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Matt-itude
07-06-2004, 07:21 AM
Okay this probably sounds n00b, but i understand that to put on *mass* you need to intake more calories then you burn.

Now if you want to build muscle, which in the end is increasing mass, and for example you just eat at mantenance, do you not gain any muscle? Or if you eat over mantenance how can you be sure that the mass you gain isn't goin to be just fat.

Also, if im bulking but want to burn fat, can i find a way to optimize both, by say for example, on 3 mornings a week b4 i eat breakfast do some steady state cardio work, and then eat breakfast straight after, and then keeping a high protein count and doin weights?

Or does ur body get into a mode of fat burning and can't really turn into a mode of muscle building in a timeframe quick enough to be benificial

Aspect
07-06-2004, 08:53 AM
Okay this probably sounds n00b, but i understand that to put on *mass* you need to intake more calories then you burn.

Now if you want to build muscle, which in the end is increasing mass, and for example you just eat at mantenance, do you not gain any muscle? Or if you eat over mantenance how can you be sure that the mass you gain isn't goin to be just fat.

If you're relatively new to weights, and have a fair amount of fat to lose, or if you're returning from a long break from training, then it's possible to gain muscle and lose fat at the same time (thus not putting on mass overall). However, once you pass the "beginner stage" it becomes very difficult to do this. Generally speaking, you need to eat above maintenance to put on muscle.

As you rightly point out, you want your gains to be muscle rather than fat. To do this, you're best off eating only a little over your maintenance - e.g. 300-500 calories per day above maintenance. Figure out what your maintenance calories are, then experiment with eating different amounts to get the best ratio of muscle to fat you can. For example, say your maintenance is 3000 cals per day. Try eating 3300 per day for a few weeks, and note how much weight you gain and how much fat you gain. Then try 3500 or 3600 for a few weeks. Did you gain lean mass at a faster rate? Did you put on a lot of extra fat? Experiment in a controlled manner, and find how many calories you need to gain muscle while keeping fat gain in check.

Also bear in mind that your maintenance level will gradually increase as you gain lean mass, so you will need to adjust your intake over time.

Of course, you also need to combine this with genuine hard training. Eating excess calories will provide the fuel for muscle gian, but you need to encourage your body to actually use that fuel for the intended purpose.



Also, if im bulking but want to burn fat, can i find a way to optimize both, by say for example, on 3 mornings a week b4 i eat breakfast do some steady state cardio work, and then eat breakfast straight after, and then keeping a high protein count and doin weights?

Or does ur body get into a mode of fat burning and can't really turn into a mode of muscle building in a timeframe quick enough to be benificial

Once again, when you're past the "beginner phase" it's difficult to burn fat while gaining muscle. Most people cycle the two objectives. I personally believe you're best to aim for slow, steady weight-gain while minimising fat loss, and maintain that for a while. When you feel you've put on too much fat, have a slow "cut" while minimising muscle loss. When you do this is down to you - some people aim to "cut" to 10% or so, then gain weight until they reach maybe 15% before cutting back down again. Don't go to extremes (e.g. don't try to gain 3lbs per week or lose a stone in a month); if you can gain even half a pound of muscle a week, you may be able to keep gaining for months and months without getting too fat.

There are other options, other diets etc. that cycle food intakes and all sorts. If you're interested, read up on UD2 for this - I've not tried it so can't comment, but it seems to be popular on these forums. But the basic method can work wonders as long as you have the patience to let it work.

galileo
07-06-2004, 09:55 AM
Working out is the first step in helping to assist weight gain to become muscle instead of fat. There will always be a percentage go to each, but by eating cleaner foods and not overestimating how many calories you need, you can end up turning the ratio in your favor.

Recomposition is possible, as previously stated, but not really something someone new to dietary manipulation and advanced training techniques should pursue.

AllUp
07-06-2004, 09:58 AM
I'd suggest UD2 as well. I have had good results with it and it has bundled routines you can try depending on your goal (fatloss, maintenence, gains). It is mainly a tweaked-out Keto diet however, so if you don't like counting carbs then it may not be for you.

UD2 was worth every penny IMHO. Lyle goes in-depth to cover the science and mechanics of the diet, worthwhile read. :)

If your new I'd eat a bit over maintenence to take advantage of newbie gains, and then progress to a gradual cutting phase. Its easier to accomplish one goal at a time generally, but doing both at the same time is possible with patience and counting the cals, assuming your eating clean.

Matt-itude
07-06-2004, 11:43 PM
im not really new, ive been weight training for a year, and then in my last bulk i just put on way too much fat. ive gone from about 20% to prolly below 15% but im looking to make about 8-9% while not being just plain skinny.

right now im 75kg and 5 foot 10 and its the middle of winter here, so should i bulk now, and then cut up closer to summer, or cut now down to below 10% and then bulk up closer to summer?