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View Full Version : Tendon and Ligament strength...



Virtron
06-19-2010, 06:58 PM
So, I haven't been on these forums for a bit... mainly because i've been letting my body rest.

I'm about to start my Westside for Skinny Bastards Routine.

Monday
Max Effort Upper Body
Rows
Flys
Cuban Presses
Pressdowns

Wednesday
RDL
Split Squats
Abs

Friday
Rows
Flys
Cuban Presses
JM Presses

Saturday
Max Effort Lower Body
RDL
Split Squats
Abs

This is just an example, but I'm sure you guys get the point. The thing is I've been reading about tendon and ligament strengthening and I would really like to integrate that into my work out. From what I understand consistency is important. So, if I wanted to integrate bench press lockouts, rack pulls, should press lockouts, and quarter squats... how could I do that? I'd like to do those exercises once a week. I understand that I wouldn't be doing them for singles... but what sort of volume scheme should I use and is it possible to do something like this...

Saturday
Deadlift - 3 rep max
Rack Pulls - 3 x 5 or Quarter Squats - 3 x 5
SLDL
Split Squats
Abs

Monday
Bench Press - 3 rep max
Bench Press Lockouts - 3 x 5 or Shoulder Press Lockouts - 3 x 5
Rows
Cuban Presses
Pressdowns

Thanks,

Virtron

Lones Green
06-19-2010, 08:23 PM
Not really sure all that is needed. Box squatting will build a ton of ligament strength in the knees, and with the Westside template you'll be doing rack lockouts, board presses, and rack pulls

Seems like you might be thinking a little too much

Sean S
06-19-2010, 08:53 PM
Just doing the regular WFSB routine will strengthen your tendons and ligaments fine without all that extra stuff you listed. They will adapt to training just like everything else in your body. Just train to get strong and your tendons and ligaments will get stronger as well.

Virtron
06-20-2010, 07:48 AM
Not really sure all that is needed. Box squatting will build a ton of ligament strength in the knees, and with the Westside template you'll be doing rack lockouts, board presses, and rack pulls

Seems like you might be thinking a little too much

The reason im thinking this way is because of my sacroiliac joint dislocation in december. I progressed in the deadlift pretty fast. the weight felt light enough for me to add weight. However, with good form my joint still got messed up. Maybe this is a bad conclusion but i just dont think my joints were able to keep up. I want to deadlift again and squat without injury. Am i wrong to think that this method will help?

Lones Green
06-20-2010, 08:16 AM
The reason im thinking this way is because of my sacroiliac joint dislocation in december. I progressed in the deadlift pretty fast. the weight felt light enough for me to add weight. However, with good form my joint still got messed up. Maybe this is a bad conclusion but i just dont think my joints were able to keep up. I want to deadlift again and squat without injury. Am i wrong to think that this method will help?i

I think so. If you dislocated your sacroiliac joint deadlifting, then you were most likely doing something wrong. Make sure you have someone experienced to look at your form, and make sure you do your assistance work.

Virtron
06-20-2010, 09:16 AM
I think so. If you dislocated your sacroiliac joint deadlifting, then you were most likely doing something wrong. Make sure you have someone experienced to look at your form, and make sure you do your assistance work.

All right thanks man. Youve given me good advice before.

Sean S
06-20-2010, 10:43 AM
I've dealt with some SI joint issues lately (not as serious as a dislocation thought) and doing heavy partials would have been the worst thing I could have done. For a while I just couldn't handle heavy loading of the joint, regardless of the ROM. So doing heavy rack pulls or partial squats would have likely made it much worse. I would recommend icing the area after training (even if it feels OK) and don't go crazy with loading the area right away. Work back to heavy lifts slowly and really make sure your technique is right.

Virtron
06-20-2010, 10:59 AM
I've dealt with some SI joint issues lately (not as serious as a dislocation thought) and doing heavy partials would have been the worst thing I could have done. For a while I just couldn't handle heavy loading of the joint, regardless of the ROM. So doing heavy rack pulls or partial squats would have likely made it much worse. I would recommend icing the area after training (even if it feels OK) and don't go crazy with loading the area right away. Work back to heavy lifts slowly and really make sure your technique is right.

I hear what youre saying. Ive been on my third week of 135lb deads. I also take animal flex and do myofascial release work with a tenns ball. I finally feel like a human again lol. I used to rely on my lats a lot when i pulled. I switched over to a more hamstring based pull. Im thinking in 5 more weeks ill be ready for 185.

dynamo
06-20-2010, 01:00 PM
correct me if i'm wrong but I believe WS4SB has speed work incorporated into it as a quasi deload type training and from what I understand speed work greatly helps with ligament strength as well as recovery.

Nevertheless, ligaments have no direct blood supply and because of this they do take a very long time to heal when injured. If you're going to focus on ligament strengthening I would make sure your vitamins and mineral intake is up to par and make certain you give your body time to heal.

I've had ligament troubles in the past but I found I could overcome them with high rep work and speed work and some good stretching and I absolutely listen to my body whenever it says "too much." I am sure I could progress faster with more injuries if I would just go for my goals, but so far I have not done any permanent damage to my body thanks to proper warm ups and recovery work when necessary.

chris mason
06-20-2010, 01:26 PM
The heavy work you do on your ME day will stimulate tendon thickness etc. Adding additional partials with even greater loads will lead to injury. If you want to support your tendons and ligaments incorporate some VERY high repetition (100 reps) work at the end of your training day. This generates blood flow to the area and helps support the health of the relatively avascular tendons and ligaments.

Virtron
06-20-2010, 01:28 PM
correct me if i'm wrong but I believe WS4SB has speed work incorporated into it as a quasi deload type training and from what I understand speed work greatly helps with ligament strength as well as recovery.

Nevertheless, ligaments have no direct blood supply and because of this they do take a very long time to heal when injured. If you're going to focus on ligament strengthening I would make sure your vitamins and mineral intake is up to par and make certain you give your body time to heal.

I've had ligament troubles in the past but I found I could overcome them with high rep work and speed work and some good stretching and I absolutely listen to my body whenever it says "too much." I am sure I could progress faster with more injuries if I would just go for my goals, but so far I have not done any permanent damage to my body thanks to proper warm ups and recovery work when necessary.

I absolutely agree with the pushing too much part... I set a goal and I wanted to reach it, but my body obviously wasn't ready. I took 2 months off and in the meantime took a multi, b-complex, and bi-flex. At some point, I bought vitamin c and animal flex. So, daily I take a multi, 12 caps of ON Fish Oil, 6 grams of vit. C, B-Complex, and animal flex. Those things are great, but the biggest help has been the myofascial release and stretching.

Is there something that you could recommend for speed work?

dynamo
06-20-2010, 01:43 PM
I absolutely agree with the pushing too much part... I set a goal and I wanted to reach it, but my body obviously wasn't ready. I took 2 months off and in the meantime took a multi, b-complex, and bi-flex. At some point, I bought vitamin c and animal flex. So, daily I take a multi, 12 caps of ON Fish Oil, 6 grams of vit. C, B-Complex, and animal flex. Those things are great, but the biggest help has been the myofascial release and stretching.

Is there something that you could recommend for speed work?

if I were in your position, and this is speaking on behalf of myself with the problems you described, I would deadlift light, maybe 135 (or maybe 145 using 2 25lbs on each side to get a good stretch), and keep good form obviously. From there I would do 1 or 2 20 rep sets as fast as I could without losing form, and naturally if my form deteriorated i'd either stop or slow down depending on how i felt. For me it was always about getting the blood pumping and loosening up the body while focusing on the affected area.

I am more of a hamstring deadlifter as well though, my back doesn't really come into play until its time to lock out.

Virtron
06-20-2010, 06:04 PM
if I were in your position, and this is speaking on behalf of myself with the problems you described, I would deadlift light, maybe 135 (or maybe 145 using 2 25lbs on each side to get a good stretch), and keep good form obviously. From there I would do 1 or 2 20 rep sets as fast as I could without losing form, and naturally if my form deteriorated i'd either stop or slow down depending on how i felt. For me it was always about getting the blood pumping and loosening up the body while focusing on the affected area.

I am more of a hamstring deadlifter as well though, my back doesn't really come into play until its time to lock out.

Sounds good. Ill try the high reps