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JSully
09-27-2011, 08:28 AM
So I ran a search on here and all it brought up was journals.

I saw an old article on EFS yesterday about carb back-loading. I've seen a couple other PLers in here using it to drop weight, but nobody has gotten into detail.

The article says to train around 3-5p. It says no carbs (<30g) all day before training, just protein + fat. After training, a big carb drink + protein to spike insulin then eat your remanining calories for the day before you go to bed.

I'm wondering if anybody has any additional information or in-depth experience with this.

http://articles.elitefts.com/articles/nutrition/carb-back-loading/
http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/?p=360
http://dangerouslyhardcore.com/?p=370

There are further links but I'm not going to post them all. I'd just like to open a discussion and get others' opinions on this.

Discuss plz.

BloodandThunder
09-27-2011, 10:49 AM
Look up LeanGains, as the the DH carb backloading is somewhat similar to what LeanGains does. It's like any other nutritional protocol, a tool merely in the toolbox (besides rest, sleep, GPP, nutrition, supplementation, etc) to use to lose fat.

I've used it and like the simplicity of it. Dropped a good amount of bf% and lifts are up all while keeping GPP/cardio work the same. As someone who's schedule is demanding, yet I often work at a computer most of the day and train at night, I find it easy to use and it makes my life easier than carrying around endless containers and protein shakes. Again, not everyone will like it and may like a more traditional approach, but it's something just like the Anabolic Diet that should be at least looked at before dismissing by some parties.

StLRPh
09-27-2011, 10:54 AM
Look up LeanGains, as the the DH carb backloading is somewhat similar to what LeanGains does.

This is what I've always thought about it. There are several very similar plans: IF, carb-backloading, LeanGains, and Iron Addict's diet.

I did it for about 6 weeks and lost about 10lbs and 4in from my waist and strength stayed pretty much the same. One thing I did notice almost immediately is that I wasn't as bloated.

JSully
09-27-2011, 11:30 AM
I've used it and like the simplicity of it. Dropped a good amount of bf% and lifts are up all while keeping GPP/cardio work the same.
this is very helpful. I'm deathly afraid of losing performance at the expense of bodyfat.


Again, not everyone will like it and may like a more traditional approach, but it's something just like the Anabolic Diet that should be at least looked at before dismissing by some parties.Anabolic diet was awesome, but I lost performance and strength. no bueno.

Thanks for the help. How did you structure your "off days"? I'm assuming exact same as training days, except keeping carbs low, in the realm of 30-100g carbs?

BloodandThunder
09-27-2011, 11:46 AM
Off days I don't train at night so the only thing that changes is I add a small amount of fat to counteract the loss of carbs. I eat a few smaller meals during the day and have a much larger meal at night when I have time to prepare and cook a meal. I'm more of a 3 meal guy myself. Keeps cals lower on off days and once or twice a week, I've added a bit more carbs at a nighttime meal to overfeed to encourage my metabolism to not kill me lol. Everyday I bring the same things to eat before I train or if it's an off day so in case something comes up and I can't train, I haven't ingested a ton of carbs on an off day. For someone like me who bloats even looking at a potato, it does make a difference. Also, I can see this diet working well for someone who has an office job but has to go to alot of afterwork business meetings or is pretty social.

This diet will be a bit different to some who need to ingest alot of carbs or bulk.

JSully
09-27-2011, 11:55 AM
Off days I don't train at night so the only thing that changes is I add a small amount of fat to counteract the loss of carbs. I eat a few smaller meals during the day and have a much larger meal at night when I have time to prepare and cook a meal. I'm more of a 3 meal guy myself. Keeps cals lower on off days and once or twice a week, I've added a bit more carbs at a nighttime meal to overfeed to encourage my metabolism to not kill me lol. Everyday I bring the same things to eat before I train or if it's an off day so in case something comes up and I can't train, I haven't ingested a ton of carbs on an off day. For someone like me who bloats even looking at a potato, it does make a difference. Also, I can see this diet working well for someone who has an office job but has to go to alot of afterwork business meetings or is pretty social.

This diet will be a bit different to some who need to ingest alot of carbs or bulk.
no preWO carbs? this is the part that confuses me. not sure how my performance won't drop without the simple sugars preWO. I'm guessing I'll just get used to it after a week or so, no?

vdizenzo
09-27-2011, 12:25 PM
I'm a big fan. Regarding no carbs before training, as long as it's not a brutal long session, you'll be fine. On my toughest day I do eat carbs before training. I think another option is to drink some carbs during the workout.

I'm surprised how much energy I have when I don't eat carbs. I had less than 20 grams in my system until 9:30 last night. The first couple of days are a little different to get used to, but after that, I now prefer it to more traditional diets. Less bloat and lethargy.

BloodandThunder
09-27-2011, 12:48 PM
Per the no-PreWO carbs. It's something that you just need to get over and you will. My energy levels are alot better when I'm not eating carbs at early meals and such. Lifting weights, especially like a PL, is alot different than marathon swimming and jogging.

It's just like the Anabolic Diet where you're under 30g for the whole day. Personally, I usually have some almonds and a whey shake before lifting. Doesn't weigh me down and I can get through a 2 hour session looking forward to a nice large meal after that.

LeanGains is more IF then DH protocol. DH is essentially like combining the Anabolic Diet before workout and does not really condone fasting (to my knowledge) but refeeding postworkout. Kiefer works with alot of guys on EliteFTS.

Both authors do present alot of citations that you can go through, so it's up to reader to make of it what they will.

IMO, this isn't a short-term fix like a crash diet. It simply makes some nutritional fixes but really, deep down hinges upon the dieter's ability to revolve the diet around their life, not their life around the diet. That's why I think it's pretty solid as a long term solution.

Alex.V
09-27-2011, 01:20 PM
Lifting weights, especially like a PL, is alot different than marathon swimming and jogging.

This is very, very, very true. Have done the zero pre workout carbs recently during a few heavy lifting sessions (Beyond sick of taking down sugars for my other training), and energy levels have not suffered in the least. Glycogen really doesn't seem to be the limiting factor in a lot of my PL style workouts.

Behemoth
09-27-2011, 01:36 PM
Not sure if you saw this thread but the first article was briefly discussed here a few weeks ago

http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/showthread.php?144901-Carb-Backloading

Behemoth
09-27-2011, 01:55 PM
no preWO carbs? this is the part that confuses me. not sure how my performance won't drop without the simple sugars preWO. I'm guessing I'll just get used to it after a week or so, no?

Assuming they're not depleted I'd sooner believe their performance suffered from placebo rather than actual lack of immediately accessible energy. And one shouldn't be depleted if they take in adequate amounts of carbs at some point in the day on a regular basis. Eat the carbs after the workout and they'll just top you back off for the next day, and for the next days workout. You're not going to blow through six or seven hundred grams of glycogen before you make it into the gym the next day.

JSully
09-27-2011, 02:02 PM
Not sure if you saw this thread but the first article was briefly discussed here a few weeks ago

http://www.wannabebig.com/forums/showthread.php?144901-Carb-Backloading
I ran the search with a dash, my bad.

lulz @ belial's breakdown.

so the science quoted to support this is bunk, but the general philosphy seems in-tact.

keeping insulin (not necessarily calories) very low by restricting carbs for the first 8-10hrs of the day, then training and overloading with calories in the late afternoon/evening to cause growth. at the very least, it seems simple to try so I might do so.