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Jonny
11-14-2005, 12:39 AM
advice on cut

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey,

Was looking to get some info on a cut I have just started. My maintenance calories (average of 5 days) was 2880 so I have cut that by 20% to 2303 per day. I'll see how that goes. Listed below is what I will attempt to eat in a day. Hopefully I can stick to it. Currently I am 180 pounds and 179cm. Any advice? maybe some tips on some low calorie foods I can eat? Also when cutting do I lower my calories further each week, or what is the go?

Total: 2316
Fat: 60 544 25%
Sat: 14 129 6%
Poly: 23 203 9%
Mono: 19 167 8%
Carbs: 190 637 29%
Fiber: 31 0 0%
Protein: 253 1012 46%
Alcohol: 0 0 0%


Any advice would be great.

I do a three day split, should I do three days of cardio aswell, I don't want to loose muscle mainly fat. Am I taking enough protein?

Looking for advice and testimonials from those who have been successful.

Cheers
Jon

SalahG
11-14-2005, 01:12 AM
advice on cut

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey,

Was looking to get some info on a cut I have just started. My maintenance calories (average of 5 days) was 2880 so I have cut that by 20% to 2303 per day. I'll see how that goes. Listed below is what I will attempt to eat in a day. Hopefully I can stick to it. Currently I am 180 pounds and 179cm. Any advice? maybe some tips on some low calorie foods I can eat? Also when cutting do I lower my calories further each week, or what is the go?

Total: 2316
Fat: 60 544 25%
Sat: 14 129 6%
Poly: 23 203 9%
Mono: 19 167 8%
Carbs: 190 637 29%
Fiber: 31 0 0%
Protein: 253 1012 46%
Alcohol: 0 0 0%


Any advice would be great.

I do a three day split, should I do three days of cardio aswell, I don't want to loose muscle mainly fat. Am I taking enough protein?

Looking for advice and testimonials from those who have been successful.

Cheers
JonYou don't need that much protein, 1g/lbs. of bodyweight, or slightly over is satisfactory. Make sure those are coming from lean protein sources(Tuna, Chicken Breast, Whey). Try to get 40% of your calories from carbs(all low-gi except postworkout for hunger purposes). Make sure most of your fats are coming from ANPB, Olive Oil, Flax Oil etc...

Built
11-14-2005, 01:54 AM
I would humbly disagree with the recommendation of 40% of cals from carbs on a cut.

First off, the concept of macronutrient ratios geared to total calories makes a lot less sense than gearing them to pounds of LBM.

Second, protein is WAY more satisfying than fat.

I might try something like this:

192g of protein, 112g of fat, and 131g of carbohydrate, 2300 calories in total.

This gives you 1.2g protein per pound LBM (assuming 160 lbs LBM), and 0.7g fat per pound LBM.

Target the carbs to the meal before and the meals after you lift.

You'll probably find it more comfortable, and the fats will help you preserve LBM.

Jonny
11-14-2005, 03:47 AM
"First off, the concept of macronutrient ratios geared to total calories makes a lot less sense than gearing them to pounds of LBM"

could you explain this a little further? Am a little lost. Is the macronutrient ratio the breakdown of what I am eating, articulated on fitday? Then the second part of the quote I am having trouble grasping. I apologise for ignorance!

Built
11-14-2005, 11:14 AM
Okay, well, usually, you'll read recommendations like "get 40% of your calories from carb" or "get 30% of your calories from fat", but this gets blown way out of whack on a bulk, and could leave you with extremely low fat and protein on a cut.

A better way is to dose your LBM with the essential macronutrients.

Guidelines I like to use are as follows:

Protein: at least 1.0g/lb LBM (higher is fine, don't go lower)
Fat: at least 0.5g/lb LBM (higher is fine, don't go lower)
Carb: whatever.

Ignore the percentages on fitday. The guidelines I've given you are better, IMHO.

:)

HILL
11-14-2005, 01:49 PM
Listen to built this is all the information you could require

SpecialK
11-14-2005, 06:16 PM
Okay, well, usually, you'll read recommendations like "get 40% of your calories from carb" or "get 30% of your calories from fat", but this gets blown way out of whack on a bulk, and could leave you with extremely low fat and protein on a cut.

A better way is to dose your LBM with the essential macronutrients.

Guidelines I like to use are as follows:

Protein: at least 1.0g/lb LBM (higher is fine, don't go lower)
Fat: at least 0.5g/lb LBM (higher is fine, don't go lower)
Carb: whatever.

Ignore the percentages on fitday. The guidelines I've given you are better, IMHO.

:)

Why do people just treat carbs as an afterthought when setting up a diet? Aren't they important for energy? I ran a cut for 3 months and while I was not satisfied with the overall results, I did notice an almost direct relation between carbs consumed and my strength levels.

SalahG
11-14-2005, 06:59 PM
Why do people just treat carbs as an afterthought when setting up a diet? Aren't they important for energy? I ran a cut for 3 months and while I was not satisfied with the overall results, I did notice an almost direct relation between carbs consumed and my strength levels.Exactly. Not to mention that carbs are essential for maintaining LBM, and making it so half of your results don't come from water losses. When I say 40% it's just an estimate based on what has worked for me. Tom Venuto suggest a diet as high as 55% of your diet from carbs. I mean, your brain uses ~130 carbs a day just to function, imagine what you lose in a workout.

Shao-LiN
11-14-2005, 07:04 PM
Why do people just treat carbs as an afterthought when setting up a diet? Aren't they important for energy? I ran a cut for 3 months and while I was not satisfied with the overall results, I did notice an almost direct relation between carbs consumed and my strength levels.

Well yah, you're going to notice a drop in energy and strength if you limit carbs.

But it's all in how you approach it. While I'm a big fan of the carb cycling approach and my strength does dip a bit on my lower carb days, the strength returns and sometimes increases after my refeed days (ala UD2 style). I wouldn't go low carb all week round, but cycling between low and high is a pretty good way of retaining LBM and dropping fat.

SalahG
11-15-2005, 01:16 AM
Well yah, you're going to notice a drop in energy and strength if you limit carbs.

But it's all in how you approach it. While I'm a big fan of the carb cycling approach and my strength does dip a bit on my lower carb days, the strength returns and sometimes increases after my refeed days (ala UD2 style). I wouldn't go low carb all week round, but cycling between low and high is a pretty good way of retaining LBM and dropping fat.I agree on the carb cycling. It works very well. However if you are in a straight deficit, I'd really suggest your main energy source be from carbs.

Built
11-15-2005, 01:20 AM
Well, we're going to have to agree to disagree, then. Carbs are non-essential; protein and fat are not. A high carbohydrate diet on a cut is a recipe for freakish hunger.

No thanks.

SalahG
11-15-2005, 01:28 AM
Well, we're going to have to agree to disagree, then. Carbs are non-essential; protein and fat are not. A high carbohydrate diet on a cut is a recipe for freakish hunger.

No thanks.Not nessacarily. Take a look at "Burn the fat, Feed the muscle." Tom has many clients which report great success using the 55% carb approach. I think it is absolutely nessacary to maintain LBM. That said, you have had great results in your methods, and you can't argue with success.

Built
11-15-2005, 01:38 AM
I've read that book.

I've read and tried them ALL.

I was 170 lbs until I figured out about dropping the carbs.

Then this happened ...

<=

DavyRen
11-15-2005, 05:39 AM
I've read that book.

I've read and tried them ALL.

I was 170 lbs until I figured out about dropping the carbs.

Then this happened ...

<=

Cracking response, can't really argue with that!
Congrats on your new look built, one day I might achieve that success!

Your like a machine!

Unreal
11-15-2005, 06:29 AM
If you have the self control to limit your calories, keep protein and fat at a good level, then I don't see a problem with carbs. I'm like built and once I start eating carbs I just get hungier and have to eat more. Keep them around 100-120g a day seems to work for me.

JustLost
11-15-2005, 02:59 PM
Protein: at least 1.0g/lb LBM (higher is fine, don't go lower)
Fat: at least 0.5g/lb LBM (higher is fine, don't go lower)
Carb: whatever.


Yeah, but is that a metric whatever, or an Imperial whatever?

Built
11-15-2005, 03:41 PM
Cubits.

zimbo
11-15-2005, 03:57 PM
There's more than one way to skin a cat. Built's method worked great for her. YMMV. As long as you're tracking your progress and making improvements, you can take any number of approaches. Folks are different.

--Steve

JustLost
11-15-2005, 04:28 PM
Cubits.

When I ate cubits of carbs, I just got fat.

Built
11-15-2005, 04:43 PM
That's because you FRIED them.

JustLost
11-15-2005, 04:48 PM
That's because you FRIED them.


No way! Sure I fried them, but it I used oil from a HEALTH FOOD STORE!

Built
11-15-2005, 04:50 PM
I'm genuinely puzzled then. It ought to have worked. Especially since you took your NO-xplode and carb blockers.

<shrugs>

JustLost
11-15-2005, 04:54 PM
I'm genuinely puzzled then. It ought to have worked. Especially since you took your NO-xplode and carb blockers.

<shrugs>


Must be because I ate them after 4 PM.

Built
11-15-2005, 05:03 PM
D'oh!