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View Full Version : How this look for a Ketogenic Diet?



Mademan118
06-07-2004, 06:52 PM
Meal 1:
3 eggs 3 strips bacon 2 capsules flax seed oil

Meal 2:
6 Slices Lunch Meat, What else?

Meal 3:
My Pwo Shake: Opticen
313 cals
52g's protien
25gs carbs
1.7gs fat

Meal 4:
Salad with 2 tins tuna, ranch dressing.

Meal 5:
6 ounces Chicken, Green beens or Corn

Meal 6:
Same as 5, still 2 capsules of flax.

Meal 7:
3 eggs with 1 cup cheese.

Augury
06-07-2004, 07:03 PM
It looks very....ketogenic. Taking multivits i hope. Whats the total calories looking like compared to your maintenance level?

Mademan118
06-07-2004, 07:25 PM
I have my multi's. I think my maintence level is somewhere around 2100 cals, maybe a 2000. I gain weight really easy. im nto sure what the total outcome is yet i have yet to plug it into fitday. Im busy studyin for exams and my quick 1-2 minute breaks are for this and changin laundry haha. But any more comments please im going to start this diet TOMORROW hopefully!

TheGimp
06-08-2004, 02:21 AM
Might also want a pre workout shake with some carbs to give you energy for your workout.

I'd use fish oil rather than flax due to the inefficiency in converting from ALA/LA to DHA/EPA.

I think some other veggies than green beans or corn would be a better option. Broccoli would be great as it's a decent source of protein.

Minotaur
06-08-2004, 07:21 AM
Lose the corn. Too starchy and high in carbs.

Mademan118
06-08-2004, 11:55 AM
okay so green beans, and then on meal 6 1 cup broccoli

ace dogg
06-08-2004, 02:01 PM
Lower protein, add fat. Should be 30% protein, 70% fat. And where is your fiber?

TheGimp
06-08-2004, 02:19 PM
Lower protein, add fat. Should be 30% protein, 70% fat.

Why is this? Protein will keep you more sated.

ace dogg
06-08-2004, 05:32 PM
Because of protein's conversion to glucose. It's the most basic aspect of the ketogenic diet. Protein = 58% glucogenic...kicik you right outta ketosis. Fat = 0% glucogenic.

Fat keeps most people more satiated anyway.

Mademan118
06-08-2004, 08:55 PM
well help me out here. What should i add, this is my first ketogenic diet and i need some help here.

TheGimp
06-09-2004, 12:04 AM
As an example, cut out one of the tins of tuna and use full fat mayo on the other?

What are your current macro breakdowns?

TheGimp
06-09-2004, 05:10 AM
Because of protein's conversion to glucose. It's the most basic aspect of the ketogenic diet. Protein = 58% glucogenic...kicik you right outta ketosis. Fat = 0% glucogenic.

Fat keeps most people more satiated anyway.

Interesting, thanks for enlightening me.

As far as fat keeping people satisfied, BBC's Horizons programme on the Atkins diet concluded that it was possible ketosis had nothing to do with its success, but rather the higher than normal protein content which kept people fuller and made it easier for them to eat less calories.

Quoting from the transcript (http://www.bbc.co.uk/print/science/horizon/2004/atkinstrans.shtml):


NARRATOR: This may be the secret to the Atkins diet. It works by controlling appetite. But what is it about the diet that kills hunger? Dr Atkins believed that it was due to cutting carbohydrates, but as yet evidence for this theory is so far inconclusive. There may be another reason. The Atkins diet is famous for its fat. Dr Atkins said you could eat as much of it as you like. Is it possible that fat could be suppressing appetite? To find out Susan Jebb and her team decided to run an experiment. All the meals in the study looked exactly the same, but there was a big difference. Half the food had liberal quantities of fat secretly added to it.

Dr SUSAN JEBB: We used things like spaghetti bolognaise or mousses so that you could because easily disguise the fat content of the food.

NARRATOR: None of the volunteers knew which type of food they were getting. But half of them were eating low fat meals, and half were eating high fat meals.

Dr SUSAN JEBB: What we told them is they could eat as much or as little as they wanted and they simply just had to ask when they wanted more food.

NARRATOR: If fat was the magic ingredient that switches appetite off, then the men eating the high fat food would fewer calories than normal to feel full. After four hundred and eighty six meals the results were clear. The fat was having the exact opposite effect. The men on the high fat food needed more calories to satisfy their appetite. They were actually overeating.

Dr SUSAN JEBB: What we conclude from that is that fat doesn’t make people feel full. It doesn’t trigger the sense of fullness and satiety that we believe is fundamental to appetite control.


NARRATOR: Professor Astrup was running a study to discover the secret of appetite control. To do this he chose sixty shoppers and split them in to two groups. One group shopped for high carbohydrate food, the other group shopped for food high in protein, similar to the Atkins diet but low in fat.

Prof ARNE ASTRUP: One group should eat a lot of, of lean meat from shell fish, fish, poultry and lean meat, and dairy products. And the other group should eat a lot of bread, pasta, rice, fruit and vegetables.

NARRATOR: Both groups were told they could eat as much as they wanted. They should eat to satisfy their appetite just as Dr Atkins advised on his diet. The study ran for a whole year and the results were spectacular.

Prof ARNE ASTRUP: One of the groups was losing much more than the other group. I say it was four or five kilo more.

NARRATOR: When they looked more closely it was clear which group had lost so much weight. it was the group eating a diet high in protein. And the shopping lists revealed why.

Prof ARNE ASTRUP: We could see from the data that the reason why the high protein group had lost more weight was because they had actually consumed fewer calories throughout the study, despite the fact that they had just as the same free access to all the foods they really want to, to eat.

NARRATOR: At last the mystery of how the Atkins diet works may have been solved. It might have nothing to do with calories being lost. Probably nothing to do with ketosis. And apparently nothing to do with burning more calories. Neither does it seem to be due to gorging on fats. The secret to the diets success may be down to something completely different. Protein makes you feel full. Increasing the amount of protein in the diet may control appetite and make people eat less than they would normally. If this research goes on to be confirmed it will be a major advance for science.

Would you be more satisfied by a teaspoon of olive oil or a 30g casein shake?

prof
06-09-2004, 06:42 AM
shake for me

Mademan118
06-09-2004, 10:18 PM
Meal 1:
3 eggs 3 strips bacon 2 capsules flax seed oil

Meal 2:
6 Slices Lunch Meat, What else? Ineed a high fat food here !!!!

Meal 3:
My Pwo Shake: Opticen
313 cals
52g's protien
25gs carbs
1.7gs fat

Meal 4:
Salad with 1 tins tuna cheese on tuna, ranch dressing.

Meal 5:
6 ounces Chicken, Green beens

Meal 6:
Same as 5 but brocoli, still 2 capsules of flax.

Meal 7:
3 eggs with 1 cup cheese.
Total macro w/o PWO:
Cals: 1900
Fat: 126
Carbs: 14
Protien: 165
I need to drop protien and raise fat. What do i need to cut out and add to my diet?

TheGimp
06-10-2004, 02:46 AM
Reduce the chicken in meal 5 and drizzle some olive oil over the rest?

Use some imagination :)

ace dogg
06-10-2004, 11:13 AM
Dude enjoy keto. How about:

meal 1 - 6 whole eggs

meal 2 - hot dogs, bacon

meal 3 - cheese burger (no bun, obviously)

meal 4 - hot dogs, bacon

meal 5 - chicken and oil

Take your vitamins and fiber.

AllUp
06-10-2004, 01:51 PM
NattyPB aint too bad either, If you're having trouble hitting your caloric req's.

If not try eatin extra mayo or oliveoil.

ace dogg
06-10-2004, 02:05 PM
Also I wouldn't worry about a meal plan at all. Just make sure each meal is ketogenic. The amount of meals doesn't matter either, or the timing of them. All that crap comes in cuz of carbs...and even then, it's still not really important.

Mademan118
06-10-2004, 07:51 PM
so basically i dont need a real specific diet? just eat no carb **** and good fats and i should be fine?

ace dogg
06-10-2004, 08:30 PM
Pretty much. You do have to get a reasonable amount of calories, but the nature of the diet itself does a good job at doing that for you. My advice is to have a basic idea of what you should be eating, which you already have, and just use it as a guideline. The more important matter is the carb load. You doing a TKD or a CKD?

iLUDEd
06-11-2004, 11:02 AM
wont the shake kick him out of keto?

ace dogg
06-11-2004, 02:15 PM
Actually yeah, that answered my own question...You want to kick yourself outta ketosis on a TKD before/after workouts.

raniali
06-11-2004, 02:17 PM
most shakes have maybe 2-5g of carbs - unless it is an MRP (which shouldn't be taken on a CKD at all unless it is carb-up time).
personally i would add mayo or cheese to the lunchmeat slices since it is like eating a saltlick to me with all the sodium. eggs are a great source of food on a keto. you can even add the yolks. make an omelet with cheese and ham as well. mmmmmm.

personally, i think overall, your EFAs are low. and FIBER is an absolute necessity on a prolonged CKD. you will thank me for that later.

mercury
06-12-2004, 12:22 PM
well help me out here. What should i add, this is my first ketogenic diet and i need some help here.

You will want to take Psyllium Husks, because you are going to want to keep things moving along.

Mademan118
06-12-2004, 01:35 PM
okay i cant stand this i need a set diet. hah so here it goes im going to take a Stab at making a diet. Basically i need help filling in the one more item spots.

Meal 1:
3 Eggs, 3 Slices Cheese, 3 Slices Bacon?

Meal 2:
5 Slices Lunch Meat cooked in 1 tsp Olive Oil, one more item

Meal 3:
Salad with chicken on it, 2 servings Ranch Dressing

Meal 4:
Tuna Melt: 2 tins Tuna, Then cover tuna completely with cheese, (usually about 4-5 slices)

meal 5: Chicken + Green Veggies Edit: Both cooked in olive oil.

Meal 6:
3 Eggs, 3 slices Cheese.

6 Flax Seed Oil Caps Taken Daily. ALso for the Meal 3: lets say im at work, can a Mcdonalds Salad be fine?

Mademan118
06-12-2004, 10:40 PM
bump

ace dogg
06-13-2004, 10:53 AM
Throw some fat in meal 5. Looks fine. Now stick to it.

raniali
06-13-2004, 10:54 AM
looks fine - curious to know total fat, protein and calories though.
and don't forget the FIBER.

Y2A
06-13-2004, 12:21 PM
FIBER is an absolute necessity on a prolonged CKD. you will thank me for that later.


Your :moon: will thank her too.

AllUp
06-14-2004, 11:06 AM
Looks good. Maybe add nuts of some sort into that one unfilled slot for meal2? , decent source of fat. Or maybe a burger patty (no bun).

-The Omellette King

Mademan118
06-14-2004, 07:35 PM
sweet! cant wait to start!

Mannequin
09-16-2004, 09:27 AM
Things are a little murky for me on carb ups. It starts right after your depletion workout on friday right? But what do you eat before the workout? still fats? Same question for Sunday. What do you eat after 5pm? I thought one of the points of this was to keep carbs/fat separate.

Mannequin
09-23-2004, 09:22 AM
Any help on this?

raniali
09-23-2004, 05:35 PM
fats should be minimized, not entirely depleted, during the carb-up period. you may want to experiment with consuming a small portion of carbs before the depletion workout ... as this would be normal in a TKD approach.

Mannequin
09-23-2004, 08:13 PM
I need to know what to eat on fridays
Do I treat the day as a carb up as soon as i finish the depletion workout or do i treat it as a normal keto day????? I need to know because it affects my whole day tomorrow

raniali
09-24-2004, 10:59 AM
your carb up begins IMMEDIATELY after depletion w/o.
before, you eat keto style.

AllUp
09-24-2004, 02:21 PM
Do I treat the day as a carb up as soon as i finish the depletion workout or do i treat it as a normal keto day?????
As soon as you finish the WO. SOON soon, as in the leaving the gym to start gorging on the carbs you have waiting in your car kind of soon(if that's your thing). :)

In my case I have a dex shake waiting for me with a bag of smarties and/or candy jewelry before I consume my overly large overkill breakfast when I get home. :)

AllUp
09-24-2004, 02:27 PM
Also ensure proper water intake, as it's key during carb-ups. :)

KiwiBuilder
10-15-2004, 10:38 PM
As far as fat keeping people satisfied, BBC's Horizons programme on the Atkins diet concluded that it was possible ketosis had nothing to do with its success, but rather the higher than normal protein content which kept people fuller and made it easier for them to eat less calories.

Interesting - I wonder what the Keto sticks used to measure the Ketone levels in one's urine is REALLY measuring then?