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Shobe
05-11-2005, 07:21 PM
I have a few questions regarding HIIT cardio.

1. Should I still do my cardio on a empty stomach even if its HIIT training?

2. Will I lose a lot of muscle doing cardio on a empty stomach if I do HIIT?

3. Now, after completeting HIIT, should I treat it like regular cardio exercise and eat a whey shake immediately after? Then, how long to wait til I eat egg whites & oatmeal?

Please help me out here.

I plan on running about 9:00 A.M.

Isaac Wilkins
05-11-2005, 07:26 PM
1. No, you generally shouldn't anyway. Especially anything with any intensity.

2. Define "a lot". You'll lose more than you should.

3. I would treat it as a weight workout as far as post-workout nutrition. If you don't do a long session, then trim down the amounts in your post-workout meal to be applicable.

Shobe
05-11-2005, 07:33 PM
How long should I wait though, after taking my whey shake til I eat? Because I think I'm just going to do it on a empty stomach. Because my diet is pretty sound.

Dedicated
05-11-2005, 07:38 PM
How long should I wait though, after taking my whey shake til I eat? Because I think I'm just going to do it on a empty stomach. Because my diet is pretty sound.

Doing HIIT on an empty stomach is really not advisable. You can run a search to find out why if you want, or you can take my word for it heh:)

Shobe
05-11-2005, 07:43 PM
Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to say you guys are liars, its just my personal preference. Now my question is this, why is it ok to do regular cardio on a empty stomach but not on HIIT?

Isaac Wilkins
05-11-2005, 07:54 PM
It's not a good idea to do any cardio in a fasted state. The more intense the cardio the higher the percentage of glucose that will be used to fuel it. In a fasted state your blood sugar will be lower and there's a stronger possibility that the body will utilize stored protein for fuel in addition to stored glycogen.

Once or twice this won't be a big deal. Habitually, and in an already hypocaloric diet, and you could be looking at muscle loss.

By "empty stomach" I assume you mean first thing in the morning after sleeping. If you only mean that you haven't eaten in a couple of hours, then I wouldn't worry as much.

Take the whey shake before your HIIT. Then eat your meal afterwards. Problem solved.

Dedicated
05-11-2005, 07:57 PM
Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to say you guys are liars, its just my personal preference. Now my question is this, why is it ok to do regular cardio on a empty stomach but not on HIIT?

If you are doing HIIT on an empty stomach in the morning your glycogen stores will be low so significant amounts of protein (might be muscle protein) can be used for energy.

If you are super serious about cardio and losing weight buy a heart rate monitor and try to stay at 65-80% of your MHR (Maximum Heart Rate) and don't run on an empty stomach. That would be your best option imo.

Also remember HIIT is very impact, it requires alot of recovery. It works and it's great and everything but it can be really hard on you.


Edit: woops didn't see Borris post sorry

Shobe
05-11-2005, 08:37 PM
Ok, thanks. But still after taking my whey shake, how long do I wait til my next whole meal??

Built
05-11-2005, 11:09 PM
It won't matter. Eat it when you want it.

Isaac Wilkins
05-12-2005, 05:27 AM
Exactly. Read what I said. Who the hell cares? You might as well eat it immediately, that's when it'll be the most beneficial.

Big Bas
05-12-2005, 12:01 PM
taken from http://www.musclemedia.com/training/hiit.asp


By the way, to maximize the fat-burning effects of HIIT, don't eat for about one hour after your workout. Then have a balanced protein- and carb-containing meal or supplement shake.

how do you guys feel about this?

Built
05-12-2005, 12:11 PM
I'm sure it'll help you burn more fat, but probably also more muscle.

Bumping for somebody smarter than me on this...

smalls
05-12-2005, 01:30 PM
I'm sure it'll help you burn more fat, but probably also more muscle.



Agreed. Taking advantage of increased nutrient transport is, IMO, going to be more beneficial than the extra .0001lb of fat you would lose. And I would be scared to be in such a catabolic state for that long while dieting.

KingJustin
05-12-2005, 02:08 PM
Shobe, if you aren't going to take our advice, then why ask the question?

I am all for doing long-distance cardio on an empty stomach in the morning if you are trying to burn that last bit of fat. Doing HIIT on an empty stomach, however, is quite stupid. You hardly burn more fat and you just lose muscle.

Just eat a lot for 2 hours after you workout. You should be hungry, so eat until you can't eat anymore.

waynis
05-12-2005, 03:21 PM
2. Will I lose a lot of muscle doing cardio on a empty stomach if I do HIIT?
.

If your on a empty stomach with depleted carbs or glycogen your body will most likely tap into some protein stores. Because your using these protein stores for energy and not for muscle building you affect the abilty to gain some muscle. This can hurt you in the long run. (the no carbs affect)

solution- eat some carbs and some protein before you run so you don't use up more protein then you want to and use that protein for muscle gain or to maintain muscle.

i've succesfully kept muscle while doing hit for the 2nd year now. If you do it right you can gain muscle at the same time. But with more then 3 hitt sessions a week and over 30 minutes each it will be harder.

MnM
05-13-2005, 11:10 AM
^^ How long should the HIIT sessions be inorder to burn the fat but maintain established muscle (or even gain)....no more than 15minutes?

Big Bas
05-13-2005, 12:17 PM
^^ How long should the HIIT sessions be inorder to burn the fat but maintain established muscle (or even gain)....no more than 15minutes?
i just read waynis' post; he said he does HIIT 3 times a week, over 30 mins a session for the second year now, and he hasnt lost muscle doing it

waynis
05-13-2005, 07:58 PM
^^ How long should the HIIT sessions be inorder to burn the fat but maintain established muscle (or even gain)....no more than 15minutes?

Like i mentioned HITT more then 3 days a week at over 30 minutes a week may hinder muscle gain. This does not mean you cannot gain muscle though. As long as you eat enough calories to maintain weight you will be fine. Right now i'am slowly getting to 40 minutes per session of HITT and i've actually gained 2 lbs. I credit the weight gain to changing my rutine though. I changed to supersets after doing 1 body part a week for like 2 or 3 months. too long. The change was very good for me.

The last seminar I was at showed that you gain the most strength or build the most muscle after the first set. Suprisingly there's not near as much of a gain in the second and third set. So you can easily maintain or gain by doing just 1 set at higher intensitys. This way you save energy and calories that you would use in doing more sets can go towards cardio.

If i don't see good results within the next couple week i'am probably going to increase HITT maybe to 5 sessions a week. Right now i'am building to it cause i haven't done hit in months. But i've had great success in the past gaining muscle while doing HITT. Last year I actually hit my max bench in 3 years all while doing hitt 3 days a week. I was in peak shape at the time. People talk about eating a lot less calories when trying to burn fat but if you want to optimize muscle gain you must eat! Personally I feel like crap and don't have any energy if I don't go near maintance. Especially after doing 30 minutes of HITT. I'am starving a hour later.

Built
05-13-2005, 08:19 PM
Hey there

If you can do 40 minutes of true HIIT, well, PM me your phone number 'cause you must have some kinda stamina!

I can usually manage 6-8 intervals of 30 seconds on, 30 seconds off before I wanna PUKE. I finish off with about 8-10 minutes of fast inline walking to burn off the FFAs released by the HIIT.

How are you doing your intervals?

waynis
05-13-2005, 08:27 PM
Hey there

If you can do 40 minutes of true HIIT, well, PM me your phone number 'cause you must have some kinda stamina!

I can usually manage 6-8 intervals of 30 seconds on, 30 seconds off before I wanna PUKE. I finish off with about 8-10 minutes of fast inline walking to burn off the FFAs released by the HIIT.

How are you doing your intervals?

LOL.. well i'am building there. Last year I was doing 40 minutes of HITT 3 days a week easy! I had amazing stamina at the time. This was all at around 14% body fat too.I would do a jog and then 8.5 up to 10mph for 2 min. UHH.. sounds crazy now. I have a little ways till I get back there again. I was doing 2 minutes jog then 2 minute sprint at my best shape. Right now i'am doing 3 minute jog 5.0 mph to 2 minute 7.5 MPH untill I get around 30 minutes I finish up by doing 2 minute jog then 2 minute sprint till my HR gets around 185 :)

Built
05-14-2005, 01:09 AM
Okay, what you're doing is interval training, which is good, but it isn't HIIT.

As I understand it, for HIIT, you sprint flat-out, balls-to-the-wall for the intervals. My feeling is that you shouldn't even have enough steam left to jog between intervals - when I do it, it's all I can do to just barely walk. You can start with 20 seconds sprint, 40 seconds walk, moving toward 30 seconds of each as you get into better and better shape.

If you can do 10 intervals like this over 10 minutes, you're in incredible shape.

waynis
05-14-2005, 05:17 PM
Okay, what you're doing is interval training, which is good, but it isn't HIIT.

As I understand it, for HIIT, you sprint flat-out, balls-to-the-wall for the intervals. My feeling is that you shouldn't even have enough steam left to jog between intervals - when I do it, it's all I can do to just barely walk. You can start with 20 seconds sprint, 40 seconds walk, moving toward 30 seconds of each as you get into better and better shape.

If you can do 10 intervals like this over 10 minutes, you're in incredible shape.

HITT= High intensity interval training? If i'am at high intensitys doesn't that make it hitt?

Explain HITT to me a little further cause I guess i'am not familar with exactly what you mean.

Maki Riddington
05-14-2005, 07:05 PM
Waynis,

Read this.:)

http://www.wannabebig.com/article.php?articleid=165

waynis
05-14-2005, 07:47 PM
"Treadmill Work: Running on the treadmill is not as effective as running outdoors due to the lack of intensity that can be achieved on a treadmill. A treadmill, nevertheless, can still do its job well. One way to really utilize this piece of equipment is to do walking lunges on the steepest grade for 30 seconds at 1.5-2.0 miles an hour. Rest 30 seconds, and repeat 5-10 times. If thatís not enough for you, speed things up or grab some dumbbells."


as far as running goes on tread mill. You would do like 30-90 second sprint Then what speed would you come down to? A walk? Also is 30 seconds enough time to rest or that is the point of hitt to keep your HR up the whole time?

As far as a walk goes. I'am assuming to get your heart rate up "most" people unless your very out of shape will be doing a high incline fast pace walk. If you were doing that what speed or grade would you come down to?

This type of interval training is all new to me. First time I saw the word HITT was actually on this forum. This sounds great for burning the cals when you don't wanna waste tons of time. Would be great for after weights!

Maki Riddington
05-14-2005, 08:13 PM
as far as running goes on tread mill. You would do like 30-90 second sprint Then what speed would you come down to? A walk? Also is 30 seconds enough time to rest or that is the point of hitt to keep your HR up the whole time?

There really is no set time period. According to the studies floating around out there (see references) you would want to use between 15-60 second high intensity intervals followed by 30 seconds of low intensity or more depending on what kind of cardiovascular shape you're in.

So for example let's say you're using the treadmill to perform your HIIT. You need to find out what your max intensity is. You should know what it is by gauging what you currently do. Let's say it's 9.2mph for 30 seconds. You'd warm up and move into the first interval at 9.2 mph. Once you hit 30 seconds you'd slow down to a steady walk which might be 3 mph until you catch your breath. Then repeat until you can no longer continue this process. If you're going all out you shouldn't last more than 15 minutes. I personally am done in under 10 minutes. I think I lasted once for 12 minutes and I almost puked.

This is just one way you can do it.

Built
05-14-2005, 08:47 PM
When I do HIIT on treadmills, I keep two going side-by-side, one at a sprint, one at a walk. I then proceed to look like Fred Flintstone starting his car when I jump onto the fast one by holding the rails, then lowering my feet onto the track while running in the air to get started.

I strongly suggest following the HIIT session with a short (8-10) fast incline walk to burn off the FFAs that are liberated by the intense bursts.

KingJustin
05-14-2005, 09:34 PM
I always did flat out sprints until a few recent discussions on this board. Powerman convinced me that sprinting is really hard on your body and sprinting more than once a week is just not a good idea. HIIT doesn't have to be so intense as sprinting, you can just do a fast run, but I think if you do this you should also throw in more (numerically) intense intervals.

Also, I have a hard time believing that anyone can sprint for 2-3 minutes. World class athletes top out at one minute.

waynis
05-15-2005, 01:33 PM
There really is no set time period. According to the studies floating around out there (see references) you would want to use between 15-60 second high intensity intervals followed by 30 seconds of low intensity or more depending on what kind of cardiovascular shape you're in.

So for example let's say you're using the treadmill to perform your HIIT. You need to find out what your max intensity is. You should know what it is by gauging what you currently do. Let's say it's 9.2mph for 30 seconds. You'd warm up and move into the first interval at 9.2 mph. Once you hit 30 seconds you'd slow down to a steady walk which might be 3 mph until you catch your breath. Then repeat until you can no longer continue this process. If you're going all out you shouldn't last more than 15 minutes. I personally am done in under 10 minutes. I think I lasted once for 12 minutes and I almost puked.

This is just one way you can do it.


thanks man

Big Bas
05-16-2005, 11:58 AM
i do my HIIT on the eliiptical machine.... i do 10 secs all out, 50 secs rest. Im not sure if my intervals are set up well, but i can do this for about 25 mins, after a 5 minute warm up... about 15 mins in, i feel like im gonna barf!

waynis
05-16-2005, 03:11 PM
I was checking out the stair master today and thought it would be incredible to do HITT on. I put the intensity all the way up and just did it for 1 minute cause i was working. haha. But I was like this is gonna be crazy even for 5 minutes!

Kiaran
05-25-2005, 10:15 AM
Is HIIT only useful if you are looking to help burn fat? I am currently bulking, so I want to stay away from HIIT for now, correct?