3-andro xtreme

[X-FORCE23]

Hey, I need the 411 on this product. Has anyone used it before?? Is it good for lean or bulk?:help: should I use one or two pills?? Let me know please.

[bigswole30]

If you are taliking about AST stay away from their prohormones. They are very outdated.

[X-FORCE23]

no one else has an opinion??

[bigswole30]

What's in it?
Supplement Facts
Serving Size: 2 Capsules
Serving Per Container: 30

Amount Per Serving
100 milligrams 4-Androstenediol
100 mg 5-Androstenediol
100 mg 19-Norandrostenedione
200 mg Caffeine
400 mg Ephedra Extract 8%
100 mg L-Phenylalanine
100 mg L-Tyrosine

5-ad is quite possibly the most estrogenic PH on the market. Do not take it unless you want boobies. 100mg of oral 4-ad will not do anything. The same goes for the 19-nor dione. The stimulants will be the only thing to have any effect. You do not have to take my word, but you should on this one.

[BUFF STUFF]

listen to bigswole

unless you want to be forking out for bra sizes very soon

[bigswole30]

Hre is some info on 5-ad that I found.

5-androstenediol is not only an androgen but also an estrogen and has almost no conversion to testosterone. The positive influence that 5AD has on your immune system is severely outweighed by the negative hormonal impact it has on your endocrine system. What you experienced is a condition arising from high levels of estrogen in the body caused by 5AD. This condition is medically known as gynocomastia or in the gym as "bitch tits." You were wise to discontinue use. If you had waited any longer, you would have needed surgery to remove the hardened fatty deposits that would have inevitably formed permanently beneath your nipples. Unless you want to "be like Mike" (Jackson not Jordan), then 5AD should NEVER be put in the human body in any amount. I just spoke with a person who was getting good results on 1000 mg. of 4AD. At the advice of a distributor he switched to 5AD and had a much worse experience than you. If your supplement company sells any form or combination of 5AD and other prohormones, I suggest you find a new supplement company. Because it has a higher conversion rate to estrogen rather than testosterone, androstenedione singly or in combination with any other prohormones should also be avoided.

[SquareHead]

Swole. In your opinion what is the best prohormone on the market today? Like what companies specific product?

[BUFF STUFF]

Square I think 1AD or 1Test has to be the best ones

Not forgeting 4AD too

the rest pah! Side effects in a bottel

I havnt tried any of the better ones though

[bigswole30]

VPX and BDC. As for what PH that depends on ones goals.

[JustinASU]

What have you guys heard about 1-tnt?

[bigmean38]

I have been lifting weights for a LONG TIME.. So I have tried a lot of worthless supplements. TNT works and works well.

It was definitely the strongest thing I have ever used. I used it while cutting and my strength actually increased on a cut. Usually I would lose a lot of mass along with my fat but I actually gained muscle.

No magic bullets of course. Still have to diet and train your ass off as usual. I got a pic thread in the Members Pics section of my progress if you wanna check it out. I'm 38, so even if you are older you can still put on some mass if you know what you're doin in the weight room.

c-ya

[bigswole30]

It is quite possibly a nice product, but there are much better products on the market.

[bigassdan]

and your basis for that statement is?

(anxiously awaits an idiotic answer)

:rolleyes:

[bigswole30]

tuttut

[X-FORCE23]

You all confusing me:confused: so 3x is not good. What about 1 and 4 AD is that good how should I use it. It costs like $100.

[bigswole30]

The amount of prohormones are too low. Also, the ones used have low oral bioavailability. Go with Syngex by VPX. If you need a thermo go with Liquid Clenbutrx.

[bigassdan]

dude, you apparently have either have stock in or work for VPX.

XFORCE, do not waste your money on anything VPX sells.

way overpriced.

[AdamGberg]

how much does an effective cycle of VPX normally run a fellow? just wondering for sake of argument....

[bigassdan]

somebody needs to post the facts so I guess I will.

you can get a 240 ml bottle of VPX's 1-Test for $112

It contains 40 servings of 250 mg of 1-Testosterone.

250mg at 40 servings equals a grand total of 1 gram of
1-Testosterone!!!

One measly gram!!!! For a $112!!! :scratch:

A company that size buys in bulk. They most likely get that 1 gram of 1-Testosterone for about $2 a gram at the most.

And then lets talk about the so called pharmaceutical delivery system. 1-Testosterone products discussed on this board which are delivered transdermally and are much cheaper have at least 4-6 grams of 1-Testosterone. So even if the "liposomal" delivery is getting 100% absorption and a transdermal is only absorbing at a rate of 20% (transdermal absorption is about 40%) you are still getting ripped off!! I'd like to know of one prescription drug which is delivered in such a manner. I can name many transdermal prescriptions such as Androgel, Birth Control patches, nicotine patches and so on.

They are the MuscleTech of the pro-hormone pro-steroid world. They name the rest of their products after illegal steroids hoping someone who is not well educated will think they are getting some serious juice. Actually, they make MuscleTech look respectable and that is hard to do.

So if you would like to refute this please do so with some science and not a smilie face.

[bigswole30]

bigassdan, do not hate. I do not work for VPX, but would love to. Who wouldn't want to work for the most innovative supplement company in the world. Just wait to I get on the 1-test CYP. I am sure it is going to set the standards for prohormones. Oh wait, VPX has already done so. You are forgetting that it does not matter how much you take.

[bigswole30]

bump

[Holto]

Originally posted by bigswole30
You are forgetting that it does not matter how much you take.

erh? :help:

good post Dan

that makes sense to a bean counter like me

[bigswole30]

Maybe you should go read up on 1-test CYP and how it is incased in a Polymer. It will release at both ends in the bloodstream and stay active for over two days. What transdermal will do that? What if they used a lipophilic delivery system that didn't release a liposome but a new breed of ploymer? which wasn't on any pharmacitcal methylated patent? But consisted of a foodbase orgin? like a dense fat molocule that was encased by the cypinated polymer, which just made some sort of single pass by the liver enzymes? and had a very slow half life? Could be interesting.

__________________

[bigswole30]

bump

[Holto]

that sounds like advertising copy to me

bigswole30:

is this what VPX claims or do you think this stuff is for real?

[bradley]

I deleted one of the posts in this thread, but I wanted to bump it back up to the top. Please express your views but do so in a courteous manner. Thanks. (sorry for the off topic post:))

[bigswole30]

Originally posted by Holto
that sounds like advertising copy to me

bigswole30:

is this what VPX claims or do you think this stuff is for real?

NO that is not advertising copy. That is personal knowledge. VPX will not release specifics to the general public because people will try to knock off their product. I am certain after talking to my source that this product will be effective. The logic is that an oral CYP product would not work due to the slow release, but I do not think that is the case with this product. MOst oral AAS are alkylated with either an ethyl or methyl, but this product is not. Hopefully my supply will come in in the next day or two. Stay tuned for the results.

[bigassdan]

I am sorry about the post that had to be deleted. I just dont like others trying to mislead people with less knowledge on a particular subject with mispelled mumbo jumbo. Hope that was somewhat courteous enough to not be removed.:)

the slow release you are talking about is the whole point of transdermal application..

Thank you for making that case for me. When you apply androgens transdermally they continue to trickle into the bloodstream for an extended period of time. Thats why that method of delivery is used in many prescription drugs such as nicotine patch, Androgel, birth control patch and others. That plus the fact that there is so little actual androgen in the VPX product just screams rip off.

I am trying to be nice and just ask a simple question.

VPX says it is a pharmaceutical delivery system. Liposomal that is.

Someone give me ONE example of a liposomal prescription drug. In plain English.

[bigswole30]

Go to Pubmed and do your own search on liposomes. They are used quite often. Orally and by IV. Lets talk prohormones. I have never said transdermals do not work, but you have no case against liposomal prohormones. You are trying to sell a product and when I turn someone on to VPX you loose a customer. You keep making your homemade transdermals while VPX is having their products manufactured by FDA approved cGMP laboratories by world renowned chemist. I am sorry the science is beyond you.

[bigswole30]

I hope there is no bitterness. People can learn from our disagreements. I do have one question. If transdermals are the way to go why would VPX not release a transdermal product? They are manufactured much cheaper.

[Holto]

I find one of the hokiest concepts in supps is the "delivery system"

where do you get this knowledge Swole ?

are there clinical studies on VPX products ?

[bigswole30]

I'lladmit that I talk with an employee of VPX quite often via email and phone occasionally. He was on the test team for the new 1-test CYP. I will see if he will send me a copy of his blood work done pre, during, and post cycle. People do not realize the magnitude of VPX. It is very to hate on something that you van't understand. Hence, Bigassdan. That is not an insult towards him in no way. I can tell you this. From my conversations with the employee of VPX I can tell you that they truly are ahead of the game. Believe it or not.

[Holto]

so this info is coming solely from a VPX employee?

[bigassdan]

thats all well and good, but my very simple question remains....

name one drug delivered in this method.

And the reason you will not see any transdermal products available commercially by VPX or anyone anymore is because it IS a pharmaceutical delivery.

Quite frankly there is no point in continuing this conversation because I think that the majority of people on this board are smart enough not to be swindled by companies that shall remain nameless.

I gotta give you credit though. You dont give up.

no hard feelings man. maybe we just see things totally different.

:)

[bigswole30]

Cool. However, I think people are coming to know that VPX is great. I just recieved notification that my 1-test cyp is on the way. Look out.