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dissipate
10-27-2005, 11:36 PM
my bulk is going to end next sunday and i'll be moving to CKD for about four months.

what i'm unsure of is whether i should
1. move into CKD immediately - fat loss cals, <=30g carbs
2. move into CKD gradually - drop 250cals a week till i reach fat loss cals (and how do i handle going from high carbs -> low carbs and low fat -> high fat? EDIT: as in do i slower lower carbs and raise fat? would fat gain be affected?)

also, i'm a bit confused about when the carb load starts. the purpose of the last workout (friday workout in the 7 day cycle) is to further deplete muscle glycogen before starting the carb-up right? but in another section, carb-up 5 hours before the final workout is recommended for glycogen supercompensation. -which is it?

TheGimp
10-28-2005, 01:44 AM
Ok I'm going by my experience of UD2.0 here:

Move into CKD immediately. You want to take maximum advantage of the switch from a high cal(/high carb) diet to a low cal/low carb one.

Have a pre-workout meal for the pre-carb load workout containing a small amount of carbs + protein to help get you through the workout, refill hepatic glycogen levels and help you switch to an anabolic state. Fruit is a good choice here. These are the only carbs I would have before the load.

Now, I forget the exact science, but the point of the pre-carb load workout is to prime the muscles you work for growth, and encourage glycogen to be stored in them. The glycogen depletion aspect is not the main purpose (and I would guess minimal, depending on how extreme your calorie deficit is, and the depletion workouts you've done earlier in the week).

Have you bought UD2.0 yet? :D

dissipate
10-28-2005, 09:27 AM
thanks for the advice gimp!!

will switching from high cal to low cal straight have a negative effect on anything? right now i'm doing 3000 cals on lifting days and 2700 cals on non-lifting. at an estimated 25% BF 59kg next sunday i could drop to 2055 cals (btw should i raise cals a little on lifting days?)

EDIT: just realised 2055 cals is supposed to be maintenance even. 20% deficit would be at 1644 cals. is there something wrong here?

about workouts, we can do our own exercises as long as they work every muscle group correct? would it hurt to do a little more than just what's needed to deplete muscle glycogen? i've been wanting to do some crossfit-like stuff and other exercises for balance etc.

Cancer
10-28-2005, 09:28 AM
Go get the gimp!

dissipate
10-28-2005, 10:26 AM
oh and i haven't bought UD2 yet hehe. don't think i could survive on it like you! am also afraid it might affect my writing.........

i can't sleep and i'm torn between CKD and TKD actually.

TheGimp
10-28-2005, 11:38 AM
1644 sounds much better

Being in a calorie deficit has all kinds of deleterious effects, that's one of the points of carb loading - to reverse them. As these are going to happen anyway, you are better off making the change quickly to lose as much fat as possible.

Any workout should do for depletion provided you are doing enough reps and hitting all of your muscle groups. I have heard there are posts on Lyle's forum about alternatives to lifting as means of depletion such as boxing and other forms of exercise. It's also recommend that you do cardio with UD2.0 in addition to the depletion workouts as this helps increase the calorie deficit and mobilise stubborn fat so I don't think the additional work will be a problem.

I didn't mean getting the book with a view to actually doing the diet, simply that it's a great resource especially if you are doing any kind of low carb/cyclical dieting, UD2.0 or otherwise.

I have no experience with a TKD personally. I would imagine the main advantage is that you do not have to carb load, if you find such things difficult, but similarly you do not get the psychological boost of gorging yourself.

:thumbup:

Built
10-28-2005, 01:18 PM
I have a hard time with looooong carbups, so TKD worked better for me in the sense it was more comfortable, and I really, REALLY looked forward to workout days.

It all works. Pick something you can live with.