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mickyjune26
06-20-2008, 10:49 AM
Anyone here hear of the Sheiko program, from Boris Sheiko a Russion strength coach?

What are your thoughts on it if you've tried it?

http://www.elitefts.com/documents/Sheiko29.htm

Keith
06-20-2008, 10:55 AM
I've heard of it but don't know much about it. I'd like to hear more on it, though...

mickyjune26
06-20-2008, 10:59 AM
they have a main page on sheiko on elitefts.com. I'm trying again now. did it about 3 months after starting my last serious bulk. I got stronger, but then again, I was barely back into the game. I'm on day 2. I like how I lift heavy, but don't max out. It seems to keep my motivated. I wonder if I'm going to build muscle on this, because some seem to think that this program lends to overraining. I don't know since many lifts stop at 75% of max....

Travis Bell
06-20-2008, 01:51 PM
sheiko is a really proven program but personally I'm not a huge fan of it. I've just seen to many guys get burnt out doing it with all the volume

Phil Bailey
06-20-2008, 02:07 PM
Sheiko training involves alot of volume at loads less than the 1 rep max. There is actually a template you can download online that outlines the sets and reps. All you have to do is plug in the numbers and the excel sheet will calculate the big 3 lifts. I guess the big advantage is the constant repeated movements. You get alot of practice on the big three. I have been on other sites and people say that once you become acustom to the routine, its ok. The hard part is doing the initial 4 weeks. you have to have a solid GPP base before you start to help with the extra volume.

mickyjune26
06-20-2008, 02:18 PM
I can tell my GPP is being worked. It's a workout to finish within 2 hours. I also do like the practice I'm getting on the big three.

I want to do this for one month, and if all goes well, I'll try it for another 4 week phase, moving on to another sheiko routine.

you're right about volume. Definately keeps me on my toes...but since there is a pre-made template, I know the exact numbers I want to shoot for each day, instead of doing things on feel.

thewicked
06-20-2008, 03:30 PM
im curious as to what kind of person you'd recommend this program to myself..seems interesting but high volume is a KILLER of my strength.

Jason Pegg
06-20-2008, 03:59 PM
im curious as to what kind of person you'd recommend this program to myself..seems interesting but high volume is a KILLER of my strength.

Welllllll, ummmmmmmmmmmmm, not you? LOLOL

Jason

Bako Lifter
06-20-2008, 04:41 PM
Don't do it. You've been warned.

nhlfan
06-20-2008, 05:59 PM
my gym owner is on it. I'll let you know in a while what he thinks of it

jbrin0tk
06-20-2008, 07:31 PM
You should try to get in touch with Eric Talmant over on EFS. I think he trains using Sheiko's program(s).

Cmanuel
04-12-2009, 10:32 AM
Raising from the dead....

I currently am doing Sheiko # 29, and will take a week off for my cross country move and use it as a deload. Then I will do Sheiko #37, which is basically the same thing as 29 with more volume. These are Eric Talmant's general recommendations for Sheiko Beginners over on EliteFTS. After I complete #37, i will re-test my 1RM's and will let you guys know. I decided to use slightly lower weights than I've worked with. These are the inputs I used:
Full Depth Olympic Squat (decided to do these instead of PL style squats)-300
Bench-275 (actual 300)
Deadlift-485 (actual 500)

My thoughts: This style of training is a lot different than what I'm used to. I really like working out with sub maximal weights for lots of volume. For one, I rarely use a training partner, and since im only using 70-80% of my 1RM, i really dont need a spot. Also, I can feel it whipping my body or GPP into shape.

A lot of people rag on sheiko for being too much volume, and that you need to be on steroids to finish each 2 hr workout or whatever.... I can see how the more advanced routines in the spreadsheet can be very demanding and taxing, but I'm specifically talking about the beginner ones. I finish my workouts in about 1.5hrs, and I really dont feel the volume oriented fatigue accumulating yet. I'm starting week 3 today of 29. Maybe week 4 will kill me.

For anyone interested, here's a spreadsheet with all the routines that are floating around
http://rapidshare.com/files/140132973/Sheiko_Spreadsheet_2008.08.25.xls.html

And here's one of many threads over on T-Nation with great reviews of this routine
http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding_strength/sheiko_works

Love it!

1400total
04-12-2009, 11:30 AM
I have used sheiko on and off for about a year now. Various routines 27, 28,29, 37 etc. All are similiar some have you training 3 days a week, while others add a 4th day. The %'s range between 55% to 85%, seldom do you go as high as 90%. The volume ranges between 20 and 30 sets. Very little accessory work is done. SOme days you will bench, performing as many as 10 sets increasing in weight, then squat 8-10 sets, then back to benches for another 6-8 sets. You do very little accessory work because its not needed at this point, and the volume is so high you just run out of gas. My experiance is that the more i did sheiko the faster i would burn out. SO if i did an 8 week cycle, then took a week off I would be lucky to get through 4 more weeks of it.

It does three things for the powerlifter (in my opinion).
1. the volume conditions you for a full meet. I performed very well in meets following a comp phase.
2. it makes you strong on the 3 lifts. ONce your done doing 5 sets of 3 with 80% benching 6 sets of 2 ith 85% is tough enough to build strength without just falling over.
3. It helps with your form.

go to the bmf forum and I believe there is a sheiko thread and you can check out all the templates.

Hazerboy
04-12-2009, 03:32 PM
Based on your guy's input I could see this working very well for a lot of intermediate/beginner lifters for a few cycles here and there, though I'm willing to bet only a select few can do it long term - sort of like 20 rep squats.

Cmanuel
04-12-2009, 04:16 PM
Based on your guy's input I could see this working very well for a lot of intermediate/beginner lifters for a few cycles here and there, though I'm willing to bet only a select few can do it long term - sort of like 20 rep squats.

I plan on cycling it every few weeks along with madcow advanced. Over the years ive had the best success with madcow in terms of strength/size gains...

a year of sheiko would probably destroy anyone haha:micro:

Travis Bell
04-12-2009, 06:10 PM
Eric Talmant posts here, so hopefully he'll chime in.

Eric Talmant
04-13-2009, 07:57 AM
I plan on cycling it every few weeks along with madcow advanced. Over the years ive had the best success with madcow in terms of strength/size gains...

a year of sheiko would probably destroy anyone haha:micro:

Have you guys ever heard of Victor Furashkine, Alexiy Sivokon, Sergey Moore, Konstantine Pavlov, Irina Abramov, etc. ?

They did not burn out in just one year :)

We have many other templates that work *much, much better* than the original recommendations of #29, #37, etc.

Dave and I have worked with close to 250 athletes now from all around the world, and we have a pretty good handle on what works and what doesn't.

I am happy to help with whatever questions you guys might have.

Be well,

Eric

Cmanuel
04-13-2009, 01:22 PM
Have you guys ever heard of Victor Furashkine, Alexiy Sivokon, Sergey Moore, Konstantine Pavlov, Irina Abramov, etc. ?

They did not burn out in just one year :)

We have many other templates that work *much, much better* than the original recommendations of #29, #37, etc.

Dave and I have worked with close to 250 athletes now from all around the world, and we have a pretty good handle on what works and what doesn't.

I am happy to help with whatever questions you guys might have.

Be well,

Eric

I guess I went w/ the original 29 then 37 programs for beginner because thats what popped up when you type "sheiko Training" into google. This page appears: http://www.elitefts.com/sheiko/

I always trust any material from EliteFTS, so I took the recommendations as the page said. Also, the fact that people have been getting great results from 29/37 from sites like T-nation helped me decide to try it.

Are there templates out there that tend to work better for a Raw lifter?? I'm 23/ all natural raw lifter, wanting to spend about a year and really focus on getting my three lifts up to respectable levels.

Regards,
CMANUEL

Kray-z
04-15-2009, 07:51 AM
Have you guys ever heard of Victor Furashkine, Alexiy Sivokon, Sergey Moore, Konstantine Pavlov, Irina Abramov, etc. ?

They did not burn out in just one year :)

We have many other templates that work *much, much better* than the original recommendations of #29, #37, etc.

Dave and I have worked with close to 250 athletes now from all around the world, and we have a pretty good handle on what works and what doesn't.

I am happy to help with whatever questions you guys might have.

Be well,

Eric

Eric, definitely interested in what you guys have learned. I found #29 and #37 beneficial, but if you have improved templates, I would be grateful to know anything you have learned. I suppose my first question would be, what deviations have you made from the #29, #37, #32 string with your other templates? I've seen the 13 week template and it seems to be similar. Also, do you train your raw and equipped lifters with the same templates and if not, how do you handle the percentages for the raw lifter?

Thanks for your help!

Eric Talmant
04-16-2009, 08:02 PM
Eric, definitely interested in what you guys have learned. I found #29 and #37 beneficial, but if you have improved templates, I would be grateful to know anything you have learned. I suppose my first question would be, what deviations have you made from the #29, #37, #32 string with your other templates? I've seen the 13 week template and it seems to be similar. Also, do you train your raw and equipped lifters with the same templates and if not, how do you handle the percentages for the raw lifter?

Thanks for your help!

Dave and I are headed out to Texas early in the morning for the Clash of the Titans on Saturday. I will be sure to answer your question(s) properly and completely when we get back. Sound good?

Thanks for your patience.

Cmanuel
04-16-2009, 09:02 PM
Appreciate it. You guys are the best over at EFS

LINK_313
04-20-2009, 07:18 AM
I have used sheiko on and off for about a year now. Various routines 27, 28,29, 37 etc. .

Where are routines 27 and 28? I have never heard of these.

Cmanuel
04-20-2009, 04:09 PM
I am curious Too.

Eric, care to chime in on our questions?

LINK_313
04-21-2009, 06:52 AM
I am curious Too.

Eric, care to chime in on our questions?

I am pretty positive that they don't exist.

AJ_H
04-21-2009, 07:21 AM
my gym owner is on it. I'll let you know in a while what he thinks of it

...well?

Eric Talmant
04-21-2009, 05:23 PM
Appreciate it. You guys are the best over at EFS

We are no longer at EFS.

I am now sponsored by BMF, Critical Bench, Titan Support, and Ultra Life, Inc.

All things Sheiko can be found here:

http://bmfsports.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=sheiko

I hate to redirect traffic from this site, but there is just so much information there that there really is no other way to do this type of training justice besides going there and then jumping in with both feet and start reading everything. Then post when you have questions.

Eric Talmant
04-21-2009, 05:26 PM
Eric, definitely interested in what you guys have learned. I found #29 and #37 beneficial, but if you have improved templates, I would be grateful to know anything you have learned. I suppose my first question would be, what deviations have you made from the #29, #37, #32 string with your other templates? I've seen the 13 week template and it seems to be similar. Also, do you train your raw and equipped lifters with the same templates and if not, how do you handle the percentages for the raw lifter?

Thanks for your help!

The 13 week raw and 13 week equipped programs are posted on the BMF Sheiko board as sticky notes at the top.

There are some new templates that we are trying out with a multitude of lifters, but Dave has publicly stated that he will not post them until we know they work for 90% of those that try them. That is the same trial-by-fire that the other programs went through; and so it will be the same with these latest ones.

If you want to start to work with Dave personally, he can be contacted at veggaman@gmail.com. He does not charge for this service, but donations are greatly accepted if you believe the programming worked for you. Dave can give you the details if you are interested.

Eric Talmant
04-21-2009, 05:30 PM
Where are routines 27 and 28? I have never heard of these.

Sheiko 27 is a preparatory program that was written for a 3X IPF World Champion. We have never posted it publicly on the internet; so if this person really has it, it would have had to come from one of a handful of people.

Sheiko 28 is the second part of this same 3X IPF World Champion lifter's preparation program; and once again we have never posted it publicly on the internet.

Both are 5 day a week programs.

Eric Talmant
04-21-2009, 05:31 PM
I am pretty positive that they don't exist.

Yes they do. Read the previous post.

LINK_313
04-22-2009, 06:31 AM
Yes they do. Read the previous post.

Wow, I sit corrected. Thanks for the info.

If you were coming off of number 37, would you increase your maxes and go into 30 or would you keep them the same and go into it?

Eric Talmant
04-23-2009, 02:59 PM
Wow, I sit corrected. Thanks for the info.

If you were coming off of number 37, would you increase your maxes and go into 30 or would you keep them the same and go into it?

37 is a preparatory cycle and it is a large load. You would want to follow up with another preparatory cycle with the same maxes, but with an average load (600-800 reps). This is where you will need to contact my coach, because he has not published many of these average loads on the internet. We just discovered them not too long ago.

After the average load preparatory cycle, you would want to peak with a small load (up to 600 reps). This would be your competition cycle.

Email my coach at veggaman@gmail.com, tell him where you are at and then include this reply by me, and he will help you complete your programming for this block of training.

Eric

Phillip Wylie
04-30-2009, 12:41 PM
I am completing my 4th week of Sheiko and I am working with Eric's coach. Dave Bates has been very helpful and is they way to go when it comes to Sheiko.