10 days rest between workouts

[RonH]

I have stopped making any gains in size or strength. I have been working out for over 15 years. i workout hard and consistant. i have changed everthing that could be changed( sets,reps exercises, time between sets, etc.)
currently i work each muscle group once a week. i do about 6 sets per muscle and all sets go to failure .the only thing i haven't changed in the past 8 years is rest. after reading
chris masons article(5 myths)I am wondering if taking more than a week between workouts would be a good idea. I don't know anybody at my gym that takes more than a week between workouts. Has anybody tried taking off this much time? what kind of success did you have?
thanks.

[chris mason]

Before you try taking more than a week off why don't you try cutting your total work sets in half. Take one week off of training all together and rest. Then resume you routine with half as many sets and I bet you will see some pretty good progress. Try that and let me know what happens.

[Joe Black]

I agree with Chris... Try lowering the volume again and see if that helps...

Also I know you are no newbie with 15 years of experience but how is your diet ? I rememeber about 20 weeks ago I was going CRAZY.. I couldn;t get my lifts up despite trying igher, loer reps and set, drop sets, negatives blah blah you name it I tried it..

Then I went to someone for diet advice and realised my diet was not helping me...

When I got it sorted my lifts soared higher than they had ever risen..

[j_dubs]

3 sets per muscle group???? WTF?!? I don't believe in high volume training, but isn't this a LITTLE low?!?!

[Joe Black]

not neccesarrily....

If you go ot the main page of this site, I assume you have seen Ian Duckett right ?

I was speaking to him and he said he was getting stronger but then slowed up...

He reduced volume and kept progressing each time he did it.. It got to the point when he was only doing 1-2 sets fo biceps and was growing and getting stronger.. Just a real life example I thought I would throw in..

If you are having trouble progressing, it isd normally better to reduce rather than increase..

Have an open mind.. Have you ever tried 3 sets ? I haven;t but I am sure I will...

I dropped from 12 for chest to 6 and started progressing again... I am sure once I fizzle out I will reduce to 4...

[RonH]

HULK my diet is good . i also sought out professional diet advise. currently i eat about 3900 cals a day. over 320 grams of quality protein.
I actually just took a week off about a month ago.
if cut my sets from 6-7 to about 4 sets , what would you suggest (chris mason and hulk) 2 exercises at 2 sets each.and each set to failure??? also what kind of rep range?currently i try to stay anywhere from 6-10 reps.
THANKS

[chris mason]

Yes to yor question about the number of sets and to failure. For reps, you have to find out what works best for each muscle group in YOUR body. The ideal number of reps for you per bodypart probably falls into the range you listed, so experiment. Give this an honest try. Make sure you train 4 days per week or less and you will gain!

[Joe Black]

Ron..

I do a mix of sets for different muscle groups..

Ie 6 for chest, 3 exercises, 2 sets each..

Yeah if I was gonna cut down to 4 I would do 2 exercises and 2 sets each...

Would be interested to know how you got on.. Keep us posted..

[RonH]

Chris and Hulk
thanks for the advise. i am going to give it a shot.i'll let you know how it goes in 8 weeks. that should be enough time to notice something.

[chris mason]

One thing, make sure to take one full week off before you start this program. It will make sure you get out of your overtrained state before you commence.

[El Kelio]

I agree with Hulk and Chris Mason. I have been training for about 8 years, and had gotten in conclusion that the most rest you get, the better.

Rest a week, and then start your training. Nowadays, my training is 4 on, 3 off ( With some cardio ), 1 month with 4-6 reps, and the next with 8-10. It's working great for me !


--------------
Someday...
Keep pumping !

[RonH]

thanks for all the help!
I'll post results in 8 weeks.

[Van Stretch]

More esteemed wisdom from the Prophet!

[The Cobra]

Ron, good luck with the program. The options they are suggesting to you are excellent, however, I'd like to add one little change that I think would seriosuly benefit you. Before taking that week off and trying the low volume approach, try a blitz attack on your muscles. For example:

Day 1) Set of 8 reps FULL DEPTH SQUAT, HEAVY AS POSSIBLE, do this every 2 hours from 10:00 A.M. - 8:00 P.M.
Day 2) Same for Bench Press, but use 6 reps each set
Day 3) Same for Supinated Chins, but use 6 reps each set

Then take your week off. If you went god-awful hard on each of those days, you'll make some serious strength gains in that week off! This is an old method my training partners and I used before a week-long summer vacation back when we were in college. Granted, you would always have a sore vacation, but it was well worth it when you come back to the gym from a week or two off and your 1RM on squats turned into your 3RM. Try it if you really like pain and like getting results. I understand that means basically spending the day in and out of the gym, but extreme staleness calls for extreme measures, and trust me, a protocol like that will make you explode with new growth.

[BIG_DONNIE_BRASCO]

Originally posted by The Cobra
Ron, good luck with the program. The options they are suggesting to you are excellent, however, I'd like to add one little change that I think would seriosuly benefit you. Before taking that week off and trying the low volume approach, try a blitz attack on your muscles. For example:

Day 1) Set of 8 reps FULL DEPTH SQUAT, HEAVY AS POSSIBLE, do this every 2 hours from 10:00 A.M. - 8:00 P.M.
Day 2) Same for Bench Press, but use 6 reps each set
Day 3) Same for Supinated Chins, but use 6 reps each set

Then take your week off. If you went god-awful hard on each of those days, you'll make some serious strength gains in that week off! This is an old method my training partners and I used before a week-long summer vacation back when we were in college. Granted, you would always have a sore vacation, but it was well worth it when you come back to the gym from a week or two off and your 1RM on squats turned into your 3RM. Try it if you really like pain and like getting results. I understand that means basically spending the day in and out of the gym, but extreme staleness calls for extreme measures, and trust me, a protocol like that will make you explode with new growth.

Hey Cobra, I understand your point! But if his lack of progress is indeed caused by overtraining do you think training MORE prior to a week off is the logical answer!?
You said that you did this protocol back in college.....well with Rons 15 yrs experience I'm quite sure he is considereably older than typical college age. His recovery ability may not be that of an 18 yr old kid!

just my .02

BIG DONNIE BRASCO

[The Cobra]

We started doing it in college. I still do it before a long time off from lifting (more than a week and a half). It works wonders on your body. If his condition is caused by overtraining, then yes, it will still yield results. The amazing shock that it will put on your muscles will spur new growth. If you do that three day bonanza, then go straight into a routine, it's worthless and will probably cause more harm than good. Since he'll be taking a week off, it'll be fine. Just because he's overtrained in the last few months doesn't mean that a system shock like that won't spur growth. It would be a great way to trigger new gains. In fact, the next time you take a week or two off, try it. You'll be happy with the results. Also, if you're not getting ready for a contest, try skipping the entire week off on diet. Get the proper number of calories, but eat stuff that you usually wouldn't. Shocking your body is one of the best ways to put on muscle.

[chris mason]

The problem I see with your suggestion Cobra is that if he is already overtrained then doing the "shock" routine and taking one week off will not alleviate the problem. The shock routine obviously puts great stress on the body in your opinion, so if it puts that much stress on a body that is already in an overtrained state it will make the week off insufficient. The body would spend the whole week trying to recover from the shock sessions and then if it did, it would still not recover from the initial state of overtraining. I think your suggestion may not be a bad idea for a weightlifter who is not currently overtrained, but even then I think the sessions you recommend would probably take longer than one week to recover from. Jacking up your sets for 1-2 workouts can stimulate the body quite well in my opinion, but make sure you only do it for 1-2 workouts as otherwise you will quickly find yourself overtrained. By the way, that routine sounds a lot like something Arnold said that he used to do in Austria in the summers in his book Education of a Bodybuilder. Is that where you got the idea?

[The Cobra]

Chris, you could be right. If he is in a state of overtraining that is extremely severe, maybe that extra shock could be too much. I still suggest it to anyone that is overtrained and ready to start a lower volume routine. Give your body that last extra burst of destruction before healing. I cannot honestly say where we got the idea. We pretty much made it up ourselves, but you've heard the saying 'Nothing new under the sun.' Arnold did do something like that back in his late teens/early twenties in Europe, and I know Charles Poliquin (of whom I am a great admirer) also has certain "one-day" cures for lagging bodyparts. Another example of this kind of super destruction/healing was Tom Platz. He used to go all out for two weeks, amazing amounts of work. Then he'd take a week or two off. It's a good method for shocking growth. But as you pointed out, if the overtraining is so severe that you can't sleep well or can't eat even close to the amount you should, then this may not be for you.