View Full Version : Power Out the Bottom!

06-22-2005, 09:27 PM
ok, i decided to start a new journal that i will actually use (unlike my old one). right now i have alot of things that im trying to do and it is a very stressful time, for 3 months my bench has been stuck at 200 lbs, but about a week ago i finally broke free. however, my deadlift has dropped 15 lbs in the last month or two and i have gained some fat. my squat and mil press are on the rise because i only recently (well, a few months now, but in my 6 months of lifting ive squatted for probably less than half) began to properly train them. my curl dropped because i quit doing them for a short time.

so heres the deal, im trying to gain strength and lose weight at the same time, they say its possible and im going to try it. ill be eating 6 meals a day and getting 1800 cals, also, i HAVE GOT TO START RUNNING... i was planning on doing this but convienience and lack of confidance really got in my way. the reason i was going to be running was for XC but i found out that im pretty much a shoe in because the coach takes FORTY guys, just over 20 showed up at the initial meeting and less than 40 were on the team last year. i do owe it to the coach to get in shape and thats what ill do, im not going to go nuts and lose all my muscle for him, but im probably going to do some regular interval training similar to HIIT, that also complements my impending cut (starting tommorow i hope... procrastination has a way with people) im going to cut until the season starts and basically try to 'power out the bottom' so to speak, im going to be eating a **** load in an attempt to prevent muscle loss from the distance.

being in HS i have an assload of summer reading and some other summer goals, among other things, i want to learn to walk on stilts (maybe on my hands too), juggle, get much better at chess (ive been playing alot latley online, and im getting better all the time), and my damn summer reading by the end of the summer. somehow all the stuff i want to do is really causing alot of anxiety.

anyway, stats:

5' 5.5''
185 (hell it varies too damn much but thats what it was the day before yesterday)
30% bf (OUCH!, thats up a bit from when i started)
15 years old. im still growing and i hope this cut doesnt stop all that, i assume the natural levels of bone growth hormones released that trigger growth will over-ride my caloric deficit.

bench- 205
squat- hell, im not sure, ive done 225 for a triple and 235 for a single, neither of which was that much effort though the triple was pretty close to my true max triple. the reason i dont have a definite number is because i usually ATF squat within my workouts.
deadlift- 300, ****, thats down from 315! man this sucks
military press- 135
power clean- never done more than 150, but i can do it a few times.
zercher squat- 180 is the most ive done, i could probably do more.
curl- dropped from 105 to 95, i think i can do 100 now.

i dont take measurements since im not a BB'er, nor am i a pler, strongman or oly lifter, hell, im not sure what i am as far as my lifting goes, i lean mostly towards pler.

well, i should be making an update tommorow possibley with what i ate, its not a lifting day in my routine but ill probably go run. right now my mile time is also 40 seconds slower than a year ago, but thats without ANY running conditioning, either way, ill never be much of a runner, even the kids that smoke weed on the team can run better than me (which is odd because i can hold my breath for 2-3X longer than them and ive always been able to go long distances under water and work well with little air supply)

hell, i better stop before i write a book here :D

06-22-2005, 10:09 PM
Looks good man, i'll be keeping up with this. I'd never noticed your only 5'5", hell yah little man

06-22-2005, 11:46 PM
Good luck man.

06-23-2005, 07:38 AM
Good luck dude.

Yes, you CAN gain strength and lose weight. Try starting out around 2200 cals a day though. 1800 will make you very tiredand you may not get everything out of your workouts. I found 2200 to be perfect for losing weight/gaining strength and we're close in height/weight. Cardio after lifting is key.

Weight loss will be slow, but you'll notice it after a month or so.

06-23-2005, 08:32 AM
i've lost weight and my strength hasnt dropped at all if thats any consulation. Granted i only lost like 5 lbs but i did a power chest day the other day and i was as good as ever.

06-23-2005, 04:44 PM
so far my cutting diet seems to be going well. i think ill post my diet this time, if anyone sees something they want to critique feel free

meal 1: approx 600 cals (only large meal of the day, i just didnt want to break up my milk)
-3.25 pints of milk (skim obviously)+ 1 slice whole weat bread (the only bread i could find w/o high fructose corn syrup lol) i know the milk has alot of sugar but its just such a damn good source of protein. any thoughts as to whether or not im getting too much sugar from this?

oh, i take a multi vit in the morning, it doesnt have much potassium in it though so im worried about that. any thoughts?

meal 2: approximatley 300 cals. 1 can tuna + 10 oz watermelon (i love watermelon, plus its got lycopene) this meal winds up coming out to be 60 cals short. its also the only part of the day so far where ive been feeling somewhat hungry before the next one

meal 3: approx 300 cals. 250 cals of various nuts + a salad (i like some variety here so i weigh them and go by the cals per serving and bust out the scale to figure it out) today it was walnuts and almonds. since walnuts have omega 3 im sticking w/ them to be at least part of that. the salad is raw w/o dressing (ive never liked having stuff on my salad) as far as apatite goes, this meal helped alot.

meal 4 approx 300: pouch of turkey/tuna/chicken + 2 slices of whole weat bread (meat in a foil pouch is damn expensive, but its just so much better tasting imho)

meal 5 approx 300: 8 eggs + large apple. im eating just one of the yolks. this is the one meal i havent had yet, usually the eggs alone were plenty of food so i think this will have me well covered through the night.

well, i know FIVE sounds a little weird since ive essentially combined 2 meals at the start of the day, but i eat every 3 hours starting at 9 in the morning so having more would be late night eating.

any thoughts from anyone whos done a cut before?

edit: in a short while im going to go running, but no lifting until tommorow which is my 'heavy day'. to be honest, i hate doing triples, i feel like its not enough reps for me to add weight and still be able to complete the desired rep range, since i have a 3 day a week fullbody routine my current plan is this-- rather than having an 8 rep day, and active rest lifting day and the heavy 3 rep day im moving to two 6 rep days and the active rest day. 6 reps is ideal in that when i add weight i wont have to worry about not even being able to do the second set or come up with almost no reps, also since its still sem-good for hypertrophy but still pretty heavy it should help me maintain muscle on this cut. another thing, when i used to do the same rep ranges with the same excercise twice a week (only did this on bench for any length of time) i got GREAT results, often times i could push up 5 lbs a week. obviously i wont be getting this much stronger but if i can go up for example 10 lbs in 3 weeks i will be pushing a good bit more weight in all my lifts by the end of the summer.

06-23-2005, 05:09 PM
Good luck with the goals bro.

06-23-2005, 05:47 PM

so much for the running, there were around 10 cars at the track and a ****load of people. i hate doing stuff like that in a crowd ( i was hoping it would be like last time i was there with just a few people, and that bothered me enough, but when i would have to sprint around and amongst lots people who i dont know thats pretty weird), im thinking that the middle of the day is better because most people are at work and hiding inside with their AC's.

does anyone who has ever done any serious running think that NON RUNNING HIIT would be much good for performance? because i can do that type of thing any time.

06-24-2005, 09:50 AM
wow, im surprised how much energy i had lifting today, i think my idea of having the one big meal in the morning probably helped me a lot. my heavy day went so well overall that im going to keep a heavy day rather than have to days of 6 reps 2 sets, i am however moving my 8 rep day to a 6 rep day because i like going heavier so much more and thats a 10% weight difference pretty much.

ATF squats- loaded up the bar with 215 the goal was two triples 4 mins apart. its been a while since i did atf (ive just been going a little deep on my heavy days, i thought it would be nice to have higher weight so i would get used to squatting heavier) so i made a pretty crappy estimate with this and wound up pinned down at the bottom. its the familiar feeling that i could get it up, but i would have bad form, so i just let it come down on the pins (and hit my head lightly on a plate as i fell out from under it lol). i didnt make any more attempts to squat since i would take too much time tooling around witht he weight just to have the numbers wrong because id fatigue myself figuring it out. i decided that for a while im only going to do zerchers, i like them and i know my max, plus they have some nice ROM to them as well, so ill probably do just zerchers for around 6 weeks. (supposedly zercher worked pretty well for ed zercher :D )

flat bench- loaded up with 185, the goal was two triples, nailed it but struggled a little on the last rep of the second set. adding 5 lbs for next week.

weighted chin-up- added 10 lbs to myself and did 3 the first set, and just one in the second set (the last rep of the first set wasnt a kip, but i did sorta throw my chin up to get the rep, all other reps were true to form and the last one was very controlled too). im keeping this weight.

deadlift- 280 lbs, goal is two triples. nailed it. adding 5 lbs for next week. (odd that i can do this but not 305 for a single anymore, maybe i can now though)

military press- 120 lbs, did 2 the first set had a hard time. then widened my grip and almost got the 3rd rep of the last but didnt, so im keeping the weight.

BB curl- 85 lbs, goal was two triples, nailed it. i noticed that flexing my abs and standing as still and bolt upright as possible actually helps. + 5 lbs for next week

power cleans- i didnt do these since im still just sort of playing when i do them, i AM trying but they dont help my other lifts much, ive got the form just about down but not quite so i dont like to do them heavy all that much, all the risk of getting hurt was NOT worth it. also, when i emphasized these more my dl suffered.

even though this isnt a planned running or cardio day im thinking about doing some hiit.

06-27-2005, 12:54 PM
the last few days have gone by easily as far as my diet goes, ive also found a nice place to run. today my weight session was a bit rough though.

zercher squats (done prison style by dling it off the floor and squatting down such that i maintained it on top of my thighs and then i could put my arms under and begin-even though i have a rack. its just so fun to do and makes you feel hardcore), goal was 160 lbs 6X2; did 6 then 4. im keeping the weight, i was close. btw, all exercises had the goal range of 6 X 2.
flat bench press 175 lbs cracked out a pair of fours, i did some stupid stuff yesterday that fatigued me so i kept the weight (a max set of light weight benches to failure and then a max set of push ups to failure, it was for an experiment to see if benching was harder than push ups when there was the same loading. due to the lack of stabalization needed from the upper body in the push up its not as good; the push up works in a set motion around a pivot point. of course common sense says that so it was in some ways a waste of time.)
RG pulldowns 150 lbs did 5 then 2, this was rougher than i had thought, im going down to 145
deadlifts 255lbs, did 4 then 5, a little tough because for some reason my grip was a little slow and im not used to resetting at the bottom. to maintain form at higher weight i intend to start doing this though.
mil press 110, did a triple and then a 4, messed with grip some more. dropping to 105
bb curl two triples like on friday. the weight i used to use on my heavy day is not yet appropriate for my 6 rep day. dropping curl weight 5 lbs.
didnt do any cleans, i might start them again.

to the first time reader of my journal, im still messing with the rep ranges and thats why you see so many instances of me dropping the weight, its not that this cut is making me weaker. it doesnt seem to be making me any lighter either, but hey, a watched pot never boils and its only been a few days.

07-01-2005, 11:44 AM
man, i dont think anyone reads my journal :cry: :cry: :cry:
im probably going to change the title as a public relations move :D

todays heavy day went pretty well.

dls 285 goal was 3 X 2 (3 X 2 w/ 4 mins rest is desired range for all exercises on this day), nailed it! just like last week, so thats good, im moving up quickly. and actually it was easier this week so thats even better.

flat bench 190, did two doubles. went with a slightly closer grip than optimal, im keping the weight for next week.

weighted chins, this time i really had myself all the way to 190 whereas i was lighter last week, did a 2 and a 1 with perfect still form.

zercher squats, 170, nailed that too. im going to start using my rack though because doing them prison style causes some unecessary fatigue, also i was holding the bar off to the side a bit on the second set and it was really weird.

mil presses, 120, did 2 and then 1. did true to form with feet together, facing out at 45 degree angles and never moving them or leaning back or anything else, so this is still good for me becaus in the past i had a more stable foot posit.

bb curl 90, did a pair of doubles. im probably going to replace these with some type of bb rows. i like a nice curl but this is really an iso exercise so i think id be better off moving on

one of these days ill actually do cleans again with my workouts...

my cut is going nice too, i lost a little too much weight (3 lbs in a week) but with my higher bf thats not that bad plus ive gained strength and so long as i dont come out of this that much smaller the strength is all i care about.

07-01-2005, 12:09 PM
Nice DLs and Zerchers. The curls are really useless.

07-01-2005, 01:28 PM
The only advice I could give you is to ALWAYS keep busy. Never rest. When I was cutting I had my ass outside all the time. Constant moving, even just bouncing a ball around somewhere, beats the **** outta sitting.

07-01-2005, 02:29 PM
ok, im going to replace bb curls with bb rows. ive pretty much got hand placement and direction decided ( i was wondering if i should do a reverse grip or a double OH, i went with double oh). my question is this, should i row at like a 45 degree angle (actually, closer to paralell than that, im just using it as an example) or should i go to 90 and put my forehead on a bench to take load off my back? i like incorperating more muscle groups and i dont like the isolation aspect of the braced version, am i right in thinking im better off with the lean over rather than the full up paralell to floor bend that would almost require me to brace my head on something?

07-01-2005, 02:35 PM
Either is fine. Do whatever one works best for you.

07-04-2005, 01:23 PM
todays workout

goals for all, 6 X 2 w/ 3 mins rest.

zercher squats- 160 lbs, nailed it. adding 5 lbs

bench press- 175, did 5 and went for the 6th rep. failed. fatigued me some and i was only able to do 3 on the next set, still better than last week.

reverse grip pulldown- i went with 140 which was a little light, nailed it. going up 5 lbs

deadlifts- sad story here, went with 255, did 6 on the first set and noticed that i had a slight headache from dehydration/overheating. i was only able to do 4 on the next one, i stopped partially because i really wanted water and was feeling weird. im keeping the weight and im sure that next week will be a walk in the park.

mil presses- 105, nailed it. adding 5 lbs

i was going to do rows but i realised that i was running late on my 3:00 meal and i had a headache. i think i became dehydrated/overheated because i didnt put my fan on its higher speeds since those scare my cat and i dont like bothering him when hes sleeping. next time im going to turn the fan up, he wakes my ass up all the time in the middle of the night and parks all 20 lbs of him on my windpipe.

07-08-2005, 09:35 AM
diet and running have been going good.

todays heavy day didnt go well at all, it was definitley one of those bad days.

goal 3X2 4 mins rest

dls, did 2 in the first set, i felt like i could have done 3 but i just didnt. then i didnt lift it for a single rep on the next set, i know i could have done it but somehow i just didnt. i wasnt focused well at all, i think that could have been it.

bench press. 190 did 2 doubles, just like last week.

weighted chin ups. did 2 (one less) and 2 (one more) than last week. not sure what this means. probably that i wasnt trying as hard as i could have been in the first set

zerchers. id rather not talk about these, im going back to ATFs, im really tired of having these damn bruises on my arms CONSTANTLY from zerchers. that part of my body wasnt meant to hold weight on...

military press. did 1 then 2. same volume but switched reps/sets from last week.

did some rows instead of curls but didnt record the weight, it was just to get the feel for them and they werent all that heavy. i have added them to my workouts and removed curls for next week.

removed cleans from my workout, i havent actually done them in some time.

of all my lifts i place the greatest stock in my deadlift and as my deadlift goes so does my workout, my dls were sloppy (not form wise, but effort wise and losing track of rest time) so thats what my workout became, not full effort and often going a minute or two either way (and usually less rest since i got in a hurry).

i feel bad that i basically lost my 'tough' so to speak (i have no better word for it, its that part of you that combats the intensity and allows you to press on even though its really damn hard and physically taxing). if i got any good from this today its that i cant wait until next week when i can get back what i seem to have lost today, i just hope i have such high spirits when i go to deadlift heavy in a week because ive noticed that of all my lifts my dl seems to be most influenced by my mind than the squat or bench (or millies, or cleans etc...). no matter my mood i can bench just fine and other than me getting REALLY lazy or tired of the bruises in the case of zerchers im always fine to squat the same weight for as many or more reps. but in the short time that i quit dling heavy i lost alot of strength on the lift. sure i had trouble with the 290 lbs today but a couple weeks ago when i was doing cleans on heavy day instead of dls i had a hard time liftng it once for a max. yet a month before my max was 315, and im still not home on that yet, but i will be soon enough, and then, with any luck, ill leave it in the dust.

obviously i wont be adding any weight to my heavy day except on my rows that are now part of my routine.

comments and words of encouragement are welcome.

07-09-2005, 12:39 PM
i definitley wasnt going all out on dls, they almost always give me lower back doms but i have NONE today. not just that but i have virtually no glute or hamstring doms. (yes im sure its doms, not from bad form. its like flys gave me chest doms 100% of the time when i did them)

if i didnt have to do dls the day after tomorrow i would go deadlift right now :cry:

07-11-2005, 03:24 PM
todays hypertrophy day went good.

goal 6 X 2; 3 mins rest 'tween sets.

deadlifts, 255 lbs. i beat the **** out of this one, it wasnt even close, just like i predicted. adding 5lbs for next week.

flat bench, 175 lbs. once again did 5 then 3. keeping the weight, if next week i push out the same im going to drop 5-10 lbs and work my way back up.

reverse grip pulldowns. 5 then 4, keeping the weight.

atf squats, loaded up 180 on the bar... i seem to have gotten weaker in my squats when i took a break and did those zerchers. also, my form started sucking ass on the 3rd rep so i quit doing them right there and im dropping it by 10 lbs for next week.

military press, did 5 then 2, keeping the weight. next week im going to do overhead presses instead because i feel like the lack of stability with the soldier like foot placement is holding my shoulders back, and i get my core worked enough when i squat and deadlift.

bb rows, 105 lbs, did it, adding 5 lbs. im a little worried about form, i felt like i might have been flicking my wrists to get a little more height.

all in all, a good workout.

sometimes i wonder if my squat is my worst lift becuase i dont care about it, i have alot of pride in pushing up my best numbers in deads and bench presses but in squats i dont really care so maybe thats why they are so weak.

comments are encouraged :D

07-13-2005, 11:44 AM
i decided to finally start doing the active rest day in my routine which falls on wednesday. i would up quitting and i think it would be better to just abridge this in the future so i only do squat bench and bb row as opposed to my normal workouts. it was really rough just to do the squats and i was just shaking way to much to do deads. the pump made my tetanus shot (overdue for one and they talked me into it when i got a sports physical) hurt alot worse lol.

why does no one respond to my journal :cry: :cry: :cry:

jk, but i would like some feedback as to whether my active rest day is even worth doing and if so is it ok to abridge it like i asked about.

07-14-2005, 11:27 AM
im starting to think active rest is bogus, my legs feel like they are going to fall off, my heavy day tommorrow is going to be damn hard...

07-14-2005, 11:46 AM
Don't try to make active recovery a regular part of your routine. Only use it when you think it's necessary. I like to do some active recovery the day after a heavy squat day and generally that's it.

On your DLs, don't use DOMS as a guage of achievment. You're probably just used to them. As long as the weights are increasing, you're making progress.

07-15-2005, 09:55 AM
but the weights quit increasing on deads (well, i guess just for a week, but still its a sudden stop to go from two triples to one double in just a 5 lb jump). and i know doms doesnt mean a good or bad workout, but it seems like if you always have it then suddenly dont, something DIFFERENT happened. different could be good or bad.

anyway, my heavy day turned out not to be much of a day at all, everything was pre fatigued, i was weaker from my active rest day. i think your right, they shouldnt be done for no reason.

my deads went like last week except i almost did a rep on the second set, i got it to just under my knees and then ran out of steam (which sucks because once it hits my knees its good to go).

im starting to dislike my routine, maybe ill start westside earlier than planned or try something else. ive been thinking alot about westside and i know what most of the assistance exercises i want to do are so maybe i should just start it after i give this program a few more weeks. i am in a caloric deficit though as im cutting and i will be cutting for a good bit longer, will i be able to handle westside in this state?

07-15-2005, 10:02 AM
Are you maxing on DLs every week? If so, DON'T. As a rule you shouldn't max on anything more than once every 4 weeks, but DLs will really suffer if you try to do them more often than every 6-8 weeks. Are your other lifts suffering as well?

07-15-2005, 12:02 PM
im not maxing on dls frequently, i do however have the occasional failure rep.

my squat is down as well, but thats just because i took a break from squats to do zercher squats (which is my #1 worry about westside, i dont respond well to NOT doing an exercise and expecting to get better at it). i dont know about my bench.

im beggining to wonder if i should just take a week off because i havent taken one off since the start of may. i worry about doing it though because im cutting and if i stop lifting for a while my body might have a tendancy to drop more muscle because it thinks i dont need it.

07-15-2005, 12:08 PM
Take a week off and go maintenance. Your body will thank you.

The beauty of the basic Westside program is that you will be doing squat bench and dead every week, just not maxing out on them every week.

I would skip the zerchers unless you feel your quads are lacking. If you're having a hard time with deads, it's more likely your hammys that need the work. If I were to replace squats with anything, it would be GMs.

07-15-2005, 09:46 PM
Take a week off and go maintenance. Your body will thank you.

The beauty of the basic Westside program is that you will be doing squat bench and dead every week, just not maxing out on them every week.

I would skip the zerchers unless you feel your quads are lacking. If you're having a hard time with deads, it's more likely your hammys that need the work. If I were to replace squats with anything, it would be GMs.

if id have to stop my cut, id rather not do it.

major edit: removed useless thread content

07-17-2005, 02:22 PM
i think i see my problem, when i up the weight i cant do as many reps which means even lower volume than what my routine calls for (ie: im already doing low reps and sets, so when i cant do as many reps and im only doing 2 sets, im probably undertraining). from now on, if i cant finish a set ill take a quick 10-15 second rest break, do more reps to get the intended volume, and THEN begin my actual rest break. this way i get more volume of work which is one of the main things i think i need.

07-18-2005, 01:49 PM
my workout went pretty decent today.

goal for all: 6X2

deadlifts, 260. nailed it, accidently rounded my back on the way down of the last rep of the last set. it hurt a little bit and i got paranoid and didnt squat, but i probably could have, it doesnt hurt at all anymore. adding 5 lbs

bench press, 175. instead of how ive been doing them, i did them with a couple seconds of pause just over my chest and then an explode to the top. only got out a few on the first set and did them conventionally on the second and had 3 reps there (same as before). after i pushed out my triple on the second set i took a 10 second break and did another rep, i did that to 6. then when i did my pulldowns i supersetted in some benching. keeping weight.

reverse grip pulldowns, 145. did 6 then 4, almost made it but not quite. keeping weight.

squats-like i said, didnt do.

OH press, 110, did same as last week (5 and 2) but my triceps were probably a little over fatigued from benching.

bb rows- running short on time, so i skipped them. i didnt do this from lazyness, i did a good bit more benching work after the end of my workout and ran 30+ mins late for my meal from lifting for so much longer than i had thought at the start.

more bench pressing- i did some lower weight pause & explode style reps, some skull crushers (which hurt my elbows, but its because im not used to them i think, when i used to do db extensions i had the same problem if i added weight too quick) and some press downs. then i busted out the dumbells and did some incline pressing and then flat pressing to failure with 50's. with any luck, this massive change in benching volume will break my plateau. the reason im most worried about bench is that ive had the least sucess w/ it lately, yes, deads have given my some trouble on heavy day, but light day is going good and i seem to be regaining strength nicely, yet on bench i barely moved before stalling out again. i really need to get back to squatting :D. should i just go to parallell on heavy day?