Just want to make sure

[ogarchamplin]

I am buying Dextrose this morning and i want to get it right with the mixing. I am told that i should mix it with a whey shake pre work out. But how much dextrose. And then i am told to mix it with creatine post work out. Same question again how many grams. Also on non workout days do you still use the dextrose?

[TBone4Eva]

From what I've gathered reading through the threads on here, it seems a 1:1 ratio is pretty good. So, if you take in 50g of Protein preworkout you would also add 50g of the dextrose. As for with the creatine, I'm not sure, but I couldn't imagine you needing more than 25g. However, I could be wrong. Assuming you will be taking the creatine daily, you can use the dextrose with that even on your non-workout days.

[ogarchamplin]

I only take 5grams of creatine a day so i mix 5 and 5 with what 8oz of water?

[rookiebldr]

25g for creatine is too high. 5g will do you just fine. And I prefer a 1:2 ratio of protein to carbs. Adjust the quantity based on your overall caloric needs and goals.

On non-workout days, adding the dextrose basically creates a meal replacement. If you need quick calories then go ahead.

[PiKappaWRX]

ogar, look at that other thread that u started that was called 'Dextrose'

STUNT said in that post:

"As a general rule, on a bulk-up plan the amount of carbs to consume following a hardcore weight training session is five grams of simple carbohydrates for every ten pounds of lean body mass (LBM). This would mean a body builder with 200lbs. of LBM would consume 100 grams of high-glycemic simple carbohydrates post-training."

"On a cutting phase I recommend consuming 2.5 grams of carbs per ten pounds of lean body mass. The goal here is to consume just enough to suppress cortisol and increase growth hormone levels and to get out of our catabolic state. During a time when you are restricting calories, the last thing you want is to be catabolic. I also recommend consuming an equal amount of grams of protein as you did grams of simple carbohydrates."

and littlejake added that:

bf% * bodyweight = bodyfat weight in lbs
bodyweight - bodyfat weight in lbs = LBM

[TBone4Eva]

25g for creatine is too high. 5g will do you just fine. And I prefer a 1:2 ratio of protein to carbs. Adjust the quantity based on your overall caloric needs and goals.

Sorry, I was referring to the amount of dextrose he should have with his creatine. I already assumed he would be taking 5g of creatine daily as this is the norm.

On non-workout days, adding the dextrose basically creates a meal replacement. If you need quick calories then go ahead.

So, what would you recommend Ogar or any of us take with our creatine on non-workout days? Will taking it with just water be effective?

[ogarchamplin]

Sorry, I was referring to the amount of dextrose he should have with his creatine. I already assumed he would be taking 5g of creatine daily as this is the norm.



So, what would you recommend Ogar or any of us take with our creatine on non-workout days? Will taking it with just water be effective?

I dont know i asked the question earlier and am waiting on a response too

[geoffgarcia]

Creatine- How much should be taken?
Excellent results have been observed in taking creatine monohydrate in two different ways.

The first way is called loading.
This method works very well for anyone who has never taken creatine before. Just as the name implies, it involves loading up or saturating your muscles with creatine. During the first four days to a week, take 20 to 30 grams per day. Mix it with non-acidic juice or water. Grape juice works well. After this loading period, take a regular intake of between five to fifteen grams per day to keep your muscles saturated (no need to over do it).

The other method is a more gradual approach to supplementing with creatine monohydrate. Over the course of an extended period, one basically skips the loading phase and just supplements with five to fifteen grams per day, everyday.

The best results have been noticed when creatine is combined with a high carbohydrate base, such as dextrose (glucose) and taken about one-half hour before training.
http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/creatine.html


How long does creatine stay in the blood stream?
When you take creatine in powder form - it is in your blood stream for about 1 - 1.5 hours. For muscle growth the creatine must be absorbed into the muscles. So, if you are working out and deplete your creatine supply in your muscles AND you have creatine available in the blood stream, your muscles can replenish their creatine supply from the creatine in your blood.

Here is the important point - if your muscles are fully saturated with creatine and you are not working out ( so you are not depleting your creatine stores) then after 1.5 hours the creatine in your blood will be converted into creatinine and excreted.


should I take it before my workout or after?
Take the powder about 1 hour before your workout. Here is our reasoning...

It can take about 1 hour for the creatine to be absorbed into the bloodstream - and from that point you have about 1.5 hours to use the creatine or lose it.

So, let's say you workout at 10am - here is our logic.
At 9am you take the creatine powder. By 10am the creatine is in the blood stream. Your muscles are probably mostly saturated with creatine from the supplement you took the day before. So, some of the creatine you took at 9am may be absorbed into the muscles - but the rest is still in the blood.
At 10am you start working out and depleting the creatine in your muscles. Your muscles then replenish their creatine supply from the creatine in the blood stream. Your workout ends at 11am (you really should not workout more than 1 hour - but that is a topic for a different day). Remember, you took creatine at 9am - but it was not absorbed into the blood stream until 10am. This means it will stay there until 11:30am (1.5 hours).
So, now you have another 1/2 hour where your muscles can replenish their creatine supply if depleted. In a way you are getting the best of all worlds - you have creatine available before, during and after your workout.


Should I take creatine on my off days? Seems like a simple question - but it is very hard to get a straight answer on this one. There is some evidence that indicates that creatine can help with muscle recovery. If this is true, then taking creatine on your off days is a good idea. Our feeling is that more research needs to be done before anyone can conclusively say that creatine helps with recovery. This research may not come anytime soon so you are left to make your own decision. If you feel that creatine is helping with muscle recovery, then yes take it on your off days. If you are not convinced that creatine helps with recovery, then you do not need to take it on off days.

Many people believe that you need to take creatine everyday to keep your creatine levels topped off. We do not see the research that proves this to be true. If you are taking creatine for the muscular boost in energy, that taking it just on workout days should be fine.

Want more facts to make this questions more confusing? A University of Kentucky study shows that use of creatine could help the brain recover from concussions and other injuries commonly suffered by professional and amateur athletes (the study was published in the Annals of Neurology - 11/2000). Brain damage was reduced 21% when creatine was given to mice three days before injury and 36% when given five days ahead of time. Rats given a diet with creatine for four weeks had 50% less brain damage than rats who did not receive creatine. This may explain why pro football players can recover so quickly from concussions - they take creatine.

So, if you play a contact sport you may want to take creatine everyday for the possible prevention of brain damage. Of course, more research needs to be done - but just another factor to consider when you decide if you should use creatine on your off days.

What do we do? Most of us take a half dose of creatine on off days and a full dose on days we work out.

http://www.absolute-creatine.com/9.htm

[ogarchamplin]

but here is an article from this site

The Optimal Creatine Dosing Schedule



View all articles by Justin Frank

Written by : Justin Frank print article email article



Most people just don't know how to take creatine in the most efficient and cost effective manner. You can take creatine just about however way you like, but it is most likely not the most efficient way. This dosing schedule concentrates on efficiency, most people take far too much creatine, and a lot of it ends up in the toilet. Now, lets get started...

The typical creatine supplementation protocol begins with a loading dose of 20 g per day for 5 days. This is completely unnecessary. 5 days is over doing it, Although a 5-day loading period is most common, 2 days of loading has been shown to yield similar muscle creatine concentration and performance results. Again, efficiency. Also, "A study by Green et al found that the addition of a carbohydrate solution (90 g four times daily during the loading phase) further enhanced the increase in muscle creatine concentration relative to taking creatine alone."

This is usually followed by a "maintenance" dose of 5-10g per day, which is excessive, 2g per day is all that is needed.

"Muscle concentrations of creatine and PCr return to baseline levels approximately 28 days after discontinuing creatine supplementation."

For those of you that oppose loading (for whatever reason, many people feel it's dangerous, which has never been shown to be true), 3 g per day for 28 days results in muscle creatine concentrations similar to 2-5 days of loading.

"It is important to note, however, that skeletal muscle has a creatine storage capacity of 150 to 160 mmol/kg (normal is 125 mmol/kg), which makes over supplementation futile. This is important information for those who think that more is better. Any excess creatine ingestion will not further increase muscle creatine but will simply increase urinary creatine and creatinine excretion."

Excretion of creatine by the kidneys at a rate of 1 to 2 g per day is via irreversible conversion to creatinine in skeletal muscle.

So, now to wrap this article up...

The Optimal Creatine Dosing Schedule:

First 2 days of creatine supplementation - Load with 10g, 2 times a day (20g per day)

After the loading phase of 20 g daily for 2 days, maintenance should be 2 g per day, Any extra is simply urinated out.

Only repeat the loading phase if you discontinue use for more than 28 days.

Written by Justin Frank.

References:

1. Harris RC, Soderlund K, Hultman E: Elevation of creatine in resting and exercised muscle of normal subjects by creatine supplementation. Clin Sci (Colch) 1992;83(3):367-374

2.Casey A, Constantin-Teodosiu D, Howell S, et al: Creatine ingestion favorably affects performance and muscle metabolism during maximal exercise in humans. Am J Physiol 1996;271(1 pt 1):E31-E37

3.Hultman E, Soderlund K, Timmons JA, et al: Muscle creatine loading in men. J Appl Physiol 1996;81(1):232-237

4.Vandenberghe K, Goris M, Van Hecke P, et al: Long-term creatine intake is beneficial to muscle performance during resistance training. J Appl Physiol 1997;83(6):2055-2063

5.Vandenberghe K, Van Hecke P, Van Leemputte M, et al: Phosphocreatine resynthesis is not affected by creatine loading. Med Sci Sports Exerc 1999;31(2):236-242

6.Juhn MS, O'Kane JW, Vinci DM: Oral creatine supplementation in male collegiate athletes: a survey of dosing habits and side effects. J Am Diet Assoc 1999;99(5):593-595

7.Green AL, Hultman E, Macdonald IA, et al: Carbohydrate ingestion augments skeletal muscle creatine accumulation during creatine supplementation in humans. Am J Physiol 1996;271(5 pt 1):E821-E826

8.Febbraio MA, Flanagan TR, Snow RJ, et al: Effect of creatine supplementation on intramuscular TCr, metabolism and performance during intermittent, supramaximal exercise in humans. Acta Physiol Scand 1995;155(4):387-395


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