View Full Version : kickboxing/bodybuilding

06-16-2008, 08:51 PM
Hey everybody, hope your training is going well

I am a 17 year old male. I'll be 18 in late july. I'm 5'9'' and 160lbs with body fat percentage under 10%. I guess I would be classified as an ectomorph if I had to label my body type. I train sanshou kickboxing which is a mix between muay thai and judo without the groudwork. I was training 7 days a week but last week changed my schedule to only five days a week with two consecutive rest days (each of which include ab work but no other physical activity).

here's my schedule

monday - legs at the gym for 1.25 hrs in the afternoon. kickboxing at night for 1.5 hrs

tuesday - 2 miles interval sprints afternoon. kickboxing at night 1.5 hrs

wednesday - lowerback, traps, lats at gym 1.25 hrs, 2 miles interval sprints afternoon, kickboxing 2.5 hours at night

thursday - 2 miles interval sprints afternoon, kickboxing at night 1.5 hours

friday - pecs, triceps, shoulders at gym, kickboxing at night 1.5 hours

sat - rest

sun - rest

in addition to all of this i do 100 v sit-ups and 50 voblique sit-ups on each side every night including rest nights. i also 50-100 db curls every day and kettlebell work 1-2 times a week.

I am on a low glycemic diet. complex carbohydrate paired with protein shake in the morning

lunch high protein meal with carbs coming from fruit or veggies

dinner high protein and veggies

I also eat snacks usually vegetables, a protein bar, or something high in fat.

i drink/eat 3-4 protein shakes/bars per day 1 with breakfast, 1 with lunch , 1 after working out, one before sleep. I'm also taking half a scoop of a creatine ethyl ester supplement called big (reccomended dose is 2 scoops but i had blood levels taken to see how it was affecting me and realized that my kidneys could only handle 1/2 scoop a day without any damage).

again i'm a very hard gainer. but i also eat a lot and work out a lot. my question is does anyone have any tips for gaining weight. people tell me that in order to do this i'll need to up my carb intake but i really don't want to lose any definition. i'm also only 17, so i'm not sure whether or not i should just let the weight come naturally with age. i want to get up to a solid 180. how do i do it?

Phil Bailey
06-16-2008, 11:11 PM
If you want a quick answer, it's slowly add more calories and see how your body responds. If you start adding more fat then cut the calories back a little. The most important thing is asking yourself, what is more important, getting bigger or kickboxing?

06-16-2008, 11:30 PM
Cut back on the distances you are running?

Phil Bailey
06-16-2008, 11:48 PM
I don't think cutting the cardio back is the right move considering it's only 2 miles. Besides cardio is vital for kickboxing and if his goal is to be competitve in kickboxing, that would be suicide. Remember fatigue makes cowards of men.

06-17-2008, 12:29 AM
Good point Phil. What is your training background?

06-17-2008, 08:42 AM
ok more calories. are there any particular foods you would recommend that have a lot of calories? oh and btw kickboxing definitely takes priority over bodybuilding. thanks i appreciate the help

left hook
06-17-2008, 10:40 AM
I do boxing and i'm beginning to dabble a bit in jiu jitsu and grappling. Eat more for sure. When I was bulking I had to eat till I was about to puke to gain weight. But when it's time to cut you'll be happy because you won't have to starve yourself or go on a radical diet to lose weight, your martial art training will burn off alot of the un wanted calories.

left hook
06-17-2008, 10:41 AM
You going to fight or planning to?

06-17-2008, 12:26 PM
planning to fight at 152 or 160 depending on how my body responds to all of this training.

06-17-2008, 02:29 PM
A few things in terms of fighting. Bodybuilding will do almost nothing for you in terms of strength. I'm guessing you want knockout power strength, and solid muscle work capacity, that's what most strikers want. bodybuilding is once you have the foundation for that strength and conditioning then the vanity workouts can be added in.

2) Dont work abs everyday. It's a muscle like all others. Also if you do work abs on a rest day, I hope you're warming up the body before just diving into them. I would switch abs at most, every other day.

3) Fighting in any sport requires good flexibility. On a rest day, add a solid stretching session. Warm up and then hit all your muscles on hold at a stretch pain of 8/9 out of 10 for 2-3 min. Head kicks are hot, but not if you lose all form doing them.

If you want to fight at 152 or 160, why are you trying to get to a solid 180?

If you want an example of strength vs muscles, look at a few UFCs ago when Cheick Kongo fought Heath Herring. Congo is stacked, the dude is sculpted but he lost the fight because it didnt translate as well to functional strength. Heath herring doesn't look like he'll win any BB comps but he more than matched strength.

If you're serious about fighting, aim for Functional strength and good conditioning. Looks like you have some of it in your routine..i.e kettlebells and such. For example, in an MMA fight, flat bench isnt going to do you as much good as incline press will simply because when you're pushing on someone you use more up that muscle emphasis.

Phil Bailey
06-17-2008, 04:45 PM
Good point Phil. What is your training background?

Iv'e trained Muay Thai and BJJ. Somewhere down the line I became interested in MMA when the UFC was still considered No Holds Barred

Phil Bailey
06-17-2008, 05:02 PM
Keep in mind powerlifting type of moves help develop explosiveness which is very important. But just as carzedwombat said, those movements wont help you win the any BB competitions. In terms of upping your caloric intake, try adding more protein or health fats to your diet. ie. beef, fish oils, etc.

In order to maximize your benefits you have to keep a journal on what you eat and breakdown the calories taken in with each meal. From their you will have to slightly increase it and see how your body adjusts to it. It's a long painful process, but it is also the most accurate way of doing. This way you take all the guess work out and can see what changes have added fat and what has added lean muscle.

On the other hand you can just fight a whatever weight your at naturally and drop a little water weight. Look at Sean Sherk, he fought in the 170 lbs division and kicked ass, but he is better suited to the light weight division.

07-18-2008, 10:49 AM
For MMA you need to work on your ground work and explosiveness. Practice your submissions, that will be a very key component and it will give you an edge on novice fighters. Something I find that always works (when done properly) is practice takedown, half guard, side guard and full guard and then different submissions. I've seen a lot of fighters use these basics and have a lot of success with it.

07-19-2008, 10:22 AM
Just from the recovery perspective, I would not have your sprint intervals that close together. Your legs have not recovered (if you're working at max intensity) from Tuesday to Thursday.

Cut out that second sprint work out and make it a recovery jog, or a rest day (I walk on all my rest days). You'll still get _some_ calorie burning benefits without undue stress, then maybe jam another sprint session in Saturday morning.

But, working out as much as you are, it's going to be difficult to put mass on.

My advice (if your goal is to excel at kick-boxing) is (in order):

-Don't worry about size.

-Perfect your technical and tactical skills
(which it looks like you are very dedicated to )

-Work on speed and agility

-build strength

-build endurance

It's going to be hard for you to get down the essence of a good punch or good kick when you are really tired. Learn to do the kicks and punches perfectly first, then work on throwing those punches and kicks while fatigued.

You might be interested in this site, which is a fitness site primarily for fighters:


good luck!

07-19-2008, 02:21 PM
Your current methods of conditioning aren't exactly ideal for kickboxing. Additionally, they do nothing to provide a stimulus for muscle growth. I think your weight training can be improved on as well.

Solution: http://www.crossfit.com -- go through the workout of the day as prescribed and kill yourself with intensity. Make sure to start each workout with the full CrossFit warm-up along with dynamic stretches, and end with a cool down run/row and a good static stretcihng session.

CrossFit is the most commonly used program for fighters in the UFC. It will work much better than what you're doing.

Oh and Rosstraining is excellent as well. (Ross does CrossFit ... I think his videos will be a good example of how effective CF can be)

As far as not gaining weight, you just have to eat more. Increase calories.

If I don't respond to any questions, send me a PM, I might forget about this thread.