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TheBug
11-02-2003, 06:41 AM
I'm getting more serious in my training. Pushing nearly everything to failure. Watching what I eat to get the right mix of protein, carbs, etc.

The problem is that I am at 22% bf. I'm 5'8" and 175 pounds. Arms are 15" and chest is 43". Since I'm starting to drink protein shakes and taking my workout to new heights, should I concentrate on bulking now or should I concentrate on getting rid of this bf?

jinxx
11-02-2003, 07:16 AM
I'd definately cut if I was at a 22% BF. Bulking now only means your gonna have to cut for a much longer time and 22% is pretty high to me. I myself never let it get higher then 15-17%, then I cut down to 8 again before starting another bulk.

Dedicated
11-02-2003, 07:24 AM
I say bulk to somewhere over 200 then cut. Get some real muscle on you before you cut, plus cutting sucks, and it's winter time.

defcon
11-02-2003, 07:31 AM
I would say cut, do not cut to sub 10 or anything.. just get down to a reasonable bf% ( say 12-13% ) then bulk up. The reason i say this is because..

1. At a higher bf% you gain a great ratio of fat compared to muscle
2. Its just overall healthier to be at a lower bf%.

IMO anyway.. it really comes down to what you want.

TheBug
11-02-2003, 08:56 AM
Right now, I want to cut off this bf. I was thinking it's winter, I can bulk now, but my bf is pretty high and cutting is going to be tough enough already. Adding more is going to make it that more difficult. Any thoughts?

OceanFit
11-02-2003, 09:14 AM
You would feel and preform better with less fat on you. Cut! Unless you are some where really cold don't let the winter i

OceanFit
11-02-2003, 09:14 AM
You would feel and preform better with less fat on you. Cut!

J450n
11-02-2003, 09:23 AM
A lot of people tend to bulk over the winter regardless of bf% but we are all different. If you're not happy with your bf% and don't really want to increase it then go on a steady cut, nothing too drastic. Your the only one who can decide this one.

JNowiski
11-02-2003, 09:28 AM
Originally posted by Dedicated
I say bulk to somewhere over 200 then cut. Get some real muscle on you before you cut, plus cutting sucks, and it's winter time.

You don't like cardio and such in the winter time? I love running in the winter, hate running in the summer...:D

PizDoff
11-02-2003, 09:29 AM
What about just maintaining weight?

Working out and getting rid of fat and gaining muscle while staying the same weight.

JNowiski
11-02-2003, 09:31 AM
Thats what I want to do PD. Exactly what I would like to do.

TheBug
11-02-2003, 10:55 AM
OK, you've convinced me to cut. Anyone have any suggestions on what to do? I already run about 4 miles a day, 3x per week.

I'm just starting with the right nutrition, so I'm not real knowledgeable about what to do. If I cut the calories, won't I be stunting muscle growth?

defcon
11-02-2003, 12:24 PM
Okay.. TheBug, i suggest you read some stickies in the nutritional forum, they will greatly help you.. then you can post more direct questions in the nutrition forum when you need help making up your diet ect..

-TIM-
11-02-2003, 09:36 PM
Originally posted by TheBug
Right now, I want to cut off this bf. I was thinking it's winter, I can bulk now, but my bf is pretty high and cutting is going to be tough enough already. Adding more is going to make it that more difficult. Any thoughts?

Yes, adding more will make it more difficult to cut where you want to be. And 20%+ is higher than what most will bulk up to. So you got to figure you're higher where you are than most want to get at the end of a bulking stage. So cut away...IMO.

kingkong888
11-02-2003, 11:30 PM
You hear alot of mention about cutting and bulking, but wouldnt it make more sense to cut and bulk within the same week??
If you take in low fat low cal foods three (resting) days of the week and high cal, high protien foods on the 4 workout days of the week, you are providing your body with the right nutrients and the right time.
To me it seems pointless to, for example eat large amounts of protien on a non workout day as protien stores fat if not utilised through the body effectively, this happens becaurse the muscles do not require large amounts, so it just sits there in the lower intestines, wasted. It makes more sense, I think to plan your diet in 'real time', and measure your calorie and fat ect intake at the end of every week, not at the end of every day.
Buy one of those pedometers that measure how many calories your burning off and only replace those ones you burn off to avoid over eating.

Crystallio
11-02-2003, 11:43 PM
You hear alot of mention about cutting and bulking, but wouldnt it make more sense to cut and bulk within the same week??
If you take in low fat low cal foods three (resting) days of the week and high cal, high protien foods on the 4 workout days of the week, you are providing your body with the right nutrients and the right time.
To me it seems pointless to, for example eat large amounts of protien on a non workout day as protien stores fat if not utilised through the body effectively, this happens becaurse the muscles do not require large amounts, so it just sits there in the lower intestines, wasted. It makes more sense, I think to plan your diet in 'real time', and measure your calorie and fat ect intake at the end of every week, not at the end of every day.

The problem I see with this is that your muscles are growing constantly, so you need a consistent flow of protein to give them the building blocks. You're right that excessive protein will be converted and stored as fat, but insufficient protein means you won't grow to your full potential. I'm sure someone with more knowledge (like Bradley) could explain the biomechanics of bulking and cutting cycles better than me.


Buy one of those pedometers that measure how many calories your burning off and only replace those ones you burn off to avoid over eating.

According to the Nutritional Sciences class I took last semester, ~70% of the calories you burn are because of your basal metabolic rate (bodily functions like organs doing their job), so only replacing the calories you burn with physical activity would put you on a starvation diet. It would probably be easier to track your calories and weight over a few weeks, and then decide on how many calories you need to maintain weight. The pedometer thing is a cool idea though; I'll have to get one for my mom since she likes to go walking a lot.

Spartacus
11-02-2003, 11:56 PM
The problem I see with this is that your muscles are growing constantly, so you need a consistent flow of protein to give them the building blocks. You're right that excessive protein will be converted and stored as fat, but insufficient protein means you won't grow to your full potential.
cutting calories doesn't mean you should cut protein though. the amount of protein stays at 1g/lb of weight cutting or bulking.

defcon
11-03-2003, 04:58 AM
Originally posted by Spartacus

cutting calories doesn't mean you should cut protein though. the amount of protein stays at 1g/lb of weight cutting or bulking.

Bump, my protein and fat stays the same bulking or cutting, well, CLOSE to the same.. only thing that changes is carbs.

kingkong888
11-09-2003, 09:17 AM
What is this a debating forum or a bodybuilding for helpful advice to those who need it??
The Bug got on here with a question about cutting and all you seem to be interested in is debating. Whats up with that??
You need a constant flow of protien, but you also need the right amount for the right type of lifestyle you lead just as you do, calories. A non active person needs less than an active person,
If you only workout for 2 days a week you wont need as much protien in the sixth and seventh as you would the third or forth.
I didnt mention anything about % your organs burn off, obviously you need a certain numbers of calories in order to maintain weight, depending on body weight, I was refering specifically to physical activity or bodybuilding, which is what TheBug was too.
But thanks for the nutrition lesson anyway.Dude.

Shroud
11-09-2003, 09:37 AM
The Bug got on here with a question about cutting and all you seem to be interested in is debating. Whats up with that??
What? We can't pursue discussions that spontaneously arise out of the question that is initially asked? I think this discussion is VERY valid for those of us who are carrying higher amounts of BF.
:whip:

J450n
11-09-2003, 11:26 AM
Originally posted by kingkong888
What is this a debating forum or a bodybuilding for helpful advice to those who need it??
The Bug got on here with a question about cutting and all you seem to be interested in is debating. Whats up with that??


Oh, i thought it was called 'having an opinion"? Silly me..

TheBug
11-09-2003, 01:04 PM
OK, good stuff so far.

So, if I want to maintain my weight and lose this bf, what's the best way to do it?

defcon
11-09-2003, 05:13 PM
You would probally cut first.. get down to 10% or sub 10 bf%, then bulk up to have a few more lbs lean muscle then your "desired image" and then do a final cut..

( i added a few more LBM to the bulk weight since some MAY be lost during cutting. )

Dedicated
11-09-2003, 08:19 PM
Originally posted by JNowiski


You don't like cardio and such in the winter time? I love running in the winter, hate running in the summer...:D
The beach isn't as active in the winter cause you can't go when it's cold. Most people cut so they are rdy for the summer and the beach and bulk in the winter. Anyways all this talk of cutting is making me think of cutting, must...step...away from thread!