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Neil
12-04-2003, 10:17 AM
What do you guys think of this article?

http://danjohn.org/page65.html

Paul Stagg
12-04-2003, 11:17 AM
I think I've never seen any statistical data showing intelligent anabolic use leads to early deaths.

I think that many elite athletes may be predisposed to early deaths just like they are predisposed to being great athletes.

I think evil steroids get blamed for illnesses and deaths when other factors may be involved - other recrational drugs, other, perhaps embarassing illnesses, or other unhealthy behavior.

benchmonster
12-04-2003, 12:45 PM
Sniff, sniff, does anyone have a tissue?


What a whiner. Check his heart attack friends blood pressure, check his resting heart rate, check his bodyweight. They will all be way way out of proportion.

Big people have heart problems, big people die young. If you want to live forever, don't lift a lot of weights and get huge. You are literally cutting years off your life if you go to extremes and get as big and strong as humanly possible. This is true whether you use steroids or not.

Think the 5 foot 10, 300lb powerlifter dies young? Yep, he sure does, but so does the 5 foot 10, 300 lb couch potato.

His cronies are dying off, or so he says, well, that sux, but by the time I was 21 there were 3 or 4 people I had graduated high school with whose funerals I had to go to, and they died, cause they just died. When your number is up, it is up.

It is possible to use steroids intelligently, and maintain high levels of health. But steroids, just like twinkies, can be dangerous when taken to the extreme. And if you are letting your bodyweight get away from you and are not paying attention to your cardio vascular health, you are asking for health problems whether you have 10% bodyfat or 40% bodyfat.

B.

phreak
12-04-2003, 12:54 PM
Originally posted by benchmonster
if you are letting your bodyweight get away from you and are not paying attention to your cardio vascular health, you are asking for health problems whether you have 10% bodyfat or 40% bodyfat. Yup.

chris mason
12-05-2003, 09:46 AM
Originally posted by Paul Stagg
I think I've never seen any statistical data showing intelligent anabolic use leads to early deaths.

I think that many elite athletes may be predisposed to early deaths just like they are predisposed to being great athletes.

I think evil steroids get blamed for illnesses and deaths when other factors may be involved - other recrational drugs, other, perhaps embarassing illnesses, or other unhealthy behavior.


Paul, if you truly believe this then why do you not use yourself?

PowerManDL
12-05-2003, 11:46 AM
There's more reasons than just health not to use.

AllUp
12-05-2003, 11:56 AM
Originally posted by benchmonster
It is possible to use steroids intelligently, and maintain high levels of health. But steroids, just like twinkies, can be dangerous when taken to the extreme.

Twinkies, lol.. They WILL cut ones lifespan in half.. :)

thetopdog
12-05-2003, 05:21 PM
Originally posted by PowerManDL
There's more reasons than just health not to use.

I can't think of any. I'm not trying to be sarcastic, but what other reasons besides health (I guess being afraid of being caught might be a reason, but we all do illegal things) would there be to not use steriods

I haven't made up my mind whether or not I will end up using (I'm only 20 so I have time to wait) but the only reason I might not end up using is health (heart, reproductive, prostate, hair etc.).

body
12-05-2003, 05:26 PM
money, gear is not cheap

MrWebb78
12-05-2003, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by thetopdog


I can't think of any. I'm not trying to be sarcastic, but what other reasons besides health (I guess being afraid of being caught might be a reason, but we all do illegal things) would there be to not use steriods

I haven't made up my mind whether or not I will end up using (I'm only 20 so I have time to wait) but the only reason I might not end up using is health (heart, reproductive, prostate, hair etc.).

how can you possibly speak for everyone and say we ALL do illegal things. speak for yourself bud.

WillKuenzel
12-05-2003, 05:52 PM
Money, availability, testing, etc. Just a couple reasons other than health.

Manveet
12-05-2003, 07:33 PM
Originally posted by thetopdog


I can't think of any. I'm not trying to be sarcastic, but what other reasons besides health (I guess being afraid of being caught might be a reason, but we all do illegal things) would there be to not use steriods

I haven't made up my mind whether or not I will end up using (I'm only 20 so I have time to wait) but the only reason I might not end up using is health (heart, reproductive, prostate, hair etc.).

I think the stigmatization associated with use is a huge reason why a lot of people don't use in the first place.

thetopdog
12-05-2003, 10:34 PM
Originally posted by MrWebb78


how can you possibly speak for everyone and say we ALL do illegal things. speak for yourself bud.

I'm not talking about using illegal drugs. I have never used them, I don't even drink, but please don't tell me EVERYBODY here hasn't jaywalked or broken the speed limit, because if you did then you would be lying

I'm just saying that since we all break the law, I don't think the law should really stop anybody from doing anything morally, since we all basically decide for ourselves what is and isn't moral anyways. Of course the penalties for speeding/jawalking and the ways most people break the law aren't as harsh as the ones for steriods

About the stigmatization issue, that only exists because the general public thinks steriods will kill you or turn you into a hairy murderer with a shrunken penis. If there were no health reasons against using steriods, it wouldn't make sense for me not to use them because the general public is grossly misinformed.

And the money issue is irrelevant (to me at least) since the amount of keepable progress you can make after a good cycle would speed up your proress so much and save you so much time and money in gym fees, supplements etc. that money should hardly be a concern (again, if there were no health drawbacks)

That's just the way I see it though

noraa
12-06-2003, 01:56 AM
the author seems like a whiney little bitch who starts off on steroids goes onto a rant about machines then all over the place.

Maybe he should worry less about the steroids and more about what he was using when writing it.

Scott S
12-06-2003, 06:28 PM
Some people take pride in what they can accomplish without augmenting their endocrine systems, too.

Paul Stagg
12-08-2003, 09:35 AM
Why not use myself? Are you serious?

Because I can't afford to get arrested.

Because I compete in a tested (USAPL) federation, and plan to continue competing there.

Because the cost/benefit doesn't currently support my use.

Because needles creep me out.

I don't do lots of things that I think could intelligently be done safely. I don't skydive, for example. I don't use ephedra. I don't use a chainsaw.

Teufelhund
12-08-2003, 10:05 AM
danjohn.org is the website of "The Office of Religious Education of the Diocese of Salt Lake City"

Just putting the article in context, I guess. I'm actually kind of surprised it doesn't say you go to hell for taking steroids...

Neil
12-08-2003, 10:42 AM
Here is the homepage for the site I got the article from.

http://danjohn.org/coach.html

Your discovery has no bearing whatsoever on the article IMO.