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fpr
09-29-2009, 09:42 PM
I know I've posted about this in the past, but my standing OH press is just so damn weak.

I struggle with 135lbs 5x5.

Could this be due to a weak core, form??? As I get more fatigued with each set I begin to compromise my form by arching my lower back.

I honestly don't know where to start...

Murph1001
09-29-2009, 10:04 PM
Drop the ego and lower the weight. If you can't do the weight with strict form, then you are going too heavy. I would suggest doing an OH press like Wendler's 5/3/1 program. Use 125 as your starting max. I know when my OH press stalled, we just dialed back the max and started over again focusing more on reps. Lo and behold, the max is higher now.

Week 1
80 lbs- 5 reps
90 lbs- 5 reps
105 lbs- 5+ reps

Week 2
85 lbs- 3 reps
100 lbs- 3 reps
110 reps- 3 + reps

week 3
90 lbs- 5 reps
105 lbs- 3 reps
115 lbs- 1 + reps

Tom Mutaffis
09-30-2009, 08:35 AM
I know I've posted about this in the past, but my standing OH press is just so damn weak.

I struggle with 135lbs 5x5.

Could this be due to a weak core, form??? As I get more fatigued with each set I begin to compromise my form by arching my lower back.

I honestly don't know where to start...

Are you doing strict press (military) or push press?

Technique can be a huge factor on OHP. This includes timing, setup, bar path, etc.

Do you happen to have any way to video your lift? That would be the best way to assess things and look at possible areas for improvement.

Depending on your bodyweight 135 for 5x5 is not something that you should be too upset with.

fpr
09-30-2009, 10:06 AM
Thanks guys, I will lower the weight some and also get a video up for critique.

fpr
09-30-2009, 10:39 AM
Depending on your bodyweight 135 for 5x5 is not something that you should be too upset with.

Heh, I weigh more than you, ~240lbs, and not even a fraction as strong. So yeah, 135lbs is pretty crappy.

Sean S
09-30-2009, 11:23 AM
Your are probably arching too much because the shoulders are getting tired and your body is trying to bring the upper pecs into the equation. As was mentioned earlier, drop back to a managable weight and work on perfecting your technique and work back up slowly. 5/3/1 would allow you to get alot of submax reps.
When my OHP goes up, so does my raw and shirted bench, so I think it's a valuable movement.

MPB
09-30-2009, 12:23 PM
If you aren't doing this already, squeeze your glutes and legs very hard throughout your set. This will provide a solid base to press from and prevent your lower back from arching.

Guido
09-30-2009, 02:09 PM
If you aren't doing this already, squeeze your glutes and legs very hard throughout your set. This will provide a solid base to press from and prevent your lower back from arching.That's good advice and something I hadn't really thought much about. My OHP has stalled, too, so I will start doing this.

Tom Mutaffis
09-30-2009, 04:34 PM
Heh, I weigh more than you, ~240lbs, and not even a fraction as strong. So yeah, 135lbs is pretty crappy.

I wouldn't compare yourself to other lifters since OHP is a lift where body leverages and technique can be a big factor.

Back to one of my original questions - are you doing push press or standing military press?

A couple of tips for either movement:

Keep your body tight and take a full breath of air before un-racking the bar. Breath at lockout and never let out your air with the bar on your chest, you will lose your core stability that way.
Try a thumbless grip and see if that helps with wrist flexbility (only if you feel safe and are not using a bent bar). You want to keep your elbows relatively high on the press.
As you are pressing the bar try to drive it back over your head once you clear your face. This will put the bar strait in line with your arms and the center of your body as opposed to pressing it out in front of you; which is much more difficult.
The more speed off your shoulders the easier it will be to drive the bar through your sticking point.


Hopefully this helps; a video would be great if you have a chance to film your next workout.

vdizenzo
09-30-2009, 05:37 PM
Just push really f'n hard.

fpr
09-30-2009, 07:06 PM
I wouldn't compare yourself to other lifters since OHP is a lift where body leverages and technique can be a big factor.

Back to one of my original questions - are you doing push press or standing military press?

A couple of tips for either movement:

Keep your body tight and take a full breath of air before un-racking the bar. Breath at lockout and never let out your air with the bar on your chest, you will lose your core stability that way.
Try a thumbless grip and see if that helps with wrist flexbility (only if you feel safe and are not using a bent bar). You want to keep your elbows relatively high on the press.
As you are pressing the bar try to drive it back over your head once you clear your face. This will put the bar strait in line with your arms and the center of your body as opposed to pressing it out in front of you; which is much more difficult.
The more speed off your shoulders the easier it will be to drive the bar through your sticking point.


Hopefully this helps; a video would be great if you have a chance to film your next workout.

Thanks, those look like some great pointer. I am doing a strict OHP. I will get something up within the next few days

sandcracker21
10-01-2009, 05:52 AM
to add to the above post i also try very hard to keep my elbows 'out in front' and not fall to the sides

..it hurts the wrist a tad bit until you get used to it, but it will allow the shoulders to really do the work; i have to concentrate very hard on this


btw: OH press is a VERY hard lift to make gains on, like the others said, drop weight and build back up

what kind of program are you on?

rbtrout
10-02-2009, 04:02 PM
I'm in the same boat as you are, FPR. So, I started 5/3/1 on this about 6 weeks ago and have steadily increased my sohp. I'm going to stick with 5/3/1 as long as I can make gains.

Polish Hammer
10-05-2009, 02:01 PM
Watch these. They helped me alot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAXPJ3PfdyY


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtTEMRse54g


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkY9aa3okxw



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsNY2RJVnp4

drbill
10-07-2009, 07:44 AM
Just to add to what Tom Mutaffis said...I was struggling with mine as well...and I love doing these as I find it a great accessory exercise for the bench...Rob Wagner gave me a few tips and it was basically everything fpr said..but he also said to keep the elbows high and in front, rather than out to the side...for me it's almost like benching...elbows in, elbows out...similar to how olympic lifters hold the bar...once I changed this I was able to handle much more weight...I'm 198 and usually work with 185X3....

McLaughlin
10-07-2009, 07:53 AM
Drop the ego and lower the weight. If you can't do the weight with strict form, then you are going too heavy. I would suggest doing an OH press like Wendler's 5/3/1 program. Use 125 as your starting max. I know when my OH press stalled, we just dialed back the max and started over again focusing more on reps. Lo and behold, the max is higher now.

Week 1
80 lbs- 5 reps
90 lbs- 5 reps
105 lbs- 5+ reps

Week 2
85 lbs- 3 reps
100 lbs- 3 reps
110 reps- 3 + reps

week 3
90 lbs- 5 reps
105 lbs- 3 reps
115 lbs- 1 + reps

A little off topic, but would using a similar set/rep scheme work for increasing bench? My bench numbers are almost the exact same as his OHP, so if I use that format for benching would it help me the same way? Also with that which you listed, is it one set at each weight for a total of 3? or is it multiple sets at each weight?

Thanks, and again, sorry for getting off topic.

Pete22
10-07-2009, 09:31 AM
I'm in the same boat as you are, FPR. So, I started 5/3/1 on this about 6 weeks ago and have steadily increased my sohp. I'm going to stick with 5/3/1 as long as I can make gains.

This is what I did a few months ago and I've made some pretty good gains on my standing OHP.

Jason198
10-07-2009, 09:57 AM
What is harder to OH PRESS, a log or a barbell? sorry to get off topic but thought soemone here could answer this question.

Murph1001
10-07-2009, 04:24 PM
A little off topic, but would using a similar set/rep scheme work for increasing bench? My bench numbers are almost the exact same as his OHP, so if I use that format for benching would it help me the same way? Also with that which you listed, is it one set at each weight for a total of 3? or is it multiple sets at each weight?

Thanks, and again, sorry for getting off topic.

It's one set per weight. Just go over to elitefts and buy Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 E-book. It might possibly be the best twenty dollars you ever spend. Buy and print this book off. Then go over to Defranco's website and print off each of his Westside for Skinny Bastards templates. Three whole punch off all of this and put it in a 3 ring binder. This will probably be all you ever need to read for years to come.

McLaughlin
10-07-2009, 05:51 PM
It's one set per weight. Just go over to elitefts and buy Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 E-book. It might possibly be the best twenty dollars you ever spend. Buy and print this book off. Then go over to Defranco's website and print off each of his Westside for Skinny Bastards templates. Three whole punch off all of this and put it in a 3 ring binder. This will probably be all you ever need to read for years to come.

Cool thanks for the advice. I'll definitely check these things out. I purchased SS last year when I joined the site... seems that now the big thing to do is the 5/3/1 so I'll have to give that a try this time around.

Polish Hammer
10-08-2009, 10:00 AM
Thanks to Wendler and Strongmen, the OHP is finally getting the respect it deserves.

Tom Mutaffis
10-08-2009, 10:09 AM
What is harder to OH PRESS, a log or a barbell? sorry to get off topic but thought soemone here could answer this question.

It depends on the technique that you are using. A log is a slightly shorter range of motion but is much harder to jerk/push jerk than a barbell, in many cases you have to press a log as opposed to jerking it. This is why the world record log press is around 450 lbs yet people have overhead lifted 100+ lbs more than that on a barbell.

For strict OHP I would say that it is a toss up. The log might be easier for some people but a lot of guys can get more back bend with a barbell than they could with the log.

Are you trying to figure something out for your training? I can probably be more helpful if you have some additional details.

Jason198
10-08-2009, 10:44 AM
thanks Tom, I hope to do my first SM meet in November, I do strict over head press and Push press to train that event, I was wondering how they compared. Is there a better way to train Log press?

MAYBE D-BELLS with palms facing my head like they would be on a log Press MIGHT BE A GOOD WAY.

Thanks for any help