kilogram of dry matter (DM) per minute). However, there was a trend for a greater use in the PLA trial after 90 min (4.2 +/- 2.8 mmol.kg DM.min) compared with the CHO-E trial (2.5 +/- 0.7 mmol.kg DM.min; P = 0.10). Plasma glucose concentrations were higher at fatigue in the CHO-E than in the PLA trial (P < 0.001). CONCLUSIONS:: These results suggest that CHO-E ingestion improves endurance capacity during intermittent high-intensity running in subjects with high preexercise muscle glycogen concentrations. The greater endurance capacity cannot be explained solely by differences in muscle glycogen, and it may actually be a consequence of the higher plasma glucose concentration towards the end of exercise that provided a sustained source of CHO for muscle metabolism and for the central nervous system.

Slim Schaedle
03-27-2008, 12:40 PM
On that one I just posted, I am going to see if I can get the entire thing to more closely examine the exercise protocol and method of intermittent exercise, since it could have closer relevance to strength training if their style was more HIIT-ish.

Nevertheless, the fact that muscle glycogen was not a major factor in fatigue, and enhanced blood glucose levels provided counteraction to this, the case could be made that maximizzing blood glucose prior to strength would aid in maxmizing perforance throughout the 1-1.5 hour workouts typically employed by us, and other athletes.


It goes without saying, that a large pre-workout dextrose/sguar drink would contribute immensly to blood glucose levels, even when muscle and liver glycogen stores are maximized.

As I said, I need to look into this study deeper.

bjohnso
03-27-2008, 08:26 PM
I ate about 260g of carbs before working out today (about 56 from dextrose) and set some PRs on a cut. I'll have to give it more time to say conclusively what the effect of pre-workout carb intake is on me, but so far it looks promising.

Slim Schaedle
03-28-2008, 12:26 AM
Berardi.....I believe this dude is rather smart, popular, and accomplished.

But I guess anyone could get a PhD by looking at past research studies and building upon it. :clown:


Precision Nutrition for 2002 and Beyond
By John M Berardi
First published at www.t-mag.com, Dec 7 2001.

Post-workout nutrition. Pre-workout nutrition. Mid-workout nutrition. Over the last year, you've heard a whole lot about these topics and for good reason. Whether you're a strength or endurance athlete, the correct nutrients before, during, and after exercise can dramatically impact your muscle mass and recovery.

A few weeks ago at the annual Society for Weight Training Injuries Specialists (SWIS) symposium, I gave a 90-minute presentation detailing how skeletal muscle adapts to resistance exercise training. In addition, I discussed how general nutrition as well as pre- and post-workout nutrition could maximize this adaptation. The following article is adapted from that presentation and it's probably the most advanced, comprehensive article T-mag has ever published on the topic.

Put your thinking caps on and let's delve into the details of why you'd better be paying close attention to what you consume around training time.

Skeletal Muscle Adaptation to Resistance Exercise and the Effects of Nutrition - How You Get Hyoooge!

The purpose of this article is to present a case for the importance of nutrition in terms of the adaptation to resistance exercise. My argument, while hopefully light and free of the burdens of complex and intimidating research jargon, is founded on dozens of research studies. Here's what's on the menu:

Muscle Protein Composition
Effects of a Single Bout of Resistance Exercise
Effects of Long-Term Resistance Training
Muscle Signaling and Protein Turnover
Interactions Between Training and Nutrition
Let's dig in.

Muscle Protein Composition

When most weightlifters think of muscle protein, protein synthesis, and protein breakdown, they undoubtedly think only of contractile protein. In the world of muscle physiology we call this portion of muscle the myofibrillar protein. However, this preferential focus on contractile protein is a big mistake since muscle protein synthesis and degradation processes are constantly occurring with respect to the other muscle proteins as well. The other muscle proteins include sarcoplasmic protein and mitochondrial protein.

Sarcoplasmic proteins are located in the free fluid portion of the cell and include proteins like the anaerobic enzymes, some structural support units, RNA, receptors, etc. Mitochondrial proteins are located in the mitochondrion - the cell's metabolic machine - and these proteins include the aerobic enzymes, the structural proteins making up the mitochondrion, RNA, and receptors. Each of these proteins are important in the response to exercise and therefore should be recognized.

Effects of A Single Bout of Resistance Exercise

A single bout of resistance exercise is both a catabolic and an anabolic event. The stress on the body is serious, but the mechanism by which the body recovers leads to growth. I want to focus first on the catabolic events induced by exercise, then we'll look closer at the anabolic events.

The Catabolic Events (The Bad Part)

In response to a single bout of resistance exercise, the following catabolic events occur:

Glycogen Depletion - Studies have shown that performing 10-rep sets of biceps curls and leg extensions leads to a significant depletion of stored muscle carbohydrates. One set of biceps curls leads to 12% depletion while three sets of biceps curls leads to 25% depletion. Three sets of leg extensions lead to 35% depletion, while six sets of leg extensions lead to over 40% depletion. A typical bodybuilding workout may consist of many more sets per muscle group and this may lead to even further depletion of muscle glycogen.

Decreased Net Protein Balance - (Protein Breakdown > Protein Synthesis) In a fasted state, muscle protein status is negative. This means that more protein is broken down than is synthesized and that leads to muscle protein loss. Now, when resistance exercise (both moderate and intense) is performed in a fasted state (after an overnight fast or several hours after a meal), protein status drops even more during the few hours following the exercise bout. This means that you're losing even more muscle protein. Although this protein loss isn't all contractile protein, all of the degraded protein must be replenished via protein synthesis when recovery needs to take place.

The question you should be asking yourself at this point is: "If protein status is negative after training, why don't people get smaller and waste away with resistance exercise?" Well, the answer is simple. Although protein status is negative during the first few hours following resistance exercise, this catabolism shifts toward anabolism later on. The body begins to build muscle after a certain point and this protein anabolism seems to peak at 24 hours after the training bout.

Increased Resting Metabolic Rate - After intense resistance exercise, the body's resting metabolic rate increases by about 12 to 24%. Interestingly, the bigger you are, the more muscle you'll damage in training and the more your metabolism may increase.

Increased Blood Cortisol Concentrations - Studies aren't totally conclusive on this point due to the daily variability of the measure (cortisol concentrations fluctuate widely based on the time of day). I believe that the evidence is fairly convincing that intense exercise leads to an increase in this catabolic hormone. Some studies have shown a doubling in cortisol concentrations after resistance exercise.

Acute-Phase Response - The Acute-Phase Response is an immune and inflammatory response that's triggered when muscle is damaged. This process leads to further tissue injury and destruction as well as the production of free radicals.

The Anabolic Events (The Good Part)

In response to a single bout of resistance exercise, the following anabolic events occur:

Increased skeletal muscle blood flow - During exercise, blood is shunted to the working muscle. This is often called "the pump." This blood delivers nutrients to fuel the muscular work.

Increased anabolic hormones - There are short-lived increases in the anabolic hormones GH, Testosterone, and IGF-1 both during and after exercise. However, people have definitely overestimated the significance of these transient increases in hormone concentrations. I hate to commit a mortal sin here, but the endocrine response to exercise probably has little to do with increasing muscle mass. The small, short lived increases in these hormones are far too brief to really affect muscle mass.

Acute-Phase Response - Wait a minute, didn't I include this in the catabolic section? Yes, I did. You see, while the beginning of the acute-phase response is catabolic, later on the response becomes anabolic.

The Acute-Phase Response

After each resistance exercise bout (assuming you've trained like a T-man), you're going to be sporting some muscle damage. This damage is most likely due to the eccentric (negative) component of the exercise and may manifest as large areas of dead or dying tissue. Once this damage occurs, an immune response is launched and this immune response is put in place to try to destroy and dispose of the dead tissue. So far, so good.

However, the immune cells (leukocytes, macrophages, etc) often don't know where to stop and continue to destroy and dispose of undamaged tissue. This is where the catabolism comes in. Now, not only are we missing contractile proteins as a result of the exercise bout (original damage), but we're missing protein that was undamaged during the exercise but destroyed by the immune response (chemical mediated damage).

Thank goodness the destruction stops here. The immune response, after its nasty destructive binge, leads to the activation of satellite cells. Basically, satellite cells are immature nuclei (nuclei contain the cell's DNA) that hang out on the periphery of the muscle cell. When the immune system kicks up, the satellite cells are stimulated to proliferate and move to the site of the injury.

Simultaneously, growth factors from a place outside the cell called the extracellular matrix are brought into the cell. These two things lead to muscle repair. The satellite cells create new proteins to replace the destroyed contractile proteins. In fact, they do such a nice job that the muscles end up bigger and stronger than they were before the bout.

Effects of Long Term Resistance Exercise Training

It's no secret that resistance training leads to increases in muscle size (hypertrophy) and muscle strength. Next, let's discuss how the muscle adapts to this type of training.

There's an increase in the size, number, and strength of myofibrils (contractile/structural protein). As muscle damage is repaired and protein synthesis elevated, a few things occur. First, the old myofibrils (not the muscle fiber itself) split in two, and when they're repaired there are two new contractile units available for growth.

Second, brand new myofibrils are added to the periphery of the muscle cell, leading to a larger muscle cell. Third, the new myofibrils added will be better suited to the demands of the activity. Powerlifting training will lead the fibers to behave more like the fast twitch Type II-B fibers (fastest available) while bodybuilding training will lead fibers to behave more like the fast twitch Type II-A fibers (still fast twitch, but slower).

There's an increase in the size and strength of connective tissue. Myofibrils are contained within muscle fibers and muscle fibers are grouped together to form muscle fiber bundles. A connective tissue sheath surrounds each bundle of muscle fibers within the whole muscle. This connective tissue adapts to resistance training by showing increases in size and strength parallel to the fiber itself.

There's an increase in stored substrate. As a result of training, there's more glycogen (carbohydrate) and triglyceride (fat) storage within the muscle. This makes more fuel readily available for exercise.

There's an increase in muscle-water content. Due to the increased carbohydrate storage (carbohydrates hold about four times their weight in water) and larger fiber size, more water is present in a trained muscle.
There's an increase in muscle enzyme content and activity. As a result of resistance training, there's an increase in the content of the enzymes of the ATP/PC system and glycolytic system.

There's an increase in nervous system efficiency. As a result of resistance training, the nervous system becomes more coordinated and efficient in terms of muscle recruitment/activation and firing frequency.

I hope it's clear that the genetically driven program of adaptation is a sound one. Adaptations occur to make the body more efficient at doing what it habitually does.

Protein Turnover and Muscle Signaling

At this point, I'd like to address a theory I have regarding physiological adaptation. This theory is based on the concept of tissue turnover. As I've discussed before, all tissues of the body go through a regular program of turnover. Most often people talk about skin turnover. We all know that old skin is degraded and dies off while new skin is synthesized to take its place. This occurs more rapidly when we experience some type of tissue injury (like a sunburn). Well, the same holds true for all tissues of the body. The only thing that's different is the rate at which this occurs.

Muscle protein is no exception to this rule. It's constantly being turned over. And turnover is the balance between protein breakdown and protein synthesis. The rate at which this turnover occurs is dependent on your nutritional intake, exercise habits (the damage caused), and genetic programming.

Understand here that this protein tissue turnover is what allows the muscle to adapt. Therefore, the goal should be to dramatically increase your protein turnover rates. Yes, that's right, I want you to increase your protein turnover and this includes protein breakdown! The funny thing is that everyone wants to decrease their protein breakdown with "anti-catabolic supplements," but that's a bad thing. Let me show you why.

When you first begin a training program, your goal is to lift heavy weights and have big slabs of beef hanging from your skeleton. However, at the start, your muscles are certainly weak and small compared to what they will be. So when faced with what you want them to do, they can't do it; they're dysfunctional.

So how do you make a muscle more functional? You destroy it! And that's what training does for you. When you go to the gym, your muscle is inadequate so you lift weights to make it stronger. This process destroys the dysfunctional muscle and signals the cell to synthesize a new protein to take its place. This protein will certainly not be the same as the previous protein. It'll be bigger and stronger, better suited to what it thinks it'll have to do in the future.

But what happens if another bout of exercise doesn't come after that? Well, as the natural tissue turnover process occurs, that strong muscle will be destroyed and replaced by a weaker one. See how it works? The body is constantly re-creating itself by breakdown and subsequent resynthesis based on what you ask it to do. It really is a beautiful system. Let's look at this process in a little more detail.

As I stated, breakdown is always occurring and is necessary for tissue remodeling. This breakdown, in conjunction with extra cellular amino acids (primarily from the diet), helps to expand the intracellular amino acid pool. When the nucleus is stimulated, the DNA contained within undergoes a process called transcription. Transcription is the process by which a specific group of RNA molecules are formed (mRNA, rRNA, tRNA). These RNA molecules are specific for the signal that interacted with the nucleus.

In the second phase of protein making, the RNA units are stimulated by a process called translation. This signal is responsible for the ultimate protein. The mRNA and rRNA units are the "template" or "blueprint" for protein formation. The tRNA units are responsible for picking up the amino acids and laying them down on this template to form the protein. The two phases of protein formation are regulated independently and I want to briefly discuss this.

New data in the research world is beginning to explain how muscles respond to the exercise signal. This is one proposed model. Basically, when eccentric exercise leads to mechanical stress on the membrane (pulls it apart), a series of chemical events occur within the cell. These chemical events form a messenger system that ultimately stimulates the nucleus. This stimulation leads to the formation of specific RNA molecules (transcription) that may, if all the other cellular conditions are right, lead to more muscle protein and a larger muscle. Remember, transcription is only part of the equation. Translation is also required.

Another major signaling pathway in the muscle is the insulin-signaling pathway. This pathway is elegant because once the insulin molecule binds to the cell membrane, it sets in motion two different chemical messenger systems that accomplish three goals. This system increases transcription (DNA formation), increases glucose uptake into the cell, and increases the translation of the cellular DNA into protein. Although there are other pathways that stimulate translation, the insulin pathway is the most important nutritional one.
The insulin-signaling pathway is dependent on nutrients to run properly. Carbohydrates are necessary for insulin release. The amino acid leucine is necessary to run one part of the pathway that stimulates translation, and the essential amino acids are necessary to lay down on the template to form the protein. Ahh, things are all coming together now.

To better remodel your muscle, you need to destroy the dysfunctional protein (keep tissue turnover rates high) and you need to exercise to stimulate the nucleus. This stimulation will lead to transcription or the creation of a specific blueprint for a better muscle. The insulin signaling pathway completes the protein making process by stimulating the translation of the blueprint into a protein. When all this comes together you end up with a muscle more suited to your activity pattern.

The next question most people ask me is, "Do high rates of muscle protein turnover, when synthesis is greater than breakdown, always lead to huge muscles?" The answer is no! What happens to the muscle is dependent on the signal that stimulates the nucleus. If the signal is a weight-training signal, the RNA as well as the ultimate protein formed will lead to big muscles. In this situation, increasing the size and the strength of the myofibrils is the priority.

However, if the signal is an endurance training signal, the RNA formed as well as the ultimate protein formed will lead to more metabolic muscles. In this situation, the priority is an increase in oxygen delivery and consumption. Because it's the exercise signal and not the nutritional signal that determines the adaptation, weightlifters and endurance athletes should have a common goal of increased protein breakdown (destruction of the old protein) coupled with an even higher increase in protein synthesis (formation of a better protein). In my opinion, nutritional needs of the two types of athletes are strikingly similar.

So, I hope I've convinced you that high rates of tissue turnover are important regardless of which type of athlete you are. But knowledge without action is powerless. Next, I want to show you how to do it.

Interactions Between Resistance Exercise and Nutrition - What to Consume to get Hyoooge!

What's the most important nutritional consideration for maximizing the adaptive potential of muscle? The answer: Total daily energy intake.
There are a few requirements for high rates of tissue turnover and they're all dependent on a high energy input. High rates of tissue turnover are very energy expensive so extra calories are needed to run this circuit. You see, your time in the gym is also very energy expensive and so is the hypermetabolism and muscle repair that follows your workout. If the body doesn't get adequate energy supplies (in the form of calories), it obviously can't optimally perform all the functions of exercise, repair, and tissue turnover.

The first system to suffer in this equation will be your tissue turnover rates. If you don't eat enough daily calories, this system will slow down so that less energy is needed and the energy to fuel the workout and recovery is provided by the destruction of tissues. But in this case, remodeling suffers.
Interestingly, this has implications for your body composition/body fat as well as muscle function. The loss of weight isn't always an indicator of inadequate calorie intake. As described above, the body will slow down tissue turnover in response to under eating. Since tissue turnover is expensive, your energy needs decrease and you remain weight stable. However, as mentioned, your tissue remodeling will suffer.

When you increase calories, the first thing to occur will be the increase in tissue turnover rates. This will dramatically raise calorie needs. Depending on your calorie intake, you may end up either losing weight (turnover increases more than calories), remaining weight stable (turnover matches calorie intake), or increasing muscle weight (turnover is less than intake). But the benefit here is that when tissue cycling rates are high, even if you're losing weight or remaining weight stable, the body is being remodeled in a positive and functional way. Again, the key is a high calorie intake.

Recovery Nutrition

The next important nutritional issue to address is recovery nutrition. Here I'll address how the provision of liquid nutrients in and around the workout can lead to positive changes in the catabolic and anabolic events associated with a bout of resistance exercise. In addition, I'll make specific recommendations about what to take during and around the workout to maximize recovery and the adaptation to the exercise.

The provision of liquid nutrients during and after exercise is important for several reasons. First, an anabolic environment is created, as the exercise and insulin signals are both stimulating cellular activity. Second, such nutrition can shift the net protein status in a positive direction so that muscle protein is being built in and around the workout. Third, muscle recovery is superior due to replenishment of muscle substrates. And fourth, nutrients are rapidly delivered for energy provision when it's most needed.
Below I'll list the ideal beverage composition for both workout and post-workout drinks. After, I'll discuss the literature that supports these recommendations.

Sip immediately before and during exercise:

Carbohydrates (0.4 to 0.8g/kg) - The carbohydrate content of your drink should contain high GI carbohydrates that are easily digested. I recommend a 50/50 blend of glucose and maltodextrin.

Protein (0.2 to 0.4g.kg) - The protein content of your drink should contain easily digested and assimilated proteins like hydrolyzed whey.

Amino Acids (3-5g of each) - The BCAA (Branched Chain Amino Acids) may be important as they're the main amino acids oxidized during exercise. The provision of BCAA during exercise decreases net cellular protein breakdown. In addition, glutamine may spare muscle glutamine concentrations and maintain immune homeostasis during training and recovery.

Creatine (3-5g) - Creatine intake increases work capabilities during exercise, increases recovery of ATP-PC homeostasis, and may increase muscle mass directly/indirectly.

Water (2 L) - The amount of water you consume with such a beverage is crucial since digestion will suffer if you have a beverage that's too concentrated. A solution of 4 to 8% is ideal for proper digestion and hydration during exercise. Any more concentrated and many of those nutrients will be completely wasted. To calculate concentration, remember 10g of total powder in 1L is a 1% solution while 100g of total powder in 1L is a 10% solution.

Editor's Note: Based on these recommendations, John formulated Biotest Surge as the perfect pre- and post-workout drink. (Biotest did not include creatine, however, because some people just don't want it or respond to it. Adding creatine would have also driven up the price, but you can certainly add creatine to your Surge drink if you like.)

After exercise:

Repeat the above beverage but add 500mg of vitamin C and 400IU of vitamin E.

Here's a sample calculation of what a 220lb (100kg) person would need:


Pre/During Exercise

40g-80g of carbohydrate (50% glucose - 50% maltodextrin)
20g-40g of hydrolyzed protein
3-5g each of creatine, glutamine, BCAA
2L water (80g CHO + 40g PRO + 5g Creatine +5g Glutamine +5g BCAA = 135g of nutrients. In 1L of water this would be a 13.5% solution and too concentrated. In 2L of water this is about 6.75% and the concentration is just right).

Post Exercise

40g-80g of carbohydrate (50%glucose-50%maltodextrin)
20g-40g of hydrolyzed protein
3-5g creatine each of glutamine, BCAA
1L - 2L water
500mg vitamin C, 400IU vitamin E

Support for these recommendations

Pre and Mid-Workout Benefits

The benefits of such a beverage during exercise include:

Rapid provision of fuel - Supplementation can provide fuel when it's needed most. Liquid, easily digestible nutrients can be digested, absorbed and delivered in a matter of minutes while whole food meals can take hours to reach the muscle.

Maintenance of blood glucose - Blood glucose can decrease during exercise, leading to local muscular as well as central fatigue. Supplementation can maintain blood glucose concentrations and delay fatigue.

Maintenance of muscle glycogen - As shown earlier, six sets of leg extensions can deplete thigh glycogen by over 40%. Supplementation with liquid carbohydrate during repeated sets of leg extensions can help prevent such a large decrease in muscle glycogen. Compared with the normal 40% decline in muscle glycogen, subjects supplemented with carbohydrate only experienced a 20% reduction of muscle glycogen.

Increased muscle blood flow - While some theorize that the digestion of this drink will draw blood away from the muscle and toward the gastrointestinal tract, this couldn't be further from the truth. Since the recommended drink is so easily digested and the stimulus to send blood to the muscle is so strong, blood flow to the muscle will actually increase with such a drink.
At rest, blood flow to the muscle is quite low. However, during exercise muscle blood flow increases by almost 150%. When a carbohydrate and amino acid drink is taken pre/during the workout, the blood flow during the workout increases by about 350%. This is a very powerful effect since there's significantly more blood going to the muscle and this blood is packed with anabolic nutrients!

Increased insulin concentrations - By increasing insulin concentrations and delivering more of this insulin to the muscle, the extra glucose, amino acids, and creatine that are in the blood will be more readily taken up into the muscle. Studies have shown that the more insulin available in the blood, the more prominent the tissue building effect. The highest insulin response noted (over 1000% increase) was induced by a carbohydrate, protein, and amino acid beverage with the same proportions of nutrients as recommended above.

More positive protein balance (see "positive protein status" below)

Post-Workout Benefits

Rapid fuel provision for recovery needs (same as above)

Decreased post-exercise cortisol concentrations - After exercise, cortisol concentrations can increase to concentrations 80% higher than resting values. The provision of a carbohydrate supplement can lower the cortisol response to exercise by about half. This means that post exercise cortisol concentrations with supplementation will only be about 40% higher when compared to resting concentrations.

Increased insulin concentrations - By increasing insulin concentrations, the extra glucose, amino acids, and creatine in the blood will be more readily taken up into the muscle.

Rapid glycogen replenishment - After exercise, if nutrients aren't provided, glycogen replenishment won't occur. In one study, a resistance exercise protocol depleted muscle glycogen by 33%. If no meal was consumed and muscle glycogen was measured four hours later, muscle glycogen remained depleted. If a 230-calorie beverage was consumed (either carbohydrate alone, or a macronutrient blend) immediately after exercise, glycogen was fully restored in the four hours.

Stimulation of protein synthetic pathway - Below, I've listed values for protein synthesis under different treatment conditions. Each percent increase is relative to fasting baseline values.

Insulin Treatment - 50% higher
Amino Acid Infusion - 150% higher
24 Hours Post-Exercise - 100% higher
Amino Acids Immediately Post-Exercise - 200% higher
Amino Acids and Carbohydrate Immediately Post-Exercise - 350% higher
Amino Acids and Carbohydrate Given Immediately Pre-Exercise - 400% higher

It should be obvious that pre- and post-workout drinks dramatically stimulate protein synthesis.

Positive protein status - When fasted, during exercise and immediately post exercise, protein status is negative (more protein is being lost than is being retained). With feeding, protein status increases so that more protein is retained than lost. If liquid nutrients are given after exercise, the protein status becomes positive very quickly with the highest increase in the group that gets carbohydrate and amino acids immediately before exercise.

In all post-exercise situations where nutrients are provided, protein breakdown is accelerated (as we'd expect and as I recommend), but the increases in protein synthesis outweigh the increases in breakdown and lead to large increases in protein retention.

Anabolic hormone changes seen with exercise are relatively unaffected - Testosterone decreases slightly after exercise when any type of food is consumed but the change is small and won't impact muscle mass. In addition, while GH declines with carbohydrate intake at rest, after exercise the signal to release GH is very strong and is unaffected by nutritional supplementation. Therefore a drink given post exercise won't diminish any small effects that the anabolic hormones may have on the body.

Prevention of free radical damage - The vitamin C and E recommendations are in place to help prevent excess free radical induced cellular damage. The exercise itself as well as the acute phase response leads to free radical production. The antioxidants may save the cell from free radical damage.

Rapid ATP/PC recovery - Intense resistance exercise leads to the loss of substrate from the ATP/PC system. Creatine supplementation can help the body more rapidly resynthesize these substrates.

Conclusion

At this point I must be completely frank by acknowledging potential critics. Some may argue that the data supporting these recommendations are incomplete. They may argue that there are no studies showing that using a Biotest Surge type of beverage will improve athletic performance or increase muscle mass. They will argue that there are no proven benefits to such a blend.

In response I must concede that they're correct, at least partially. There are no such long-term studies at the present time. However, in our laboratory and others, research is currently being conducted to address these concerns. But, as we all know, research takes time. So what does one do until the debate is settled?

You could certainly stay on the fence and wait until the data are in. However, in the mean time, I believe that the evidence and real world feedback weighs in strongly that such a beverage will offer significant benefits. And as Arnold Schwarzenegger said in the movie Pumping Iron, "All these things are available to me. And if they are available to me, I might as well use them."

I'll go one step further in saying that you should use them.

Slim Schaedle
03-28-2008, 12:51 AM
A little tid-bit about "sugar crash."

http://www.criticalbench.com/pre-workout-meals.htm



Pre Workout Meals
By Mark Strasser M.S. CSCS of CriticalBench.com


Maintaining your strength and energy level is essential when training or competing on a highly intense level. The food you eat is a big factor on how you perform.


During exercise athletes primarily rely on pre-existing glycogen stores and fat stores. If your pre-workout meal is eaten at the proper time then you will be assured that your glycogen stores are plenty full and this will optimize performance. Liquid meals can also be an advantage by digesting more rapidly than solid foods as well as provide hydration. Liquid meals can be eaten closer to workouts because they are emptied from the stomach quickly.


Pre-workout snacks within 1 hour of competition or practice can be more beneficial to athletes that exercise longer than 60 minutes.


It is important to choose primarily carbohydrates before a workout because they are quickly digested, and readily available for fuel.



Drink adequate amounts of fluid (avoid dairy). The American College of Sports Medicine recommends 17 ounces of fluid two hours before exercise, as well as enough fluid during exercise to replace the water lost through perspiration. A rule of thumb is to drink enough water to urinate clear prior to a workout. For the first hour of aerobic exercise use water only. Use electro-light replacement drinks after the first hour of exercising.


Use caution with foods that have a high sugar content (such as soft drinks and candy). Since athletes' metabolism is higher than the average person they may experience a drop in blood sugar following consumption, which can result in light-headedness or fatigue and loss in performance.

Slim Schaedle
03-28-2008, 11:08 AM
A topic I actually wrote about for Built's article.....





mattclark 08-17-2006 02:49 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Muscle Glycogen vs. Liver Glycogen

This is a rather vast, open ended question.

Aside from where they are stored, what is the major difference in the two in terms of how they are used?

I guess what I'm getting are things like:

Why is dextrose better than sucrose or fructose pre workout?
Does a muscle glycogen depletion workout effect liver glycogen in any way?


I know this has been discussed here and I even vaguely remember reading it in some threads, but for some reason search is sometimes like finding a needle in a haystack.

Thanks.
lylemcd 08-17-2006 02:56 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by mattclark
This is a rather vast, open ended question.

Aside from where they are stored, what is the major difference in the two in terms of how they are used?

I guess what I'm getting are things like:

Why is dextrose better than sucrose or fructose pre workout?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Becaue fructose is preferentially used by the liver and works poorly to refill mucle glycogen
that said, adding a small amount of fructose (perhaps 10% of the total) to post-workout drinks can be beneficial

Quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Does a muscle glycogen depletion workout effect liver glycogen in any way?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


If it did, it would be indirectly. Liver glycogen exists to sustain blood glucose levels, muscle glycogen is for local muscular use. if muscle glycogen depletion increases teh rate of blood glucose ptake into muscle, that might mandate more need for the liver to release/produce glucose to sustain blood glucose levels

Why?

mattclark 08-17-2006 03:17 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for the response.

Im interested simply for my own knowledge. I mean, I currently eat some smarties before a workout because dextrose is "good for muscle glycogen" but thats the extent of my understanding. I have a post workout shake that contains milk so my post workout sugar is mostly lactose. But, to me, I'm not sure why or what that means physiologically.

I guess I want to be able to talk some of the talk or at least really know whats going on when Im doing what Im doing.

I dont quite understand why fructose would be good post workout. Wouldn't you want dextrose to replace the depleted muscle glycogen?

lylemcd 08-17-2006 03:20 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by mattclark
I dont quite understand why fructose would be good post workout. Wouldn't you want dextrose to replace the depleted muscle glycogen?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


two things

1. liver glycogen is a major determinant of the body's overall anabolic status, refilling it post-workout helps with anabolism

2. some ingested glucose can actually be used by the liver, as I recall, adding some fructose helps get glucose through the liver faster

Lyle

mattclark 08-17-2006 03:22 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ahhh. That actually makes a lot of sense.

So pre workout dextrose for better workout performance, post workout fructose for anti-catabolic effects.

Excellent. Thanks.

Slim Schaedle
03-28-2008, 11:17 AM
"Real Life" evidence that some people do not tolerate pre-glucose well, and feel sick...as described in other threads...


Pattos 06-15-2006 02:47 AM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carbs pre-workout, can't do it!

hi.
i was hoping people could answer a few questions for me:
1)
i know people recommend eating carbohydrates pre-workout,
complex carbs, with low GI (starches preferred), and post)_workout should be high glycemic carbs, first i would like to know what's the quickest, highest GI carb aside from dexterose? will sugar table (sucrose) do the trick?
2)
and second: each time i eat carbs before workout i always feel either weak\tired or sick during the training session. All of my best workouts always take place when i don't eat any carbs at least 4 hours before my workout.
what's wrong with me???

(when i say workout, i mean weight lifting, usually rep range 8-12).

thanks in advance!

Slim Schaedle
03-28-2008, 03:22 PM
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ddegroff
03-28-2008, 05:09 PM
Are you bored on spring break Slim?

Or is this a quest for something?

It's good info but what are you trying to prove? Just curious.

Built
03-28-2008, 05:10 PM
Don't you know? Slim's OCD!


<giggles>

ddegroff
03-28-2008, 05:12 PM
^Haha. That's why I'm thinking spring break.

Slim Schaedle
03-28-2008, 05:18 PM
It's good info but what are you trying to prove? Just curious.

Prove? Nothing.


Examine? Everything.


I have received several PMs thanking me for this thread and the varied info it presents, so I might as well roll with it.

If anything, someone could link it to a newbie asking questiuons, or for debate purposes if an issue on the topic were to arise.

Slim Schaedle
03-28-2008, 05:23 PM
Don't you know? Slim's OCD!


<giggles>

I prefer dedicated.


And perhaps, motivated. ;)

bjohnso
03-28-2008, 05:28 PM
It's a good thread. There is a ton of good info here.

Slim Schaedle
03-28-2008, 05:44 PM
From Maki, another one of our own......

Also touches on fructose, which was part of the topic I provided Built with for her article.



The Fat Loss King - An Interview With Lyle McDonald (Part III)

For the final interview I‘ve decided to throw some commonly-asked questions at Lyle--questions which are forever appearing on the message board. I figured this would make for an interesting, informative piece, and perhaps put to rest some of the debates that frequent the various forums… or add more fuel to the fire. I'm sure you'll find that this read will equip you with new insights on some controversial topics.

Wannabebig: For some time now, doctors, trainers and coaches have had an ongoing problem with people who complain of weight-gain even though they’ve been exercising vigorously. The standard diagnosis in fitness circles says that a diet lacking in calories is the culprit. In most cases, many are told that it's because their body’s metabolism is cruising along at a snail’s pace. The body, in fact, has been storing the food as fat instead of distributing it as needed. Is there any truth to this?

Lyle M: Over the years, there's been a long held debate over the fact that people swear that they can gain weight (or not lose weight) on low calories. There's typically been two interpretations of the data: either there are people out there who's metabolism are just so far outside of the norm that they violate basic laws of thermodynamics OR that people are just really ****ty at estimating how much food that they eat and how much exercise they do.

Wannabebig: I think that the majority of the exercising population fails to pay attention to certain areas such as portion control which, in turn, takes them several steps backward instead of forward.

Lyle M: A number of recent studies support the latter conclusion. The fundamental problem with most of these reports is that they are self-reported. That is, you ask
people how much they are exercising and they say "A ton, at high intensities" and then you ask how much they are eating and they say "Oh, almost nothing." Then you actually track them covertly and you find that most people are vastly over-estimating how much exercise they are doing, and vastly under-estimating how many calories, they are burning. These mis-estimations can vary by 50% either way (that is people may over-estimate their activity by 50% and under-estimate their caloric expenditure by 50%). In addition, I want to make it clear: I'm not saying that these people are doing it deliberately, or lying. Most people are simply very bad at this sort of thing.

Now, that said, don't misunderstand me: there are most certainly adaptive decreases in metabolism with dieting that do occur. This, of course, reduces maintenance calorie needs. Now, part of the reduction simply has to do with the weight loss itself. Both resting metabolic rate and the calorie burn during activity (moving around and exercise) are related to bodyweight; so less weight means fewer calories burned (if you don't believe me, put a 10 lb weight in a backpack and carry it around all day, tell me how much more tired you are from the extra workload). Carrying around 100 lbs of fat burns a lot of calories.

Wannabebig: No thanks; I have enough trouble carrying around my stomach as it is.

Lyle M: But there is also an adaptive component that is a drop in metabolic rate beyond what can be explained by the drop in bodyweight. This gets back to the leptin system I talked about earlier: the body down regulates total metabolism during dieting to compensate and dropping leptin appears to be the main signal involved.

Now, during extreme dieting, either extended periods to very low body fat percentages, or simply very low calorie dieting, this adaptation tends to be the greatest. In one of the classic studies (the Minnesota Semi-starvation study), lean men were put on 50% of maintenance calories for 24 weeks. They pretty much lost all of their body fat and had a reduction in total energy expenditure of 36%, of which 16% was part of the adaptive response. However, their maintenance calorie requirement never went below their caloric intake. Now, that's a very extreme reduction, 5-10% is closer to average. That is, the adaptation to low calorie dieting, even extremely low calorie dieting is NEVER large enough to suddenly bring that person back into positive energy balance. You see a 5-10% reduction in resting metabolic rate at the maximum.

So say you have someone with a total energy expenditure of 2000 calories/day. Now you put them on 800 cal/day. Let's assume the same level of adaptation as seen in the Minnesota study (which is the largest value I've ever seen): 36%. So, after a while, their energy expenditure is down 36%. That's 720 calories, giving them a new maintenance level of 1280. Fine, yes, that will certainly slow weight loss, but they are still in a caloric deficit. They don't magically start getting fat again *unless* they start overeating.

Wannabebig: And, sad as it is, most will start over-eating again.

Lyle M: Basically, I've seen no evidence in the studies (done over 3 decades where food and activity are rigorously controlled, and that's the key) that daily maintenance calories can ever somehow drop below caloric intake during low calorie dieting. Yes, it will adapt and I've seen it literally stop fat loss in its tracks. And certainly, if you jack up calories rapidly under those conditions (a depressed metabolic rate), you're going to get rapid fat gain. However gaining fat on super low calories has more to do with people being terrible at estimating their caloric intake and expenditure.

Ultimately, it comes down to the following discrepancy: in controlled lab studies where caloric intake and expenditure are rigorously controlled and measure (and I'm talking they spray these folk's plates with water and make them drink the mush so they know *exactly* how many calories they are eating), the observation of someone gaining weight on super low calories has NEVER been observed. That's over decades of study and lord knows how many subjects. Then we have these self-reports of folks gaining weight while dieting, coupled with more studies showing that people usually underestimate food intake and over-estimate activity.

I hate to be a party pooper but people are deluding themselves.

Wannabebig: Well I'm sure you've been asked this question many times, but since it's always being debated I have to ask you. There's a nasty myth in circulation right now claiming that only 30 grams can be taken in. How much protein can the body assimilate at one time?

Lyle M: Well, I think part of the problem has to do with what you mean by 'assimilate'. That is, you sometimes see the '30 grams per meal' (or whatever it is) to mean how much the body can digest, utilize, or what have you. But nobody seems to really want to nail down what they are talking about.

Wannabebig: Ok, let me rephrase the question: "how much protein can the body handle in one sitting?"

Lyle M: I consider all of this "The body can only use X grams per Y" as a lot of nonsense. First and foremost, it makes no evolutionary sense (how I've been looking at a lot of physiological processes lately). That is, our ancestors did not eat protein in small amounts throughout the day. Yet, anthropological studies show that they had more muscle and bone mass than most of us. Rather, they were more likely to eat a ton of protein after a kill, and whatever amount they got from vegetables and such the rest of the time. Massive protein intakes at once were more likely the norm during 99% of our evolution than not. This means that our guts evolved to handle it. In addition, when you start looking at digestion and such, you see exactly that: even with massive protein loads (I vaguely recall they've looked at like 1.5 g/kg of beef all at once), digestion still stays very high (on average 90-95% for animal proteins meaning you're losing at most 10 grams of protein/100 grams ingested). The body can digest/absorb pretty much anything you throw at it. You won’t be pooping protein if you eat 35 grams at a sitting, is what I'm saying.

Now, a slightly separate issue might be one of how much protein (amino acids really) the liver can handle at once. If the recent studies on whey vs. casein have pointed anything out, it's that flooding the liver with amino acids at a high rate leads to increased amino acid oxidation (burning) in the liver. I suppose it's conceivable that high protein intakes at any given meal could be having this effect. I suspect it depends on the source of the protein (whole food which digests slowly vs. protein powders which digest faster). That is, consuming, say, 50 grams of whey protein at once might lead to more waste (mainly as amino acids oxidized and then converted to urea) than 50 grams of casein or beef. But that's more an issue of speed of digestion than amount per se.

Wannabebig: So how much protein can the body use for growth?

Lyle M: In terms of supporting optimal growth, an interesting discrepancy actually occurs here between the studies on our ancestral diet and the protein needs of athletes, but nobody has an explanation yet. Good studies by Peter Lemon, Mark Tarnopolsky, etc. support a maximum protein requirement for natural lifters of about 1.8 g/kg (a little less than the 1 g/lb that bodybuilders have used for years). But studies of our ancestral diet suggest protein intakes as high as 2.5-3 g/kg. Nobody is quite sure if this protein intake was simply a side effect of the diet our ancestors followed, or if it had some actual benefit.

Finally, I think the whole 30 g/meal (or whatever) thing can't possibly apply to everyone. I mean, at the low end, figure a 210 lb lifter is eating 210 grams of protein per day. If he's limited to 30 grams/meal, that means seven meals minimum per day. Obviously, if there is some limit to protein absorption/assimilation/digestion/utilization (and I don't honestly think that there is) it's going to be related to body mass: a larger individual needs more protein and would be able to utilize protein in larger amounts than a smaller person. Ultimately, my hunch is that the whole '30 grams per meal' (or whatever) thing came from one of two places:





Early supplement companies trying to convince lifters why their protein product (containing 30 grams) was better than others. I remember one company pulling a scheme like this, when their product contained like 37 grams of protein, they wrote that 37 grams was the maximum that could be absorbed. When they bumped it to 42 grams of protein per serving, 42 became the magic number. Ah, advertising.


Bodybuilders rationalizing what they had already decided to do. That is, you frequently see bodybuilders and other athletes finding a strategy that works (i.e. eat protein at intervals throughout the day) and then making up physiological rationalizations afterwards. It wouldn't really surprise me if that weren't the case here. Of course, if anybody has a single piece of peer-reviewed research supporting this 30 grams myth (everybody seems to claim to have seen it but nobody seems to ever have it; it's like those friend of a friend stories), they can feel free to send it to me care of lylemcd@onr.com



Wannabebig: How much muscle can a person gain? Bryan Haycock states that theoretically a trainee could put on 20 pounds in 4 weeks and 60-100 pounds in a year’s time by an individual using anabolic steroids. Most people realize that theory and real-life results don't always go hand-in-hand. Variables such as protein synthesis, proliferation and differentiation of satellite cells, environment, hormonal levels etc. all play big roles. Given a perfect playing field, do you think that this is achievable and how much can the average natural lifter gain in a year?

Lyle M: What he actually said on the HST forum (www.hypertrophy-specific.com) was: "Theoretically, with heavy drug use, a human could probably put on 20 pounds in 4 weeks. That same person could probably put on 60-100 pounds in 12 months. I have never personally seen anyone do this though."

Unfortunately, all of the theoretical calculations tend to be exactly that, theoretical. Moreover, they never seem to pan out because they ignore the body's ability to adapt to just about anything. So short-term studies looking at bumps in protein synthesis after training (which can be used to calculate theoretical maxes over a year or what have you) ignore the fact that the body will also be increasing rates of protein breakdown as you get larger.

On top of that, you have hormones, nutrition, optimizing training, etc.

But ignoring all of that, I think that 20-25 lbs in the first year by a natural lifter would be average. Again, that assumes they get even most of it right in terms of training and diet (on top of rampant training mistakes, most people simply don't eat enough to put on mass at an appreciable rate). After that, it's harder to predict. Another 10 lbs in the second year, maybe 5-10 lbs more total after that; so you're looking at maybe 40 lbs total for a natural lifter. Women would probably make maybe half of that naturally. I think that's going to close to the limit for your average natural trainee.


Wannabebig: How flawed is the Glycemic Index?

Lyle M: Ah, another quickly answered question. Sure. As usual, I'm going to be wordy as hell and look at GI from both the pro and con parts of the debate. IF readers are wondering, this is how I at least try to look at stuff. That is, rather than trying to say "X good, Y bad", I look at it from a cost/benefit or pro/con point of view. It's part of why I'll never be a billion dollar best selling diet book author; I won't give people absolute answers when that's what they want. But that's another rant for another day.

Wannabebig: How about explaining to readers who aren’t familiar with it, what the glycemic index is all about.

Lyle M: The glycemic index (GI) is a measure of how a given food affects blood glucose. It was originally developed for diabetics, for whom blood glucose regulation is literally a matter a life and death. To measure GI, subjects are given either 50 or 100 grams of a reference carbohydrate (they used to use glucose, now they use white bread) and blood glucose concentrations are measured. Technically, they are measuring the area under the curve of blood glucose versus time. This is given an arbitrary value of 100. Then they give 50 or 100 grams (I think they are using 50 grams of digestible carbohydrate now since it's a more realistic portion) of the test carbohydrate, measure area under the curve, and compare the two. So if a food only has 60% of the effect on blood glucose as white bread, it's given a GI of 60. A food with 110% of the effect on blood glucose has a GI of 110. And I really want to make the point that GI is a relative scale. The numbers don't mean anything, they are simple arbitrary values. You could call white bread 1 and give foods a value of 0.6 and 1.1 for all it would matter. The 100, 60, and 110 don't mean anything, they are just relative rankings.

Now, before the GI, the assumption was always that simple carbohydrates (think sugars and fruit) would digest more quickly and be worse for diabetics than the complex carbohydrates (starches and such). The early studies on GI showed this to be false. It turned out that the sugars fructose (which is handled mainly by the liver) and sucrose (which is half glucose and half fructose) had much lower GI's than more complex carbs. Potatoes had a very high GI, so did carrots (more on this in a second). Table sugar had a lower GI than many complex carbs, which threw a real wrench into the whole issue. We can generalize that less refined foods have lower GI's than more refined foods but it's not even that consistent. It's turning out that the type, form, structure of the carbohydrate are all having an impact.Everybody thought that this would really revolutionize diabetic meal planning and, of course, athletes picked up on it because glucose/insulin control is important for them. But there were some immediate problems.

Wannabebig: What were some of the problems?

Lyle M: The first is how GI is measured, by giving folks 50 grams (again, digestible carbohydrates, fiber doesn't count) of that food alone. Some foods can't be tested. I mean, how much lettuce would it take to get 50 grams of digestible carbs. A metric ton is how much. Of course, those types of foods really aren't the problem.

But what about carrots? Folks got their panties in a twist because carrots were shown to have a high GI. But you'd have to eat enough carrots to get 50 grams of carbohydrates. That's like 9 or 10 carrots in a sitting. Worrying about the carrot shards in your salad while dieting is missing the point.

Now, this led to one easy solution, the concept of the glycemic load, which is simply the amount of carbohydrate (in grams) times the GI. So say you want to compare two foods, one with a GI of 50 and the other with a GI of 100. In terms of glycemic load, you could eat twice as much of the first food as of the second.

That is, 10 grams of the first food (GI = 50) gives a glycemic load of 500. 5 grams of the second (GI = 100) gives a glycemic load of 500 as well. The next problem is that people don't just eat carbs at a meal (well, many do but they shouldn't). It turned out that adding protein, fat and fiber to a meal almost universally lowered GI (most likely by slowing digestion which decreases how quickly glucose hits the bloodstream). There were also problems with individual response, and the fact that most foods hadn't been tested (at this point, this last criticism isn't that big of a deal).

Wannabebig: Maybe I'm getting ahead of myself, but does the insulin index come into play somewhere along here?

Lyle M: Hold your horses. Recently, more research has identified another problem: although glucose is a problem for diabetics, insulin management is equally crucial (the fundamental problem in diabetics is related to insulin). It was always assumed that changes in insulin and blood glucose would be identical but it turns out not to be the case. One group of researchers has recently identified an 'Insulin Index’, which is a measure of the actual insulin response to various carb foods. And while GI and insulin index are related, they aren't always consistent. For example, adding protein to a meal does lower the GI, but some studies show it increases the insulin response at the same time. Oh what to do? Eventually you reach the conclusion that you just shouldn't eat anything at all.

Anyway, the argument over GI usually goes along these lines.




GI is good, because it lets us predict the blood glucose (and maybe insulin) response to foods.

Yeah, but it's only valid if you eat that food by itself, as long as you eat protein, fat and fiber at each meal, GI doesn't really matter.

Maybe not, but research in diabetics does show that mixed meals with low GI foods still give better blood glucose control than meals with high GI foods.

Well, ok, but GI is a bitch to use, most foods haven't been tested, and it's just not practical in the real world. And if you’re worrying about insulin, GI may not predict the insulin index.

Well, you're an idiot.

Oh yeah, your mama



Wannabebig: Hah! #6 is sure to ignite some debate amongst the white coats.

Lyle M: Around and around it goes and it's always fun to watch scientists bitch at one another over stuff like this. It never quite gets to stages 5 and 6 but it's not far off.

My opinion, GI is one of many nutritional factors that can be useful, but don't get too hung up or psycho about it. As I mentioned above, as long as you get sufficient protein, fat and fiber with each meal, the GI of a food becomes much lower and the GI concept ceases to have much relevance. For diabetics, yes, GI is probably far more important.

Regular exercise, maintaining a low/normal body fat percentage, all of the other behaviors that bodybuilders and athletes engage in makes GI much less important because the body is so much better at handling blood glucose and insulin.

Of course, there are other good reasons to pick unrefined, high fiber carbs besides the low GI. They tend to promote more fullness, have more micronutrients, etc. But, overall, I don't think that the GI concept per se is that big of a deal, especially not if you're eating protein, fat and fiber at each meal (as I think folks should be). That's on top of regular training to maintain glucose disposal and insulin sensitivity, keeping body fat under control, etc.

Wannabebig: So, what would you say to sum things up?

Lyle M: I guess, I don’t know that the GI concept is inherently flawed, it simply has some real limitations in terms of application, and I think it only has a huge relevance to certain groups (diabetics).

Wannabebig: Let's switch gears here and look at muscle hypertrophy, and at how glycogen super compensation may be a focus area for supplement companies in the future. We all know that a happy muscle (full of glycogen) is one that will produce more work thus leading to a more 'intense' (I'm using the term "intense" loosely) workout.

Lyle M: Ok, lemme go into one of my page long 'quick' tangents and talk about this. First, I agree about avoiding debates over intensity, too many competing definitions. Instead, I want to talk about the role of glycogen levels on weight training performance.

Semi-surprisingly, but maybe not, the studies on the topic don't generally show a decrease in performance with weight training during glycogen depletion (or improvements with super compensation). Of course, there are some problems, the main one being that most of the studies are only testing performance over a set or two. Unless glycogen is really really depleted, a single set or two isn't going to tax stores.

As well, fatigue during a single set isn't limited by glycogen stores (generally). Rather, it's caused (depending on rep range/set time) on lactic acid buildup and neural factors. So, in theory at least, glycogen stores shouldn't matter. OF course, in reality, we know that's bunk. Unless you're doing very low volume training, your ability to perform well across multiple sets is going to be affected by glycogen stores.

Which leads to another tangent, related to glycogen compensation, training volume and growth. The energy stores of a muscle are involved in how well growth can proceed. For example, during a set, levels of ATP drop (technically the ATP/ADP ratio goes up). In response to this, little buggers called eukaryotic initiation, factors (EIF's) stop working. Now EIF's help to turn on ribosome activity (ribosomes take messenger RNA and make proteins out of amino acids). Once ATP levels are repleted, EIF's activate ribosomes again and protein synthesis can take place.

The point being that cellular energy depletion tends to 'tell' the cell what's relatively more or less important. Under most circumstances, short-term energy repletion is more important than anything else (in this case protein synthesis). Basically, if you’ve depleted muscle glycogen extensively, you can't really grow until you replete it. Depending on diet, that can take 1-3 days (depending on depletion as well). The body doesn't do two things at once well under most circumstances (this was a point that Duchaine/Zumpano made nearly 20 years ago in their Ultimate Diet and they were absolutely right). That is, if you deplete glycogen and stimulate growth, your body will tend to refill glycogen first, and worry about growth second.

Now, most people training high volume (assuming average genetics) are training each body part infrequently. By the time, they've refilled glycogen; the stimulus for growth is gone (mRNA and increased ribosome activity is pretty short-term, 36 hours or so). I suspect this is part of why these types of folks invariably grow better on higher frequently, lower volume training (think Hardgainer philosophy or my buddy Bryan Haycock's Hypertrophy Specific Training). Not only are they not significantly depleting glycogen because of the lower volume (meaning no real need for repletion), but also they are able to train more frequently and keep growth (via mRNA and ribosome activity elevation) going better. Now, most people training high volume (assuming average genetics) are training each body part infrequently. By the time, they've refilled glycogen; the stimulus for growth is gone (mRNA and increased ribosome activity is pretty short-term, 36 hours or so). I suspect this is part of why these types of folks invariably grow better on higher frequently, lower volume training (think Hardgainer philosophy or my buddy Bryan Haycock's Hypertrophy Specific Training). Not only are they not significantly depleting glycogen because of the lower volume (meaning no real need for repletion), but they are able to train more frequently and keep growth (via mRNA and ribosome activity elevation) going better.

Wannabebig: Interesting stuff. Now, what about those who use anabolic substanceslike testosterone? Many people who've dabbled with or are frequent users of this drug have found they can get away with a higher volume of sets. Does this have anything to do with their glycogen stores?

Lyle M: Interestingly enough, a thing about glycogen repletion is that testosterone increases the body's ability to replete glycogen (and store more of it). So take a steroid user or someone with high normal testosterone (i.e. not me); they are the folks who can do high volume training and grow well. They can pack so much glycogen into their muscles that they don't really deplete it that much in the first place; and in response to training they can refill glycogen so quickly that they can still get growth even training very infrequently. This is sort of a tangential benefit of testosterone (ab) use among athletes; in addition to direct effects on protein synthesis, by affecting glycogen storage, you get overall increased growth. That would be on top of any cellular hydration based mechanisms.

But the point of where this started: glycogen super compensation does appear to make people marginally stronger, most likely via purely mechanical/leverage means (water storage in the muscle). But it's not really an effect of having more glycogen per se; because glycogen levels aren't (typically) what limits performance. However, glycogen stores are still important from the standpoint of growth for other reasons.

Wannabebig: With all these new methods and the revolving factor of 'refeeds', 'carb ups' and/or 'binge days' being the center of attention, people are going to be looking at trying to minimize the spill-over of glucose and maximize glycogen stores. Supplements such as Alpha Lipoic Acid, Vanadyl Sulfate, Chromium Picolinate, Glutamine and drugs such as snythetic Glycogenin (not yet approved for human consumption--at least to my knowledge) Metformin and Phenformin are being explored increasingly. Do you think that any of the above-mentioned have had any noteworthy effect on glycogen storage?

Lyle M: Lipoic acid definitely works but it takes high doses (gram plus per day) which gets pricey. Honestly, most people never really got much out of chromium or vanadyl (maybe at high doses). I think using glutamine for glycogen repletion is an inefficient way to do it; I know what Poliquin (who has popularized the approach) is trying to do, I just think it's very expensive for what it does. I wasn't aware that they were working on a synthetic glycogenin drug, interesting. I've used Metformin (or was it Phenformin) years ago and it definitely improved the quality of my old Bodyopus carb-ups (even as crappy as they were): more glycogen storage and less spillover. So I think they have some utility here.

So yeah, I think they have some benefit but it depends on what you're trying to do. Someone with normally good muscular insulin sensitivity (these people tend to stay lean while putting on muscle, get great pumps during training, etc) probably won't get much out of him or her. But they might be worth trying for other people.

Wannabebig: What do you think is the most effective method for shuttling glucose into the muscles and bringing about greater glycogen storage?

Lyle M: Well, the classic method of increasing glycogen stores is with prior depletion. Back in the 50's, the endurance folks did 3 days of low carbs with glycogen depletion followed by 3 days of high-carbs and reduced training. They were able to push glycogen stores far above normal levels that way. As with the weight training studies, while it didn't increase the speed at which they could go (equivalent to strength in weight training), it let them maintain that speed for longer periods (equivalent to doing multiple sets in weight training).

Later research showed that you didn't have to go to that extreme: regular training plus a high carb diet leads to higher than normal glycogen storage anyhow (athletes run higher levels of muscle glycogen than non-athletes for this reason).

A recent study (I saw it, like a week ago) showed that you can actually get super compensation of muscle glycogen (quads) in 24 hours which runs contrary to old belief which says it takes 2-4 days or so. They had guys cycle for something like 250 seconds at 100% of VO2 max followed by 30 seconds at 130% of VO2 max. Then they gave them 10 g/kg carbs over the next 24 hours. They achieved near maximal glycogen levels. So, if your explicit goal were to max out glycogen stores, for some reason, you would first want to deplete (meaning high volume, high reps: sets in the 45-60 second range which maximizes glycogen use) and then eat carbs like they were going out of style. This was what the Bodyopus diet was doing.

Wannabebig: If someone were to incorporate training as a way of increasing their stores they would basically train using higher than normal volume and eat carbs post- workout like a pig.

Lyle M: Yes. Muscular contraction increases glucose uptake into the muscle cell (via increased levels of the transporter, GLUT-4). As well, glycogen depletion leads to increases in levels of the enzymes which store glycogen (glycogen phosporylase and glycogen synthase).

If you were trying for super compensation (as opposed to just maintaining normal or high-normal levels), you'd want to go for nearly full depletion (which takes quite a bit of volume) followed by one or more days of very high carbs (10 g/kg lean body mass in the first 24 hours, 5 g/kg in the second 24 hours).

Using lipoic, acid or one of the other insulin mimetics might very well either:

a. increase the levels of glycogen you achieved
b. speed up the process (so you could carb-load faster).


Wannabebig: Speaking of carbs and glycogen replenishment--what would you say is the best post-workout method for enhancing muscle recovery and promoting protein synthesis?

Lyle M: It really depends on which part of recovery you're focusing on. Unfortunately, most authorities only focus on one part of the big picture.

In simplistic terms, you need to be worried about two recovery factors in terms of optimizing growth (this assumes that your workout stimulated it which is a separate issue: local and systemic recovery. The first is local glycogen recovery, along with the provision of amino acids. Part of this ties into refilling muscular glycogen stores as quickly as possible (as per the question above), so that protein synthesis can take place. You get the most rapid rate of glycogen storage right after the workout so this is the best time to do it. Additionally, study after study after study show that raising insulin (via carbs) along with amino acid levels (via protein intake) improves post workout protein synthesis.

A recent study actually showed that pre-workout carbs/protein (and we're not talking large amount: it was like 30 grams carbs, 6 grams essential amino acids) improved post-workout protein synthesis better than post-workout carbs. The reasons is likely one of timing: even if you slug a shake immediately after your workout: it's still 30 minutes before it gets to your muscle. Take a drink right before training, and it's there as soon as the workout ends. Of course, I'd suggest people do both.

Recommendations below.

But muscular recovery is only part of the picture; you're only dealing with local factors. There is also a systemic factor to consider, in terms of the body's overall metabolism (anabolic or catabolic to be simplistic). This is being controlled mainly by liver metabolism. Now, liver metabolism doesn't get talked about very much, it's not a very 'sexy' topic. But it is important to overall growth. Keeping the liver in a fed state (by maintaining levels of liver glycogen) keeps the body in a more anabolic state. You maintain insulin levels better, which means better IGF-1 levels (although blood borne IGF-1 really isn't that important to muscular growth, contrary to what most people believe), you get better thyroid conversion, the higher insulin also helps unbind testosterone from SHBG (sex hormone binding globulin) and keeps cortisol down. etc. etc.



Wannabebig: Most publications, studies, and fitness experts talk about Fructose being a carbohydrate that should not be a bodybuilder’s first choice when it comes to a post-workout shake. Why is that?

Lyle M: Well, intensive training depletes liver glycogen quickly because of the hormonal response. That means that, depending on diet, length of your workout, etc. you are entering a systemically catabolic state as you come out of the workout because of the shift in liver metabolism. Correcting that and returning to an anabolic, state is part of overall recovery and growth.

Now, while glucose is the main fuel for muscle glycogen (quite in fact, fructose can't be taken into the muscle cell, there's no transporter), it doesn't do a very good job of replacing liver glycogen. 80% or more of ingested glucose goes straight through the liver, to get to the muscle. Fructose, on the other hand is primarily liver fuel. Now, I know that a lot of people have made an issue of how *excess* fructose converts to triglycerides and this is an issue with massive amounts (which you see in the general public because of too much sucrose and high fructose corn syrup intake). But you don't see problems until you get to like 50-60 grams per day, which is actually quite a bit (an average piece of fruit may have 7 grams of fructose). It's simply a non-issue for most people.

Wannabebig: In your opinion, what would be an approximate ratio for pre/middle/post workout nutrition?

Lyle M:




Take a small shake of say 20-30 grams carbs (glucose/maltodextrin) with some protein (maybe 12-15 grams since we don't have access to essential AAs by themselves) in as little water as you can mix it (this is to avoid getting sick) right before your workout starts.


If your workout were particularly long (more than 1-1.5 hours), it would be a good idea to sip on a Gatorade solution. 15-30 grams of carbohydrate per hour is plenty. This will maintain blood glucose better, and an abstract a year or two ago showed that it improved overall anabolism.


Then slam your post workout shake immediately after training. The old recommendations for post-workout carb intake was 1-1.5 grams of carbs/kg lean body mass with about 1/3rd as much protein. So, for an average lifter (say 65 kg=150 lbs of LBM or so), you get 65-100 grams of carbs with 20-30 grams of protein. Since you already took in 20-30 grams pre-workout, I'd subtract this from the post-workout shake. If you took in carbs during the workout, you'd subtract that too. So you'd be looking at 45-80 grams of carbs post workout, with 20-30 grams of an easily digested protein. You'd want most of the carbs to be glucose or glucose polymers, but with some fructose (maybe 10-20 grams) in there as well.


Then you'd eat a normal meal about 2 hours later to keep things moving.



So it would look like this overall for a lifter with 65 kg (150 lb) of LBM:

Pre-workout: 20-30 grams glucose/12-15 grams whey protein

During workout: 15-30 grams carbohydrate/hour (if needed)

Post-workout: 45-80 grams carbs from glucose/maltodextrin and some fructose (10-20 grams) with 20-30 grams of protein

2 hours later: normal meal

Wannabebig: I'm sure our readers have acquired a great deal of info they can apply to training. Nevertheless, to a large extent knowledge does not necessarily empower someone if they aren’t mentally motivated. In all your experiences did you ever, or can you pass along any inspirational quotes which may have motivated you?

Lyle M: I'm going to have to pass on this question; I'm not really a motivated/motivational type of person. Any quotes I'd put here would just be mean and nasty because I'm really cynical and pessimistic most of the time.

Wannabebig: Are you available to do online coaching, programs, nutritional plans and pre-comp prep? If so, how can people reach you?

Lyle M: The best way is to simply email me directly (lylemcd@onr.com). I'm usually looking for new guinea pigs for various ideas.

Wannabebig: Thank you Lyle.

Well there you have it folks. I'm sure Lyle will return in the future to share more information about nutrition, supplementation and training. If you’re interested in purchasing one or both of Lyle’s books you can do so at Power store, Netrition, Amazon.com, or they can also be ordered directly from our Lyle's Ebooks section on Wannabebig.

His new book 'Special Report #1: Bromocriptine' is currently also only available in our Lyle's Ebooks section on Wannabebig.

Written by Maki Riddington

Bupp
03-28-2008, 05:58 PM
This thread should be added to the Diet and Nutrition FAQ under the category of: The Timing Of Nutrition Intake.

This thread seems to have more info than the thread that is currently being linked to.

ddegroff
03-29-2008, 12:26 AM
Prove? Nothing.


Examine? Everything.


I have received several PMs thanking me for this thread and the varied info it presents, so I might as well roll with it.

If anything, someone could link it to a newbie asking questiuons, or for debate purposes if an issue on the topic were to arise.

NO don't get me wrong this is a great thread. I was kinda making a joke. You kept posting stuff with no contention from other members. It was you posting a bunch of proof about what we already know. I agree that "we" know this but it's good for newbies and people new to the game.

Let's get a little debate going. Or atleast I'll try. Now I skimmed most of the stuff you posted but it seems most of it points to pre work out sugar is good for muscle glyco replenishment. Certain amino's promote protein synthesis more than others. So if I take a shake pre-workout with the things I listed above (L-carnitine, Whey, WM, etc.) I will increase glyco replenishment and protein synthesis.

Now if it whole food sits in the gut for a while whats wrong with a meal 1.5hrs before supplying everything above? Then a shake of the right amino's, whey etc. post workout. Do you think it really matters for the average individual? Or does this only really matter for that top 5%?

Now I've had some of my best workouts on low carbs (UD2), some of my best workouts on carb load (UD2), some at a totally fasted state, and drinking whey/sugar durning my workouts. For me it really doesn't matter. I feel that most of us are over thinking most of this and consitancy is really what matters. Whatever you choose, keep doing it more than 2wks. See what happens.

Slim, I like that your posting all of the point of views. I like the science approach but sometimes the science just fits certain individuals and not otheres.

This turned out to be a lot longer than I thought it was going to be. But it's worth disscussing.

Built
03-29-2008, 12:32 AM
I do the solid food thing, too - just farther ahead, as you suggested. It's all a logistics problem - getting the right stuff (glucose and amino acids) to the right place (your working muscles) at the right time (while they're working, to spare glucose and let you maintain intensity throughout your workout, and start the rebuilding process ASAP).

ddegroff
03-29-2008, 12:45 AM
I do the solid food thing, too - just farther ahead, as you suggested. It's all a logistics problem - getting the right stuff (glucose and amino acids) to the right place (your working muscles) at the right time (while they're working, to spare glucose and let you maintain intensity throughout your workout, and start the rebuilding process ASAP).

That's kind of my point. I've done some of the most intense workouts completely fasted. Some intense workouts with a bunch of sugar. Now that's just me so it's not too scientific. Arn't human's built for this. We have stored glyco for intense exercise at the spur of the moment?

I just feel sometimes we get too nit picky about nutrition timing. Isn't the bigger deal getting most of our cals "around" our workout not necessarily before (CHO+PRO)?

Slim Schaedle
03-29-2008, 12:58 AM
NO don't get me wrong this is a great thread. I was kinda making a joke.

Yeah, I took it that way, so it's cool. :)

I will get to the other stuff later.

Slim Schaedle
03-29-2008, 01:02 AM
Real quick....let's say that pre-carbs do all this fun stuff for glyco replenishment and protein synthesis as evident by the articles and stuies posted here.

So someone benches 315 during the session the took the pre-shake but cannot go higher.

Next week they come back and bench 320, a new PR, and continue to work better throughout their assistance and auxiallry exercises with more strength and endurance, less fatigue, etc.

Let's say this contunues, and is out of the norm.

Could we attribute this to the pre dex/pro?

ddegroff
03-29-2008, 01:14 AM
Could we attribute this to the pre dex/pro?

I'd say no. Now yes we see progression but there is way too many variables to say conclusively it's the pre dex/pro.

Which is the point I'm getting at. Most of these studies focus on such a needle in a hay stack. Meals 2hrs, 4hrs, etc. pre could contribute to their perfromance. Also the post-workout recovery meals could play just as big of role. I could go on but then I would be rambling. Too many variables. I think this is the biggest disconnect between studies and real life applications, IMO.

Slim Schaedle
03-29-2008, 01:22 AM
If the added dex/pro beforehand was the only the thing they changed or added, what would be the contributing factor, if all else remained the same?

ddegroff
03-29-2008, 01:28 AM
From the research that you provided then I would say it is the pre supplementation.

Built
03-29-2008, 01:30 AM
From the research that you provided then I would say it is the pre supplementation.


Now you know them's fightin' words...

Slim Schaedle
03-29-2008, 01:35 AM
From the research that you provided then I would say it is the pre supplementation.

I certainly agree that there are a ****load of factors and that studies do not always indicate real life, etc. etc.


But when minor adjustments translate into instant results, it usually seems like we can narrow it down.

Anyone know if the benefit of creatine is instant? To my knowledge it is not.

Built
03-29-2008, 01:46 AM
Neither are AAS.

Ha! Testosterone is useless for all but toning reps!

Slim Schaedle
03-29-2008, 02:11 AM
Neither are AAS.

Ha! Testosterone is useless for all but toning reps!

Ahem, ...Study?

jdeity
03-29-2008, 08:04 AM
It's a good thread. There is a ton of good info here.

ditto

ddegroff
03-29-2008, 08:42 AM
I certainly agree that there are a ****load of factors and that studies do not always indicate real life, etc. etc.


But when minor adjustments translate into instant results, it usually seems like we can narrow it down.

Anyone know if the benefit of creatine is instant? To my knowledge it is not.

Right. It was tough writing that because not everyone is that scientific about it (only changing one variable, ie pre wo nutrition). But the way you narrowed it down it was really the only answer to give.

I had that discussion with a nutrition teacher a few years back about creatine. We looked over a study that was done over a one week period. The study found no benefits. I attacked the study and said it was too soon to tell. We argued about how the body can't store creatine etc. etc.

Like a said before, it's all about constancy. Whatever your doing, diet, routine, sleep, follow it for a longer period of time to see the results. Then adjust from there.

Slim Schaedle
03-29-2008, 11:42 AM
Right. It was tough writing that because not everyone is that scientific about it (only changing one variable, ie pre wo nutrition). But the way you narrowed it down it was really the only answer to give.

I had that discussion with a nutrition teacher a few years back about creatine. We looked over a study that was done over a one week period. The study found no benefits. I attacked the study and said it was too soon to tell. We argued about how the body can't store creatine etc. etc.

Like a said before, it's all about constancy. Whatever your doing, diet, routine, sleep, follow it for a longer period of time to see the results. Then adjust from there.

Well said.

That is why I am personally hesistant to spend a considerable amount of money on something that is not as basic (carbs, being a macronutrient) as opposed to other substances. (unless I am seeing an immediate result or a can 100% say it is making a difference)

With regards to studies that are controlled, and have various weaknessess, we basically have two categories:

Substances with alot of studies vs. subtances with one or two.

ddegroff
03-29-2008, 11:57 AM
With regards to studies that are controlled, and have various weaknessess, we basically have two categories:

Substances with alot of studies vs. subtances with one or two.

That's where the personal experience fills in the gray areas. :read:

Slim Schaedle
03-29-2008, 12:01 PM
That's where the personal experience fills in the gray areas. :read:

Exactly.

Keith
03-30-2008, 06:59 PM
What's your take on Justins Harris' supplement, Anatrop? Based on my knowledge and from what I've read about it, it's everything you need excluding carbs.
Better bang for your dollar to go this route mixed with a carb source (waxy maize, dex, etc.) or buying everything seperately?

Slim Schaedle
03-30-2008, 09:43 PM
What's your take on Justins Harris' supplement, Anatrop? Based on my knowledge and from what I've read about it, it's everything you need excluding carbs.
Better bang for your dollar to go this route mixed with a carb source (waxy maize, dex, etc.) or buying everything seperately?

I haven't looked at it but the only thing I buy that is not individual is a $20 Pill NO product called NOS Precursor.


Everything else is individual so I can custom tailor things.

Built
03-30-2008, 10:42 PM
Everything else is individual so I can custom tailor things.
Nice to know I'm not the only control freak with this stuff.

I don't even take a multivitamin!

Slim Schaedle
03-30-2008, 10:47 PM
Nice to know I'm not the only control freak with this stuff.

I don't even take a multivitamin!

Well, ya got me on the multivitamin.

And well...if I use a green drink...that would be a little hard to individualize.


But, there's no way in hell I am shelling out cash for something that can easily be customized.

WBB taught me back in 2002 the wonders of buying dextrose, maltodextrin, etc. alone and ditching the cell-tech and phosphagen HP.

Built
03-30-2008, 10:54 PM
Well, ya got me on the multivitamin.

And well...if I use a green drink...that would be a little hard to individualize.


But, there's no way in hell I am shelling out cash for something that can easily be customized.

WBB taught me back in 2002 the wonders of buying dextrose, maltodextrin, etc. alone and ditching the cell-tech and phosphagen HP.

Amen to that.

I'm a firm believer in building my own fat burners, too.

Slim Schaedle
03-30-2008, 10:58 PM
Amen to that.

I'm a firm believer in building my own fat burners, too.

Yes, I can get scapels and alcohol pads from work.

And you only have to buy a blow torch once.

TopCat
03-30-2008, 11:41 PM
WBB taught me back in 2002 the wonders of buying dextrose, maltodextrin, etc. alone and ditching the cell-tech and phosphagen HP.

Though I would like to say it is priceless information, I am sure I could estimate this site has saved me from fads. That estimate is... A LOT.

Anywho... this Saturday I did my old pre-nutrition routine. Good meal ~3 hours to lifting, small dex/whey shake ~1 hr prior then a dilute one to sip on. Worked like a charm. Though it was the strength day from UD2, I believe it certainly helped. Once I'm off my diet I'll try and experiment with my lifting maybe.

Built
03-31-2008, 12:14 AM
Well, ya got me on the multivitamin.

And well...if I use a green drink...that would be a little hard to individualize.


But, there's no way in hell I am shelling out cash for something that can easily be customized.

WBB taught me back in 2002 the wonders of buying dextrose, maltodextrin, etc. alone and ditching the cell-tech and phosphagen HP.


Though I would like to say it is priceless information, I am sure I could estimate this site has saved me from fads. That estimate is... A LOT.

Anywho... this Saturday I did my old pre-nutrition routine. Good meal ~3 hours to lifting, small dex/whey shake ~1 hr prior then a dilute one to sip on. Worked like a charm. Though it was the strength day from UD2, I believe it certainly helped. Once I'm off my diet I'll try and experiment with my lifting maybe.


My work is done...

Keith
03-31-2008, 11:19 AM
I haven't looked at it but the only thing I buy that is not individual is a $20 Pill NO product called NOS Precursor.


I can't find any breakdown as to what exactly is in it, but here is the link to the product.

http://www.troponinnutrition.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=48&Itemid=48


Anyone else familiar with it?

Slim Schaedle
03-31-2008, 11:23 AM
I can't find any breakdown as to what exactly is in it, but here is the link to the product.

http://www.troponinnutrition.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=48&Itemid=48


Anyone else familiar with it?

I can't really comment on BCAA's and leucine since I have never used them individually.

From what I have read and seen, Justin likes them.

But with any supplement, I think what matters most is what the little guys in the trenches get from it, not an endorsed athlete who gets free stuff.

Keith
03-31-2008, 11:26 AM
But with any supplement, I think what matters most is what the little guys in the trenches get from it, not an endorsed athlete who gets free stuff.

Good point.

Slim Schaedle
04-01-2008, 07:13 PM
http://www.medbio.info/Horn/PDF%20files/homeostasis1.pdf


Energy Stores in Humans.

The surprising part of this business is that we have a very limited amount of circulating glucose in spite of a very rapid and extensive use of this sugar as anenergy source. Look at the table below. The highlighted area shows how long our blood and extracellular glucose can support differing activity levels.

Our total reserve of blood glucose is around 20 grams. Twenty grams of glucose give enough energy for about 40 minutes with little or no activity! If you just sit and relax you could use all of your glucose in less than one hour! If you walk, glucose could disappear in around 15 minutes and moderate work (that which can be maintained for some few hours) might exhaust your sugar reserves in about 4 minutes.