View Full Version : To The Wise.
10-29-2010, 04:42 PM
I have a simple question to ask. ITs to the point of 'duh!'.
I am on a 2000 cal diet with a 40-40-20 split. I work out 3/week and do cardio 5/week. I have a calorie tracker that allows me to tally what i eat. Given that i eat 2000 cal/day. I also expend about 400-600 calories 5days/week. the net compsumption is anywhere between 1500 to 1400 cals/day
My aim is to cut down from my current 180 pounds 20 percent bf to 180 pound 15percent bf. I should be doing this on such low calories but i dont seem to be. Whats going wrong ?????
10-29-2010, 05:10 PM
How long have you been doing this for without seeing results?
unless you are weighing your food, you are not tracking calories correctly
20% to 15% should be easy once you learn to count
10-29-2010, 06:58 PM
unless you are weighing your food, you are not tracking calories correctly
20% to 15% should be easy once you learn to count
That depends on what food he's consuming. If it's majority self prepared (ie rice, grilled chicken) I agree, a food scale is pretty helpful, but in no way imperitive. Measuring cups will get the average dieter more than close enough. If he's eating the majority of his food that his portions are listed on the package then obviously it's even less necessary, as you know. I do agree though, for the $20 an accurate digital one costs it's much easier and accurate. And there's really no reason not invest in one, but the OP should not be led to believe that if he is indeed not successful, that it's because lack of a food scale.
To the OP - Can you rephrase your question, I'm not totally sure what you're asking. When you say "I should be doing this on such low calories but i dont seem to be. Whats going wrong ????? ." I start to lose you. Are you asking if it is too few calories? Possible, but that's not certain. The biggest question is how long have you been on this protocol consistently?
10-30-2010, 08:29 AM
Thank you for the replies.
I have been on this for 12 weeks now consistently. There hasnt been much improvement
My diet is pretty healthy and i follow the portions listed on the food products. These include Oats, Chicken breasts, tuna, Whey, whole wheat, brown rice, broccoli and fruit ( only one per day ). for the record i do not have a measuring scale but have measuring cups.
@ Behemoth - Logically i should be loosing Weight but i dont seem to be. It is possible that my body has become accustomed to this food regime but i want to know what to do next.
Do i cut down the carb calories ? I have done this in the past to 80 gm/day and reached 17 percent but it left me drained. Gym workouts were difficult !! Getting through the day was a chore !!
Do i just increase the cardio ( 45 minutes/4 times a week on the elliptical aint enough ?)
Do i blame the genes and give up ?
10-30-2010, 10:05 AM
I don't think it's the diet. It's probably the exercise.
You want to be training like an athlete, and feeding your body as such. You shouldn't just be trying to cut percentage points of body fat. You should be training to make your body optimized for physical effort. Doing so will make you lean, strong and muscular over time.
Please post what you do in the gym during cardio and lifting days and we'll be able to figure this out.
10-30-2010, 03:29 PM
2000 calories a day @ 180lbs for 12 weeks and you haven't seen much weight loss means either your calories are too high, or like F=MA said you're not being accurate, or you're not being consistent. If you are confident that you have been within 200 calories of that mark every day or at least almost every day for those 12 weeks then you simply need to eat less. You're definetly not eatting too little to be stalled IMO.
10-31-2010, 10:09 AM
I am encouraged by your replies. I am posting what i do through the week. I am probably going to get a rap on the knuckles( or head) but i recently shifted to the German Volume training workout a week ago. I have not altered my diet as i dont know what to do. As i mentioned my aim is to weigh 180 pounds but cut down my BF% to 15 from 20.
Day 1 - Morning ( 45 min on elliptical at Fat burning HR on an empty stomach , machine says 500 calories burnt)
Evening - Chest & back - Superset Inc Db Press 50 pounds & Seated Rows for 10X10 ( 90 sec rest between the supersets, 4-0-2 tempo).
Inclinne Flyes & upright rows 3 X10 ( 60 secs rest and 3-0-2)
Day 2 - Morning Cardio ( as above )
Evening - Abs super set - sit up, leg raise, planks, side bends ( 5X 15-25)
Day 3 - Morning Cardio ( as above )
Evening - Gym Arms and Shoulder
Curls - 20pd Db & Dips 20 (10X10, 4-0-2 tempo, 90 secs rest between supersets)
Lateral raise 25 pd db & bent over raise 15 pd ( 3X10, 3-0-2 tempo, 60 sec rest)
Day 4 - Morning Cardio ( as above)
Evening -Abs - Super set - Sit up, planks,Side wood chop, leg raise ( 5X10
Day 5 - Gym ( no morning cardio ) Legs - Smith Machine Squats (70 pd) & seated Leg curls ( 10X10, 4-0-2, 90s) Leg Extension & calve raise 5X10, 3-0-2, 60 secs rest
Day 6 & 7 - REST !!!!
Thank you for having a look and letting this novice know...
10-31-2010, 10:12 AM
Please be advised that i changed my previous workout to the GVT a week ago. Prior to that i was following a different routine. It was based on Hugo Rivera's book. I became fitter and found myself able to complete the workouts easier but that was it.
11-01-2010, 04:55 PM
We need to know what you were doing for lifting before because that's what you were doing while having trouble. The GVT can be good for a 4-8 week period of time, but isn't something you want to be doing long term. It doesn't target the right types of muscle fibers for maximum growth or force the neural adaptations needed for maximal strength. It's a best of no worlds program, but can be extremely effective for people who haven't trained in that fashion previously. In your situation it's probably not the best option, especially since it's a demanding program meant for building muscle and you are in a calories restrictive phase. In fact, looking more closely at that program it's pretty terrible and not even a proper manifestation of GVT.
Major problem in how you are doing your cardio and something I suspected. You want to be training cardio like you do lifting - intense and progressive. You are not burning 500 calories on that machine, your body is burning less each time you do it because you become more efficient at performing the exercise.
If you simply do "45 minutes of cardio in the fat burning zone" your body is only going to adapt to be able to do just that. You lose fat and gain muscle by forcing your body to adapt to a stimulus.
You want to do something more along the line of setting a timer for 30 minutes. Start at an intensity level that is difficult but not a maximum effort. On your elliptical it gives you a calories readout (a distance traveled would be better if available). Record the the 476 calories burned or whatever it is. Next workout, you MUST beat that number. There are different ways to structure it. Personally, I would go all out as long as possible, then go back to a moderate pace, then all out etc...each time try to go all out longer and moderate shorter. In theory (and practice) you will eventually reach a point where you can go all out for all 30 minutes straight. You are now badass and can be sure your body will have changed.
I can go on a bit more if you like, but that's the basic idea I want to get across. You must be training to FORCE your body to adapt. It knows how to burn less energy as you take in less energy. You need to prove to your body it needs to be in awesome shape because of the exercise you put it through.
Keep in mind, worst case scenario you get burned out. This type of training will cut your workload down, but you will get more out of it. Pay attention to your energy levels and motivation and make sure you are recovered.
You may also find you need to INcrease calories to support the new metabolic demands you are putting on your body. This is good - your body is now using those calories to adapt your body to meet the athletic requirements you are placing on it. This = lean muscular you with consistency.
Stick with it! This is always a trial and error game. You will always be making adjustments.
11-03-2010, 07:43 AM
' I can go on a bit more if you like ' - YES, PLEASE!!!!
The cardio i do in the morning is not in a steady state. I tend to increase and decrease the tempo and resistance over the time period. But i take your point about it being progressive. I was getting a little too complacent & obsessed with the numbers. From what you are saying, i infer that i am to decrease the time period required to burn those calories....like trying to go down to 40mins from 45 then 35 from 40 then 30 from 35 tillll i am going all out.
The workout prior to shifting to the GVT is as follows
Day 1 - Cardio in the morning for 30 mins after empty stomach or post workout
Superset 1 - Chin up, Smith Mchine reverse grip Bench press , Upright row,Incline Flye - 60 secs break between each superset.10 reps /exercise,60secs break)
Super set 2 - Lateral Raise, Bicep Curls, Bent over raise, Skull Crusher - 60 secs break between each superset. Again 4 sets of 10 reps per exercise
Superset 3 - Abdominals - Weighted lying leg raise ( with form!!) weighted side bends, Plank ( 1.5 mins),sit ups ( 15 - 25 reps each for 4 sets, 60 secs brak)
Day 2 - Cardio in the morning on an empty stomach or post workout.
Superset 1 - Smith machine Squat, Leg curls, Leg extensions, SLDL - 10 reps/exercise, 4 supersets, 60 secs break after each superset)
Super set 2 - Lunges, Calve raises, Leg curls, Seated Calf raise - 10 reps/exercise - 4 supersets, 60 secs break
Abs - crunches. 4 * 25
Day 3 - REST
Day 4 - Cardio in the morning or post workout
Superset 1 - Shrugs, Incline Db press,Seated rows, Incline Machine press ( 10 reps/exercise, 4 supersets, 60 secs after each superset)
Superset 2 - Shoulder press ( Db), Bicep curl, Lateral raise, close grip tricep push up ( 10 reps/exercise, 4 sets, 60 secs break)
superset 3 - Hanging leg raise, side woodchops, plank, sit ups
Day 5 - As above.
DAy 6 - Cardio in the morning on an empty stomach.
The gym i goto does not have a squat rack ( shocking) or barbells, it is one of those apartment building type gyms. I cant do things like barbell rows free squats, free bench press. The upside is we have a good amount of very expensive looking dumbells. I have thought of joining an ouside gym but life happens.........so i have had to compromise. I was able to go from 10 to 12 reps on most of these exercise and FINISH 4 sets by the end of 6 weeks with form.... There wasnt much improvement otherwise... in terms of aesthetics.
GVT was to shock my system. i chose it out of frustration and a sense of ' now what?'. You said it wasnt a good manifestation. Why ? I read Charles Poliquins workout schedule and just tweaked it so that i could do it in my gym ( No barbells). What should i change ?
Thanks for taking a look and really REALLY appreciate the input.
11-03-2010, 09:03 AM
Sorry about the error on Day 5 - Its the same as Day 2 .....
11-04-2010, 06:43 PM
You can choose any progression method for you cardio. If you you want to work your way down in time like that you can. The cardio just needs to be intense and progressive like your lifting sessions should be. You should feel like you just ran for your life. I wouldn't recommend going longer than 30 minutes/day with this type of cardio but you aren't going to be intense right away anyway so you can work your way down. I don't mean that as an insult - it just takes a few sessions for your body to be able to go all out at a given task.
The workout is pretty terrible. Your limitations in free weights are exactly what you need to fill in. If you can't do the correct exercises, your results will suffer. No way around it. You need to have use of a barbell and weights. The only good exercises in your whole routine are chin ups, SLDL, lunges (if done properly), and incline DB Press.
If you can't get the barbell and weights, there isn't much good advice I can give you. You will get some beginner gains and stall out with the equipment you have. Machines are terrible and even counterproductive, and DB's have an issue with long term progression when used alone.
11-04-2010, 10:02 PM
Looks like i may end up joinging a gym then. Its not that far and i am willing to do it to get it right!!
What would you change if i did have access to barbells and free weights ?
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