Deadlift with barbell vs. with a trap bar.

[Nongan]

Ok guys, I've got a major problem. My weights teacher refuses to let us do regular deadlifts on the basis that deadlifts w/ a trap bar are just as good. I posted a thread awhile back wondering if they are the same thing, and the general concensus was that they weren't. But as of now, their all I can do. Should I do deadlifts with the trap bar, or should I just work on some isolation exercizes like shrugs, chins, rows, etc?

[completeNewb]

whats a trap bar?

[DarkSmurf]

So he wont let you do regular deads but he'll let you skip the trap bar deads? Just trying to figure out if I read that correctly. Maybe he just doesnt want to be responsible if someone hurts themselves due to improper form. I cant see why he would stress trap bar over conventional BB other than that and so he could be able to say you move more weight. I know that when I did trap bar one workout over the summer I got up an extra 30lbs and felt like I could do more. Id say just try your best to get in BB deads then go to his trap bar if he ABSOLUTELY needs you to do them.

DS

EDIT for CN:

Trap Bar (http://www.wannabebigforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17992)

[completeNewb]

ahh i looked up a picture. i see.

[HardToSquat]

Trap bar Deads should actually be called 'squats holding the barbell with your arms and hands'. They are in no way equivalent in effectiveness as the regular deadlift nor regular squat, but if that is all you are permitted to do then still do them as you will still get bigger as it is a major compound movement.

[SW]

It sure is a fun compound movement. One that equal's the deadlift in tearing your hands up!

[Nongan]

It sure is a fun compound movement. One that equal's the deadlift in tearing your hands up!

Yeah, your hands get killed from the trap bar, especially when doing heavy shrugs with it.

[MixmasterNash]

Trap bar Deads should actually be called 'squats holding the barbell with your arms and hands'. They are in no way equivalent in effectiveness as the regular deadlift nor regular squat, but if that is all you are permitted to do then still do them as you will still get bigger as it is a major compound movement.

Give me a break.

Trap bar deads are slightly more similar to a hack squat, but they're pretty damn close to a deadlift. Your statement makes as little sense as "regular deadlifts are in no way equivalent in effectiveness as the trap bar deadlift." If they're "easier," then add weight.

[SW]

Just for ****s and giggles the trap bar is also called a "hex" bar. Sounds more badass.

[Nongan]

yeah, it is called a hex bar. We call them hex deadlifts, just figured trap bar would be more widely known then hex bar or hex deadlifts.

[Mr Joshua]

Ok guys, I've got a major problem. My weights teacher...

What is a weights teacher? Is he a coach for a team you're on or something? Is he claiming that deadlifting with a straight bar is dangerous?

[Nongan]

What is a weights teacher? Is he a coach for a team you're on or something? Is he claiming that deadlifting with a straight bar is dangerous?

He's basically in charge of the weight room for the weights classes during school. And I don't know, but I've asked him multiple times and he always says that we cant do regular deads.

[Mr Joshua]

He's basically in charge of the weight room for the weights classes during school. And I don't know, but I've asked him multiple times and he always says that we cant do regular deads.
Ask him to stand behind his words. See if he'll fire up his computer and get on these boards and tell us why he's against them.

[Deadlifter]

I don't blame the weights teacher for making you use a trap bar, it makes it impossible to bend over and stiff-leg the thing like an idiot. On the other hand, it forces you to use a very narrow stance which could be harder for people with longer legs.

[SW]

Nongan, he is apparently a ******. The big 3 are the best of the best lifts, I don't care what sport/activity you're doing. He's holding alot of kids back strengthwise. I'd love to have him tell me I couldn't. Take Josh's advice and have him come read up and put up an arguement.

[Stumprrp]

i think the straight bar will get your back more but both are good, my friend always used hex but the straight was alot harder for him

[djreef]

He's just protecting his ass. Straight bar deads are extremely dangerous to those that no nothing about them (hell, they are even risky for those that do), which I would recon would be about 99% of the 16 year olds on the planet. Think about the liability issues for the school, and the teacher in this age of litigation lottery. It only takes one kid rupturing a couple of discs to close down a weight room to the general (non-atheletic) student body of a school.

DJ

[Doobs]

Just do em when he's not lookin.

[Gutz981]

He's basically in charge of the weight room for the weights classes during school. And I don't know, but I've asked him multiple times and he always says that we cant do regular deads.

Tell him he can shove his hex bar up his ass. Chalked palms and bloody shins :) the true art of a deadlift. :)

Oh yeah just make up some bull**** that you are gonna try competing and need to get used to a BB for competition reasons.

[Nongan]

Oh yeah just make up some bull**** that you are gonna try competing and need to get used to a BB for competition reasons.

That may actually work.......Thanks for the idea. I hope it does cause I've only ever done real deads once, and I could only do 225 :cry:. I wanna lift more, lol.

[spencerjrus]

Just do em when he's not lookin.



If you're teacher is that stupid this is your best option.


On second thought, I'm not sure I would let dumbass 16 year old kids do deadlifts without supervision if I was liable.

[Nongan]

If you're teacher is that stupid this is your best option.


On second thought, I'm not sure I would let dumbass 16 year old kids do deadlifts without supervision if I was liable.

Lol, I'm glad I'm just a dumbass 16 year old kid :zipit:. Just kiddin, I know what you meant. We have tons of ididots in our class that load tons of weight on the pulldown machine and use it as a toy to hang on, and then others only go halfway down on bench, and then we have guys that bench with proper form, but they bench 2x what they squat. So yeah, most kids that lift at my age are complete dumbasses and are a hazard to those of us that actually have an idea on what we're doing.

[sickman99]

well said m8

[dw06wu]

Nothing against you man, and you seem cool enough. But trust me, you'll know what we mean in about 4-6 years when we say that 30 16yr olds in a gym room can do some stupid ****.

[Sensei]

He's just protecting his ass. Straight bar deads are extremely dangerous to those that no nothing about them (hell, they are even risky for those that do), which I would recon would be about 99% of the 16 year olds on the planet. Think about the liability issues for the school, and the teacher in this age of litigation lottery. It only takes one kid rupturing a couple of discs to close down a weight room to the general (non-atheletic) student body of a school.
DJ
You make it sound like there is no way to do a hex/trapbar deadlift with poor form... I work in a high school weight room and I see it all the time!

There is nothing so inherently dangerous about deadlifting w. a regular bar.

[Paul Stagg]

The dangerous part is the inability of the teacher to teach proper form.

[djreef]

No truer words spoken. But given that this guy prob teaches 2 classes of Social Studies, 3 PE classes, and is the low man on the totem pole in terms of seniority at the school....He prob had the choice between working in the weight room or supervising detention. Gravitation by default.

DJ

[Deadlifter]

It is extremely unlikely that a teenager would screw up their back, unless they maxed out every day (which isn't uncommon, heh). The joints are very flexible and pliable at that age, so there is a smaller risk of injury. That doesn't it mean it won't happen, however, and once they start using heavier weights they're probably going to hurt their back temporarily.

95% of people that lift don't even do deadlifts, so I don't see what the concern is.

[djreef]

You make it sound like there is no way to do a hex/trapbar deadlift with poor form... I work in a high school weight room and I see it all the time!

There is nothing so inherently dangerous about deadlifting w. a regular bar.

Sensei, I respectfully disagree with you. Deadlifting is risky, even to those who know what they are doing. I've been deadlifting with proper form for nearly 2 decades, and even I inadvertently screw up on occasion and injure myself. It's easy to get distracted for one reason or another (esp. in a public setting), or push yourself one rep too far. I never implied that hex deads aren't also risky, but the perception, whether correct or not, is that they are safer than traditional. I happen to do both, and my personal experience is that they are safer. There also may be school mandates that prevent the instructor from allowing certain movements in class, and we all know where this stuff comes from. I think the point is, that the school weightroom should be staffed by a professional who knows proper form for all movements, or at the very least the movements that are most likely to maim when done improperly. Until that happens a 'better safe than sorry' policy is appropriate given the potential risk.

DJ

[rbtrout]

I agree with djreef -
It's like doing squats. Proper form is a must, but that one day you push yourself is all it takes.
I think the 'teacher' needs to teach proper form and let those who are serious do it - correctly. Back years ago when I was in high school, our parents signed a form saying that the coach wasn't repsonsible for injuries occurred in the weight room.

[HARDI]

get used to the straight bar. The trap bar is easier but gives you some false weights

competiton=straight bar

[SteveEU]

Can someone post a link to traps bar...I can't find one and would love to know what it looks like.

[HARDI]

http://images.google.com/images?svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&q=trap+bar

[SteveEU]

http://images.google.com/images?svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&q=trap+bar
Aaah right!...Thanx for the link, deffo ain't got one of them in our gym.

[HARDI]

You mainly see them in highschool gym's. It is a little easier to have better form when using a trap bar

[SteveEU]

Certainly looks like it's kinder to the shins for Deadlifts!