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View Full Version : Good and Bad Advice...which is it?



Y0yo
09-15-2005, 04:20 AM
I'm trying to help a friend sort out his lifting routine and diet. However, he's decided to follow the advice of someone else. This someone else is much leaner and stronger than I am, so it would look as though he knows what he's talking about. Here was his advice to my friend


The best time to workout is in the mornings.
No creatine when you wanna get cut.
Protien shakes after you work out or in the morning on days off.
No carbs in the evening.
No eating within 2 hours before sleeping.
And...abs everyday.

My answer to this was...


I don't know about the best time of day to workout, but I'm sure whenever is fine.
Creatine is close to no calories and helps increase LBM, so in effect it would help with cutting.
Protien is protien is protien. The only true difference may be that the protien in shakes are more quickly absorbed into your system that say chicken.
No carbs in the evening sounds good unless you lift in the evening.
From what I understand eating before sleeping does not turn the food to fat and little harm could come of it.
Your abs are like every other muscle so treat it like every other muscle. Your friends who have cut abs who do situps everyday aren't cut because of situps but rather because of the diet they have and their low bf%.

Would people here generally say I'm right, or have I made any mistakes in my answers. I would rather have him on WBB to check things out for himself, but he doesn't have the internet. I told him not to judge a book by it's cover, as in genetics may have played a bigger role in why his friend is leaner and stronger but that it doesn't necessarily make him more knowlegable. I by no means think I know everything, I just want to get this right.

HILL
09-15-2005, 05:47 AM
i agree with everything u have to say. and weight training in the evening may actually be better as you will have more energy possibly from the food you have consumed throughout the day rather than on an empty stomach.

Y0yo
09-15-2005, 08:18 AM
i agree with everything u have to say. and weight training in the evening may actually be better as you will have more energy possibly from the food you have consumed throughout the day rather than on an empty stomach.

Cool...anyone else. Even if someone out there disagrees with what I have said please comment and let me know why...or if you agree with the initial advise, please say so.

Anthony
09-15-2005, 08:28 AM
Your advice is more accurate. Simple as that.

bigedge
09-15-2005, 08:34 AM
i would disagree with you on the creatine thing, although it may help you add lbm, it also helps your body hold more water, hence making you look more bloated and round not lean and cut

Canadian Crippler
09-15-2005, 10:06 AM
Ok, and that effect can be diminished in a matter of days. No point in losing LBM so you don't look a bit more bloated during the cut itself.

malkore
09-15-2005, 11:00 AM
I'd agree with cardio in the mornings on an empty stomach for cutting, but no so much the weight training. takes the CNS about 2 hours to fully wake up...so if you lift super early, you'll feel weak and less in control.

Y0yo
09-15-2005, 11:06 AM
i would disagree with you on the creatine thing, although it may help you add lbm, it also helps your body hold more water, hence making you look more bloated and round not lean and cut

OK, so if you wanted to lose weight (Just lbs) then you would not take creatine. But if you are wanting to keep LBM while cutting, would you still take it? Healthy weight is good weight right, so whats a little water...unless you are going into competition. Am I right or wrong here?

muscleup
09-15-2005, 12:35 PM
OK, so if you wanted to lose weight (Just lbs) then you would not take creatine. But if you are wanting to keep LBM while cutting, would you still take it? Healthy weight is good weight right, so whats a little water...unless you are going into competition. Am I right or wrong here?
If water is retained do to creatine, it can be lost in a matter of days just like Crip said.
I retain water during the week because I drink a gal+ every day while at work. On the weekends I don't drink as much and notice the difference instantly.

Working out in the morning when your body has zero fuel is not something I would recommend to anyone. I notice an intensity difference when I try to lift after 1 meal versus 3-4 meals. Lifting after 3-4 meals is ideal for myself.

getfit
09-15-2005, 12:38 PM
If water is retained do to creatine, it can be lost in a matter of days just like Crip said.
I retain water during the week because I drink a gal+ every day while at work. On the weekends I don't drink as much and notice the difference instantly.

Working out in the morning when your body has zero fuel is not something I would recommend to anyone. I notice an intensity difference when I try to lift after 1 meal versus 3-4 meals. Lifting after 3-4 meals is ideal for myself.

i've been training in the morning for the last 4 years no problem here!

muscleup
09-15-2005, 01:17 PM
i've been training in the morning for the last 4 years no problem here!
Have you ever wondered if your progression would have been any different if you chose to lift any other time besides right after you got finished fasting your body for 7-8hrs?
I bet you'd still be ripped :)

Y0yo
09-15-2005, 01:36 PM
i've been training in the morning for the last 4 years no problem here!

But does morning = best? Whether you've eaten breakfast or not?

Built
09-15-2005, 01:43 PM
OK, so if you wanted to lose weight (Just lbs) then you would not take creatine. But if you are wanting to keep LBM while cutting, would you still take it? Healthy weight is good weight right, so whats a little water...unless you are going into competition. Am I right or wrong here?

If you wanted to lose weight, you'll STILL lose more if you take creatine than if you don't, because it helps your muscles grow, which costs calories.

You'd ditch the creatine just before a show or a photo shoot as part of the whole "water dropping" thing. But you need things like salt and creatine during a cut because they help push water into your muscle cells, which helps them grow.

From http://chemo.net/sodium-.htm
"Increasing cellular fluid increases protein turnover and overload stimulated lean tissue accrual."

Y0yo
09-15-2005, 01:59 PM
If you wanted to lose weight, you'll STILL lose more if you take creatine than if you don't, because it helps your muscles grow, which costs calories.

You'd ditch the creatine just before a show or a photo shoot as part of the whole "water dropping" thing. But you need things like salt and creatine during a cut because they help push water into your muscle cells, which helps them grow.

From http://chemo.net/sodium-.htm
"Increasing cellular fluid increases protein turnover and overload stimulated lean tissue accrual."


I thought as much. I actually read that link from an earlier thread. Thanks! I'm still curious about the morning evening workouts. Does the time of day really matter? I would assume as long as you got you food in you it wouldn't, and that most people take their schedule into account rather than what time of day is best to "gain muscle mass"

Anthony
09-15-2005, 02:03 PM
Time of day is pretty much personal preference.

muscleup
09-15-2005, 02:13 PM
I would assume as long as you got your food in you
This was my only beef with the morning...hard for me to slam down enough food right after I wake up and then go lift.
Time of day really means nothin, it's the food intake that's important.
Sorry I wasn't clearer.

Built
09-15-2005, 02:15 PM
I can NOT train in the AM. I simply don't have enough food in me that early.

Y0yo
09-15-2005, 02:24 PM
So if you were able to get enough food into yourself (For that particular person...maybe not you) would that person have any reason to believe he's better off lifting in the morning? Any science behind it?


Time of day is pretty much personal preference.

Or is it as simple as this...that's what I thought, but couldn't back it up with any science.

Y0yo
09-15-2005, 02:28 PM
EDIT-

muscleup
09-15-2005, 02:29 PM
This guy would have told you if there was any science behind it, and or sent you to the appropreite article. :)


Time of day is pretty much personal preference.

Y0yo
09-15-2005, 02:32 PM
This guy would have told you if there was any science behind it, and or sent you to the appropreite article. :)

That's why I posted here, so I could double check I was right or wrong, and see if I could back it up with fact not just "Well, I know 2 guys with really cut abs and they do situps everyday." as my fact...which is what he's doing. I just want to make sure he follows fact and not "second hand" advice...

Shao-LiN
09-15-2005, 09:01 PM
Train whenever the hell you want or find most convenient. If first thing in the morning, you'd at least want a protein shake in you.