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Jay-X
05-31-2005, 11:59 AM
what should the ratio of milk to water be when you are bulking?

Built
05-31-2005, 12:02 PM
???

Jay-X
05-31-2005, 12:12 PM
i mean, when i'm thirsty, i usually drink milk, instead of water and i'd like to know if this could interfere with my bulking...

Built
05-31-2005, 12:13 PM
How would extra calories interfere with bulking?

Jay-X
05-31-2005, 12:22 PM
dunno, maybe since you don't get enough water, if you drink mostly milk...

spencerjrus
05-31-2005, 12:37 PM
I think what you are trying to ask is how much water do you need if you are consuming milk throughout the day instead of water.

Jay-X
05-31-2005, 12:48 PM
actually, what i'm trying to ask is more or less "is it good to drink milk more often than water?"

JesseM
05-31-2005, 12:56 PM
actually, what i'm trying to ask is more or less "is it good to drink milk more often than water?"

Well... milk has calories, water has no calories. Calories add weight, no calories add no weight.

Jay-X
05-31-2005, 01:05 PM
Well... milk has calories, water has no calories. Calories add weight, no calories add no weight.


yes, i know this. but i also know that calories are not everything when bulking. you can eat lots of food, but if you don't drink enough, your bulking will suffer from it. so, what i'm asking is "does milk have enough water inside or it's better to reduce its amount, while drinking more water?"

Anthony
05-31-2005, 01:18 PM
How much milk do you drink? How much water do you drink?

Jay-X
05-31-2005, 01:22 PM
i don't know, but usually i drink 3 glasses of milk for each glass of water, so i'm worried about not drinking enough water

Anthony
05-31-2005, 01:23 PM
You don't know how much water you drink? Can you estimate? 1 glass/day? 8 glasses? Either way, if you're that concerned, drink more.

Jay-X
05-31-2005, 01:27 PM
i'm sorry, but i don't really know, since it varies a lot... for example, yesterday i drank just 2 liters of milk, while i got plenty of water. rather, 2 days ago i could have drank *maybe* 6 glasses of water, while i drank lots and lots of milk. i'd like to know if it's better to cut on the milk, in order to have room for water, or is it better to drink lots of milk and some water?

JesseM
05-31-2005, 01:37 PM
Drink both simple as that. I drink a lot of milk 1/4 to 1/3 gallon a day and probably 3+ 16oz glasses of water a day, I dont think its that big of deal really. Like Ant said just down some water if your worried.

Anthony
05-31-2005, 02:11 PM
Let me get this straight.

You're bulking. You don't know how much milk you drink. You don't know how much water you drink. I'm going to assume you don't even know how many calories you eat. And you're concerned about the ratio of milk and water?

I'll make things real simple. Drink however much milk you want AND 2-4L of water.

WBBIRL
05-31-2005, 03:29 PM
Milk has tons of fat, unless your drinking fat free skim milk. Even 2% has a fairly high amount of fat in it. You should be drinking at least 3.78 L or 1 gallon of water every day. Trust me your body needs alot of water and getting dehydrated can cause alot of pain. Keep the milk to under 1L a day, were not worried about the calories obvisouly but wrather the fat. One cup of 2% reduced fat milk has 130 calories (45 from fat), 5 g of fat, 3g of saturated fat, 20mg of cholesterol, 125mg of sodium, 410mg of potassium, 13g of carbs, 12g of sugar, and 8 g of protein. There are about 4.2 cups in each liter so if your drinking 2 liters of milk every single day then your getting 8.4 cups of milk. That would be 1092 calories from milk (378 calories from fat), 42g of fat, almost 25 g of saturated fat, 101 g of sugar, and about 67.2 g of protein just from the milk. I think thats alot of fat for a clean bulk... and thats assumeing you drink 2% reduced fat, if its whole milk then its alot worse. Whats the rest of your diet look like??? Proteins??? Carbs??

I go with something like this, atleast a cup of milk every day and atleast a gallon of water every day. Cals from protein always above 40% and fats alwasy under 20%. Im on a clean slow cut which is around 1800-2000 calories per day. I do try to get my protein from sources other then shakes but sometimes our menu and budget wont allow... so there are somedays where I take 6-7+ protein shakes, and others where I need less then 4.

monotone
05-31-2005, 03:34 PM
why under 20% for fats... he is bulking, did you not read that???

WBBIRL
05-31-2005, 03:40 PM
Yes I did, which is why I said he isnt concerned with calories. But a clean bulk is essential to avoiding alot of extra fat gain. Its alot easier to gain 50lbs of fat then it is to gain 50lbs of muscle. Also I said thats what I do, but Im not trying to get more bulk but wrather stronger, leaner and lighter at the same time... which is very tricky.

Anthony
05-31-2005, 03:45 PM
42g is a lot of fat? lol. That would be about 5% of my calories.

WBBIRL
05-31-2005, 03:58 PM
On second thought it may not be that much, but the rest of the diet would explain alot. This is like shooting in the dark, without a full diet any kind of evaluation is purely hypothetical.

smalls
05-31-2005, 07:13 PM
Milk has tons of fat, unless your drinking fat free skim milk. Even 2% has a fairly high amount of fat in it. You should be drinking at least 3.78 L or 1 gallon of water every day. Trust me your body needs alot of water and getting dehydrated can cause alot of pain. Keep the milk to under 1L a day, were not worried about the calories obvisouly but wrather the fat. One cup of 2% reduced fat milk has 130 calories (45 from fat), 5 g of fat, 3g of saturated fat, 20mg of cholesterol, 125mg of sodium, 410mg of potassium, 13g of carbs, 12g of sugar, and 8 g of protein. There are about 4.2 cups in each liter so if your drinking 2 liters of milk every single day then your getting 8.4 cups of milk. That would be 1092 calories from milk (378 calories from fat), 42g of fat, almost 25 g of saturated fat, 101 g of sugar, and about 67.2 g of protein just from the milk. I think thats alot of fat for a clean bulk... and thats assumeing you drink 2% reduced fat, if its whole milk then its alot worse. Whats the rest of your diet look like??? Proteins??? Carbs??

I go with something like this, atleast a cup of milk every day and atleast a gallon of water every day. Cals from protein always above 40% and fats alwasy under 20%. Im on a clean slow cut which is around 1800-2000 calories per day. I do try to get my protein from sources other then shakes but sometimes our menu and budget wont allow... so there are somedays where I take 6-7+ protein shakes, and others where I need less then 4.

I'm sorry bro, but this is a horrible post. Your taking what you view as a clean bulk and applying it as the standard for everyone. Why a low fat bulk? Also I drink over 1.5 gallons a milk a day and yet I get 0 grams of fat from milk, so your kinda jumping the gun assuming most everyone takes in 2% of whole, even if they do it's not a problem provided their total macronutrients are in order.

To the original poster, milk is comprised mostly of water. So I think your gonna live regardless of the ratio. Eat more and worry less.

Nito
05-31-2005, 07:39 PM
While you guys are discussing fat intake, would someone mind peaking in my fitday (which is in my sig) and telling me if the ratio's are okay? I am currently bulking.

smalls
05-31-2005, 08:12 PM
Nito, I think your ratios look good. What type of weight gain are you getting at 3700 cals/day?

waynis
05-31-2005, 08:21 PM
carry around a gallon jug of water through the day. Drink it all by the end of the day and don't worry about it.

Optimum08
05-31-2005, 11:24 PM
how about u drink as much of both as possible...you aren't gonna die if the "ratio" isn't perfect because there is no "ratio"....so on second thought...u might die...

WBBIRL
06-01-2005, 09:20 AM
Well smalls, I assumed that he was at best drinking 2% and not fat free skim milk while bulking. To me thats alot of fat for just what you drink, that doesnt consider what he eats. I guess as an overweight person I tend to cringe on too much fat intake, espically that much saturated fat.

CarlP
06-01-2005, 01:11 PM
yes, i know this. but i also know that calories are not everything when bulking. you can eat lots of food, but if you don't drink enough, your bulking will suffer from it. so, what i'm asking is "does milk have enough water inside or it's better to reduce its amount, while drinking more water?"

Calories are everything when bulking. Bulking is consuming more calories than you need to maintain weight, in order to gain weight. You're overthinking the ratios here. Like someone said earlier, finish a gallon of water a day and you should be fine.

YungLifter
06-01-2005, 01:24 PM
why do we have to drink so much water anyway?

Drai's
06-01-2005, 01:25 PM
Calories are everything when bulking. Bulking is consuming more calories than you need to maintain weight, in order to gain weight. You're overthinking the ratios here. Like someone said earlier, finish a gallon of water a day and you should be fine.

:withstupi

Built
06-01-2005, 01:33 PM
Milk has tons of fat, unless your drinking fat free skim milk. Even 2% has a fairly high amount of fat in it. You should be drinking at least 3.78 L or 1 gallon of water every day. Trust me your body needs alot of water and getting dehydrated can cause alot of pain. Keep the milk to under 1L a day, were not worried about the calories obvisouly but wrather the fat. One cup of 2% reduced fat milk has 130 calories (45 from fat), 5 g of fat, 3g of saturated fat, 20mg of cholesterol, 125mg of sodium, 410mg of potassium, 13g of carbs, 12g of sugar, and 8 g of protein. There are about 4.2 cups in each liter so if your drinking 2 liters of milk every single day then your getting 8.4 cups of milk. That would be 1092 calories from milk (378 calories from fat), 42g of fat, almost 25 g of saturated fat, 101 g of sugar, and about 67.2 g of protein just from the milk. I think thats alot of fat for a clean bulk... and thats assumeing you drink 2% reduced fat, if its whole milk then its alot worse. Whats the rest of your diet look like??? Proteins??? Carbs??

I go with something like this, atleast a cup of milk every day and atleast a gallon of water every day. Cals from protein always above 40% and fats alwasy under 20%. Im on a clean slow cut which is around 1800-2000 calories per day. I do try to get my protein from sources other then shakes but sometimes our menu and budget wont allow... so there are somedays where I take 6-7+ protein shakes, and others where I need less then 4.

For a clean slow cut, I take in between 35% and 55% of my calories from fat. I don't feel comfortable with them lower. I do NOT think it's a particularly good idea to go as low as 20% of cals from fat, and furthermore, natural saturated fat is good for test production. Also, my cutting calories are the same as yours, and I'm a middle aged chick who weighs a buck thirty five.

And yes, I used to be overweight - for about 20 years. My lowfat diet made me hungry all the time. Now that my diet is higher in fat, it's easier to control my appetite and I no longer struggle with my weight.

I fully realize the ratios are unique to the individual. But 20% seems far too low, especially for a bodybuilder and especially where appetite control is a factor.

My .02

Drai's
06-01-2005, 01:48 PM
I agree with Built.

WBBIRL
06-01-2005, 02:41 PM
Well, I dont know anything different I can do. That calorie range is where I dont gain or lose... its a maintance range. For all the more lean mass I have I would figure my metabolisim would be much higher then it is, unless somehow Im not montering my calories very well. Lifting should also burn a ton of cals, as I lift heavy and fairly intense but if i go into the 2500+ range I gain weight no matter what. My weight has went from about 308-310 down to around 301-300 in around 3-4 weeks. At this point in my weight loss effort I would have expected to be shedding poundage much quicker, espically on such a restricted caloric range... like you said yourself Built, thats what you cut on and im a 18 year old big framed big bodied male, not a 41 year old female.

smalls
06-01-2005, 08:41 PM
I hope my earlier post wasnt offensive. I actually bulk lower fat than many people, I was just stating that you probably should be more open about suggestions etc.

Undereating for long periods of time may have effected your current metabolism, but at the end of the day everyone is very different. Lots of bigger framed people have slow metabolism. For some it's hard to bulk for others its harder to cut. For many of us, both suck, lol.

British Pimp
06-06-2005, 09:03 AM
I can't remember who it was - maybe Tom Venuto or someone - suggested you should pee clear urine roughly five times a day. If you do, your water intake is probably adequate.