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ShadyRensch
07-17-2005, 05:25 PM
I just can't seem to win these days. As I've posted many a time before, I have lost a lot of weight dating back to about a year and a half ago, about 80 pounds. I did this while on Weight Watchers and since then I have stopped.

I've been lifting a ton for the past 3-5 months, I used Creatine for a good two months, and now I'm on NO2, Protein, and Thermorexin.

I am 19 years old, 6'0'' and I range from 200-210 week to week....There's my problem, I go on here and find out I shouldn't be doing weight watchers cuz it's not enough calories/fats/protein etc.... Then I tried pretty much just starving myself which is stupid but it was working, I ate breakfast...only had a protein shake for lunch...then ate whatever my parents made for supper. And I got down to 200 pounds, the lowest I had ever been.

I can't seem to find a diet to stick to right now, and I need some help. Like this past week I just pretty much ate whatever, and it might sound stupid, but I seriously get hardcore pissed off when I gain weight. When I look in the mirror I just am disgusted, even if it's a minute change. I just got back this weekend from up North with my dad fishing and we ate fast food places, and junk foods in the boat. I couldn't just not eat. And when I got home this afternoon first thing I did was hop on the scale=208 pounds. This seriously pisses me off.

I just really want a good diet, that is going to cut off this frickin flabby fat I have left from losing all that weight, I hate it but I've become so picky with my body since that, and I just need a good diet I can stick to.

Since I lift 3-5 times a week, and also run just as many days, I don't know how to get a proper Cut diet, while I'm lifting still so much.

Built told me to look at her diet, but it's so confusing to me. I'm desperate, I seriously just feel horrible when I gain any weight back again after how hard I worked. I'm sure a lot of it is water weight, and stuff like that, but I need a solid diet to get this extra flab off.

ddegroff
07-17-2005, 05:38 PM
Yeah, try to six healthy meals a day. Also i would do a search on cut diets, because this is a very popular question. The diet that you were talking about when you lost all the weight is a bad idea. Its also why you have put some of the weight back on.

Built
07-17-2005, 06:25 PM
What's confusing, hon?

Figure out how many calories to maintain. Then drop by 10-15%.

Eat 1.0-1.5g protein per pound goal weight.

Eat at least 0.5g fat per pound goal weight.

Get the rest of your calories from whatever combination of protein, carb or fat you desire.

Split the protein into 6 meals.

Eat the rest of the stuff you get to eat that day with those meals.

Target the starchy carbs to the meal before and the meals after you lift, and only on lifting days.

On non-lifting days, limit or eliminate the starchy carbs. Just eat protein, fruit and veggies with healthy fats for those meals.

Built
07-17-2005, 06:26 PM
Tell me your goal weight and your maintenance calories, and your workout days, and I'll break it down for you, okay?

ShadyRensch
07-17-2005, 08:14 PM
Okay, well right now I weigh about 205. I'm 6'0''. My goal weight would be about 180. I'm not sure what my maintenance calories are...sorry.

I workout right now just upper body, Monday Wednesday and Friday.
I run Monday-Friday though at night usually after 7 PM.

Built, you have been so much help since I joined this forum. Thanks a ton. If you need any more info I will try to help!

CarlP
07-17-2005, 08:17 PM
Okay, well right now I weigh about 205. I'm 6'0''. My goal weight would be about 180. I'm not sure what my maintenance calories are...sorry.

I workout right now just upper body, Monday Wednesday and Friday.
I run Monday-Friday though at night usually after 7 PM.

Built, you have been so much help since I joined this forum. Thanks a ton. If you need any more info I will try to help!

Work your entire body. Squats are your friend.

Tony G
07-17-2005, 08:23 PM
1. What's your body composition?
2. What's a typical day look like in terms of your diet?
3. Why are you only training half your body?

EDIT: Do you do HIIT?

BG5150
07-17-2005, 08:26 PM
..and stay away from the scale...it's the body fat % I think you need to consider. Someone who weighs 200# and has 12% bf and someone who weighs 200# and has 25% bf look like two totally different people. Tell me who you think would look better?

Built
07-17-2005, 08:33 PM
Okay, well, let's suppose your maintenance calories are 3000 a day.

You'll have to tweak this if it's wrong, but we need a starting point.

So, get in your protein: let's set it at 1.5g/lb goal weight: 270 g

Fats at 0.5g/lb goal weight put you at 90g fat per day.

Carbs at about the same as protein and you're at about 3000 calories a day to maintain.

To carb/calorie cycle, split your protein into 6 meals of 45g of protein each.

To each of these meals, add in the rest of the calories you have for the day, targeting your starchy carbs around your lifts. The other meals are the protein you get, plus a non-starchy vegetable and some healthy fat.

An example of a protein and starch meal could be chicken breast with a cup of brown rice.

An example of a protein and fat meal could be chicken breast with a half an avocado and a salad.

Or steak and buttered broccoli.

For non-lifting days, ditch the starches. So your carbs will come from any fruit you eat (try to stick to lower carb fruits, such as berries), non-starchy vegetables you eat, but no sugars or starches other than this. Your carbs for your non-lifting days will likely come to about 60-100g, which is fine. Increase your fats a bit on these days - maybe go to about 110g fat for your lower carb days. With 90g of carb, your non-lifting days will have about 2500 calories.

So, summarizing:

Lifting days: 270g each of protein and carb, 90g fat. Carbs in the meal before and the meals following your lifts (keep these meals low fat). Protein and fat in all other meals. Green veggies as often as you like. (About 3000 calories).

Non-lifting days: 270g protein, 110g fat, 90g carb. Spread the carbs around reasonably evenly in all your meals. (Just under 2500 calories)

You may well chose to drop or raise calories from this point. But it'll get you started with the carb cycling concept.

Now, I have NO idea why you aren't working your lower body. Running does NOT build up your leggies, and you're REALLY missing out on fat burning by ignoring the lower body lifts because these are SUCH large muscles. Nothing stimulates test like squats and deads. I'd ditch a night of running and add in a forth day for legs if I were you. Seriously.

Built
07-17-2005, 08:36 PM
Oh, and feel free to increase the fats and drop the carbs by as much as you like for the lifting days. The 90g fat is a MINIMUM, not a target.

ShadyRensch
07-17-2005, 08:46 PM
I know, starting this week on Tues., Thurs. I am going to lift legs again, with Squats, Curls, Extensions, Lunges. etc.

Built
07-17-2005, 08:52 PM
...deads...

NormalDude
07-17-2005, 10:18 PM
I am totally on the same page as ShadyRensch. I am a bit bigger though. I was wondering if the only way to go is 6 meals ? Can this be done in 3 meals? My goal might be different from his. I am just trying to drop fat plain and simple.

Optimum08
07-17-2005, 10:22 PM
Built=Amazing...

Optimum08
07-17-2005, 10:22 PM
I am totally on the same page as ShadyRensch. I am a bit bigger though. I was wondering if the only way to go is 6 meals ? Can this be done in 3 meals? My goal might be different from his. I am just trying to drop fat plain and simple.

just read what Built wrote...all the diet related knowledge u need is there...

Built
07-17-2005, 10:22 PM
It can be done in ONE meal, if you must.

Many here find it a lot easier to survive lower calories with multiple protein-centred meals - keeps a steady flow of food happening.

The strategy I've outlined above is a cutting strategy, not a muscle-gaining strategy. It's bloody hard to put on muscle while dropping calories, but put it to you this way: would you be HEARTBROKEN if you managed a small gain in LBM? ;)

Built
07-17-2005, 10:23 PM
PS thanks Optimum. :)

NormalDude
07-17-2005, 10:30 PM
Built I put a better post of my question on here called is there a way

Built
07-17-2005, 10:31 PM
The answer is the same.

ShadyRensch
07-17-2005, 11:01 PM
Built, thanks a ton for all of your expertise. I may need to ask some questions here and there, but this should be a good base for me. It may take a little while to figure this out completely, but I think I can do it. Do you usually eat the same things every week? This isn't that hard for me, after being on Weight Watchers for about a year, but I was just wondering. If I can find a pattern of foods to eat, I think this would be much easier.

ddegroff
07-17-2005, 11:16 PM
follow what built said or close to it and the fat will drop off

Built
07-17-2005, 11:42 PM
Shady, you're welcome. I hope you'll be able to find a meal plan that makes you comfortable.

I have a sample day posted in the link in my sig.

I find that in being anal about my macronutrient mix, my foods don't vary all that much from day to day, but I try to deliberately build in variety in small ways - broccoli instead of green beans, pecans instead of almonds, blueberries instead of apples, more meat and less cottage cheese and vice versa, different meats...

I think, from a nutrition point of view, that variety is healthy. It's just harder to program.

Sc00t
07-18-2005, 07:30 AM
Surely, and correct me if I'm wrong here guys cause I'm not 100% on this;

If you want to lose weight, stick at Weight Watchers, but if you want to CUT then you should be reducing your daily cals by 10-15% etc, and they are two completley different things altogether. Cutting and losing weight, that is.

Cardiovascular excersizes man, running, rowing, cycling, stuff like that. You won't get any more muscular, not really, but you will lose weight, as long as you're doing cardio alongside a sensible diet, as I'm sure you know.

Jennikins
07-18-2005, 07:57 AM
Do you usually eat the same things every week?

I started out eating the same stuff every DAY. Very boring - I like my variety too. This is a great thread if you're looking for variety in what you can eat while eating clean:

what a bodybuilder eats... (http://www.wannabebigforums.com/showthread.php?t=46565)

Built
07-18-2005, 11:25 AM
Surely, and correct me if I'm wrong here guys cause I'm not 100% on this;

If you want to lose weight, stick at Weight Watchers, but if you want to CUT then you should be reducing your daily cals by 10-15% etc, and they are two completley different things altogether. Cutting and losing weight, that is.

Cardiovascular excersizes man, running, rowing, cycling, stuff like that. You won't get any more muscular, not really, but you will lose weight, as long as you're doing cardio alongside a sensible diet, as I'm sure you know.

For cutting fat, cardio is not necessary. But the diet and lifting ARE.

The difference between "losing weight" and "cutting" of course is that weight loss doesn't distinguish between muscle and fat loss. On a cut, you want to (ideally) lose no muscle - only fat.

NormalDude
07-18-2005, 11:46 AM
So wait Built your saying I dont need to do 20 minutes of running a day after lifting to drop BF ? I have to imagine it would make my task go alot faster though?

Built
07-18-2005, 11:52 AM
You don't need it, but it will likely speed things along by creating more of a caloric deficit. The bigger deal is that you don't need to create so much caloric deficit through diet - in other words, you don't have to go quite as hungry.

I don't run post workout - I stick to a fast incline walk (3.5 mph, 10% grade) or HIIT if it's after a lighter/upper body workout.

NormalDude
07-18-2005, 12:03 PM
But with the shape your in I have to imagine you did tons of cardio to get there. right?

Unholy
07-18-2005, 12:04 PM
wrong

NormalDude
07-18-2005, 12:07 PM
wrong

Which post?

Unholy
07-18-2005, 12:10 PM
needing alot of cardio to get where she is, Built does as little cardio as possible.

Built
07-18-2005, 05:18 PM
But with the shape your in I have to imagine you did tons of cardio to get there. right?

To get my body ready for the pix in my December shoot, I did virtually NO cardio (I'll hop on my bike recreationally for a 2 hour tour around the city from time to time, but not regularly - maybe once or twice every couple of weeks - I generally eat extra on these days *coughDONUTcough*). I also go for a leisurely stroll with hubby in the evenings sometimes, but this would hardly qualify as "cardio".

Remember, I used to weigh 170 lbs. I was 140 on the dot in December.

I'm doing SOME cardio now as my cut progresses - a 20 minute brisk walk in the AM before breakfast most mornings, and about 20 minutes of fast incline walking, or fast incline walking with 8 minutes of HIIT in the middle, after most lifting days.

That's it.

And for me, that's a LOT of cardio.

D Breyer
07-18-2005, 05:30 PM
wow built rocks

NormalDude
07-18-2005, 05:38 PM
Yeah built I am totally trippin because I swore cardio was the key to dropping the fat. And to look the way you do and not do any signifigant amount of cardio I am amazed

Built
07-18-2005, 05:54 PM
The cardio thing seems to vary tremendously from person to person.

Women typically need more cardio to lean out than men (we have less muscle mass and an unfavourable endocrine profile for fat loss), but the amount needed is less than what most people seem to think.

The key to WEIGHT loss is creating a caloric deficit (any combination of diet, cardio and lifting will do this).

As I understand it, at least one of the keys to FAT loss is maintaining that caloric deficit while convincing your body to hang on to muscle (hence the heavy lifting). Since muscle "costs" more for your body to maintain, you need to convince your body that this muscle "earns its keep". By lifting heavy through your cut, you continually remind your body that, expensive as it is to maintain, it's going to need that muscle so it had better drop some of the less metabolically active fat instead. Compounding this problem, your metabolic rate slows as you cut, particularly if you drop calories too rapidly through whatever combination of exercise and diet you use.

Intense activity (heavy lifting, HIIT) mobilizes free fatty acids. A little strategic steady-state cardio at the end of these activities will burn these FFAs, and a few extra calories. This way, you don't have to diet quite so hard while you cut.

Best of luck. :)

ShadyRensch
07-18-2005, 07:21 PM
I was busy at my work today, and my dear Ma checked out some Natty PB at the grocery store for me. She said that the Jiffy Creamy we have is actually less fat and has no trans fats. It's the reduced fat version, but she said that all of the Natural PB's were higher in fat. What's the deal? Is she coockoo and should I go check for myself?

Also, about the cardio, I actually enjoy running later at about 7 or 8 at night after workouts, if I can do it without exhausting myself it will only help my cut right?

ddegroff
07-18-2005, 07:49 PM
natty pb is probabaly higher in fat but its good fat, check it out for yourself. It has more mono and poly fats.

Built
07-18-2005, 10:56 PM
Get natty. It's better for you.

ShadyRensch
07-19-2005, 07:58 AM
Should I continue to use creatine and protein during my cut or is that just a waste of them?

MM
07-19-2005, 08:07 AM
Don't stop using it, it's not a waste of time. In fact, it will help you.

IRN-BRU
07-19-2005, 03:14 PM
Here's some advice that hasn't been mentioned. You need to get less emotional about your current weight, and have confidence about the fact that in the long term this will work. If it doesnt work - adjust it - dont get pissed off and give up. Have some faith in yourself dude, good luck.

I've felt the same way, results may take a few weeks to get going, stick at it, and keep vigilant (except on cheat day).

Built
07-19-2005, 03:40 PM
Nice point, IrnBru - I've had to go through this one myself.

What you are doing WILL work, IF you get your diet and training dialled in. This will involve endless tweaking as you move through the process, but once you find your groove, you'll see the results and believe that it really IS true - you ARE in control of it.

:)

ShadyRensch
07-19-2005, 03:54 PM
Thanks for all the advice, I'm just excited to get it started, I bought some things at the grocery store today and am starting tomorrow. I'm not worried about staying determined, because I know after losing 80 pounds that anything is possible. Once again the advice is highly appreciated.

CarlP
07-19-2005, 08:27 PM
Nice point, IrnBru - I've had to go through this one myself.

What you are doing WILL work, IF you get your diet and training dialled in. This will involve endless tweaking as you move through the process, but once you find your groove, you'll see the results and believe that it really IS true - you ARE in control of it.

:)

This doesn't get said enough, IMO. Everyone here just says "squat, rest, eat" Which is excellent, don't get me wrong. But no diet or routine is perfect, there are always some adjustments to make. Use the advice here to get started, then find what works best for YOU.

Shao-LiN
07-19-2005, 09:50 PM
But with the shape your in I have to imagine you did tons of cardio to get there. right?

You don't actually have to do any cardio to lose fat. What it comes down to is caloric deficit, which cardio will help create.

Shao-LiN
07-19-2005, 09:50 PM
This doesn't get said enough, IMO. Everyone here just says "squat, rest, eat" Which is excellent, don't get me wrong. But no diet or routine is perfect, there are always some adjustments to make. Use the advice here to get started, then find what works best for YOU.

I've seen lots of peple say that it takes a lot of tweaking and adjusting...hell, I always say it.

ShadyRensch
07-20-2005, 07:10 AM
I've without question took every poiinter you all have given me thank you! One thing tho, 3000 calories seems like a lot to me. Is this right for me? At 205 and 6'0'' that's the ONLY thing I'm just a little concerned with.

Anthony
07-20-2005, 07:54 AM
Intense activity (heavy lifting, HIIT) mobilizes free fatty acids. A little strategic steady-state cardio at the end of these activities will burn these FFAs, and a few extra calories. This way, you don't have to diet quite so hard while you cut.

I found this interesting ... that HIIT "mobilizes" FFA and steady state at the end will "burn" them. I'm curious to read more about this since my HIIT is pure HIIT and no steady state. Do you have any studies, Built? Thanks!

Anthony
07-20-2005, 07:57 AM
I'm without question took every poiinter you all have given me thank you! One thing tho, 3000 calories seems like a lot to me. Is this right for me? At 205 and 6'0'' that's the ONLY thin I'm just a little concerned with.

She used it as a guideline to provide you with an example. It really depends on your level of activity, body composition, food choices, etc. The best way to determine your maintenance calories is to record what you eat for 1-2 weeks (www.fitday.com) and weigh yourself. If you gain weight, you're eating above maintenance. If you lose weight, you're below. If you stay the same ... bingo ... you just found your maintenance calories and now you can adjust accordingly.

Anthony
07-20-2005, 08:17 AM
I was busy at my work today, and my dear Ma checked out some Natty PB at the grocery store for me. She said that the Jiffy Creamy we have is actually less fat and has no trans fats. It's the reduced fat version, but she said that all of the Natural PB's were higher in fat. What's the deal? Is she coockoo and should I go check for myself?

Most people use PB in their diet for the fat content. The protein doesn't hurt either. ;)

sharkall2003
07-20-2005, 08:55 AM
Yeah, I have one peanut butter and raspberry jelly sandwhich every day with 12 grain bread. Works great. You get fiber protein and a little bit of a fruit serving. I would just think very positive. I believe that a great attitude is the way to go about things. Just say you know you can lose the weight. And you will be able to do it.

Built
07-20-2005, 12:11 PM
I found this interesting ... that HIIT "mobilizes" FFA and steady state at the end will "burn" them. I'm curious to read more about this since my HIIT is pure HIIT and no steady state. Do you have any studies, Built? Thanks!


I don't. I'm parroting somebody whom I trust very much.

I'll try to find the studies to back me up.

Built
07-20-2005, 12:35 PM
Yeah, I have one peanut butter and raspberry jelly sandwhich every day with 12 grain bread. Works great. You get fiber protein and a little bit of a fruit serving. I would just think very positive. I believe that a great attitude is the way to go about things. Just say you know you can lose the weight. And you will be able to do it.
Um, if you think raspberry jam is a good source of fruit...

ryuage
07-20-2005, 12:37 PM
To get stubborn fat mobilized, you have to overcome a fairly severe resistance in terms of both blood flow and lipolysis, this requires very high concentrations of catecholamines (adrenaline/noradrenaline). Basically you jack up the levels then let them fall by taking maybe a 5 minute break... what was outlined for me was something along the lines of

5-10 minutes high intensity or intervals break then 30-45 minutes low/moderate intensity, take in mind this is done first thing on an empty stomach/low carb diet/or a few hours after a meal if you are doing this for the sole purpose of mobilizing "stubborn fat" Now for each portion it is recommended that you use 2 seperate means of cardio so if you do hiit on one machine use another machine to do the moderate session.

The study was along the lines of roughly 5 minutes after fairly high intensity cardio (steady state) there was this big jump in blood fatty acid levels. bascially, it looked like the stored triglycerides were broken down but trapped in the fat cell (by lactate and everythign else associate with high intensity work) and only when the high intensity stimulus was removed did they 'appear' systemically. Thus the need to wait then resume with moderate intensity to burn the mobilized fatty acids.

Also was advised was no ephedrine use but caffeine/yohimbine would be beneficial in this case.

NormalDude
07-20-2005, 01:14 PM
To get stubborn fat mobilized, you have to overcome a fairly severe resistance in terms of both blood flow and lipolysis, this requires very high concentrations of catecholamines (adrenaline/noradrenaline). Basically you jack up the levels then let them fall by taking maybe a 5 minute break... what was outlined for me was something along the lines of

5-10 minutes high intensity or intervals break then 30-45 minutes low/moderate intensity, take in mind this is done first thing on an empty stomach/low carb diet/or a few hours after a meal if you are doing this for the sole purpose of mobilizing "stubborn fat" Now for each portion it is recommended that you use 2 seperate means of cardio so if you do hiit on one machine use another machine to do the moderate session.

The study was along the lines of roughly 5 minutes after fairly high intensity cardio (steady state) there was this big jump in blood fatty acid levels. bascially, it looked like the stored triglycerides were broken down but trapped in the fat cell (by lactate and everythign else associate with high intensity work) and only when the high intensity stimulus was removed did they 'appear' systemically. Thus the need to wait then resume with moderate intensity to burn the mobilized fatty acids.

Also was advised was no ephedrine use but caffeine/yohimbine would be beneficial in this case.


Ok forgive me for being a ****** but can I get some more english in there please

getfit
07-20-2005, 01:17 PM
Ok forgive me for being a ****** but can I get some more english in there please
HUH? that's english!

spanky33
07-20-2005, 01:49 PM
Ok forgive me for being a ****** but can I get some more english in there please


1)basically, just run as hard as you can for 5 mins, then take a short break, then jog for 45 mins.
2)Lay off the ephedra, take some caffeine.
3) done on empty stomach or during a low carb diet.

hope this helps

2BBuilt
07-20-2005, 01:49 PM
I've without question took every poiinter you all have given me thank you! One thing tho, 3000 calories seems like a lot to me. Is this right for me? At 205 and 6'0'' that's the ONLY thing I'm just a little concerned with.

It depends. It may well be high. Try it as a baseline for a couple of weeks and see if you maintain a 1-2 pound per week loss. If not, you might want to drop your daily consumed calories down 200 for a week and see if that helps.

I have a history of several starvation diets. I did these before I knew any better and that has screwed with my metabolism. So all of the online BMR calculators were too high. By slowly lowering my calorie intake 200 at a time until I found I could loose 2 pounds a week I was able to find my true metabolism rate. It just takes trial and error. Adjusting from 3000 calories a day is much better than using, say, 1000 calories at a starting point. Because if your body goes into a starvation mode then all results will be tainted. Also, don't adjust the protein intake. Take the adjusted calories from the carbs and fats.

I guessed that I was burning 2800 calories per day. I subtracted 500 from it, as a safe starting point, leaving me with a 2300 calorie diet. I slowly adjusted it down until I was able to loose 2lbs per week. I ended up at 1600 calories per day which I'm on now. That puts my true metabolism rate at about 2600.

FYI, here is the plan I'm following...

First I determined these stats:

5'11", 225lbs, 30% body fat
Calculate lean body mass:

225 x 0.70(30%bf) = 157.5 LBM
Calculate protein requirements for maintainence and repair:

157.5(LBM) x 1.25g(protein) = 197g per day (33g per meal x 6)

-2b

NormalDude
07-20-2005, 01:56 PM
1)basically, just run as hard as you can for 5 mins, then take a short break, then jog for 45 mins.
2)Lay off the ephedra, take some caffeine.
3) done on empty stomach or during a low carb diet.

hope this helps


Thank you thats what I needed.

Anthony
07-20-2005, 01:57 PM
Hmm, interesting ryuage. I'm not going to spend 50 minutes doing cardio, but based on your comments do you think it would be more beneficial to do ...

My current routine: 1 minute warmup, 20 minutes HIIT (10 second sprint, 20 seconds easy for a total of 40 intervals), 1 minute cool down

OR

1 minute warmup, 10 minutes HIIT (10 second sprint, 20 seconds easy for a total of 20 intervals), 1 minute cool down, 5 minute break, 20 minutes steady state at moderate pace.

My goals with this are to aid in fat loss and maintain/increase vo2 max.

ryuage
07-20-2005, 02:01 PM
if general fat loss is your goal and increasing your vo2 max then I would say regular intervals would get that accomplished, anyone can argue what is the most effective way of performing hiit as in interval times but what you are doing is fine, id venture to say though if it was really hiit I dont think you'd be able to handle 40 intervals in a session :) and personally would try somewhere along the lines of 30-45 seconds if fat loss is the "main" goal, As far as vo2 max and increased nutrient partitioning that will happen within the few seconds of the sprint. So no need for the high intensity then the moderate session in your case, at least imo.

spanky33
07-20-2005, 02:02 PM
Hmm, interesting ryuage. I'm not going to spend 50 minutes doing cardio, but based on your comments do you think it would be more beneficial to do ...

My current routine: 1 minute warmup, 20 minutes HIIT (10 second sprint, 20 seconds easy for a total of 40 intervals), 1 minute cool down

OR

1 minute warmup, 10 minutes HIIT (10 second sprint, 20 seconds easy for a total of 20 intervals), 1 minute cool down, 5 minute break, 20 minutes steady state at moderate pace.

My goals with this are to aid in fat loss and maintain/increase vo2 max.


Obviously I'm not ryuage but I think the answer is that you'd have to try both and see what works best for you. Personally, I think the second option looks better. You'll get the benefit of both HIIT and steady state. I tried HIIT for a while but I ended up overtraining my legs, especially since I train legs twice a week. I find steady state easier on my legs.

One important note is that ryuage's earlier post was a study done to burn STUBBORN fat. If you're not at <11% fat then I dont think you have to worry either way. Both HIIT and steady state will help.

Built
07-20-2005, 02:03 PM
Personally, I don't bother with the break.

I do about 3 minutes of steady state, then stretch out my hams and quads, then do 8 intervals (30 seconds each), and finish with the 8 or 9 minutes left (I set the walking pace treadmill for 20 minutes) at a fast incline walk. (3.5 mph, 10% grade)

(I always do these after an upper body workout)

Anthony
07-20-2005, 02:19 PM
Ryuage: I've read some where (on this site, I believe) that shorter intervals are better for fat loss. I'd have to look it up to say why, but it sounded reasonable. As for it being "real" HIIT, keep in mind that I'm only sprinting for ~6.5 minutes over a 20 minute span. It's not easy, and it took a few sessions to build up to 20 minutes, but it's definitely possible.

spanky: I'm sub 10% (clip at 7.5% which probably puts me around 9.5%), so if the concept is legit I could probably benefit from it.

built: you said you do 8 intervals, is that 4 sprint + 4 easy @ 30 seconds each, or is it 8 sprint @ 30 seconds? I've always considered 1 interval = sprint + easy. So in my case, 1 interval = 30 seconds (10 sprint + 20 easy).

Built
07-20-2005, 02:52 PM
8 sprints, 8 walks. 8 minutes in total.

Paladyr
07-21-2005, 06:29 AM
I'd just like to add my personal experience with cardio.

This year my stagnant weight (where my body doesn't want to get leaner) is around 185. I can stay there all day and night without much effort. If I drop my maint. calories down to 1800-2000 (from 2800 or so), I can get down to about 182, but then I stall again. At this point I'm around 20% body fat. I'll stay there forever unless I add cardio. If I simply lift four times a week my weight will just stay the same (as will my bf %). So the amount of cardio you need probably varies from person to person.

spanky33
07-21-2005, 08:55 AM
I'd just like to add my personal experience with cardio.

This year my stagnant weight (where my body doesn't want to get leaner) is around 185. I can stay there all day and night without much effort. If I drop my maint. calories down to 1800-2000 (from 2800 or so), I can get down to about 182, but then I stall again. At this point I'm around 20% body fat. I'll stay there forever unless I add cardio. If I simply lift four times a week my weight will just stay the same (as will my bf %). So the amount of cardio you need probably varies from person to person.

I strongly agree. But this applies to ANYTHING, not just cardio. Everyone will respond differently to different situations. Some people need cardio, some dont. Some do well on low carbs, some dont. Some gain or lose weight quickly, some dont.

The main point is that everyone has to try everything and see what works best for him or her.

Woodward
07-21-2005, 11:28 AM
Built=Amazing...Agreed.

Built
07-21-2005, 03:47 PM
:kiss:

<blushes>