PDA

View Full Version : Low Bodyfat - Death? How and How Low?



capinatl
06-29-2002, 09:09 PM
I've heard that a 2% bodyfat percentage will ensure certain death. Why is that? What reaction occurrs to cause fatality when bodyfat is too low?

Thanks.

Clark
06-29-2002, 09:19 PM
It has something to do with the protection or needs of your organs I believe

Tryska
06-29-2002, 09:20 PM
well your organs are cushioned by bodyfat....also it keeps you warm and it's there as a source of energy.....so yes...you can die if your bf gets too low. I know there's more science to it then that, but i don't have the info off-hand. i'm sure soemone else does tho.


ps - did we talk about where in Atl you were?

capinatl
06-29-2002, 09:43 PM
I actually work for a restaurant management corp. based in ATL and am frequently relocated throughout the south. I used to manage at the Tavern At Phipps in Phipps Plaza, and also Joey D's Oakroom near Perimeter Mall. Currently I'm in Columbia, SC (and wishing to return to ATL). I assume you are from ATL also...?

Spiderman
06-30-2002, 02:52 PM
Your bf being to low can be unhealthy for you. However, it is quite hard to get it any lower than just above 3%. Remember that your brain makes up about 2.5-3% of your bf to begin with. So, you can only get SO low before you can seriously endanger your health. Take it from someone who's been down that road.

Tiare
06-30-2002, 03:02 PM
Certain vitamins etc needed for production of hormones in your body are stored in your fat. If your fat falls too low, you would die but you could not intentionally get your body fat that low. Effectively you would have no subcutaneous fat that you could see long before you would die of having too low a body fat and your body would go catabolic before it would allow you to use up the last of your fat supplies.

Ever seen pictures of starving people in 3rd world countries? Assume they are 3-4% bodyfat.

body
06-30-2002, 03:03 PM
Originally posted by Spiderman
Your bf being to low can be unhealthy for you. However, it is quite hard to get it any lower than just above 3%. Remember that your brain makes up about 2.5-3% of your bf to begin with. So, you can only get SO low before you can seriously endanger your health. Take it from someone who's been down that road.

your heart, lungs, liver, kidney have fat in there structure as well..

calipers can't measure this fat.

also if you bloated your fat % will decrease. if you get ripped your BF% will increase even though you look leaner.

Tryska
06-30-2002, 08:50 PM
Originally posted by capinatl
I actually work for a restaurant management corp. based in ATL and am frequently relocated throughout the south. I used to manage at the Tavern At Phipps in Phipps Plaza, and also Joey D's Oakroom near Perimeter Mall. Currently I'm in Columbia, SC (and wishing to return to ATL). I assume you are from ATL also...?

cool....it's not the buckhead group is it? anyways..yeah i'm in Atl too....well, cobb county right on the perimeter.

BCC
06-30-2002, 09:04 PM
Originally posted by body

also if you bloated your fat % will decrease. if you get ripped your BF% will increase even though you look leaner.

Hmmmm...interesting statement there...I'm looking very lean right now, and I have half the amount of bodyfat I had when I started dieting...

geoffgarcia
06-30-2002, 09:20 PM
I ran track in college, they gave us a 5 pinch caliper test and my coach (who was 4th in D1 NCAAs in the 400 hurdles a few years earlier) was between 2.8-3.5 can't remember the exact number anyway, once they figured it out the weight trainers had an ambulance there within 10 minutes to take him away.
He never had any health problems that i knew about.
and yes, he was tall and all bones

PowerManDL
06-30-2002, 10:07 PM
Originally posted by capinatl
I actually work for a restaurant management corp. based in ATL and am frequently relocated throughout the south. I used to manage at the Tavern At Phipps in Phipps Plaza, and also Joey D's Oakroom near Perimeter Mall. Currently I'm in Columbia, SC (and wishing to return to ATL). I assume you are from ATL also...?

Oh hell! I love the Tavern. Phipps Plaza has mega tail factor.

MarshallPenn
06-30-2002, 10:37 PM
Originally posted by Spiderman
Your bf being to low can be unhealthy for you. However, it is quite hard to get it any lower than just above 3%. Remember that your brain makes up about 2.5-3% of your bf to begin with. So, you can only get SO low before you can seriously endanger your health. Take it from someone who's been down that road.

Actually, the brain is less than one percent of your bodies total fat. But a good argument for why you can't get below 1%.

body
07-01-2002, 02:14 PM
Originally posted by BigChaseyChase


Hmmmm...interesting statement there...I'm looking very lean right now, and I have half the amount of bodyfat I had when I started dieting...


notice the symbol '%' rather than total fat.

the total fat mass will stay the same. just the ratio will alter.

MarshallPenn
07-01-2002, 06:37 PM
Originally posted by body



notice the symbol '%' rather than total fat.

the total fat mass will stay the same. just the ratio will alter.

that just makes abosulutely no sense.

Podium Kreatin
07-01-2002, 09:01 PM
no! brain tissue isn't lost when u lose fat! when u have low cholesterol, ur organs are not smaller, nor when u have tons of cholesterol, ur organs bigger! they both are made of the same macro, but they are not the same.

for the bf thing, <7% is gradual deterioration of body mass (starvation). i never heard of instant death from low bf

RG570
07-02-2002, 06:17 PM
yikes! Bad news for me. I havn't been over 8% since early childhood. Now at 5-6% gotta eat!

Podium Kreatin
07-03-2002, 12:17 AM
wtf RG570. u were never over 8%? how much do u weigh, i seriously doubt that is possible unless u have a thyroid condition. u must've measured incorrectly.

g-dot
07-04-2002, 05:03 PM
I love all this talk about bodyfat because it's so way off base that it's funny. First of all anyone with these low sub 10% figures is out to lunch. Without getting into any real detail bodyfat refers to organ fat, subcutaneous fat and intramuscular fat. The only people in the world with really low BODYFAT are US Rangers and perhaps other branches of the special forces, people on their deathbeds and corpses. Even professional bodybuilders don't have these insanely low percentages everyone says because the more muscle you get the more body fat you get. If your muscles lack intramuscular fat they are "flat" and don't have the "full" look. People saying they are at something like 5% bodyfat are imbeciles. If you're at that level of bodyfat you're close to death and could begin seeing organ failure. Calipers "measure" (I'll use the term loosely because calipers are so grossly inaccurate they aren't even worth using) subcutaneous fat which is based largely on genetics and ethnicity as well as eating habits. All you should really care about is how you look in the mirror. To answer the original question from capinatl, if you're at 2% bodyfat you're a corpse that is rotting away. You want to see someone with bodyfat that low? I'll direct you to a cemetary.

BCC
07-04-2002, 05:22 PM
The full look of pro bbs is not achieved by intramuscular fat. That is one ignorant statement.

g-dot
07-04-2002, 05:42 PM
Good job at proving me wrong BigChaseyChase you had a very convincing argument, the only thing ignorant around here is you for replying like that. I guarantee you that if the pros had these 4-5% bodyfats they claimed (if we looked past the fact they'd be dead) they would lack "fullness" to their muscles. The fat content of muscle has much to do with its size and water retention and thus it's fullness. You didn't provide any counter claim as to what gave the pros their look, but believe me I'm dying to hear it. Don't try and miscontrue what I'm saying either by interpretting what I said to mean that the pros size comes from fat, because I'm not an idiot and I know they have plenty of muscle. You're free to believe whatever you like, but don't be a jackass and tell me I'm wrong without providing any explanation.

Tryska
07-04-2002, 05:53 PM
damn attitude.....chill out man. if you wanna be smarter then everybody and point someting out, try not to be so abrasive. people listen better when your not grating on their nerves.

Lucian
07-05-2002, 09:27 AM
I've heard that a 2% bodyfat percentage will ensure certain death. Why is that? What reaction occurrs to cause fatality when bodyfat is too low?

Thanks.



The only Guy who I've heard of who could have died from something weird like that was bruce lee, he died in his sleep due to some sort of random brain swelling but alot of people say his bodyfat was low, like in the 2% range.


I dont really think low bodyfat killed him ubt you never know really. Its just speculation.

The question is would your body even let you get down to 2% bodydat?

Lucian
07-05-2002, 09:30 AM
wtf RG570. u were never over 8%? how much do u weigh, i seriously doubt that is possible unless u have a thyroid condition. u must've measured incorrectly.

You educate yourself. Genetics. My Uncle and my Mom both are below 6% bodyfat and always have been every day of their life.

Genes plays a big rule you know.

Tryska
07-05-2002, 12:13 PM
how did your mom give birth to you if she's never been below 6% bodyfat? I'm surprised she even started menstruating.

body
07-05-2002, 12:56 PM
used must have been a very small baby. as your mum does not eat enough.

ElPietro
07-05-2002, 01:38 PM
What does water have to do with fat g-dot? And no people can't measure visceral fat but that doesn't mean measurements are worthless. They can help you guage progress for yourself. Since normally we are primarily concerned with subcutaneous fat levels as those are "visible" fat stores, finding your overall accurate bodyfat level is pretty trivial and meaningless.

I still laugh at some of the claims people make on what their bodyfat levels are or what others are. We can only make comparisons when we are all using the exact same methods in exactly the same weigh. You might as well just judge things visually and save yourself the embarassment of making amusing bodyfat level claims...I've seen ppl with 20-25% claim 12% and it just wrecks their credibility on any other claim they may make.

If it were this easy mr.olympia competitions could just consist of a guy measuring off each competitors stats and then taking bf% measurements and we wouldn't need them to pose anymore...just stand in line to get tested...

g-dot
07-05-2002, 04:38 PM
ElP I just reread what I wrote I wasn't trying to make any great statement on fat and water just about the variables that affect muscle "fullness". I should have clarified that more I suppose.

Lucian I REALLY advise you to stop making posts like that. I don't claim to know everything even though it may come off like I try to appear like I do. A woman at 6% bodyfat? The only woman in the world at 6% bodyfat is a corpse. Every woman on this planet has more bodyfat than an average male due to the presence of high amounts of estrogen along with other hormones. . Oh I forgot to mention, read my first post, because if your uncle isn't currently in the US special forces or a similar group that is engaged in intense wilderness training OR if he isnt currently dead, then I assure you he isn't anywhere near 6% bodyfat.

raniali
07-05-2002, 05:03 PM
:rolleyes: let's play nice, now

Podium Kreatin
07-05-2002, 07:34 PM
g-dot, wher are u basing that only the US special forces or wahtever has that low bodyfat? the AVERAGE amateur wrestler in the olympics have 7% bodyfat. an AVERAGE olympic gymnast has 5%. sub 10% is not that hard, but staying sub 7% for your whole life (wrstlers and gymnasts don't stay that low bodyfat for long) is really bad.

as for lucian; genes do play a role...in evolution! no selection would favor adults having that low bodyfat. a woman that low bodyfat will have hormone problems (athletic girls dont' menstruate til after their sport season is finished, in which they relax and bf goes back up). pplhave to measure more than once w/ several methods. tools may be precise, but not accurate
btw, i've dropped to 4% for wrestling naturally, its common for ppl who have to make weight for their sport, so don't think its impossible. however, i'm SURE if i stay 4% for more than a week (i used both caliper and electroanalysis), i may die.

Reinier
07-06-2002, 03:28 AM
"The only woman in the world at 6% bodyfat is a corpse. "

Bull. when they have ripped 8 packs with poppin veins over em im sure they are around that %

Lucian
07-06-2002, 07:29 AM
I was 6 pounds, My mom wasnt fat when she gave birth, her stomach was big and she gained weight yes, but still she was thinner than most people.

Lucian
07-06-2002, 07:31 AM
g-dot The only woman at 6% bodyfat is a corpse? Dude bodybuilding women are at that level. Women have more water than men yes but we are talking about fat.

Podium Kreatin actually you are right my mom does have some hormone problems, minor though, acne (is that how you spell it)

Doctors tell her to eat more constantly but she doesnt gain any weight.

body
07-06-2002, 07:59 AM
Originally posted by Lucian
I was 6 pounds, My mom wasnt fat when she gave birth, her stomach was big and she gained weight yes, but still she was thinner than most people.

did she look like a pro-bb as they look pregnant when they are at 6%bf.

though they probably have bigger stomachs.

Podium Kreatin
07-06-2002, 09:03 AM
lucian, when i said hormone problems, i meant the converse statement; low bf cause low hormones, not low hormones cause low bf (actually, low hormones cause hi bf). acne usually means excessive amts of hormones (like a teen), so i guess it doesn't imply here.
anyway, on topic again; i could see high metabolism from this high amt of hormone, but 6% is truly too low. i really believe that there was inaccuracy in measuring the bodyfat. metabolism slows down w/ age (averagely, ppl add +2% bf every year in high school).

as for pregnancy, she was 6% during? 6lb baby is pretty healthy, i don't think 6% is the accurate number.

Tryska
07-06-2002, 08:36 PM
agreed. the way hormones and female fat interact is as follows:

estrogen is stored in BAT (brown adipose tissue, ie estrogenic fat - tris, breasts, butt, thighs) untill it reaches appropriate elvels to kick off FSH, which then kicks off the menstrual cycle. If adequate bodyfat (round 18%, altho this can be different for each woman, definitely never as low as 6%) isn't available menstruation will either cease, or become irregular, and women have a difficult time ovulating to even get pregnant (same goes for having too much fat). This is why alot of times the suggestions for infertile couples is to either gain fat or lose it (depending on the size of the woman) as this often aids in regulating fertility.

g-dot
07-07-2002, 05:19 PM
Podium Kreatin - The US Special Forces is based on literature regarding said forces. During survival training they can reach extremely low bodyfat levels in the range that I stated. The point of mentioning that is that staying at that level is dangerous if not deadly. When they are at those levels theyre pulled from the exrecises because they are near the onset of organ failure. The point is that very few people in the world EVER experience bodyfat that low. As to your statements about wrestlers and gymnasts you're way off. At such low bodyfat levels you face the very real risk of organ failure. Yes some gymnasts and some wrestlers are very low bodyfat compared to an average person but 7% and 5% are impossible for them to have AND be competing athletes.

Reinier - You really don't have a damn thing to offer this argument. If you had the SLIGHTEST HINT of an idea on what a person at 6% bodyfat looks like you'd know how stupid your comment was. There are NO and I will repeat this, NO FEMALE BODYBUILDERS AT 6% BODYFAT. There never has been, never will be and never CAN BE. As unlikely as it is for any male in the world to be that low, a female with a bodyfat % that low could not exist in any healthy and living form. Females are genetically predisposed to store more fat. PERIOD.

Lucian - I have no patience for you. Maki edits all my posts to you so you don't get to see what I really think about your complete and utter lack of knowledge about anything. Talking to you is like trying to teach a chimp to perform open heart surgery. Hopefully Maki doesn't edit this because this is heartfelt advice to you Lucian. You're 21 years old, and here is my advice to you: Go back to school. I find it impossible that you were in any school system and are so completely devoid of not only knowledge but even basic common sense. Female bodybuilders are not at 6% bodyfat. Like I told Reinier it's IMPOSSIBLE FOR THEM TO BE THAT LOW. Your mother doesn't have bodyfat anywhere NEAR 6% try maybe 16% and that's being generous.

Would someone please listen to Tryska, she's laid out the facts for you and its all in plain english.

Tryska
07-07-2002, 08:28 PM
*lol@teaching a chimp open heart surgery*

that's funny.

PowerManDL
07-07-2002, 08:55 PM
This thread makes me want to drink.

Podium Kreatin
07-08-2002, 06:56 AM
organ failure? i know lots of ppl who achieved 7% or lower! have u tried going that low bodyfat, its not "near impossible" nor "near death." you are overexaggering how low low body fat is.
also, female bodybuilders can get less than 6% i think, don't forget that they use steroids and tons of drugs to get their competition physique.

Podium Kreatin
07-08-2002, 06:58 AM
here's me like almost 2 years ago, when i was 7%.

http://www.wannabebigforums.com/attachment.php?postid=9957

geoffgarcia
07-08-2002, 08:29 AM
I'm getting tired of reading posts on here by people that think they know what they are talking about.

How about if everyone posts pics of themselves.

Then we can judge if you know what your talking about by how your body looks.

Podium Kreatin-good pics, I'm 7% myself and look close to your build.

Tryska
07-08-2002, 08:48 AM
podium....7% via calipers? or via hydrostatic tank?

Podium Kreatin
07-08-2002, 02:24 PM
i used digital calipers. when i was 4%, i used both calipers, and the electric current one. i never used the water tank, cuz it really wasn't that important how low i was, it was just to make sure i was making weight for wrestling weigh-ins b/c i was losing fat, and not muscle.

Reinier
07-09-2002, 01:23 PM
nice quads. but.... is that a bikinitop tanline ?!

NateDogg
07-09-2002, 01:34 PM
Originally posted by Reinier
nice quads. but.... is that a bikinitop tanline ?!

Reinier, you're killing me today...:D

g-dot
07-10-2002, 11:10 PM
Calipers are garbage. They're utterly useless. Once again I will restate what I've said 100 times before. NO WOMAN WILL EVER BE AT 6% BODYFAT. NEVER. You aren't at 7% in those pictures. You do realize your muscles contain fat and this fat contributes to your total BODY fat right? The problem is, all you people are referring to subcutaneous fat, NOT BODYFAT.

Geoffgarcia - your statement about posting pics to see how much a person knows is the most ignorant thing I've ever read. The most intelligent and educated people in the world aren't bodybuilders. You don't need ANY in depth knowledge of anything to bodybuild. You can do things trial and error and still be huge. If your comment about people thinking they know what they're talking about was direct at me, which I believe it was, then give me a minute while I go have a laugh. If any of the people (Reinier, Lucian, You) had the slightest idea that bodyfat refers to more than visible fat stores under your skin (subcutaneous fat) then there wouldn't even be an argument.

How everyone can ignore what Tryska said completely is beyond me.

Podium Kreatin
07-11-2002, 06:43 AM
that is 7%. if u've never seen 7% before, how can you say its not? let me remind you again you are overexaggerating low bodyfat. its so simple.

Short N Buff
07-11-2002, 09:48 AM
LUCIANS 21 YEARS OLD???

Short N Buff
07-11-2002, 09:51 AM
g-dot. which weighs more, muscle or fat? fat is very light. when u see fat, it weighs less than u think. 7% x 160= 11.2 lbs of fat. thats a lot of fat in terms of volume.

Relentless
07-11-2002, 01:24 PM
http://www.preparationh.com

Just thought I'd post this link to help a couple of the people in this thread that may be experiencing some discomfort after talking out of their asses so much.

Cheers,
Cal

Alex.V
07-11-2002, 01:27 PM
LMAO @ callahan

Blood&Iron
07-11-2002, 02:50 PM
Originally posted by g-dot
Calipers are garbage. They're utterly useless.

This is one of the stupider statements I've seen in some time.

Nope, I don't really have anything else to say.

g-dot
07-11-2002, 03:51 PM
Blood&Iron - How is that a stupid statement, in my opinion they are garbage. What purpose do they serve? You can use them to track progress but they're unreliable and a mirror or pictures are far better to track your progress. I still maintain its a waste of time and money using calipers. My point is there are far more effective ways to track progress than calipers which aren't even accurate.

Tryska
07-11-2002, 07:26 PM
i agree with g-dot on that. they are a grat wqay of tracking sub-cutaneous fat...but again...and this is why ia sked what method of BF-testign was used....subcutaneous fat can be estimated via calipers, or bio-imedance.....

the only true way to gauge true BF% is hyrdostatic weighing, as it takes into account subcutaneous fat, AND internal fat.

matter of fact all other bf measuring tools use logartihms based on hydrostatic weighing.

until you've had that done, you can't say to any degree of certainty what your BF% is.

GuitarPlayer
07-11-2002, 08:38 PM
unfortunately when you use a mirror you have to keep using the same one

i was all proud of myself for losing some fat in my home mirror, i thought i was down to about 15% fat from 20% ... then i go to the swimming pooln and in that mirror i looked like a complete fatass compared to the other one, my little love handles were a LOT more visible and noticeable. i didn't even feel like swimming it was so bad.

but...
mirrors will always lie and i will always listen

Tryska
07-11-2002, 08:49 PM
lead mirrors are more accurate then anything else.

ElPietro
07-11-2002, 09:10 PM
Where can I get one of those nice circus mirrors that make you look super thin?

Blood&Iron
07-11-2002, 09:20 PM
Originally posted by g-dot
What purpose do they serve? You can use them to track progress but they're unreliable and a mirror or pictures are far better to track your progress
[/B]
I think you've answered your own question here. Why does anyone need an absolutely accurate figure for bodyfat, other than to impress other people? What matters is progress and, properly performed, a caliper test is not that significantly less accurate a gauge of changes in bodyfat than any other testing method. Mirrors and pictures, on the other hand, are horribly subjective media.



Originally posted by Tryska

matter of fact all other bf measuring tools use logartihms based on hydrostatic weighing.

While hydrostatic weighing is the most accurate method, even it is prone to error and will not give the true figure. If you're concerned with complete accuracy, here's what you have to do: die. Make sure in your will you ask to be dissected, and your fat stripped from your body and weighed. You'll never see the figure, but it'll be accurate at least. Personally, I'll take calipers.

Maki Riddington
07-11-2002, 09:27 PM
Me two.

body
07-12-2002, 12:10 PM
use calipers and the mirror. a mirror will meausre water retention and vasucalrity. calipers will not. but over peroid X water retention is easier to alter.

elperto - the circus mirror will make you private area look smaller though!

g-dot
07-12-2002, 02:43 PM
The thing is for the purpose of tracking your gains or losses you'd be controlling the situation anyway. So you'd be taking weekly/monthly pictures or standing infront of the mirror at the same location and time while wearing the same shorts or bikini if you're a woman. You'd have months of progress pictures, which are in my opinion infinitely more valuable than caliper measurements. People try to use caliper measurements to suggest how they look anyway so both pictures/mirrors and caliper measurements would be used only for how you appear (ex. People say oh I'm 20% bf and you get the idea of someone who is fairly fat, if that person is a male). I still maintain calipers are junk.