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JSully
03-14-2005, 11:55 PM
OK.. so what's the general rule on refeeds?

I was talking to a bud today about his comp (5 days out) and he says he has refeeds every 4 days. I don't need that yet because I'm not 4% bodyfat.

Is there a general "chart" or something for how often to refeed based on bodyfat percentage?

IE: >15% = once every 2 weeks
..12-15% = ??
..08-12% = ??

etc etc etc...

I suppose by the time you break under 10% it would move to every 4 days or so.

My stats: 6'0-225lbs (carb depleted). Loaded I'm about 232.

I train 3 times /week, full body, 4 sets per bodypart, 6-8 reps (except one of the workouts is a glycogen depletion workout so thats 15-20 reps and used only after my carb load day)

My total calorie intake is/will be:
Protein: 280g
Carb: 35g
Fat: 45g
Total cals: 1650

It's really a modified PSMF that I've tailored to fit me better. I believe this will work better for me and won't make me crave quite as much. On my off days I currently do 45 minutes of cardio training, but I'm going to be adding another cardio session in the morning as I switch to this routine.

So, back to my main question, how often should I do my refeed?

And when I say refeed, I mean ~50g fat, ALL clean carbs (beans/oats mainly with a smidgeon of sweetness for my sweet tooth), and the same protein as normal. (not including the protein from the carbs.. ie whatever the protein = from beans will be added on to my protein for the day, so there's a good chance I'll have 500+ g protein in one day.. get it? or is this a no good idea?)

Also, amount of carbs. When fully carb depleted it's best to stick with Lyle McDonalds rule of 7-8g/lb LBM carbs. I doubt I'll hit anywhere close to that. I'll start the refeed IMMEDIATELY after my last workout with a shake containing 150g dextrose. From there I will eat approx 800-1000g carbs in the form of beans/bagels/oats. I don't really see much need for more carbs than that considering I'm going to do a depletion workout that very next day to just kick 'em right back out. I will most likely do cardio on this day as well.

ok... synopsis of questions:

1). How often to refeed based on bodyfat %?
2). How much carbs on a refeed?
3). Should I include the trace protein from the carbs in my daily protein allowance, or just let it be added on to my regular protein intake?

Hmm... I think that's it for now. Thanks in advance.

Vido
03-15-2005, 12:06 AM
My stats: 6'0-225lbs (carb depleted). Loaded I'm about 232.

You sure those stats are accurate? Is the 225 lbs in a non-FULLY depleted state? A 7lb difference doesn't seem like much to me.

Sorry I can't be much help on your questions bro, I gotta admit refeeds aren't one of my strongpoints...hell, you've seen what they look like :D.

The only one I'll comment on is the trace protein issue. From 1000g carbs, you're likely to get a fair amount of trace protein. To count it all towards your daily total might mean you're not getting very much "good" protein. I'd try to shoot for at least 150g of "real" protein, in addition to the trace stuff. I think that would be sufficient.

JSully
03-15-2005, 12:09 AM
You sure those stats are accurate? Is the 225 lbs in a non-FULLY depleted state? A 7lb difference doesn't seem like much to me.

Sorry I can't be much help on your questions bro, I gotta admit refeeds aren't one of my strongpoints...hell, you've seen what they look like :D.

The only one I'll comment on is the trace protein issue. From 1000g carbs, you're likely to get a fair amount of trace protein. To count it all towards your daily total might mean you're not getting very much "good" protein. I'd try to shoot for at least 150g of "real" protein, in addition to the trace stuff. I think that would be sufficient.

Yes 225 is fully depleted, because 232 ISN'T fully loaded. 232 was only after 5 hours of as many carbs as I could stuff in my mouth. Which was probably only about 3000 cals total. FULLY loaded, I'm probably closer to 235-236. Thanks for the input on the protein.

and yes I do know how your refeeds went. Vido = :alcoholic: :D

Anyone else know about refeeds?

ryuage
03-15-2005, 03:44 AM
i think lyle outlines it in his book if not check the psmf sticky on his forums

Manveet
03-15-2005, 09:38 AM
1). How often to refeed based on bodyfat %?
2). How much carbs on a refeed?
3). Should I include the trace protein from the carbs in my daily protein allowance, or just let it be added on to my regular protein intake?

Hmm... I think that's it for now. Thanks in advance.

1) If you are 15% and lower, you should be refeeding 1 time at the end of PSMF (which is a little over a week). Your refeed should last a couple of days, maybe even 3.

If you are 16-25%, you should be doing the 5hr refeeds once a week.

If you are 26%+, you dont need to refeed at all.

2) UD2 suggests something like 7-8g of carbs per lb of lean body mass. This would work perfectly for the 15% and under group. I have no clue about the 5 hour refeed group. My suggestion would be eat as many carbs as you possibly can. After dieting psmf style for an entire week, you will be quite depleted, so I don't see how "over spilling" of carbs into fat can occur on a measly 5hr refeed.

3) Yes, 500g of protein on a refeed is overkill. On my refeeds I may throw in some protein sources here and there, but largely my protein comes from the carbs I eat.

raniali
03-15-2005, 11:45 AM
if you haven't already looked, there is a sticky at the top of this forum on refeeding. a good read.

Vido
03-15-2005, 12:00 PM
1) If you are 15% and lower, you should be refeeding 1 time at the end of PSMF (which is a little over a week). Your refeed should last a couple of days, maybe even 3.

I can't imagine that's possibly necessary, even if you're completely depleted. You can only hold so much glyocgen; 2-3 DAYS of super-high carbs is overkill imo.

lol, on a side note, I'm just thinking of how my body would respond to a 3-day refeed doing them the way I do. I'd probably end up fatter than at the beginning of the week :).

crazedwombat
03-15-2005, 12:22 PM
if you haven't already looked, there is a sticky at the top of this forum on refeeding. a good read.

referring to ST's insane food diet that I still cant make sense right? heh.

gino
03-15-2005, 12:41 PM
I don't think you should base re-feeds on your bodyfat percentage. You should have the same goals if your 30% or 15% - minimizing muscle loss. The same principles apply here regardless of bodyfat percentage. The longer you go in a carb depleted state, the more likely you are to sacrifice muscle. Keep the carb depletion short and efficient - the whole process should take a week or less no matter what your physical make up.