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View Full Version : Tailoring split around cheat day



shootermcgavin7
08-31-2005, 07:18 AM
While I'm sure this has been addressed before (as it is mostly common sense), I ran a quick search for it and nothing immediately stuck out.

It is also a theme in CKD (and I'm guessing in UD 2.0, to an extent); however, I don't use diets based around limiting carbs anymore (tough for me to take in enough calories), and I felt like such crap during the week it is tough to get any decent training in.

What I've attempted to do is to tailor my split during my cut so that my heavy lifts fall around my cheat day.

Example (cheat day falls on Saturday):

Friday: Heavy chest work
Saturday: Heavy Squats
Sunday: Deads
Monday: HIIT
Tuesday: Accessory back work, DE squats
Weds: Accessory shoulder/arm work; DE chest
Thurs: HIIT

My only initial concern with this split was the Squats & Deads on back to back days, but I've been taking in such a massive amount of food on Saturday that it hasn't really been a big issue.


Again, it seems to me to be common sense (structure your heavier lifts around eating); but I just wanted to get some general thoughts.

spanky33
08-31-2005, 09:59 AM
If you're having a cheat day, i'm assuming you're cutting. If you're cutting, then I think you risk overtraining your legs with what you've put together above. You have squats, then deads, then HIIT, then DE squats, then HIIT again on thursday. I say you should cut out at least one of those HIIT sessions and replace it with some other form of light intensity cardio, or high intensity rowing or something.

Manveet
08-31-2005, 10:47 AM
If you're having a cheat day, i'm assuming you're cutting. If you're cutting, then I think you risk overtraining your legs with what you've put together above. You have squats, then deads, then HIIT, then DE squats, then HIIT again on thursday. I say you should cut out at least one of those HIIT sessions and replace it with some other form of light intensity cardio, or high intensity rowing or something.


I disagree.

You can train squats and deads 3x per week and not be overtraining.

As long as you are training away from failure (1-2 reps shy) I see no problem with his outline. Of course, if he wanted that extra day of rest for his low back, he could simply swap heavy chest day and heavy squat day.

shootermcgavin7
08-31-2005, 11:08 AM
Of course, if he wanted that extra day of rest for his low back, he could simply swap heavy chest day and heavy squat day.


I actually tried this in the beginning; because normally I'll work them [squats & deads] at opposite ends of the week. The problem I ran into was I was still on low cals on Friday, which made the squats brutal to get through.


And spanky, I haven't run into any overtraining issues with the HIIT & Squats, I've been through 6 weeks of my cut. I'm assuming there are a lot of people on WBB who do ME & DE squats as well as a couple weekly sessions of HIIT.

spanky33
08-31-2005, 11:31 AM
Ok my bad. I tried HIIT sprints for a while with squats and deads while cutting and I burnt out pretty quickly, after about 3 weeks. It was the HIIT that killed me, not the squats/deads. If it works for you then stick to it.

Manveet
08-31-2005, 12:11 PM
I actually tried this in the beginning; because normally I'll work them [squats & deads] at opposite ends of the week. The problem I ran into was I was still on low cals on Friday, which made the squats brutal to get through.


I think with the Friday session you are going to run into that problem regardless of what body part you decide to train, that's just the nature of training on low calories. Granted, squats are more physically (and mentally) more demanding then most other exercises out there.

With UD2 the goal for the workout prior to the carbup is to gradually shift you back into an anabolic phase, and prime your body for storing glycogen. So a fullbody session (4 sets for bigger parts, 2-3 for smaller parts, 6-12 reps) worked out very well in that situation.

shootermcgavin7
08-31-2005, 09:32 PM
I think with the Friday session you are going to run into that problem regardless of what body part you decide to train, that's just the nature of training on low calories. Granted, squats are more physically (and mentally) more demanding then most other exercises out there.

With UD2 the goal for the workout prior to the carbup is to gradually shift you back into an anabolic phase, and prime your body for storing glycogen. So a fullbody session (4 sets for bigger parts, 2-3 for smaller parts, 6-12 reps) worked out very well in that situation.


I never bought the online book, mainly for the reason that CKD and limiting carbs did not work out very well for me. While I'm sure it has been completely overhauled, the "training around carbs" general theme did not work well for my job, etc. I take it back, CKD worked very well when I would bulk to 200-205 and then cut, and I was in town the majority of the time. I don't want to put it down, the diet worked well.


And I completely agree that the Fri lifts will suffer the most. However, I was most worried about the losses on squats & deads during my cut. I have managed to keep my bench with very minimal losses while even improving squat & dead ME.

To put it simply, I'd advise putting whichever of the "Big 3" you can most do without the day before your cheat day, and the other two around the cheat day, where you eat 3 bowls of Chex, 12 eggs, 12 Krystals, 2 steaks, 3 chicken breasts, and whatever else you can get ahold of.


Edit: Manveet, I think if I ever drop back out of the business world & head back for a PhD, I'll give UD2 a try. But for my line of work, I simply travel too much to manage the specific macros the diet requires.

Manveet
09-01-2005, 10:52 AM
I never bought the online book, mainly for the reason that CKD and limiting carbs did not work out very well for me. While I'm sure it has been completely overhauled, the "training around carbs" general theme did not work well for my job, etc. I take it back, CKD worked very well when I would bulk to 200-205 and then cut, and I was in town the majority of the time. I don't want to put it down, the diet worked well.


And I completely agree that the Fri lifts will suffer the most. However, I was most worried about the losses on squats & deads during my cut. I have managed to keep my bench with very minimal losses while even improving squat & dead ME.

To put it simply, I'd advise putting whichever of the "Big 3" you can most do without the day before your cheat day, and the other two around the cheat day, where you eat 3 bowls of Chex, 12 eggs, 12 Krystals, 2 steaks, 3 chicken breasts, and whatever else you can get ahold of.


Edit: Manveet, I think if I ever drop back out of the business world & head back for a PhD, I'll give UD2 a try. But for my line of work, I simply travel too much to manage the specific macros the diet requires.


For some people being on low carbohydrates is a nightmare. Personally, I've never had too much trouble with energy, cravings etc. while on UD2. As a matter of fact, I tend to feel pretty damn strong while on low carbohydrates.

As for the friday workout, do what works. Now thinking back on my original post, I don't think there is much sense in following a UD2 protocol when you not following the dietary regimen.

tigo
09-05-2005, 12:09 AM
what do you mean overtrain?

also its bad to fail if youre on a cut?