PDA

View Full Version : Doc (ckd)



Mista
07-26-2001, 11:43 AM
I've noticed that you had some great success with a ckd diet! I've lost about 10 lbs in the first week and pretty much leveled off now! Im taking the carbup on every second week approach. Im heading into my first carbup in about 2 days and i'm more or less looking for some fine tuning you may have done to the original bodyopus diet! What carb/fat/protein ratio did you use, and what should my calories be at? (190 pounds) I don't want to screw up the carb up phase so i thought i'd ask the advice of you as well as others that have gone threw it already! How many hours of carbing did you find effecient and what time on friday did you start and what time on sunday did you stop?? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

the doc
07-26-2001, 04:15 PM
i'm sorry but i didn't do the body opus diet

I used the NHE diet which consist of smaller more frequent carb ups. I like its principles much better than the conventional CKD.

I think that the diet you describe (carbing every two weeks) is not compatible with weight training on a regular basis as there's no way to get around the necessity for carbs in anaerobic activity.

Yaz
07-26-2001, 04:24 PM
CKD you may carb up once every week, they recommend carbing up after two weeks on the assessment period. Load of sh*t.

Your workouts (Resistance training) must be done Monday and Tuesday, since Tuesday evening or early Wednesday you will most likely enter ketosis. Depends a lot on you and your diet.

Mista
07-26-2001, 07:26 PM
hmmm.... what type of ckd do you guys use? i remember both of you had good results with yours! How freqeuntly do you carb up? My work-outs suck but I enjoy the weight loss! What do the ratios of carbs/protein/fat look like!! I'd really appreciate your help cause my nrg levels suck!!

Yaz
07-26-2001, 08:16 PM
You must eat considerably more fat than protein.

I myself ate at a 60/40 ratio. Some need a 70/30. It just depends on you. Try both, see which one you feel better on... there are always more options.

And I carbed up once per week.

Mista
07-26-2001, 09:24 PM
thanx yaz! Im currently on a 70/30 ratio but i was wondering what your weekend ratio looked like and what time and what day it both begins and ends? also what should my caloric intake look like for the card loading?? (190 pounds) Thanx again!

Yaz
07-26-2001, 09:37 PM
I did not have a set ratio for carb loading, nor did I count calories.

What I did was simply go by instinct. Start Friday after your workout, and carb up until late Saturday. Sunday is a rest day. Eat as many carbohydrates as you like, until you begin to feel bloated. Your muscles will tighten up considerably doing this, and once you start to feel as if you are putting on unwanted water or fat, you cut the loading phase.

And also, no fructose.

Mista
07-26-2001, 11:21 PM
thanx a lot man i'll give it a try!

Wizard
07-27-2001, 06:33 AM
The carb up frequency is based on your bodyfat levels.
>15%bf=once/2weeks
10-15bf%=once/1week
<10%bf=twice/1week

Following this schedule,you have optimal leptin and t3 levels.

Yaz
07-27-2001, 06:39 AM
Blackalpha...

Why would you wait 2 weeks, if you're lifting weights as well? That's definately not good for muscle preservation.

the doc
07-27-2001, 07:41 AM
yaz i suppose it all depends on your goals and priorities. If body fat loss is your #1 goal then carb up every 2 weeks will produce more results. Like everything else in life to get someting you must give something. In this case you sacrifice progression in your workouts.

Yaz
07-27-2001, 10:28 AM
True. I was guessing since he was on a bodybuilding site, he wanted to at least maintain...

When I assume, it makes an ass outta just me. :D

However Mista, if you do want to maintain most of your muscle, despite your bodyfat %, I recommend carbing up once per week. If you just are eager to lose fat, doc and Blackalpha are correct - Once every two weeks will produce better results for fat loss. (Notice, it will NOT produce good results for muscle maintainence.)

Wizard
07-27-2001, 11:49 AM
Yaz,I agree with you that when performing carb-ups rarely,you're gonna screw up your lifts but while ketones have an anticatabolic action,you're not going to loose any muscle mass.You may be flat because of the abscence of glycogen but when your carb up is done,your appearance is ok and your muscles are toned.
It's about what the doc said:If your goal is to loose fat,then you should follow the suggested plan.
I think that you didn't have to drop much bodyfat when you did the ckd,isn't it?

Mista
07-27-2001, 11:57 AM
my main goal is to preserve muscle due to the fact that my main reason for working out is to gain strength as it will help me with my martial arts! At this point Im a little to bulky for my liking and its slowing both my speed and endurance down! Im usuing L-Glutamine 2-3 times a day in small doses to try and maintain as much muscle as possible! Its been working so far its just my workouts both Martial arts and weights are lacking nrg! I still like to hear what docs ckd or anyone elses for that matter looks like and what there carb up meals look like!

Mista
07-27-2001, 12:00 PM
blackalpha are you currently on a ckd?

Mista
07-27-2001, 12:07 PM
blackalpha are you currently on a ckd?

Wizard
07-27-2001, 12:23 PM
Yep,I'm on a ckd,but modified by myself.I've done this diet several times in the past and now I think that I've found what works well for me and what "stalls" me.
I'd suggest you first trying to loose the fat and then focus on adding strenght.Don't try to combine a lot of goals all in once.
As for the meals plan,it's not really important as far as you have your fat/protein ratio fixed.(usually 70/30)

Mista
07-27-2001, 12:33 PM
at this current time im not trying to gain strength or new muscle mass im just trying to maintain as much as i can. As for the diet im clear on the 70/30 ratio i've been able to do this for the last 2 weeks but the carbup is whats got me a little worried as i hear if you overdue this you can mroe or less undue the progress you've obtained! Blackalpha you said you've more or less figured out a way to fine tune this diet plz share that with me thats exactly what im looking for! I'd like to hear what foods people use for their carb-ups!

Wizard
07-27-2001, 12:48 PM
OK
My plan is:
2days:15%under maintenance levels:80%protein-20%fat
3days:10%under " " " " :20%protein-80%fat
1day:50%under maintenance levels,"fat fast":20%protein-80%fat
1day carb-up:~15%above m. levels:65%carbs-20%protein-15%fat
(carb sources:mainly oats and sweet potatoes.I eat every 2 hours so that my stomach can process all the carbs)

Mista
07-27-2001, 12:58 PM
thanx man! I've never seen anything like that! Do you still get into ketosis within 48 hours with your protein that high? What kind of reslults have you been getting?

Wizard
07-27-2001, 01:06 PM
It's weird but it works for me.Actually I'm in ketosis by the second day I follow the 80fat/20prot,but it doesn't matter cause the fat fast day I'm loosing a ton of fat.I have managed to get to 7-8%.(I was around 12%in winter).It's a mix of 3different diets. :D

Wizard
07-27-2001, 01:08 PM
Actually the 3 diets I mentioned before are:
1)Ckd
2)Protein cycling
3)Fat fast
Combined in en effective way.

Mista
07-27-2001, 01:14 PM
wciked i'll give this a try man looks real good and its easy to understand! How long you plan on doing this? Thanx a lot agian man!

Wizard
07-27-2001, 01:24 PM
I've been following it for about 3months.
When on high protein,try to eat only healthy fats.(especially the nasty tasing flax seed oil).
Sorry for the type error.(ie above)