Want more info on IGF-1

[Hatred]

After using the long-lost "search" button it turned up bumpkus.
I would like to read more info on IGF usage and it's application for bodybuilding. I can't really search from work all that well. Thanks for the help.
Is it as expensive as GH?

[ryuage]

http://forums.anabolicreview.com/showthread.php?t=164557

http://forums.anabolicreview.com/showthread.php?t=15971

[ectx]

After using the long-lost "search" button it turned up bumpkus.
I would like to read more info on IGF usage and it's application for bodybuilding. I can't really search from work all that well. Thanks for the help.
Is it as expensive as GH?

It's cheaper than GH. much of HGH's anabolic properties are caused by stimulating IGF production.

[Hatred]

Thank you Very Much Ryuage.

[gino]

Sounds like pretty fun stuff. I'd like to experiment a bit with it in the future.

[Franco]

Genuine receptor grade can be extremely expensive per mg. Media grade tends to be far cheaper

[rookiebldr]

It's cheaper than GH. much of HGH's anabolic properties are caused by stimulating IGF production.

Adding the two together sounds like a real kick. :)

[Hatred]

And expensive.

[rookiebldr]

lol of course, but when you're 180lbs......

On a more serious note:

1. If GH stimulates igf production, then is there really an advantage to stacking the two together?

2. Other than cost is there an appreciable advantage to using genuine receptor grade over media grade igf? One article I read said no, but is it true?

3. hgh is best used for 3months or more. Can the benefits of igf be found in less time and is it better to use shorter cycles?

[smalls]

lol of course, but when you're 180lbs......

On a more serious note:

1. If GH stimulates igf production, then is there really an advantage to stacking the two together?

2. Other than cost is there an appreciable advantage to using genuine receptor grade over media grade igf? One article I read said no, but is it true?

3. hgh is best used for 3months or more. Can the benefits of igf be found in less time and is it better to use shorter cycles?


This is only from feedback I've heard from others.

1. The difference in people who like IGF (feel it's worth it) they say it is best run in conjunction. GH has other benefits than IGF.

2. Most people say as long as it's real the difference is negligable. In fact receptor grade is so expensive I doubt anything your getting that says it's receptor grade actually is.

3. Thats one of the main benefits toted behind IGF. HGH like benefits in some regards in short time periods. It's usually only supposed to be used in 4-6 week cycle.

There are alot of mixed reports on it from what I've seen. First you have to know you **** is legit. Then you have to constitute it and store and handle it correctly (it's supposedly quite fragile). But even then some people say it's awesome and others say they dont notice ****e. It's hard to say if it's worth it, just use more tren, lol.

[ectx]

lol of course, but when you're 180lbs......

On a more serious note:

1. If GH stimulates igf production, then is there really an advantage to stacking the two together?


From what I understand, yes. Exogenous IGF will downregulate the production of GH. GH has other effects that are not necessarily anabolic. You won't see the decrease in truncal and abdominal fat, the improved lipid profile, etc. In conjuction you get endogenous IGF not to shut down (not exactly sure about this but I seem to remember reading something along those lines).

[Franco]

The pertinent advantage in its favour is that it supposedly has the ability for hyperplasia. The only problem though is that there are no precise peer reviewed studies upon exogenous IGF-1 in humans

[Shark]

Has anyone checked out the oral stuff that IBE Nutrition started selling. It's called Oratropin and I don't think I am allowed to link to it but its not hard to find.

[love2build]

Has anyone checked out the oral stuff that IBE Nutrition started selling. It's called Oratropin and I don't think I am allowed to link to it but its not hard to find.
Yes, I have checked it out some. I am acutally probably going to order 1 kit and see how it goes. There have been a few cycle logs on the outlawmuscle forums and thus far those people seem pleased with the results. I am anxious myself to try it.

$130 per kit, so i'll start with one kit and see if I like the effects and if so..continue on, if not..cease fire.

I'll let you know how it goes, I will hopefully be starting my next cycle in about 2 weeks..maybe less dependent upon how quickly gear arrives.

- Chris

[Shark]

Are you planning on stacking it or are you gonna run it by itself? What about PCT? Is that even needed with GH and IGF-1? I have no knowledge of this stuff.

[ryuage]

actually some people run gh/igf along side of pct, so no you would not need pct

[Franco]

PCT isn't required if using IGF soley. There does to be some kind of synergy between coupling gear and igf into a cycle.

The IGF can be used during your PCT to assist in holding on to more gains whilst still gaining a degree of lbm at the same

From my experience there seems to be a very mixed response from the oral version of IGF

[bigpoppapump979]

have you heard anything about the transdermal?

[Drai's]

There's certain compounds out there that really make no sense to use IMO if you're not going to compete (IGF-1, gh, dnp, t-3). I just don't see a point in messing with the really "hardcore" drugs if you're merely doing this for a hobby. If good ol' test/d-bol/fina (and others like that) can't get you the physique you want, then you probably have more to worry about than what drugs you're consuming.

I have no clue who in this thread plans to compete or not, I just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in.

[Hatred]

Good for you. *throws .02 back*
Keep your ****ing opinion to yourself.
What is the difference between DNp and Gear?
They both take a lot of research and knowledge to be used correctly and safely.
They are both a means to an end.

If good ol' test/d-bol/fina (and others like that) can't get you the physique you want, then you probably have more to worry about than what drugs you're consuming.
If you have to rely on ANY drugs to get you the physique that you want then you are pretty much ****ed.

If I want to be shredded and huge with a big Gh gut that I can flex to wow and amaze my hamsters; that's my business.

[smalls]

If you have to rely on ANY drugs to get you the physique that you want then you are pretty much ****ed.

If I want to be shredded and huge with a big Gh gut that I can flex to wow and amaze my hamsters; that's my business.


I couldnt agree more. The whole "only if you compete" thing boggles my mind. Compete at what level? People are always spouting this ****, "2 grams+ should only be used if you compete" WHY? Most people will never make a living at this and one in a million will be pro. Basically what I'm asking you is, what about competetion is more important than personal satisfaction?

It's always a personal decision, just like ST's sticky. You have to decide what is worth it for yourself. I will never step on stage but I can gaurentee I will use dosages that most people couldnt fathom, but there are certain things I wont use only because I feel there not necassary. I've never been in this **** for the health benefits.

Drai's, this post wasnt meant to be harsh. I really want to understand where your thinking comes from on this topic, because it seems quite popular.

[Drai's]

Hatred, I guess today is one of those days you didn't get much sleep or were effected heavily by whatever drugs you're taking ;). (This is from another thread, Hatred will know I'm joking.)

Smalls, yeah you're right, it's a personal decision. My reasoning is simple: The downsides of some of these drugs don't make it worth it. I have no problem with educated gear use. But I can't fathom why some people want to risk potentially $#%@ing with their bodies so much, when they're only lifting weights "for fun". Sure, you can mess yourself up pretty bad with basically any kind of gear if you react poorly or stay on too long, etc. but there's just so much less room for error with some of those drugs. T-3? Come on now, my thyroid's pretty important. I think I'll leave it alone, thank you very much. DNP? Taking a drug that can kill you because you want to be lazy and sit around your house for a week, sweating profusely, while you drop 10 lbs because you're too lazy to work hard is stupid...IMO.

Then again, I don't see why someone who isn't competing would bother trying to get past their genetic potential in the first place. So my argument is basically stemming from my view that it doesn't take any hardcore drugs to reach your genetic potential. If you want to be 6' 250 8%, then yeah maybe...but I can't imagine the psychological pain you'd go through when you decide to come off. That's just not worth it to me.

You'll find that I probably agree with you guys on most gear-related issues. This clearly is not one of them.

[Hatred]

I can honestly say that there is noone I enjoy disagreeing with on this board more then you Drai's.
I can see your point.For me it is about efficiency. If I can diet moderately and double the rate at which I burn fat;I will. It is not so much about laziness as using what tools are out there to accomplish a certain goal.
Why should I diet for 2 months when I can use something in conjunction with diet that will accomplish the same thing in 7 days?

Suffer for months if you want to. I can as well and have.
Why drive to the grocery store when you can walk?
WHy take the easy way out? The PROPER way to do it is to take hours to walk to the store and then carry all of your groceries home on your back.Sorry.
Damn punk kids and their bicycles and cars flying around like a bat out of hell.for shame!
Technology is around for a reason and I for one use it.

[Shark]

Why should I diet for 2 months when I can use something in conjunction with diet that will accomplish the same thing in 7 days?

See, now this is what i need to do! What compound will do that? =)

[ryuage]

dnp

[smalls]

Smalls, yeah you're right, it's a personal decision. My reasoning is simple: The downsides of some of these drugs don't make it worth it. I have no problem with educated gear use. But I can't fathom why some people want to risk potentially $#%@ing with their bodies so much, when they're only lifting weights "for fun". Sure, you can mess yourself up pretty bad with basically any kind of gear if you react poorly or stay on too long, etc. but there's just so much less room for error with some of those drugs. T-3? Come on now, my thyroid's pretty important. I think I'll leave it alone, thank you very much. DNP? Taking a drug that can kill you because you want to be lazy and sit around your house for a week, sweating profusely, while you drop 10 lbs because you're too lazy to work hard is stupid...IMO.

Then again, I don't see why someone who isn't competing would bother trying to get past their genetic potential in the first place. So my argument is basically stemming from my view that it doesn't take any hardcore drugs to reach your genetic potential. If you want to be 6' 250 8%, then yeah maybe...but I can't imagine the psychological pain you'd go through when you decide to come off. That's just not worth it to me.

You'll find that I probably agree with you guys on most gear-related issues. This clearly is not one of them.

I can understand your point to a certain extent. But once the decision to use has been made who decides what is excessive, what is "too much" for each individual.
You stated that you "cant see why anyone who isn't competeting would bother trying to get past their genetic potential." I think this is where our differening views stem from. If someone can be satisfied with there genetics, or the progress they can get naturally that is awesome, and honestly I admire that. But I can't.

[love2build]

In reply to an earlier post, yes I am planning on stacking it with AAS. I'll probably run a basic bread and butter with 750mg/wk of test. enan., dbol, and possibly some tren..i am trying to find some GOOD quality tren. In the past I haven't been too impressed with QV products, so I will use that as a last resort. This is my first use of tren, so I want to know the full effects of it and not risk it with QV which seems to be quite underdosed and amazingly painful at times. If anyone recommends a specif brand of tren, either UG or pharm., let me know. tren enanthate is what i would like..thanks.


Also, as for the time of use for the oratropin..i'm thinking about running the first kit in the first two weeks, then if i like the results..continuing with a second kit from there on or either towards the end or PCT of the cycle.

- Chris

[rookiebldr]

It's always a personal decision, just like ST's sticky. You have to decide what is worth it for yourself. I will never step on stage but I can gaurentee I will use dosages that most people couldnt fathom, but there are certain things I wont use only because I feel there not necassary. I've never been in this **** for the health benefits.

You've captured my thoughts exactly!

[Drai's]

I can honestly say that there is noone I enjoy disagreeing with on this board more then you Drai's.

Awesome. That's going in my sig :p


I can see your point.For me it is about efficiency. If I can diet moderately and double the rate at which I burn fat;I will. It is not so much about laziness as using what tools are out there to accomplish a certain goal.
Why should I diet for 2 months when I can use something in conjunction with diet that will accomplish the same thing in 7 days?

I can see your argument to be honest. I mean, isn't efficiency the reason one uses gear of any type in the first place?

I guess the point where people draw the line between efficiency and safety is different for some people though.


I can understand your point to a certain extent. But once the decision to use has been made who decides what is excessive, what is "too much" for each individual.

Yup, exactly what I just said above. The line is drawn at different places for different people.


You stated that you "cant see why anyone who isn't competeting would bother trying to get past their genetic potential." I think this is where our differening views stem from. If someone can be satisfied with there genetics, or the progress they can get naturally that is awesome, and honestly I admire that. But I can't.

I never made any argument for staying natty. You can still use gear and not go past your genetic potential. It's what Hatred referred to as efficiency. Do you want to hit your natural potential when you're 22 or 32?

[Severed Ties]

IMO unless you getting receptor grade I wouldn't bother, buddy of mine ran several mg's of media grade and didn't get a hair's worth of results from it.

If you want to invest a ton of cash in a cycle save up and get some HGH, it can be found reasonibly priced.

ST

[tony touch]

i still can't really see the justification of price vs benefit ratio on it man.

i think you are better off buying more juice with that money...lol

[smalls]

IMO unless you getting receptor grade I wouldn't bother, buddy of mine ran several mg's of media grade and didn't get a hair's worth of results from it.

If you want to invest a ton of cash in a cycle save up and get some HGH, it can be found reasonibly priced.

ST

From people who actually like the stuff they say they like media grade just fine, but I would have to agree with you. And even then receptor grade is so much more expensive I can't imagine it being worth it. I could do a few grams of test a week for YEARS straight for the price of that ****.

Also, about the oral versions out now, I dont understand how someone could convert such an extremely fragile compound to be orally ingested. Especially some research company on the internet.

[Shark]

Also, about the oral versions out now, I dont understand how someone could convert such an extremely fragile compound to be orally ingested. Especially some research company on the internet.

This is what i keep thinking about IBE's stuff. I really don't think they're well enough equipped to do work like that. Then again, its just a hunch on my part but to me that seems like huge drug company ****, not something a little nolva and clen online business would be able to handle.

[SirTest2004]

i'm just coming to the end of using 50mcg Igf-1 for 3weeks...i'm also on 750mg sus. I've put on just under 2stone in the 6weeks so far and i contribute almost all of the size gains to the sus BUT the fat loss while on Igf AND the highest dose of test i've ever used has been nothing short of amazing.

I am gettin another igf kit to use during my pct and i dont think i'll use it again until i'm earning more.....but i might save up for some GH if i can source it at a reasonable price

[Severed Ties]

From people who actually like the stuff they say they like media grade just fine, but I would have to agree with you. And even then receptor grade is so much more expensive I can't imagine it being worth it. I could do a few grams of test a week for YEARS straight for the price of that ****.

Also, about the oral versions out now, I dont understand how someone could convert such an extremely fragile compound to be orally ingested. Especially some research company on the internet.


Smalls thats odd thing about IGF, especially the media grade lr3 form. Some of the guys I talk to online and trust their opinions have gotten results with it...it really seems like a coin flip with it but the guy I was referring to is the only person I've actually trained with who was running IGF and like I said...neither of us thought it made a hair's worth of difference.

Personally I think IBE's product is BS I don't believe an underground lab...and I use that in the loosest sense if you knew who they were prior to re-opening under that name. Could develop an orally bioavailable form of IGF when no pharmaceutical company is even testing a human version at the moment. Considering how many forms of IGF-1 Goprep has available/testing I would think they would be all over such a delivery method.

ST

[Hatred]

I was under the impression that IGF ONLY affected muscle tissue. And not fat loss.

[Severed Ties]

umm IGF effects just about everything in the body...hence the question of it's safety.

IGF-1 lowers blood glucose so less insulin is needed to store glucose after eating. Lower circulating insulin levels leads to fat loss for some users.

ST

[Hatred]

So can I grow a horse pecker with it? WIll I need penile weights?

[Hatred]

I really wanted this last one answered...:(

[SirTest2004]

anything is possible....

[Severed Ties]

better spot inject to improve delivery to desired tissue

ST

[rookiebldr]

lmfao Why would it not surprise me that someone will try this. ..... Hatred?

[Hatred]

The hope for a 13 in dong is enough motivation to make me poke my pecker ED.

[JSully]

The hope for a 13 in dong is enough motivation to make me poke my pecker ED.LMAO

amazing

not to be a hijacker,

Hatred: have you tried stacking you're super stack (test/deca/eq) with insulin for improved delivery of nutrients, lowered fat storage, etc etc etc

[Hatred]

As of yet I have not used insulin. it scares me to be honest because I don't know enough about it.
Plus I have been off now for 6 weeks.