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dxiw
04-24-2008, 06:57 PM
For the last few months I have been incorporating the conjugate method and D.E/M.E. principles for bench and deadlift, and both have gone up considerably. My huge weakness right now is my squat. I want to spend the next 2-3 months focusing on building my squat up. I have never trained the squat hardcore, so I am looking for some advice on how to build an M.E./D.E. routine for squats.

My full depth squat max is about 315 now, which is pitiful considering I can easily get up 325 on the bench raw and 420 on the deadlift raw. I would really like to get the squat to 405 atleast.

Like an idiot I always trained squats without proper depth and so now I'm being mature about it and dropping the weight and focusing on full depth / below parallel. My quads are strong and I can lock out 400-500 pounds easily if I do squats to just above parallel. It's around parallel and below when the glutes/hamstrings kick in that I completely die.

Keith
04-24-2008, 07:06 PM
http://www.elitefts.com/documents/raw_squatting.htm

joey54
04-24-2008, 07:22 PM
you could check these threads out until the big boys here reply. they have some good info if you have never read them before. the one above looked good too.

http://www.intensemuscle.com/powerlifting-forum.html

http://www.intensemuscle.com/21280-why-you-should-box-squat.html

dxiw
04-24-2008, 07:28 PM
Here is my proposed routine:

Monday: ME squat
ME squat, work to heavy single (raw, full depth)
Box Squats?
Heavy Rack Pulls 5x1-3
hamstrings?
calves?

Wednesday: DE bench
Bench (3 grips) 9 X 3 focusing on speed (some sets with bands)
JM presses 5 X 5
Standing military press / db press 5 X 1–5
Pullups / Rows 5 X 5
Biceps 3–5 sets

Friday: ME bench
ME bench, work to heavy single (vary exercises, raw full ROM)
Board press / rack lockouts 3 X 3–5
Pull-ups / Rows 5 X 10
H-Roll 3 X 10
Biceps 3–5 sets

Saturday: DE Squat / Core
Full Depth Squats 9x3 focusing on speed
Good Mornings 5x10
hamstrings?
calves?
abs?

Not really sure what to do for the lower body days, this is where I am asking for advice…

Detard
04-24-2008, 08:34 PM
This is what Rhodehouse suggested to me back in december and for me, it's the best routine i've ever been on. I'm stronger than i've ever been and much bigger.

ME Squat (Close-stance Box Squat, Free Squat, Box Squat)1-5RM
DL, DL Variation to 1-3RM GM's to 3-5RM
Low Back 4x10
Abs 4x10

ME Bench (Bench, Floor Press, Incline, 2 Board) 1-3RM
4-5 Board 1-5RM
Rows 4x10
Lats 4x10
Biceps - whatever

DE Squat 6-8x2@50%, 55%, 60%
GM's or Pulls (whatever you didn't do on ME Day) 3-5RM
Leg Press 4x10
Abs 4x10

DE Bench 6-8x3@50%, 55%, 60%
Military Press 4x10
Rows 4x10
Rear Delts 4x10
Triceps - whatever

Xellarz
04-24-2008, 08:38 PM
You say you can do 400-500 just above parallel, but can't hit more than 315 to just below parallel? Or is the 315 an ATG Oly. squat? If it's closer stance, ATG squat, what's your powerlifting legal max?

I'll let the other guys answer your question(s). But I think you should do the Smolov. Assuming you're under 160.

Crap, just noticed you're not. I think you should work to 2xBW Raw, then do the Smolov. I bet if you were to do it, you could add 25lbs (at LEAST) just by doing the introductory 3-week cycle. But don't stop there, finish it out and reap the rewards.

nhlfan
04-24-2008, 09:50 PM
I think working up to a raw 1RM for squat every monday would probably stagnate your results fairly quickly. I like the looks of detard's setup though.

Travis Bell
04-24-2008, 09:58 PM
a true Westside routine would have you working up to a single every week, but we have the luxury of varying, box height, band tension, chain weight (or combining both), gear (straps down, up, just briefs, wraps, no wraps) and all the different bars. You can see the combinations are pretty much endless.

When you don't have that availability, a rep range of 1-5 is probably a good idea. Other than that, Detards routine is really good

nhlfan
04-24-2008, 10:01 PM
a true Westside routine would have you working up to a single every week, but we have the luxury of varying, box height, band tension, chain weight (or combining both), gear (straps down, up, just briefs, wraps, no wraps) and all the different bars. You can see the combinations are pretty much endless.

When you don't have that availability, a rep range of 1-5 is probably a good idea. Other than that, Detards routine is really good

:thumbup: great post, I completely agree

Reko
04-24-2008, 10:17 PM
I would also consider swapping the friday and saturday workouts, only because you are hitting the same body parts about 48 hours apart. If you switch you get 72. Might not be a big deal but just something small that might make a difference. And like Travis said, the key to making west side method work is being able to constantly switch up the exercises, or at least the reps.

dxiw
04-25-2008, 02:00 AM
You say you can do 400-500 just above parallel, but can't hit more than 315 to just below parallel? Or is the 315 an ATG Oly. squat? If it's closer stance, ATG squat, what's your powerlifting legal max?

I'll let the other guys answer your question(s). But I think you should do the Smolov. Assuming you're under 160.

Crap, just noticed you're not. I think you should work to 2xBW Raw, then do the Smolov. I bet if you were to do it, you could add 25lbs (at LEAST) just by doing the introductory 3-week cycle. But don't stop there, finish it out and reap the rewards.

parallel and below I can only get up 315ish, if i do a typical gym rat "I think I'm parallel, but I'm really 2-4 inches higher" squat I can get 400-500.

motoko013
04-25-2008, 02:04 AM
This is what Rhodehouse suggested to me back in december and for me, it's the best routine i've ever been on. I'm stronger than i've ever been and much bigger.

ME Squat (Close-stance Box Squat, Free Squat, Box Squat)1-5RM
DL, DL Variation to 1-3RM GM's to 3-5RM
Low Back 4x10
Abs 4x10

ME Bench (Bench, Floor Press, Incline, 2 Board) 1-3RM
4-5 Board 1-5RM
Rows 4x10
Lats 4x10
Biceps - whatever

DE Squat 6-8x2@50%, 55%, 60%
GM's or Pulls (whatever you didn't do on ME Day) 3-5RM
Leg Press 4x10
Abs 4x10

DE Bench 6-8x3@50%, 55%, 60%
Military Press 4x10
Rows 4x10
Rear Delts 4x10
Triceps - whatever

stolen thanks

dxiw
04-25-2008, 01:29 PM
This is what Rhodehouse suggested to me back in december and for me, it's the best routine i've ever been on. I'm stronger than i've ever been and much bigger.

ME Squat (Close-stance Box Squat, Free Squat, Box Squat)1-5RM
DL, DL Variation to 1-3RM GM's to 3-5RM
Low Back 4x10
Abs 4x10

ME Bench (Bench, Floor Press, Incline, 2 Board) 1-3RM
4-5 Board 1-5RM
Rows 4x10
Lats 4x10
Biceps - whatever

DE Squat 6-8x2@50%, 55%, 60%
GM's or Pulls (whatever you didn't do on ME Day) 3-5RM
Leg Press 4x10
Abs 4x10

DE Bench 6-8x3@50%, 55%, 60%
Military Press 4x10
Rows 4x10
Rear Delts 4x10
Triceps - whatever

What do you think about adding some JM presses on the ME day and biceps work to the DE day..

Travis Bell
04-25-2008, 02:14 PM
do your JM's on DE day on this set up

Keith
04-25-2008, 02:53 PM
What do you think about adding some JM presses on the ME day and biceps work to the DE day..

Keep it the way it is.

There's no reason to put in another tricep movement with all the heavy pressing and lockout work. I'm also using almost that exact same template and it's worked wonders.