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NickAus
09-22-2010, 04:48 AM
Anything you have found to work well?

Any favourite movements to build your Sumo?

Thanks!!

Lones Green
09-22-2010, 06:42 AM
Off the floor or at lockout?

When I was at Westside once, AJ told me to work my opposite stance hard. That's what I've been doing and my deadlift is increasing

AdamBAG
09-22-2010, 08:46 AM
I always found practicing my form in full gear for speed helped my sumo pull. Then use conventional stances exercises raw to build up my back and lockout. I found that with box squatting wide all the time I didn't need to do a ton of sumo pulling as long as I was comfortable in my gear.

NickAus
09-22-2010, 03:54 PM
Thanks guys!!

My lock-out is pretty strong, floor to knees is my weakness.

IronDiggy
09-22-2010, 05:14 PM
My weakness is lockout with sumo. However I used to almost always pull conventional in training.

ScottYard
09-22-2010, 06:41 PM
Abs. Abs. Abs. And then more Abs. Hit them 3-4 times per week and Your pull will have no choice but to grow.

Barbaccio
09-23-2010, 06:34 AM
Wide Stance GM's
Deficit Pulls w/ & w/o Bands
Ukranian's (Basically you stand on to boxes with a heavy Kettlebell/Dumbbell held between the legs and squat as low as possible trying to touch the dumbell/kettlebell to the floor.)

NickAus
09-23-2010, 06:30 PM
Thanks everyone!

AlMohr
09-23-2010, 07:56 PM
>Speed pulls w/ chains or bands
>stiff legged sumo's (I never go below 5 reps on this)
>zercher harness for lockouts
>and my favorite pulling against quaded mini's, teaches speed and builds a great lockout

NickAus
09-23-2010, 08:53 PM
Seems Im going to have to add sumo sldl's right away, never done them.

DMedley
09-24-2010, 08:30 AM
Thanks guys!!

My lock-out is pretty strong, floor to knees is my weakness.

My deadlift looks like the average persons bench press, but what my trainer has started me doing with the Sumo Deadlift follows.

Floor to knee hold 1 second set bar down, repeat 5 times ... rest and then repeat for 5 sets.

second lift

Floor to knee, hold 1 second, snap into lock out, set bar down and repeat for 5's x 5 sets.

Follow this with deficit deadlifts for more power from the floor. I use 35# weight plates to create the deficit, instead of standing on something.

hulk242
09-24-2010, 08:50 AM
I like the sumo stiff legged deadlifts as well and for that matter any stiff legged deadlift. I am high on keystone deadlifts done both styles.

JSully
09-24-2010, 10:01 AM
Off the floor or at lockout?

When I was at Westside once, AJ told me to work my opposite stance hard. That's what I've been doing and my deadlift is increasing

so you're saying, if I compete conventional, train the **** out of sumo and my conventional will still go up?

Andrew Cohn
09-29-2010, 09:30 AM
Last winter I trained for 10 weeks and put 28 pounds on my deadlift taking it from 578 to 606 while keeping my bodyweight within 2 pounds of my beginning weight. This whole time I trained without a belt (except for the 90%+ sets), trained for higher reps (lots of 5x5 sets) and trained the **** out of the reverse hyper. My reverse hyper went from 250 pounds for 8 reps (not a max but definately a very hard set) to nearly 400 pounds.

Summary:
High reps
No belt
Reverse Hyper

NickAus
09-29-2010, 03:56 PM
Last winter I trained for 10 weeks and put 28 pounds on my deadlift taking it from 578 to 606 while keeping my bodyweight within 2 pounds of my beginning weight. This whole time I trained without a belt (except for the 90%+ sets), trained for higher reps (lots of 5x5 sets) and trained the **** out of the reverse hyper. My reverse hyper went from 250 pounds for 8 reps (not a max but definately a very hard set) to nearly 400 pounds.

Summary:
High reps
No belt
Reverse Hyper

You pull Sumo?

Thanks.

jtteg_x
09-29-2010, 06:10 PM
Abs. Abs. Abs. And then more Abs. Hit them 3-4 times per week and Your pull will have no choice but to grow.

I've heard this one before. What ab exercises are good for pulling?

BloodandThunder
09-29-2010, 06:11 PM
Nick
besides what everyone else said, try anything that will target your erectors. Andrew was onto something with high reps off the floor and reverse hyper. Try doing some full Olympic squats and High Bar GMs and Seated GMs with a sumo stance. Alot of sumo pullers dont keep a tight arch and once that fails, your form will suffer. Anything that keeps your erectors in a tight position. I've liked the Halting DLs past the knee, with an emphasis of keeping a good isometric position with the back. Believe Marc Bartley liked doing dead stop leg presses to teach the quads to drive off the floor as well.

Dave Schwab
09-29-2010, 07:08 PM
Wide Stance GM's
Deficit Pulls w/ & w/o Bands
Ukranian's (Basically you stand on to boxes with a heavy Kettlebell/Dumbbell held between the legs and squat as low as possible trying to touch the dumbell/kettlebell to the floor.)

What Tone said. All 3 will help your pull at the floor. Don't totally neglect your lockout work though, add some pin pulls or elevated pulls around once every 3 weeks, preferably conventional.

NickAus
09-29-2010, 07:43 PM
Big help guys, thanks!

Andrew Cohn
09-30-2010, 06:40 PM
You pull Sumo?

Thanks.

Yessir. I think the erectors and the speed are the biggest factors. The speed can be built with the high rep sets and doesn't need it's own day.

NickAus
09-30-2010, 09:53 PM
Thank you very much!

Did you work off a certain percent for the sets of 5?

Andrew Cohn
10-01-2010, 10:51 AM
Most of the sets were for 4's and 5's based off three week progressive overload waves. An example would be:

Wave 1
70% 5x5
75% 5x5
80% 5x5

Wave 2
75% 5x5
80% 5x5
85% 5x5

Repeat these waves until your competittion. The lighter percentages really let you focus on form and speed while building up the posterior chain. The strength will build quickly as well. The first time I hit 90% in that cycle it called for 525x2 (insert sets as needed). I didnt think I'd possibly be able to do it but I smashed that set and eventually worked up to a 35 pound PR of 551x2 that day. The simple stuff can work, I didnt use a band or a chain the whole cycle.

NickAus
10-01-2010, 07:19 PM
Great, I appreciate your time!

Thanks!

NickAus
10-01-2010, 07:20 PM
85% 5x5 must be hard.

SoCoBarbell
10-02-2010, 01:31 PM
If I read everything correctly you're pulling sumo and have trouble from the bottom? If I'm right then consider this. When you pull sumo the first half of the lift is a high squat. You should be pushing your feet through the floor while keeping your back as straight up as possible so all you have to do to finnish the lift is squeeze your glutes and flex your back a little.

I train a girl who has put #70 pounds on her deadlift. In under 6 months. She had the same problem. She could rack pull about #100 more than she could pull off the floor because she couldn't get the lift started with heavy weight. Her legs were weak.

I had her start doing squats from the bottom with the bar in chains. I set the bar just below the position she started her pull from. As her legs got stronger her form got better and her pull shot up. Identify your weakness and make it strong.......... Good luck

Andrew Cohn
10-02-2010, 03:01 PM
85% 5x5 must be hard.

It aint easy but by this point, the volume should have pushed your true max up significantly so the training max of 85% isn't all that bad.

NickAus
10-02-2010, 06:57 PM
Thank you guys I really appreciate the advise and will put it to work.

Hit a good PR the other day so that's a start.

pricedtosell
10-02-2010, 10:32 PM
http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/showthread.php?132136-Best-Deadlift-Builders

Just saw this in the "similar threads" links hah, some good answers here in your last thread about this too.

Also, for the wide stance/sumo stance SLDL's, are you guys keeping your feet pointed more forward in more of a wide squat stance or are you keeping them pointed out to the sides parallel with the bar in more of a sumo stance?

NickAus
11-07-2010, 03:51 AM
Just an update, I have been doing a lot of 5s and 4s in the 75-90% range and my Sumo is moving well.

I have been pouring my effort into the lift itself and not much else other than high volume upperback work.

Thanks for all the advice!!