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NormalDude
01-30-2011, 02:07 PM
I recently started a cut and I am losing 1.5 to 2 lbs a week. My diet has a 250 grams of protein in it but it is also 2250 cals. Now I have heard a couple different thing about adjusting your diet for cutting. I Have heard to eat as many grams of protein as you want to weigh. So if I wanted to be at 225 lbs then I would eat 225 grams of protein. Then I also heard eat less calories than you burn and you will drop weight. So which is the way to go? Because with my diet right now I am losing weight but it will stop at 250lbs according to the protein theory because I am on 250 grams of protein.

Also another part of my question is lets say I drop the protein how do I keep the muscle? I always get a little mixed up with the numbers for diets. Maybe I should just do Hershal Walkers diet. I mean he only eats a soup and salad once a day and look at him.

RichMcGuire
01-30-2011, 02:35 PM
I recently started a cut and I am losing 1.5 to 2 lbs a week. My diet has a 250 grams of protein in it but it is also 2250 cals. Now I have heard a couple different thing about adjusting your diet for cutting. I Have heard to eat as many grams of protein as you want to weigh. So if I wanted to be at 225 lbs then I would eat 225 grams of protein. Then I also heard eat less calories than you burn and you will drop weight. So which is the way to go? Because with my diet right now I am losing weight but it will stop at 250lbs according to the protein theory because I am on 250 grams of protein.

Also another part of my question is lets say I drop the protein how do I keep the muscle? I always get a little mixed up with the numbers for diets. Maybe I should just do Hershal Walkers diet. I mean he only eats a soup and salad once a day and look at him.

I think you might be a bit confused. Protein doesn't determine how much weight you are going to lose. Total Calories do. I mean, you could eat 250 grams of protein but then get 900 grams of carbs and 300 grams of fat. You won't be losing weight on that.

To make a long answer really short, just keep what you are doing and continue to strive for a 2 lb fat loss per week. If you start losing less, lower Calories again from carbohydrates and/or fat until you are again losing 2 lbs per week. Keep it up until you are where you want to be. It's just that simple.

Behemoth
01-30-2011, 02:54 PM
Eat 250g protein a day. Considering your calories your eating, how much you weigh, and the rapid weight you're dropping you might want to add 200 or 300 more calories.

NormalDude
01-30-2011, 03:04 PM
Eat 250g protein a day. Considering your calories your eating, how much you weigh, and the rapid weight you're dropping you might want to add 200 or 300 more calories.

Well I dont want to slow the weight loss down. I always read that it rate to drop weight and keep it off was about 2lbs a week?

RichMcGuire
01-30-2011, 03:12 PM
Well I dont want to slow the weight loss down. I always read that it rate to drop weight and keep it off was about 2lbs a week?

One of the reasons that whole "2 lb rule" came about was because that's a 7000 kcal deficit a week...which would be a reduction of about 1,000 kcals a day. It's a pretty big deficit.

Behemoth
01-30-2011, 03:20 PM
If you don't want to slow it down that's ok. But you have better odds of sticking with it and transitioning out of it better if it isn't as difficult day to day. Things are easy in the beginning but can quickly turn to a daily hell and some strenous mind games fighting off food if things are real severe. For some 2lbs a week is perfectly fine though, particularly if you aren't fighting an unnatural conditioning. One thing to remember though is if you push yourself into some dieting distress, its tough to balance yourself back out without relapsing back towards where you started or even past.

NormalDude
01-30-2011, 03:24 PM
If you don't want to slow it down that's ok. But you have better odds of sticking with it and transitioning out of it better if it isn't as difficult day to day. Things are easy in the beginning but can quickly turn to a daily hell and some strenous mind games fighting off food if things are real severe. For some 2lbs a week is perfectly fine though, particularly if you aren't fighting an unnatural conditioning. One thing to remember though is if you push yourself into some dieting distress, its tough to balance yourself back out without relapsing back towards where you started or even past.

Oh ok I understand what you mean now. The first two weeks of the diet was hard mentally. After that I was good. I have no problem with the mind games right now. I am dead set on getting through at least 3 or 4 months of this diet I am trying to drop 20- 30 lbs and will be ok mentally if I see the weight dropping off. And of course I have no problems training 5 or 6 times a week. So thats not a problem mentally either.

Behemoth
01-30-2011, 03:44 PM
Oh ok I understand what you mean now. The first two weeks of the diet was hard mentally. After that I was good. I have no problem with the mind games right now. I am dead set on getting through at least 3 or 4 months of this diet I am trying to drop 20- 30 lbs and will be ok mentally if I see the weight dropping off. And of course I have no problems training 5 or 6 times a week. So thats not a problem mentally either.

I meant with regard to whacking out your hormones. If you do, they will always win.

NormalDude
01-30-2011, 03:53 PM
I meant with regard to whacking out your hormones. If you do, they will always win.

***** I didnt know I had to worry about hormones when trying to cut. Is there anyway to tell if I am not balancing my hormones properly?

Behemoth
01-30-2011, 04:10 PM
***** I didnt know I had to worry about hormones when trying to cut. Is there anyway to tell if I am not balancing my hormones properly?

Lol. I didn't mean to scare you or anything. If you're going to diet your hormones are going to be altered, there's no way around that. It's why people get cravings, moody, irritable, lethargic, etc. All I meant was if you crash diet or go too fast things can get pretty miserable and only continue to do so until you start eating again (usually back up to your previous weight or past). You're never going to completely eliminate the side effects of being on a diet, but the aim is to minimize them as much as possible by taking it as gradual as you can afford to. This way you're less likely to rebound off it.

At your weight losing 2lbs a week it's probably not an issue. Just be advised that in further months down the road you should not expect or try to continue to lose at 2lbs a week.

NormalDude
01-30-2011, 04:41 PM
Lol. I didn't mean to scare you or anything. If you're going to diet your hormones are going to be altered, there's no way around that. It's why people get cravings, moody, irritable, lethargic, etc. All I meant was if you crash diet or go too fast things can get pretty miserable and only continue to do so until you start eating again (usually back up to your previous weight or past). You're never going to completely eliminate the side effects of being on a diet, but the aim is to minimize them as much as possible by taking it as gradual as you can afford to. This way you're less likely to rebound off it.

At your weight losing 2lbs a week it's probably not an issue. Just be advised that in further months down the road you should not expect or try to continue to lose at 2lbs a week.

Haha for a second I was tripping and started to google hormones and dieting. As for my diet it is defiantly not crash. I made it roughly 50%protein,25% fat, 25% carbs. All stuff I have read on this board.

Behemoth
01-30-2011, 05:12 PM
Haha for a second I was tripping and started to google hormones and dieting. As for my diet it is defiantly not crash. I made it roughly 50%protein,25% fat, 25% carbs. All stuff I have read on this board.

Crash dieting would not be classified by your macronutrient ratio, but your caloric intake.

Honestly 50% protein is probably too much, carbs will maintain your metabolism for longer if you can lose weight with a high amount (and I'm sure you can). But you don't want to go by ratios. I hate ratios, they're so irrelevant.

The easiest way to setup a diet is to take your weight (250) and multiply that by 12 for your starting calories. This would start you out at 3000 calories. You eat that consistently for two weeks and weigh yourself first thing in the morning every morning (post bathroom use but pre eating or drinking) and you watch and record your weight for every day. If you're losing you keep it there, if you're not losing you drop a couple hundred calories and repeat.

To set up your macro nutrients you do this.
You eat your weight in protein - 250g
You factor in necessary fat - 55g

Those are the only nutrients your bodies going to be in dire need of. But only when you meet your necessary calorie intake (presumed now to be 3000). You're still only at one half of your necessary calories with those (1000cals from 250g protein, 495cals from 55g fat).

So you have 1550 calories left over that you must allot to a mix of protein, fat, and carbs.

The benefits of more protein are going to be they will keep you more satiated. You will feel full longer than most carb sources (though I have found this is somewhat individual). But in general, protein is more satiating than carbs.

The benefits of more fat is also they are more satiating than carbs (in general). But they are extremely calorie dense and a small amount of nuts or oil or whatever the source is a very limited amount of food in your stomach. They serve very little purpose above meeting your necessary requirements.

The benefits of more carbs is a plethora. They will keep your muscles glycogenated and full and consequently less susceptible to being used for fuel in a calorie deficit. Excess protein itself won't do this anywhere near the extent that carbs will. Carbs are also the easiest source of fuel for your body to run off of. You will train harder and think clearer keeping them in your diet, I guarantee you that. Can carbs hinder fatloss? Yes. They can produce an insulin response that shortly after ingesting them your body may slow down it's fatloss... but you will pretty much makeup the difference after they're quickly burnt off or stored as glycogen in your muscles or liver. Carbs are also less likely to they themselves be stored as bodyfat than excess dietary fat is. A drawback to carbs is they are in general less satiating than fats or protein per calorie (not always by density though). Fiber is an exclusion to this.

If I were in your shoes I would probably allot my calories like this -
300g protein
55g fat
325g carbs

I would eat that for two weeks watching the scale in the morning as I directed above. If it continues to drop don't change anything. If it doesn't or you've hit a roadblock you need to drop calories. At this point you're obviously not going to drop below your 55g of fat. You do however have 50g worth of protein you can cut into, and 325g of carbs you can cut into. If you've found yourself pretty hungry on this but your energy and mental clarity has been fine then I'd take 50 of carbs away (giving you a 200 calorie drop). If you find hunger hasn't been a big issue and but you feel a less optimal than you did when not dieting I'd dropout your 50g of protein before moving the carbs down.

Keep on with this and if you hit a further roadblock either dropout your protein down to 250g if you didn't the first time. Or if you did drop protein your future drops should all come from carbs.

Done.

NormalDude
01-30-2011, 07:45 PM
^ This is the info i will be going by and end of the thread. Thanks guys for the replies

GreggNJ
01-30-2011, 07:51 PM
Behemoth - that post is just fantastic! It echo's my feelings on carbs and it explains so much......I think I'm going to follow that advice as well.

matthewalan8
02-04-2011, 04:19 AM
To set up your macro nutrients you do this.
You eat your weight in protein - 250g
You factor in necessary fat - 55g

Those are the only nutrients your bodies going to be in dire need of. But only when you meet your necessary calorie intake (presumed now to be 3000). You're still only at one half of your necessary calories with those (1000cals from 250g protein, 495cals from 55g fat).

So you have 1550 calories left over that you must allot to a mix of protein, fat, and carbs.

Behemoth, that is an amazing write-up but parts of it to me are like trying to understand chinese. The part that I quoted is difficult to understand.

I have thick lets, skinny arms and chest and a fat belly. Typical guy that didn't do much to add bulk, but ate a TON of fast food. I weigh 205, but I am about 21% BF at 6'2". Do you have any advice for me? I want to lose the belly fat, but I also want to gain muscle. I've attached my photos from one month ago from before I started lifting.

Thank you, and I look forward to hearing from you as you are definitely one of the many people on this site that inspire me.

f=ma
02-04-2011, 05:28 AM
mathew, his defined gram amounts would be your base calories. from there, you plug the remainder into their respective categories. for me, it has been best to keep dietary fat low and use carbs as your variance.

Behemoth
02-04-2011, 01:28 PM
Behemoth, that is an amazing write-up but parts of it to me are like trying to understand chinese. The part that I quoted is difficult to understand.

I have thick lets, skinny arms and chest and a fat belly. Typical guy that didn't do much to add bulk, but ate a TON of fast food. I weigh 205, but I am about 21% BF at 6'2". Do you have any advice for me? I want to lose the belly fat, but I also want to gain muscle. I've attached my photos from one month ago from before I started lifting.

Thank you, and I look forward to hearing from you as you are definitely one of the many people on this site that inspire me.

Matt - I wrote up a sticky with a little more detail on this. It can be found here -- http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/showthread.php?141624-Setting-up-a-very-basic-diet.

I'm not always the best at explaining things so if some of it still does not make sense please let me know and I will try to reword it so it is better understood.

matthewalan8
02-04-2011, 06:31 PM
Wow, that write-up was incredibly informative. Not to mention, with me being at about 205 pounds, the numbers are basically written out for me already :)

I can't tell you how much I appreciate this. I have also been looking at some of your recipes that you have posted and I'm definitely going to give some of them a try!

Thanks a billion and I think this will help me greatly. :strong:

mjd1982
02-16-2011, 04:19 PM
Lots of good info in here, thanks guys I learned a lot too.

DavyRen
02-22-2011, 06:54 AM
great advice behemoth

perfect timing

Raleighwood
02-22-2011, 09:04 AM
Behemoth, that is an amazing write-up but parts of it to me are like trying to understand chinese. The part that I quoted is difficult to understand.

I have thick lets, skinny arms and chest and a fat belly. Typical guy that didn't do much to add bulk, but ate a TON of fast food. I weigh 205, but I am about 21% BF at 6'2". Do you have any advice for me? I want to lose the belly fat, but I also want to gain muscle. I've attached my photos from one month ago from before I started lifting.

Thank you, and I look forward to hearing from you as you are definitely one of the many people on this site that inspire me.

Matt, this depends on your goals, but from your pics I would recommend this:

Keep your nutrition about the same as what it is and start a well rounded strength training routine that is a 3 or 4 day/week program. I recommend just about any of the programs listed on this site.

As far as protein, aim for 1g/lb of body weight.

Just keep upping your strength performance as prescribed in the programs and stay with it for at least 6 months and your body will be transformed.

Hugol
02-23-2011, 01:06 PM
Matt - I wrote up a sticky with a little more detail on this. It can be found here -- http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/showthread.php?141624-Setting-up-a-very-basic-diet.

I'm not always the best at explaining things so if some of it still does not make sense please let me know and I will try to reword it so it is better understood.

Couldn't go to the sticky...I got this message

Hugol, you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:

Your user account may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system?
If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation.
:confused:

Off Road
02-23-2011, 01:56 PM
Couldn't go to the sticky:Look for Behemoth's article in the Nutrition Faq stickied to the top of this forum. It's in there.