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cameronp81
12-15-2009, 06:35 AM
Can anyone give me some good bench routines for high school athletes. Keep in mind this is a weightlifting team and they will be working out 4 days a week. Things like floor press or board press or use of bands are not accessible for us. JUst any routines of the bench and supplemental excerises. If you can, please be specific and include percentages if you use them or things like that. Thank you.

tnathletics2b
12-15-2009, 06:53 AM
. Things like floor press or board press or use of bands are not accessible for us.

Just out of curiousity, why are floor presses and board presses not accessible? You can make boards by spending $5.00 at Lowes and floor presses, well, you just get in the floor. I would think a weightlifting team might want to make use of these popular techniques.

MarcusWild
12-15-2009, 10:41 AM
Just out of curiousity, why are floor presses and board presses not accessible? You can make boards by spending $5.00 at Lowes and floor presses, well, you just get in the floor. I would think a weightlifting team might want to make use of these popular techniques.

+1 Those are some of the most basic exercises and easy to implement.

poopoo333
12-15-2009, 10:48 AM
Can anyone give me some good bench routines for high school athletes. Keep in mind this is a weightlifting team and they will be working out 4 days a week. Things like floor press or board press or use of bands are not accessible for us. JUst any routines of the bench and supplemental excerises. If you can, please be specific and include percentages if you use them or things like that. Thank you.

Are you talking about prepping for the Florida high school weightlifting season? I found that when I competed in my last year of high school with the team, I could not get any stronger once the season started because there were meets pretty much every week, I thought it was ridiculous.

jtteg_x
12-15-2009, 02:15 PM
this program may work as it doesn't involve usage of boards, bands, or other tools. http://www.wannabebig.com/training/powerlifting-and-functional-strength-for-athletics/up-your-bench-press-30lbs-in-30-days/

n00bster
12-17-2009, 03:37 AM
If you are talking about high school athletes, then I would start at WS4SB3 which is a 4 day training template. Don't forget that its not just bench that needs to be trained. WS4SB3 has specific sections for athletes, football players, basketball players and would suit your high school lifters.

cameronp81
12-17-2009, 09:42 PM
do you have a link for that?

n00bster
12-18-2009, 02:32 AM
do you have a link for that?

There you go. (the forum software won't let me link as I'm a n00b,so replace @ with www) @defrancostraining.com/articles.html

nickp8
12-18-2009, 11:29 AM
5/3/1 would also work.

n00bster
12-19-2009, 04:56 AM
5/3/1 would also work.

Given the trainees are not powerlifters with bands, chains, boards but just high school athletes, ws4sb3 fits like a glove. They even have drills/conditioning and speed work that they can do because many of them are athletes.

gatorman2k6
12-19-2009, 10:15 AM
Given the trainees are not powerlifters with bands, chains, boards but just high school athletes, ws4sb3 fits like a glove. They even have drills/conditioning and speed work that they can do because many of them are athletes.

5/3/1 doesn't use chains, bands, or boards.

Barbaccio
12-19-2009, 10:29 AM
I wonder how long they can possibly let you stay around n00b.

5/3/1 is great especially if you don't want to use boards, chains, or bands. The $20 investment in the book is well worth it. It lays out the program, the accessory work, and the conditioning. You run it 2, 3, or 4 days a week. However, it's probably not the best program to use if you're training athletes during the season. It would be great for off-season work. Check out www.elitefts.com for a lot of help on training high school kids. There's plenty of good, reliable info on there.

n00bster
12-19-2009, 10:47 AM
5/3/1 doesn't use chains, bands, or boards.

5/3/1 is great for raw strength but I woouldn't push it on high school athletes. I have always believed in the following approach :-

n00bs - programs for n00bs e.g. SS
Intermediates - programs like WS4SB3, Madcow 5x5 etc
Advanced - Dogg Crapp, Jim Wendler 5/3/1, Shotgun etc

A common question on many boards is what is the best program?, and people will say X, Y or Z without looking at the target audience who may be a n00b who can't squat 3x weekly for example.

nickp8
12-19-2009, 11:42 AM
5/3/1 is great for raw strength but I woouldn't push it on high school athletes. I have always believed in the following approach :-

n00bs - programs for n00bs e.g. SS
Intermediates - programs like WS4SB3, Madcow 5x5 etc
Advanced - Dogg Crapp, Jim Wendler 5/3/1, Shotgun etc

A common question on many boards is what is the best program?, and people will say X, Y or Z without looking at the target audience who may be a n00b who can't squat 3x weekly for example.

So if 5/3/1 is great for raw strength but not good for high school athletes, what kind of strength do they need? What you are saying doesn't make sense. 5/3/1 is in no way shape or form only for advanced lifters. As far as target audience goes high school athletes should be squating, benching, and deadlifting. WS4SB is a good program but it isn't the only one and nothing is more simple than 5/3/1 so stop talking.

n00bster
12-19-2009, 12:44 PM
So if 5/3/1 is great for raw strength but not good for high school athletes, what kind of strength do they need? What you are saying doesn't make sense. 5/3/1 is in no way shape or form only for advanced lifters. As far as target audience goes high school athletes should be squating, benching, and deadlifting. WS4SB is a good program but it isn't the only one and nothing is more simple than 5/3/1 so stop talking.

WS4SB3 is modelled on the famous Westside Barbell system but is designed specifically for high school athletes and includes conditioning/GPP and drills e.g if they are football or basketball players. Jim Wendler 5/3/1 is good but ot one that you can say that is is the best for high school athletes.

Where is the specific programming for basketball players or football players in the 5/3/1? I would like to hear any proper scientific arguments you have. I would also like high school coaches and people who work with high school athletes to chime in.

jbrin0tk
12-19-2009, 12:53 PM
Lol, why do you think 5/3/1 is such advanced programming?

joey54
12-19-2009, 12:56 PM
WS4SB3 is modelled on the famous Westside Barbell system but is designed specifically for high school athletes and includes conditioning/GPP and drills e.g if they are football or basketball players. Jim Wendler 5/3/1 is good but ot one that you can say that is is the best for high school athletes.

Where is the specific programming for basketball players or football players in the 5/3/1? I would like to hear any proper scientific arguments you have. I would also like high school coaches and people who work with high school athletes to chime in.

So you lift 5/3/1 and then do some sport specific work/cardio. Its not rocket science.

nickp8
12-19-2009, 12:56 PM
WS4SB3 is modelled on the famous Westside Barbell system but is designed specifically for high school athletes and includes conditioning/GPP and drills e.g if they are football or basketball players. Jim Wendler 5/3/1 is good but ot one that you can say that is is the best for high school athletes.

Where is the specific programming for basketball players or football players in the 5/3/1? I would like to hear any proper scientific arguments you have. I would also like high school coaches and people who work with high school athletes to chime in.

I never knocked WS4SB it is a program I used for 3 years with great results. The OP was asking for a program for a weightlifting team, not a basketball or football team. As far as programs that hit all the big lifts and that are easy to use with large groups of people the 5/3/1 fits this situation a little better. So the specific lifts in this routine are the bench press, the deadlift, and the squat. Next time read the post.

n00bster
12-19-2009, 01:12 PM
So you lift 5/3/1 and then do some sport specific work/cardio. Its not rocket science.

Are you a high school coach? Where should the athlete get the sport specific work from as they are not in the 5/3/1 ebook. I would actually love to hear from qualified people who actually work with high school athletes. Yes it is not rocket science but Joe Defranco is an expert in this area. :ninja:

nickp8
12-19-2009, 01:37 PM
Are you a high school coach? Where should the athlete get the sport specific work from as they are not in the 5/3/1 ebook. I would actually love to hear from qualified people who actually work with high school athletes. Yes it is not rocket science but Joe Defranco is an expert in this area. :ninja:

What are your qualifications? Are you a coach or trainer? What are your numbers? Maybe if you answer a couple of these questions you give yourself some credibility instead of making yourself seem like a troll. Once again no one is saying that WS4SB isn't a great program, and Joe Defranco is an expert and he actually has been using the 5/3/1 recently with his sport specific work. The main thing you that you don't realize is that 5/3/1 is basically a rep scheme for the big lifts. You can program the sport specific work, the conditioning work, and all the accessory lifts in many different ways to fit your schedule and goal.

gatorman2k6
12-19-2009, 01:53 PM
Are you a high school coach? Where should the athlete get the sport specific work from as they are not in the 5/3/1 ebook. I would actually love to hear from qualified people who actually work with high school athletes. Yes it is not rocket science but Joe Defranco is an expert in this area. :ninja:

So is Jim Wendler, so if you want his credentials, check out his bio on elite. He is a Strength and Conditioning expert and has worked with college programs, so I'm pretty sure his 5/3/1 program is just fine for high school athletes, specifically the weightlifting team, which is the one the OP wanted to know about.

Learning2Lift
12-19-2009, 02:13 PM
Noob, please read carefully so we can all avoid unnecessary arguments. The OP was asking for a program for a high school LIFTING team. Not a specific sport. With large groups like the ones usually found in a high school weight room sometimes the best program is the simplest just because of the lack of supervision, spotters, etc. And considering most coaches only have a limited amount of time they can spend with a group or team 5/3/1 will allow them to focus on the major lifts and leave any of the accessory stuff for the guys who actually want to take the time and do them on their own time.

joey54
12-19-2009, 03:41 PM
Are you a high school coach? Where should the athlete get the sport specific work from as they are not in the 5/3/1 ebook. I would actually love to hear from qualified people who actually work with high school athletes. Yes it is not rocket science but Joe Defranco is an expert in this area. :ninja:

Nope. But I know training isn't that hard to figure out. It would depend obviously on what sports the kids are playing and what their needs are for the positions they play.

BloodandThunder
12-21-2009, 10:16 AM
If these kids are relatively new to strength training, more important than the program they are running is the coaching they are getting. Newer trainees can make progress by doing basic programs, if they are coached well. Remember not everyone can succeed on a given program, as not every kid has the same lifestyle, food, dedication, sleep issues, GPP levels, genetics, etc. Also, understand your training timetable, for instance, is it necessary for them to peak and taper at any point; when to deload; when to wave intensity and volume, etc.

What's important as a coach is taking note of all this and monitoring progress and failure and responding to that (addressing poor technique, changing programs, addressing weak points, etc). Coaching is not simply handing out a sheet of paper with percentages and a few exercises written down. If these kids leave high school with the ability to write their own program and understand what they are doing, you did your job.

Learning2Lift
12-21-2009, 11:07 AM
If these kids are relatively new to strength training, more important than the program they are running is the coaching they are getting. Newer trainees can make progress by doing basic programs, if they are coached well. Remember not everyone can succeed on a given program, as not every kid has the same lifestyle, food, dedication, sleep issues, GPP levels, genetics, etc. Also, understand your training timetable, for instance, is it necessary for them to peak and taper at any point; when to deload; when to wave intensity and volume, etc.

What's important as a coach is taking note of all this and monitoring progress and failure and responding to that (addressing poor technique, changing programs, addressing weak points, etc). Coaching is not simply handing out a sheet of paper with percentages and a few exercises written down. If these kids leave high school with the ability to write their own program and understand what they are doing, you did your job.

Great point.

KoSh
01-09-2010, 10:30 AM
I use 5/3/1 with my high school athletes... It works great.

The main lift is also 5/3/1 and then I go sport specific lifts for the accessory work. It's money in the bank.