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Frietbakker
07-09-2008, 03:42 AM
Hi guys, hoping to find some help here regarding my raw bench.

When i bench i can get up to a certain weight and press it good and strict. If i add just 5kg/10lbs and try to lower it, just after lowering 3/4 of the way it just comes crashing down. This naturally i want to avoid.

Im thinking this is pec strength so i need to do DB presses and ultra wide benches. But maybe im wrong and i need to do something different... Thats why i am asking here... Maybe another thing i can do is pause on the bottom for 2sec on each rep...

Im training in a gym in Europe that only has a straight bar, no cambered bars or what ever... The box, boards and bands i use are mine that i brought to the gym there.

Can you guys help me out how not to let the weight come on crashing?

mikesbench
07-09-2008, 06:09 AM
Upper back work is also huge for controlling the bar down. I've noticed heavy rows (barbell rows, T Bar Rows...) have helped me a lot with this same issue, but I've also been doing more DB pressing during this time, so I would say both of these approaches have a good chance of fixing your weakness.

chris taylor
07-09-2008, 07:31 AM
You are on the right track.
Deffinately start adding in db work as well as illegal wides (go light with these) and the pause reps are awesome. The other dude mentioned upper back work as well make sure yu hit some overhand rows shoulder width and some rev flys. Lastly if yu have a spotter you can also add in some overload negatives and make sure yu count them down with a 5 count.

CT

smokinHawk
07-09-2008, 07:32 AM
yes upper back will help with that
also just keep doing heavy sets and you will eventually control it.
how long have you been benching?

Frietbakker
07-09-2008, 08:07 AM
thanks for all the replies so far man, i have been benching for quite a few years now.... When i started i could not press the bar... I weighed a 70kg/154lbs and was about 20yrs old. That is also when i started weightraining and i have been doing powerlifting for 3 years now or so.... i think.... Anyway the bench has always been my weakest lift. It is now 125kg/275lbs

I have been doing rows often, i like them! DB presses i also have been doing quite a lot lately. As well als heavy pressing against bands. This all seems to help to some degree, but im thinking i need more possibilities so i can rotate them more often.

Can it be a shoulder weakness? As i know i also suck completly at overhead... But then again, i dont do it much since it is not in the original WSB template plus shoulders get pretty worked during bench trainings. But maybe it is still a weakness in my bench since i press about half overhead of what i bench....

alex11012
07-09-2008, 08:33 AM
While we are on the topic. Other than the obvious chest & tris (upper back is also already mentioned), what other muscles need to be strong to improve your bench. I am guessing legs play a factor. Anything else?

HP666
07-09-2008, 09:24 AM
While we are on the topic. Other than the obvious chest & tris (upper back is also already mentioned), what other muscles need to be strong to improve your bench. I am guessing legs play a factor. Anything else?

You should strengthen your entire upper body, shouders/traps as well.

pocoloco blanka
07-09-2008, 11:45 AM
with all that is mentioned, howis your speed work???? having a big raw bench or even shirted bench means you are pushing the limits of the body. being to strict or controlled may be wasting all your energy.keeping control under max downward bar speed is saving the strenght you have for the drve back to the top.. if your 1rm is taking longer than 2 to 3 seconds to achieve speed work may help...

Eric Downey
07-09-2008, 09:52 PM
i did read it all but as far as the bar coming down to fast its back work. BACK BACK AND MORE BACK. Gotta build a base.

Frietbakker
07-11-2008, 02:06 AM
Thanks for the replies guys! I will try to post my benches on wednesday. Thats when i bench. The template i use is a heavly modified WSB Template.

Monday:
- latwork (pulldown of somekind)
- a heavy squat (1RM, 3RM, 5RM)
- a compound lower body movement
- abs
- calves

Wednesday
- a bench (1RM, 3RM, 5RM)
- a compound upperbody movement
- triceps assistance
- triceps assistance
- biceps

Friday
- latwork (pulldown of somekind)
- a deadlift (1RM, 3RM, 5RM)
- a posterior chain/hamstring assistance excercise
- row
- row

Do i need to push my backwork even more you guys think? Lately i have been doing 1 or 2 sets of DB Presses after my bench en before my other compound movement.

Im thinking of doing ultra wides for a while as second excercise and drop the DB presses....

vdizenzo
07-11-2008, 09:28 AM
I am not a big fan of that routine. Your lats must be banged up for you Wed bench. Your lats get hit again with bench as they are a stabilizer and then you train them again on Friday. If you are tucking your elbows that is your lats are do a lot of the work on the lower portion of the lift on the way down and up. Where is your direct shoulder work?

Eric Downey
07-13-2008, 12:51 AM
I work my lats once a week with pull ups pull downs and heavy bent over rows of some sort. We deadlift on a totally different day than our back day.

Frietbakker
07-13-2008, 07:13 AM
I am not a big fan of that routine. Your lats must be banged up for you Wed bench. Your lats get hit again with bench as they are a stabilizer and then you train them again on Friday. If you are tucking your elbows that is your lats are do a lot of the work on the lower portion of the lift on the way down and up. Where is your direct shoulder work?

Thanks for the reply man, i really appreciate it. There are two reasons why i do latwork before the squats and deads;
1. It helps me get ready for my workout, it prepares my body. This way when i warm up in the squats and deads i am already wanting to squat and deadlift BIG! That motivates me throughout those exercises. Warming up with the squat and dead doesnt do the same for me...
2. This way my lats are fired up, so when i squat and dead they need to work harder which in return gives me a better back for those exercises.

That at least is the theory.

You are right on my direct shoulder work, i dont do this now since there are a lot of lifter which dont do it. I kinda looked at what they are doing and figured since they are stronger than me they probably know what they are doing. But im thinking more and more that i do need it, since my overhead is weak as piss.

If possible i want to stay training 3 days a week, how would yo modify the routine with included direct shoulder work? Just include a OH press on bench day? Personally i was thinking benching on one week OH press the other week and keep alternating that.

Its a long post... my maybe someone has absolutley nothing to do and will read it all... ;)

Travis Bell
07-13-2008, 08:43 AM
um...my 2 cents, if Vincent Dizenzo tells you hes not a big fan of that theory.....don't do it

Frietbakker
07-14-2008, 01:09 AM
Hey Travis, thanks for the reply! And, 'duh'! Vdizenzo know his stuff, and so do you and many others here. But then comes to mind; What SHOULD i do training three days a week? Any help is greatly appreciated!

thewicked
07-14-2008, 09:38 PM
heavy back work..DO IT!

waynedang
07-14-2008, 10:06 PM
I have a crappy overhead press. I cut direct shoulder (pressing) out years ago. Early this year I decided to start working my OHP. I started off doing Bradford press and then military press. It made a big difference in both my raw and shirted benches. I hit a long awaited 635 single ply bench and I think I owe a lot to the shoulder work. This was also the best my shoulders have felt from a heavy bench cycle.


Wayne

Frietbakker
07-29-2008, 04:34 AM
Ok guys, just an update on this:

- I switched back to the original WSB template, so there DE days are back.
- Im doing lots of back work and upperback work on the Upperbody days.
- Im learining on how to bench the bar straight up, this way i use my triceps more. Before i used a more Metal Militia style of benching... which does not help during boardpress and thus now the tri's are getting worked harder too!

So all in all, ill keep this up for a few months and see where it leads me! Thanks for all your suggestions guys!

vdizenzo
07-29-2008, 05:42 AM
Glad to hear it. Keep us posted.