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ricky0000
02-01-2004, 02:39 PM
When you gain fat during a bulk, are you gaining more fat cells, or just enlarging your existing fat cells?

Saint Patrick
02-01-2004, 02:51 PM
:lurk:

Holto
02-02-2004, 10:38 AM
I agree with Patty
























don't worry about it

(fat cells ususally multipy in cases of obesity)

TylerDurden
02-02-2004, 11:29 AM
Fat cells do not replicate they can only grow in size. They're called adipoctyes.. It has been found that the number of fat cells is a genetic consequence. However, if you remove them they will replicate to the number that is genetically programmed. That is why lipo does not work.

galileo
02-02-2004, 12:35 PM
Fat cells do not replicate they can only grow in size. They're called adipoctyes.. It has been found that the number of fat cells is a genetic consequence. However, if you remove them they will replicate to the number that is genetically programmed. That is why lipo does not work.


Can you give some sort of medical reference for this? If lipo didn't work, no one would get it.

Saint Patrick
02-02-2004, 12:46 PM
Lipo works because they take fat cells out of one part or the body and put them in another part of the body (taking cells out of your stomach and putting them in your glutes, for example). this keeping the same # of fat cells in the body.

Holto
02-02-2004, 12:54 PM
Fat cells do not replicate they can only grow in size

are you sure you're not thinking of myocytes

I can't even estimate the number of times I have read that fat cells replicate, in books like fat wars etc...

raniali
02-02-2004, 12:59 PM
what are you talking about, patty? they do not move the fat around in lipo. it goes straight to the biological waste container. lipo is a temporary fix but typically people will regain the fat because they fail to make dietary and lifestyle changes that led them there in the first place.

i believe that the number of fat cells can increase since there is a volume limit that a typical cell can maintain. however, that may only be the case in extreme obsesity, but i should do a search for info.

Saint Patrick
02-02-2004, 01:06 PM
what are you talking about, patty? they do not move the fat around in lipo. it goes straight to the biological waste container. lipo is a temporary fix but typically people will regain the fat because they fail to make dietary and lifestyle changes that led them there in the first place.

i believe that the number of fat cells can increase since there is a volume limit that a typical cell can maintain. however, that may only be the case in extreme obsesity, but i should do a search for info.

Well I guess I had the wrong understanding.......

What was that surgery that Geraldo had on his show a few years ago?

TylerDurden
02-02-2004, 02:09 PM
Lipo works for a limited time, all the cells will replicate until contact inhibition kicks in. The cell size can get very large. That is why when you dissect a cadaver you see big fat globules that are just adipocytes. I'll try and find my Physiology reference, but this was taught to me by Dr. Walter Johnson.

This is a well documented, its really that new. I've been taught this in a couple of different classes.

Here are the sources, Guyton and Hall - Textbook of Medical Physiology, 9th Ed.,
Rhoades and Tanner - Medical Physiology.

defcon
02-02-2004, 02:11 PM
I think you genetically start out with x number of fat cells

as you become more fat, your fat gets stored in these cells, once they are at their full capacity, they replicated themselves for more fat storage.. once these new ones are full, the also replicate, and so on

when you lose weight, you still have alll the x+new # of fat cells, they do not go away.
when you get lipo, you can remove fat cells, if you are still above your genetically given x number of fat cells then everything is okay, i believe if you go below your genetic x fat cells, then they replicate back to x.

get what i mean? well im not sure if its right.. but that is how i think it works.

JTyrell710
02-02-2004, 02:17 PM
i dont think your body is THAT smart, defcon
A similar fat-losing surgery is stomach bypass or something, basically they staple your stomach and make it smaller, decreasing your apetite. It is very dangerous. Al Rokey, the fat black weather guy for NBC had that and he looks.. weird. But it worked for him

TylerDurden
02-02-2004, 02:50 PM
defcon, Thats a nice theory but its not true to life. Thats like saying my muscle cells get so big then they cant grow anymore and replicate for more storage. Muscle cells do not replicate either (except in extreme cases) they just increase in size and cellular components. Why is this so shocking to people? this is a pretty well known biological process. I'm sure there is someone here that has had medical biology and can back me up on this.

TylerDurden
02-02-2004, 02:59 PM
Lipo works because they take fat cells out of one part or the body and put them in another part of the body (taking cells out of your stomach and putting them in your glutes, for example). this keeping the same # of fat cells in the body.
People get lipo because they don't understand this concept, and its the easiest fastest way to lose weight. If you diet and keep the cals down you can maintain it. those cells will still replicate to fill in the void they just wont enlarge until extra glycogen that needs to be stored. (hence, the reason for low carb diets)

JTyrell710
02-02-2004, 03:04 PM
I have a small bit of biology education in me, And basically the only cells in your body that replicate (mitosis, meiosis excluded) are some organs, liver, and your skin. It is still under debate and study as to if brain cells replicate..

TylerDurden
02-02-2004, 03:06 PM
are you sure you're not thinking of myocytes

I can't even estimate the number of times I have read that fat cells replicate, in books like fat wars etc...
Myocytes do have replicative ability, example is heart hypertrophy from loss of elasticity in the vascular lumen. The left ventricular wall, in this case, gets much thicker to increase cardiac output.

Holto
02-02-2004, 08:59 PM
skeletal tissue not cardiac

it wouldn't surprise me if fat cells can't replicate their expansion capability is virtually limitless

TylerDurden
02-03-2004, 09:05 PM
myocytes. MYo meaning muscle, cytes meaning cells.. I'm sorry i chose cardiac cells, but when doctors talk about myocytes they are usually refering to mycytes. Skeletal muscle does not replicate, but in recent findings there is some replication in tramatic incidences. For bodybuilding purposes, it is established that replication of sk. mm. cells is not possible.