First cycle for a non-noob to lifting

[Hedzilla]

Well, heres the low down. Ill make this short. Ive been lifting for a while now, approx 3 years. I know what im doing, i know what works for me, and i know how to gain. I lift absolutely balls-to-the-wall during summers, when i have the time. The summer that just passed, i put on 7lbs of muscle, and upped my bench press by 90 lbs (thats right, 90lbs), by lifting religiously, giving plenty of rest time for my parts, and eating like a feind. That worked great. I looked good, felt strong as hell, and was at my peak. School started again, and i lost some interest, and actually had a 3 week period where i did nothing :(

Heres what I was at during the end of august:
163lbs, 6'1" tall
Chest: 43"
Arms: 15"
Waist (around belly button): 29.5
Legs: too small lol (13.5 calf, 21" leg)
Max bench was 275lbs for one solid rep

I am smaller now, i know that much. Im prolly at a 40 or 41" chest, 14" arms, and about the same waist and legs.

Anyway, i know people who have done cycles, im good friends with them, and i can get basically anything i want. Ive been lookin over some sample cycles, talked to people and gotten some good ones, but im serious about it now, im doing one. I need to get a decent first and second one together before i go any farther.

Do any of you have any good ones to look at for cycle 1 and 2, so i can compare them with the ones i had planned?

[Jasonl]

I'd just do a 10-12 week cycle of test E at 500mg/week injecting 250mg 2x a week. But I know I'm not going to be the last to say this: 6'1" and 163lbs you probably don't need a cycle yet, wait until you put on some more pounds.

[ryuage]

I'd just do a 10-12 week cycle of test E at 500mg/week injecting 250mg 2x a week. But I know I'm not going to be the last to say this: 6'1" and 163lbs you probably don't need a cycle yet, wait until you put on some more pounds.

tuttut

[Hedzilla]

Yea, i know that at 163lbs, people wouldnt highly reccomend doing one yet, but ill say this: Im advanced enough that i do know what im doing, and most of my mass is in my upper body (look at my stats, i have some smallass legs). If my legs were in proportion, id be at like 180lbs. I hope the cycle helps me with this.

The test E, doin 2x a week, will that be a fairly big difference that i will notice in my gains? Thats not too much to inject, so what about post-cycle recovery stuff, like Nolvadex or Clomid, anything like that needed?

[HahnB]

If you've only gained 7lbs since you began training and eating correctly then continue doing that. I put on 40lbs before my first cycle and most people would say I started too early. If you're losing interest off and on then chances are when you come off your cycle you're going to lose interest again and lose everything you gained. If you must then use test by itself-which is what most people will recommend.

[Hedzilla]

I gained 7lbs when i bulked. Ive gained about 30 since starting training.

Would test-E be enough though? Am i going to see a big enough difference from the test-E and bulking together than just the regular test-E? And not just a difference in quick mass, how about keeping the gains? Test E you normally dont keep all that much of what you blow up with.

I HAD been looking at sust and deca, but i really didnt want to take both combined for a first cycle, possible just sust or just deca....

[ryuage]

well, ultimately the choice is going to be yours.... but ya you probably would notice a big difference.

[bill]

wt gainer ( @ 6'1") you could gain lots before this. Good luck if you do it.

[Hedzilla]

Yea, i always knew that test e was a good starter cycle, but i may mix it with dbol for 4 or 5 weeks or something like that. i still got time to figure it out.

thanks guys, ill post before and after results.

[Jasonl]

Dbol is a pretty good way to front load test E. 30mg ED for 4 weeks should be plenty. Clomid and nolva would be good PCT, I'm sure you'd be able to find a lot of info on PCT for a cycle like that via search.

[Shark]

163 pounds and you're worried about adding dbol to your first cycle. Come on man, let's get serious here. At 6'1" you need to gain at least 20-30 pounds before you can seriously consider doing a cycle. What you don't realize is that it seems like a good idea now but after this first cycle you will never be able to put on natural mass at the rate that you can now. You would really be doing yourself a favor to gain a bunch more natural weight before starting in with aas.

Another thing that tells me that you're not ready for AAS are your leg stats. Working your legs will put mass on your body quickly. Give it some thought.

[ryuage]

just run a test only cycle... this way you can get a feel for how each substance effects you

[Shao-LiN]

Yea, i know that at 163lbs, people wouldnt highly reccomend doing one yet, but ill say this: Im advanced enough that i do know what im doing, and most of my mass is in my upper body (look at my stats, i have some smallass legs). If my legs were in proportion, id be at like 180lbs. I hope the cycle helps me with this.

The test E, doin 2x a week, will that be a fairly big difference that i will notice in my gains? Thats not too much to inject, so what about post-cycle recovery stuff, like Nolvadex or Clomid, anything like that needed?

Don't need a cycle to help small ass legs. You need to train them.

[chris6969]

Get back to where you were at your best then do a cycle. So you're actually using the juice to push to new heights. Is your max still 275x1? If not get back to that then start.

Just do test 1st cycle, at your weight you could probably do 400mg/week for 10 weeks, and then take Clomid afterwards 50mg/day for 3 weeks. You should have some nolvadex or arimidex handy in case you start getting gyno symptoms. I like Arimidex personally, I just take 1 pill like every other day to minimize the amount of estrogen I get, but I've never had gyno problems either. More of just a waterbloat minimizer.

Dont do D-bols your first cycle, save it for like your 3rd cycle. You'll put enough stress on your heart with the added BP, waterbloat, and weight just from test alone.
1st cycle 400mg test/week 10 weeks
2nd cycle 500mg/week 10-12 weeks
3rd cycle 500mg/week + Dbol 10-12 weeks

[bill]

If your not training well enough to get over 160 @ 6'1"

[basil]

If you've only gained 7lbs since you began training and eating correctly then continue doing that. I put on 40lbs before my first cycle and most people would say I started too early. If you're losing interest off and on then chances are when you come off your cycle you're going to lose interest again and lose everything you gained. If you must then use test by itself-which is what most people will recommend.

:withstupi

I only put on 20 pounds before my first, but I lost 10%bf and put in damn near 6 years hardcore training. If you've lost interest, then doing a cycle won't help you get it back. You certainly shouldn't hit gear until you know you can devote all the time it requires in the gym and at the dinner table.

[chris6969]

:withstupi

I only put on 20 pounds before my first, but I lost 10%bf and put in damn near 6 years hardcore training. If you've lost interest, then doing a cycle won't help you get it back. You certainly shouldn't hit gear until you know you can devote all the time it requires in the gym and at the dinner table.

And doing a cycle will actually demotivate most people in the long run. B/c they make great gains when they're on.... then they come off and get disappointed with normal natural progress. (plus the PCT period of slight decline) You get spoiled by the progress that you can make on juice, so you're less motivated to work out naturally.

IE: if you're not motivated now, the juice will only temporarily motivate you, then unmotivate you in the long run.

[BigMatt]

6.1 163? Were you come from? south africa?

[chris6969]

6.1 163? Were you come from? south africa?

I think you mean... more northern Africa, like Ethiopia... j/k lol :)

[Hatred]

I love these threads.

"Gain more weight before you cycle"


Why?

Humor me.

[Hedzilla]

^^^^That what im wonderin too

A lot of you guys are sayin that i shouldnt do a cycle because my legs are small, thats what it breaks down to. I worked my legs somewhat, but never hardcore like i worked my upper body. Im back in my lifting cycle now, im 100% motivated, and im eating right and lifting right. I personally know someone who went from 145lbs to 250lbs in 3 years, and went from benching 120 to 430 in that time usin tons of crap.

Thats why im basically re-doing my homework.

Thanks for the info, im doin it either way, but now its just a matter of me lookin to use just test e for the first or stack it with something else like dbol. thanks guys.

[ryuage]

general consensus would say to do test only for a first cycle, if you stack the two and have an adverse reaction... how would you know which if the dbol or the test caused it.. I would say a test only cycle for your first then if all goes well you can add stuff in your next cycle and so on and so forth.

[Spiderman]

^^^^That what im wonderin too

A lot of you guys are sayin that i shouldnt do a cycle because my legs are small, thats what it breaks down to. I worked my legs somewhat, but never hardcore like i worked my upper body. Im back in my lifting cycle now, im 100% motivated, and im eating right and lifting right. I personally know someone who went from 145lbs to 250lbs in 3 years, and went from benching 120 to 430 in that time usin tons of crap.

Thats why im basically re-doing my homework.

Thanks for the info, im doin it either way, but now its just a matter of me lookin to use just test e for the first or stack it with something else like dbol. thanks guys.

First mistake is basing your potential gains on what happened to your friend. Remember, everyone is different bro. With that being said, I suggest doing a test only cycle of 500mg/wk for 10 weeks and by all means start training your legs. You should train your WHOLE body, no exceptions. If your legs are lagging start doin 2x a week if you can handle it to bring them up.

[Hedzilla]

Seems like most of you guy think that the test e cycle alone will be enough. So thats probably what ill go with. Do i need any nolva or clomid at all with just a cycle of say 500mg of test 2 per week doin 250mg 2x per week?

I am workin out on a 6 day cycle right now, 3 day split. chest back shoulders m and thursday, arms on tu and friday, and legs wed and sat. sunday is rest. that seems to work great for me.

and as for my friends gains, i dont expect that, i was just using that as an example. he took hgh too, which im not about to do.

thanks agian

[Spiderman]

You should have nolvadex in case you get any signs of gyno. Its unlikely you will, but just to be safe. You'll need clomid as well for your post cycle therapy (30 50mg tabs of clomid will be good).Then you'll be set.

[POPS]

I don't think you listening. Has not a fxcking thing to do with your legs. There telling you to put on some weight. If you can't read then don't use gear.

If you decide to learn how to read then follow chris6969 advice and you'll end up a happy camper!

[Hedzilla]

spiderman, 50mg (1 tab) per day for PCT decent enough?

[ryuage]

you could run 2 tabs a day for the first week then the following 2 weeks 1 tab/day

[chris6969]

Working out your legs will stimulate your natural HGH production, b/c they're such big muscle groups. Keeps your body in growth mode... in between upperbody work out days.

[Hedzilla]

Working out your legs will stimulate your natural HGH production, b/c they're such big muscle groups. Keeps your body in growth mode... in between upperbody work out days.


yea, someone else told me that and i noticed that when i did work my legs over the summer, the rest of my body grew faster also. i plan on working everything hardcore during the cycle, cause i might as well not let it go to waste ;)

i have my whole routine worked out right now, for the cycle, so i think im good to go.

[ryuage]

you should be working your whole body cycle or not :)

[MarioCisneros]

Well, I'm not a pro in the anabolics subject, but in my personal opinion u still have a lot more of natural growth at ur stats... Look at my stats....

[Hedzilla]

Well, I'm not a pro in the anabolics subject, but in my personal opinion u still have a lot more of natural growth at ur stats... Look at my stats....

my chest is an inch smaller than yours, my arms are an inch bigger, and i weigh 7lbs less. i dont see how i have a lot more growth available, but whatever.

ryuage, yea :(, im workin the whole body now, like i did summer time, im hittin my legs especially hard now

[MarioCisneros]

my chest is an inch smaller than yours, my arms are an inch bigger, and i weigh 7lbs less. i dont see how i have a lot more growth available, but whatever.

ryuage, yea :(, im workin the whole body now, like i did summer time, im hittin my legs especially hard now

Well, look at my heigth... almost 5'6" hehe

[chris6969]

Mario I read your journal... and I think you're smoking crack.

[MarioCisneros]

Mario I read your journal... and I think you're smoking crack.

Hey chris, I answered ur post at my journal man, If u wanna check it

[Hedzilla]

Well, look at my heigth... almost 5'6" hehe


yea, exactly, for me to be 6'1" and have very close stats is good

[basil]

I love these threads.

"Gain more weight before you cycle"


Why?

Humor me.


We're not saying gain more weight. We're saying get your motivation on track and your priorities in order. Gear should never be used to increase one's motivation, because like chriss6969 said, you're only getting motivated by "artificial" gains, which wears off when your supply is dry.

If lifting isn't a priority, then juice isn't for you. Period.

If you can't devote all the time it takes to lift hard and diet properly, then juice isn't for you. Period.

If you haven't gone as far as you can go naturally, then juice isn't for you. Period.

[Hedzilla]

i think you guys got the wrong idea from my 3-4 week stint of not lifting. i had to get my schedule right with school, and i had a lot of **** goin on at that time. i kicked myself every day because i couldnt get to the gym.

so ill put it this way:
Lifting right now is my #1 priority
I have the time and the food for it
I am at a plateau with what my body can handle as far as muscle, but im striving to get farther.

im 90% sure i know exactly the juice route i want, and 100% sure i want to use the gear, so now im just wrapping up loose ends with the whole thing. im the kind of person that researches EVERYTHING before i do it, and thats what im finishing now.

[Shark]

You're a moron. That's all there is to it. You come onto an anabolic forum and ask for advice. You don't like what you hear, so you get defensive and try and bull**** your way out of the fact that you OBVIOUSLY have not reached anything near your natural potential and you want to shortcut that by going on gear. It's so ignorant it makes me sick.

WHY DID YOU ASK FOR ADVICE?????
You don't care what other people think, you're closed minded and have no idea of that type of dedication that goes into taking advantage of gear. For gods sake, you're 6'1" and you weigh 160 pounds. It'c crazy. I feel like i'm taking crazy pills! i'm 6'3" and weigh in at ~230 and I don't think i'm near close enough to my genetic potential to be thinking about a cycle.

Again, I ask, why did you ask for advice? You're mind was made up before you came here.

Mods: Feel free to edit me if you have to but this is totally garbage.

[chris6969]

lol, well, there's no way you're near your natural potential at 160lbs... at any height.... (well, unless you're a midget and like 4'6")

Do the juice if you must, it will change your physique, though it may demotivate you in the long run, like I said... if you're having problems now. I havent gone more than 6 days with out weightlifting in over 5-6 years. (absolute minimum 1 day/week) Even when I was on vacation, I used the gym at the hotel. I couldnt fathom missing 3-4 weeks.

Though I would wait until you demonstrate a real dedication.... like 1 year.... 4 days/week EVERY week. Eat more... more... more protein. Then do it.... set it in stone... if I work out 200 times in the next year... roughly 4x week x 52 weeks... I will hit a cycle... test 500mg/week 10-12 weeks.... with PCT afterwards.. Thats a plan.

[Hedzilla]

You're a moron. That's all there is to it. You come onto an anabolic forum and ask for advice. You don't like what you hear, so you get defensive and try and bull**** your way out of the fact that you OBVIOUSLY have not reached anything near your natural potential and you want to shortcut that by going on gear. It's so ignorant it makes me sick.

WHY DID YOU ASK FOR ADVICE?????
You don't care what other people think, you're closed minded and have no idea of that type of dedication that goes into taking advantage of gear. For gods sake, you're 6'1" and you weigh 160 pounds. It'c crazy. I feel like i'm taking crazy pills! i'm 6'3" and weigh in at ~230 and I don't think i'm near close enough to my genetic potential to be thinking about a cycle.

Again, I ask, why did you ask for advice? You're mind was made up before you came here.

Mods: Feel free to edit me if you have to but this is totally garbage.


Chris russow, you in fact are possibly the moron here. Know anything about the three body types? Do you realize the training potential for each one, and how incredible hard it is for an ectomorph to put on mass? I have no clue why you are focused on my mass as the main thing for a cycle.

Do i know the dedication it takes to put into a cycle? Yes, as a matter of fact i do.

Did i come to this forum for advice? Yes, i did, but not advice on whether or not to do a cycle, i had made up my mind on that before! I came on advice for a sample cycle to see if it was similar to what i had planned out.

I have already decided on the cycle im going to do, gotten the price, and talked to my contact for the stuff. i already have the PCT and the anti-e stuff setup. I have my workout set and tons of suppliments, and know my doses im taking.

Think what you want, when i start ill post my begining measurments and my progress and finally my end results.

[Shark]

Know anything about the three body types? Do you realize the training potential for each one, and how incredible hard it is for an ectomorph to put on mass?

I live with an ectomorph who eats like a horse and is making really good gains.


I have no clue why you are focused on my mass as the main thing for a cycle.

Please tell me then what you're taking the cycle for? I'm sure we would all love to know.


Do i know the dedication it takes to put into a cycle? Yes, as a matter of fact i do.

Really? Did your massive 160 pound frame and underdeveloped legs teach you that? Dedication is an ectomorph that goes from 135-200 on food and hard work. Shats, deads, core exercises, that takes dedication. Being a bench and curl jokey, eh, not so much. I should really just keep my mouth shut though, as you know so much more than me.


Think what you want, when i start ill post my begining measurments and my progress and finally my end results.

I'm sure if you do everything correctly you will have great gains from this cycle. But dude, you're missing the point! You're what, 20 years old? A 20 year old guy at 6'1" 160 has no business using. Period. You may think I’m just being a jerk now but you just don't understand what's involved here. You might think you do. But you don't. You love to work out right now right? After you do this cycle your perspective on lifting off cycle will be totally different. You're going to miss the awesome gains you made on cycle. You're going to miss the awesome pumps you had on cycle. Frankly, you're not going to want to be off cycle because as an ectomorph it’s going to be awesome for you. You'll probably gain weight at the rate that I gain it off cycle which for you will be phenomenal.

All that being said, you're going to come off cycle and then you're going to crash. 90% of my friends who used in college had the same experience. They were stellar when on and then finals came, or they had drama with females or they drank to much ,whatever. Stupid **** happened that distracted them from what they were doing. They crashed, lost most of their gains, got fat, and became unhappy.

If you're really making the decision to use you have to be 130% committed. I'm serious; you have the opportunity to really mess some **** up here if you go about this the wrong way. I and many others here have just seen a lot of people like you roll through these forums posting in a similar fashion and having bad experiences. Keep in mind, you came here and asked for advice. You got advice. It’s not always what you want to here, but there are knowledgeable people here who you should really listen and learn from.

At least take some time and do some more research before you jump into this.

-Chris

[benfsu03]

i read every response and now heres mine:

i just decided to take a cycle- Test and Deca for 8 wks

been training for 2 years....6"2 and 195lbs
arms-16.1 and 16.3
chest-47"
claves-17"
neck-17"
waist-32/33"

i just considered myself ready for gear, but i still have doubts- u arent ready to juice

[Hedzilla]

Chris Russow, i now see exactly what your saying, and i must say, that was very well put. I can see that stuff comes up to not totally dedicate you 100% to lifting, and i know the stuff that goes with college. I am willing to give up plenty for this: Drinking, fraternity activities, working on my car (working on cars is actually a huge passion of mine, and yes, believe it or not, im actually willing to give it up, both spending money on my car and working on it) just for lifting.

What you said it totally true, and really shows the risks of using them at my age.

BUT, i know too many people who use them now and have used them, and i have seen the results and know exactly what they went through. And i am ready for it. Last year i almost took them, but decided not too because i had to concentrate on school work more. This year is different.

Thanks everyone for your concern, but this is something i feel ready for.
We shall see.
Its one of those things that if i mess up, i have the price to pay, and i have to learn from it.

Thanks for all the info.....im goin through with it.

[BigMatt]

Do what you want, if you wanna take 1 gram test a week , do it.
When you be 6.1 190 lbs and cannot gain no more dont come here crying...
That may be rude but you seem like someone who ask for help and deny it after.

[Hedzilla]

Final time, i wasnt asking for help on the subject of weather to take them or not, i was asking for help in WHAT to take.

Maybe that will clear things up some, maybe not

[Khamel]

God, this thread can't be real. This guy is a joke.

[Khamel]

i read every response and now heres mine:

i just decided to take a cycle- Test and Deca for 8 wks

been training for 2 years....6"2 and 195lbs
arms-16.1 and 16.3
chest-47"
claves-17"
neck-17"
waist-32/33"

i just considered myself ready for gear, but i still have doubts- u arent ready to juice

Up it to 2 more weeks and it'll be better.

[benfsu03]

what diff. will 2 weeks have?

[Khamel]

what diff. will 2 weeks have?

Test E usually kicks in around weeks 4-5. Now only 3-4 weeks past the kick in time.......what does that tell you? 10 week cycles are the minimum on all the other boards (Except this one).

[Shark]

Chris Russow, i now see exactly what your saying, and i must say, that was very well put. I can see that stuff comes up to not totally dedicate you 100% to lifting, and i know the stuff that goes with college. I am willing to give up plenty for this: Drinking, fraternity activities, working on my car (working on cars is actually a huge passion of mine, and yes, believe it or not, im actually willing to give it up, both spending money on my car and working on it) just for lifting.

What you said it totally true, and really shows the risks of using them at my age.

BUT, i know too many people who use them now and have used them, and i have seen the results and know exactly what they went through. And i am ready for it. Last year i almost took them, but decided not too because i had to concentrate on school work more. This year is different.

Thanks everyone for your concern, but this is something i feel ready for.
We shall see.
Its one of those things that if i mess up, i have the price to pay, and i have to learn from it.

Thanks for all the info.....im goin through with it.


I can sometimes come across a bit harsh but i'm glad you got my point. Of course i wish you the best of luck and hope it works out for you. If your mind is made up then its made up.

I assume you're gonna roll test-e for 10 weeks plus ptc? You're not still thinking deca are you?

[chris6969]

what diff. will 2 weeks have?

It will give you a total of 6 weeks good growth vs. 4 weeks of good growth. 25% more time on, but really 50% more of the good growth time.

Your body is just "warming up" the first 3-4 weeks. And your gains kick in to high gear from week 3-4 on. So if you do a 8 week cycle, you only get 4 really good weeks. With a 10 week cycle you get 6 really good weeks. (50% more) - no you won't gain 50% more weight, but you get another 2 GOOD weeks of progress.

With a cycle, you have the "warm up" period (where your body is getting ready to make great gains) and the come down period (where you lose some mass from the drop in test).... you want to maximize the middle period of good gains.

Thats why most people preach 10-12 week cycles. After about 11-12 weeks usually the progress slows down a little, unless you up the dose.

[ryuage]

what if you are using fast acting esters such as prop

[benfsu03]

It will give you a total of 6 weeks good growth vs. 4 weeks of good growth. 25% more time on, but really 50% more of the good growth time.

Your body is just "warming up" the first 3-4 weeks. And your gains kick in to high gear from week 3-4 on. So if you do a 8 week cycle, you only get 4 really good weeks. With a 10 week cycle you get 6 really good weeks. (50% more) - no you won't gain 50% more weight, but you get another 2 GOOD weeks of progress.

With a cycle, you have the "warm up" period (where your body is getting ready to make great gains) and the come down period (where you lose some mass from the drop in test).... you want to maximize the middle period of good gains.

Thats why most people preach 10-12 week cycles. After about 11-12 weeks usually the progress slows down a little, unless you up the dose.

thanks for clearing that up chris, didnt know 2 more weeks would have such an impact on growth...good advice that i will follow

[chris6969]

what if you are using fast acting esters such as prop

Even with faster acting eithers, I'd do a 10 week cycle. They will kick in faster, but still your best gains will be probably weeks 3-9.

The 1st week or 2 your body is filling with nutrients, water, etc... and just gearing up for the growth.

You can't inject and bam grow overnight. It takes time even on steroids for the muscle to grow. So your growth may start a week earlier... like in week2-3, instead of 3-4.

[Hedzilla]

Chris Russow, what im actually doing is 400mg of Test 400 from Generic Labs, in 2 200mg injections per week, for 10 weeks. Ive got nolvadex on hand in case of gyno at all, and Clomid for PCT.

Im not stacking at all, for the first cycle at least. We'll see how it works out and how my body takes it.

Now, the guy who is helpin me out with this, both getting it and showin me the ropes of gear, has never used test alone before. His first cycle was all sust.
Is it better to take test in the leg, butt, or shoulder, or doesnt it matter really?

[ryuage]

he never used test alone before but his first cycle was all sust... uhm...

and it doesnt matter shoot it in your chest/bi/calves wherever the heck you want.

[Jasonl]

Is it better to take test in the leg, butt, or shoulder, or doesnt it matter really?
Check here http://www.spotinjections.com for the procedure.
I'd just inject test into the leg or glute. Don't forget to aspirate.

[HahnB]

Go for the glute and switch from side to side each injection.

[ryuage]

what's the minimum amount of time everyone uses before hitting the same injectino site.

[benfsu03]

alright, im hijacking here...im stackin test/deca...when do i inject the deca? same days as test? also what week should i stop the deca, around 6?

[Severed Ties]

what's the minimum amount of time everyone uses before hitting the same injectino site.


It really depends on what your injecting...

With patients on HRT because the same site will be used for the rest of there life an injection site is only used once every 2 weeks to avoid scar tissue building up over the years.

For the average user once per week is best with any low BA based injectable. However you could inject into a muscle every day for a week or two and not develop scar tissue provided you stopped using the injection site for a mont and were using an oil based solution with low BA.

The higher the BA content the more time you should allow before injecting at the same site. Water based injectables don't dissperse as well as oil and have a different PH than the body which can cause irritation so should be injected less frequently.

ST

[ryuage]

It really depends on what your injecting...

With patients on HRT because the same site will be used for the rest of there life an injection site is only used once every 2 weeks to avoid scar tissue building up over the years.

For the average user once per week is best with any low BA based injectable. However you could inject into a muscle every day for a week or two and not develop scar tissue provided you stopped using the injection site for a mont and were using an oil based solution with low BA.

The higher the BA content the more time you should allow before injecting at the same site. Water based injectables don't dissperse as well as oil and have a different PH than the body which can cause irritation so should be injected less frequently.

ST

thanks :thumbup: good to know.

[Hedzilla]

Jasonl, thanks for the link.

Severed Ties, great post, and how do you find the BA content of say Test 400?

[ryuage]

www.google.com

[Khamel]

Jasonl, thanks for the link.

Severed Ties, great post, and how do you find the BA content of say Test 400?

Hahaha, I already said the BA content was HIGH in Test 400. Expect pain, nothing but pain. Go buy some Enanthate instead.

[Severed Ties]

Jasonl, thanks for the link.

Severed Ties, great post, and how do you find the BA content of say Test 400?

With high mg/ml hear like Test 400 you need either high amounts of BA to keep the testosterone in solution or moderate amounts of BA but the the testosterone re-crystalizes after injection which leads to severe pain at the injection site so expect a great deal of pain and swelling with high dose products.

The brand Test400 from mexico is a very poor product in general.

ST

[Hedzilla]

Appreciate the info, since its the first cycle, and ive only heard rave reviews about the Aburaihan Test-E i can get my hands on, ill do that.

Thanks again.

[chris6969]

Your plan sounds ok at 400mg/week, etc... though I would hold off a little longer... the better your natural base.... the more gains you'll make on the cycle.