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PowerManDL
01-07-2002, 02:45 PM
Some of this is training-related, but considering the nature of it, I thought I'd put it here.

Basically it revolves around hormones and using diet/training to manipulate them for positive effects.

I've got some of this in my journal (January 7th), but I wanted to lay it out completely.

The idea focuses around the training time, and what you want to get done. For starters, you've got three main hormones that come into play. Testosterone, growth hormone, and insulin. For most of the day, growth hormone is the one you'll want to have floating around, with insulin levels kept stable. However, during the time you train and immediately after, insulin is much more important because it keeps nutrients flowing to the muscles.

That given-- the quickest way to get a boost in insulin is to eat high-GI carbs. Even so it takes 45 min to an hour to get the spike. So, about 45 min to an hour before lifting, get some quick-digesting protein and some simple carbs, and eat up. That way the insulin hits right as you start the workout, carries you through it, then drops off at the end.

Immediately afterwards, eat some protein and low-GI carbs to get protein into the muscles and stabilize the insulin levels.

Then an hour or so after that, eat a large meal of protein, fat, and fiber.

Now, this isn't designed to be a keto fad diet. For breakfast, you'll want to have a big protein/carb meal, and you'd ideally get another one at some point during the day.

Now regarding hormones in general:

Everyone that made a big ruckus about hGH helping muscular anabolism-- well, it does all right, but mainly of the ST fibers. Same goes for IGF-1. Those two boogers also have the effect of converting IIb/IIx fibers into IIa and I fibers.

Conversely, anabolic-androgenic hormones (testosterone and its buddies), catecholamines (ephinephrine/adrenaline), and beta-adrenergic agonists (again epinephrine) have been shown to have the biggest effect on type II fiber hypertrophy.

Not surprisingly, 5RM sets with 1 minute rests promote T release, while 10RM sets with short rests promote hGH release.

One final thing-- turns out that T3 has a pretty damn big effect on hypertrophy itself, as it mediates cellular growth. This sucker can not only increase fiber hypertrophy, but it can also prevent the conversion of type IIb/IIx fibers into IIa and I.

Pretty neat, I thought.

Pup
01-07-2002, 03:00 PM
Good stuff Powerman

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-07-2002, 03:09 PM
pfft...that's only breaking the water for what we've got folks...

Jane
01-07-2002, 03:15 PM
:thumbup:....but im still mad

Wizard
01-07-2002, 03:22 PM
I also learned that you don't need all that crapy sugar in your body after a workout to promote anabolism because you can substitute them with 4-5 grams of L-Arginine.That's the reason why some proteins are absorbed faster than others.

syntekz
01-07-2002, 03:25 PM
I've always been under the impression that you want to get an insulin spike after your workout.


Good post, even though I don't understand some of it.

:help:

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-07-2002, 03:44 PM
Hey Wiz, i been noticing stuff about L-Arginine.

did you read the article about how sending Nitric oxide to satalite cells in the muscle can spur on muscle hypertrophy?

It was by Dr Judy Anderson.

Anyhoo, i've read that taking a time-release L-arginine can keep a constant flow of Nitric oxide in the blood stream. The problem with this is that Nitric oxide can produce a peroxynitrite which = not ace.

the next problem lies in the fact that Nitric oxide in the blood stream does not equate to nitric oxide in the muscles. Judy Anderson uses some sort of 'compound' to get the nitric oxide into the muscles to activiate the satalite cells and i have no idea what it is. Any ideas?

I was thinking that general muscle 'damage' from training would be sufficient personally. Especially from negatives since these damage the sarcolemma the most.


Quick addition:

I've now just read that L-citrulline may be better - it apparently recycles back into arginine and because of the long conversion path it's like a 'time- release'. This then can release nitric oxide. Apparently L-arginine is not readily absorbed either, so gettting arginine via citrulline may be a good idea.

the article about the nitric acid making satalite cells to promote hypertrophy was just a crappy news bulletin i read btw - I have no 'official' study, but here's the study about Citrulline converting to arginine if you're curious:

L-Citrulline mediated relaxation in the control and lipopolysaccharide-treated rat aortic rings
Eur J Pharmacol 2001 Nov 9;431(1):61-9
Raghavan SA; Dikshit M
Division of Pharmacology Central Drug Research Institute, Lucknow,India.

The present study was undertaken to investigate relaxant effect of L-citrulline in phenylephrine precontracted endothelium intact thoracic aortic rings obtained from control or lipopolysaccharide (1 mg/kg)-treated rats. L-Citrulline produced 40 /-3% (n=36) and 60 /-5% (n=24) relaxations in control and lipopolysaccharide-treated rings, respectively. Nitric oxide (NO) release and cyclic guanosine-3',5'-monophosphate levels from the rings were also increased following treatment with L-citrulline. Inhibition of guanylate cyclase, L-citrulline recycling to L-arginine or denudation of the endothelium, significantly reduced L-citrulline-induced relaxations both in control and lipopolysaccharide-treated rings. Treatment of rings with protein synthesis inhibitors prevented relaxations to L-citrulline. Inhibitor of Ca(2 )-activated K( ) channels, tetrabutylammonium or precontraction of the rings with KCl (80 mM), significantly attenuated L-citrulline mediated relaxations in control and lipopolysaccharide-treated rings. Thus, L-citrulline seems to exert significant relaxation by supplementing the release of NO due to its recycling to L-arginine, which gets further augmented after lipopolysaccharide treatment.


Any input?

Avatar
01-07-2002, 03:47 PM
Originally posted by PowerManDL

That given-- the quickest way to get a boost in insulin is to eat high-GI carbs. Even so it takes 45 min to an hour to get the spike. So, about 45 min to an hour before lifting, get some quick-digesting protein and some simple carbs, and eat up. That way the insulin hits right as you start the workout, carries you through it, then drops off at the end.

Immediately afterwards, eat some protein and low-GI carbs to get protein into the muscles and stabilize the insulin levels.


why high GI pre-workout and then low GI post-workout?

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-07-2002, 03:55 PM
he just told you Andrew.

Wizard
01-07-2002, 04:17 PM
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
Hey Wiz, i been noticing stuff about L-Arginine.

did you read the article about how sending Nitric oxide to satalite cells in the muscle can spur on muscle hypertrophy?

Any input?

Yup,I did.I think it's great and a big step towards a more effective anabolism without getting bloated from the sugar loading.It's very early to say whether it can produce the same effect as the carbs do but it definitaly worths a try.

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-07-2002, 04:25 PM
haha, the report was comparing it with gear and you're comparing it with carbs :)

what's your opinion on NO being able to produce the peroxynitrite free radical? sounds nasty no?

body
01-07-2002, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by Avatar


why high GI pre-workout and then low GI post-workout?

So you are in a decreased catabolic state post training. Your body can start repairing straight away. then you want a constant flow of carbs to take advantage of glycogen synthase post training.

Wizard
01-07-2002, 04:49 PM
The truth is that I can't realize the effects it can have to the body (the peroxynitrite) without knowing its structure.However the participation of peroxynitrite in membrane lipid oxidation of muscle foods is uncharacterized yet so it's co productive to discuss about it now.

I compare it with carbs because there's a company that sells a new supp which doesn't contain any carbs at all but 4 grams of l-arginine by serving and they claim to be as effective as having high gi carbs in the release of insulin and thus on anabolism.

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-07-2002, 04:53 PM
haha we're in the same boat. I know fuk all about it, except that it's a free radical. i was hoping you could shed light on the subject.

Ah well, maybe Doc or ST can help.

Avatar
01-07-2002, 07:47 PM
ok I worded my question wrong.
I should have asked why do you not want an insulin spike post workout. Why all the talk all of a sudden about needing to stabilize insulin levels with low gi instead of spiking insulin with high GI? For years bbers have been preaching high gi carbs post workout. How is low gi superior now? I can understand when cutting, but how so when bulking?

and to add - the opposite question also applies. People in the past have preached low GI carbs pre-workout for stabilized insulin levels to get through the workout (consistent flow of energy). Why do you want to spike your insulin before a workout?

PowerManDL
01-07-2002, 10:35 PM
Because it takes 45 minutes to an hour after ingestion to get the "spike" of insulin.

If you take low-GI before hand, you won't change your insulin level until after the workout. If you take high-GI afterwards, you won't get the spike for about an hour. By then, its too late to help anything.

By doing the exact opposite, the energy kicks in right as you need it, and the stable insulin response afterwards insures that nothing is wasted metabolically speaking.

beercan
01-08-2002, 05:40 AM
I see what you're trying to say, but still prefer to use simple sugars for glycogen replacement, not energy for workouts.

I'm not trying to be a caveman afraid of fire here, but the 4:1 sugar to protein ratio has worked wonders for myself and those around me.

I'd still be interestred to hear more about it tho....

jarhead
01-08-2002, 07:29 AM
Originally posted by PowerManDL
...the quickest way to get a boost in insulin is to eat high-GI carbs. Even so it takes 45 min to an hour to get the spike. about 45 min to an hour before lifting, get some quick-digesting protein and some simple carbs, and eat up. That way the insulin hits right as you start the workout, carries you through it, then drops off at the end.
Immediately afterwards, eat some protein and low-GI carbs to get protein into the muscles and stabilize the insulin levels.Can someone please list some examples of high/low GI carbs and quick digesting proteins. Another words, which foods should be eaten pre and post workout?

ericg
01-08-2002, 07:34 AM
I have always heard that you eat for what you plan on doing in the next 3 hours; not for what you did hte past 3 hours. So the above info makes loads of sense.

hemants
01-08-2002, 08:24 AM
Good info Powerman,

What would you say in terms of modifying your diet for non-workout days? What about days where all you do is cardio?

Also let me see if I've got this right:

Regular meals : Slow digesting Protein/Low GI carbs/fat/fibre

Pre workout : Quick digesting Protein/High GI carbs

Post workout : Quick digesting Protein/Low GI carbs

Post post workout : back to regular meal

?

ericg
01-08-2002, 08:31 AM
Originally posted by hemants
Good info Powerman,

What would you say in terms of modifying your diet for non-workout days? What about days where all you do is cardio?

Also let me see if I've got this right:

Regular meals : Slow digesting Protein/Low GI carbs/fat/fibre

Pre workout : Quick digesting Protein/High GI carbs

Post workout : Quick digesting Protein/Low GI carbs

Post post workout : back to regular meal

?

I would say that the reg meal looks cool like what i got from all of this, but i think the post-post workout (assuming its later in the day or at night) i would eat less low GI carbs, more fibre, slightly more fat????

gino
01-08-2002, 09:40 AM
Originally posted by PowerManDL
Because it takes 45 minutes to an hour after ingestion to get the "spike" of insulin.

If you take low-GI before hand, you won't change your insulin level until after the workout. If you take high-GI afterwards, you won't get the spike for about an hour. By then, its too late to help anything.

So take high GI carbs and vitamins DIRECTLY before your workout. By the time you finish your workout, you'll have the insulin spike when you need it most, along with vitamins and minerals for your body. Add a whey protein shake after your workout and voila...

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-08-2002, 10:01 AM
stop stealing his thunder Gino. ;)

there's gonna be an article on this btw guys.

also, andrew, to expand on what PM said: weight lifitng increases insulin sensitivity, so by the time the high GI carbs have made it through the diestive process, the muscles will be soaking it up nicely.

there's gonna be a total meal plan guideline hopefully in the article too so watch this space.

ericg
01-08-2002, 10:51 AM
:cool:

coo foos

:thumbup:

unev_en
01-08-2002, 11:25 AM
Where did you find the fact that insulin takes 30-45 minutes to be released even in response to high-GI carbs? I'm not criticizing or doubting you; I'm just curious, as I have always believed that high-GI carbohydrates such as dextrose in liquid produce an almost-immediate insulin response.

Furthermore,
That way the insulin hits right as you start the workout, carries you through it, then drops off at the end.

the role of insulin, at least as I understand it, is not to provide energy but to REMOVE glucose from the bloodstream. This would seem to be exactly what one does not want during an intense weight-training session. Instead, I would argue that a small low-GI carbohydrate and protein meal should be consumed roughly 45-60 minutes before training; this ensures stable glucose levels with an insulin spike towards the end of the workout. Supplement this post-workout insulin spike with high-GI carbs, which I continue to believe produce an almost immediate insulin response, and protein, and you should be set.

Avatar
01-08-2002, 11:41 AM
Originally posted by unev_en
Where did you find the fact that insulin takes 30-45 minutes to be released even in response to high-GI carbs? I'm not criticizing or doubting you; I'm just curious, as I have always believed that high-GI carbohydrates such as dextrose in liquid produce an almost-immediate insulin response.

Furthermore,

the role of insulin, at least as I understand it, is not to provide energy but to REMOVE glucose from the bloodstream. This would seem to be exactly what one does not want during an intense weight-training session. Instead, I would argue that a small low-GI carbohydrate and protein meal should be consumed roughly 45-60 minutes before training; this ensures stable glucose levels with an insulin spike towards the end of the workout. Supplement this post-workout insulin spike with high-GI carbs, which I continue to believe produce an almost immediate insulin response, and protein, and you should be set.

I agree with un_even. From what I have always read and heard, and also just recently read in NHE by Rob Faigin, is your insulin starts to respond within seconds from taking in a high GI carb like dextrose. I belive what you'll find if you take a high gi carb 45 min before a workout, is your insulin with be spiked long before, and then drop, leaving your energy levels tangled and in an unstabilized condition.

IMO, you should take a low-GI carb 90 min pre-workout (ie -oatmeal) along with slow acting protein (ie - cottage cheese) to give the body excess amino acids before hand. This combo will give you the energy and nutrient stabilization needed for the workout, and then post workout hit it up with the high GI carbs and quick absorbing protein. I can't understand why you guys would think a high-GI carb like dextrose would take 45+ min just to raise insulin. *scratches his head* :confused:

Joe Black
01-08-2002, 11:44 AM
test

body
01-08-2002, 11:58 AM
How would a meduim Gi meal be about 1 1/2 hours before trianing instead of high GI a bit sooner?

Uneven - you are correct about insulin not providing energy. But its what insulin is transporting to the cells(from blood stream - your body does not metabolise it in the blood) that will provide energy. Think of it this way. when you insulin levels drop to low you become sleepy and tired or even coma - see diabetics.

A low Gi meal will not cause a insulin spike at the end of your workout. The reason people avoid high GI as they do not want a insulin spike in the day so they will be in a fat storage mode, then it will fall quickly and be hungry again so they will eat more. But doing it before trianing will not put you in a fat storage mode as the fuel being released into your blood will be used for energy helping you lift harder etc. I heard colin jackson before big race (110metre hurdler olympic cham) used to eat like a pound of sugar before a sprint so he would be fully of energy.**this may make some people sick**

Though powerman - do you know how glycogen synthase is effected by doing different types of Gi carbs around trianing time.

gino
01-08-2002, 12:01 PM
Originally posted by Avatar


I can't understand why you guys would think a high-GI carb like dextrose would take 45+ min just to raise insulin. *scratches his head* :confused:

Dextrose is an exception, along with most powder/liquid diet aids. Pasta will give you an insulin spike, but not for a while after eating it. Even chocolate takes a while to spark a response. Dextrose DEFINITELY should be taken AFTER a workout, but many other high GI carbs take longer to kick in, hence the pre-workout(immediately before) consumption effectiveness, assuming you aren't lifting more than 40 minutes(like myself).

body
01-08-2002, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by Avatar


I agree with un_even. From what I have always read and heard, and also just recently read in NHE by Rob Faigin, is your insulin starts to respond within seconds from taking in a high GI carb like dextrose. I belive what you'll find if you take a high gi carb 45 min before a workout, is your insulin with be spiked long before, and then drop, leaving your energy levels tangled and in an unstabilized condition.

:confused:

The carbs have to be aborbed before they can do anyhting to GI, this take a while to get to the stomach.

Also i would be more concerned about insulin repsonse to a meal than Gi, as some foods get to your intestines very quickly(liquids) while solids take more time, but once they are in the intestine they are abosrbed quickly giving a quick insulin reponse though the GI is lower. so you just have to plan when to take your meal a bit better.

Also after trianing your body may be crying out for nutrients but your stomach is not ats its optimum for digesting meals as its water content will be lower so it takes longer to digest food so better have taken it before.

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-08-2002, 12:19 PM
"the role of insulin, at least as I understand it, is not to provide energy but to REMOVE glucose from the bloodstream."

you're right - and guess where it puts it :) [providing glycogen stores aren't already full - and with the diet guidelines you'll get from the article they most definately won't be.]

And gino is right - dextrose is an exception - purely because it is a monosaccaride and doesn't take much digestion.

Matt really should have specified but when we were on about high GI we were not on about dextrose. even malto takes a while to digest because it is a glucose polymer - basically 'starch' - just like pasta as Gino rightly said. This is how it is known as a 'complex carb'. White bread is another high GI carb you could take 45 mins before training. Up to you really, but when we were discussing it we were sub-consciously thinking of malto :)

Last thing - this is the kind of disclaimer if you will.

This whole idea is based around a diet guideline to maximise the potential of the three hormones that matt stated in the beginning. This isn't revolutionising the world of BBing. You really need to remember that before you criticise.

body
01-08-2002, 12:26 PM
even with dextrose its aborption time will vary depending on wethter its in solution or eaten powder. Also as you add protien to the dextrose it will slow down the rate through the stomach.

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-08-2002, 12:28 PM
exactly - which is precisely why the GI should not be taken *too* seriously.

I like your thinking Stevo.

Severed Ties
01-08-2002, 12:33 PM
Hate to break it to you guys but you will never get an insulin spike post workout by eating a high carb pre-workout meal unless you are shooting insulin with a needle.

Anaerobic work competely blunts insulin responce, if it didn't working out could put you into an insulin induced coma.

ST

gino
01-08-2002, 12:37 PM
Originally posted by body
even with dextrose its aborption time will vary depending on wethter its in solution or eaten powder. .

Eaten powder?

(*gag reflex, gag reflex...pause...eyes water...gag reflex*)

After every workout, I mix up my dextrose with water and force it down. It makes me nautious for 5 minutes or so because I don't like sweets and this stuff is unbearably sweet. I couldn't imagine taking spoonfulls of the stuff like creatine and washing it down the hatch. Sends chills up my spine just thinking about it...

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-08-2002, 12:37 PM
it's not for getting the spike post workout ST.

gino
01-08-2002, 12:41 PM
Originally posted by Severed Ties
Hate to break it to you guys but you will never get an insulin spike post workout by eating a high carb pre-workout meal unless you are shooting insulin with a needle.

Anaerobic work competely blunts insulin responce, if it didn't working out could put you into an insulin induced coma.

ST

Not if the high GI carbs you've eaten haven't made it through your digestion process to where they actually cause the insulin spike. As we're saying, different high GI carbs cause insulin spikes at different times, which is why you wouldn't take dextrose pre workout.

(note - in preworkout, I mean DIRECTLY before working out, not 1 hour before)

Avatar
01-08-2002, 03:33 PM
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy


Last thing - this is the kind of disclaimer if you will.

This whole idea is based around a diet guideline to maximise the potential of the three hormones that matt stated in the beginning. This isn't revolutionising the world of BBing. You really need to remember that before you criticise.

If you want a better growth hormone and testosterone response then I think you will want low-GI carbs pre-workout. The higher your insulin level the less GH and test produced in the body.

If you want to "maximize" these 2, the best formula is protein/fat pre-workout but since most people are in sugar-burning mode due to their diet, this is not the most effective way in terms of energy levels. But it would certainly "maximize" your hormones and keep insulin at bay.

The_Chicken_Daddy
01-08-2002, 04:01 PM
Argh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I said three! Three! Three! Three!

:)

three hormones - remember, this is a 'lean mass' gain diet taking advantage of insulin, test and GH. Insulin is only 'manipulated' around the times of training. All will be explained in the article.

In the article there will also most likely be reference to tweak the diet in order to focus more on cutting - and i can tell you now that the notes i sent matt yesterday actually informed him to use low GI pre-train for the cutting aspect.

Remember the disclaimer...

PowerManDL
01-08-2002, 05:01 PM
Originally posted by Avatar


If you want a better growth hormone and testosterone response then I think you will want low-GI carbs pre-workout. The higher your insulin level the less GH and test produced in the body.


We want that throughout the day, yes. But as was stated, the insulin response is more important during and immediately after the workout than GH is.

Insulin isn't an agonist to test production, as I will vouch for from yesterday's workout.

And yes, what we've outlined is the "bulking" version. It does change somewhat for cutting.

Finally, the idea of wanting to create a spike is erroneous-- the idea is to get as much glycogen in the muscle as possible during the workout. Causing an insulin response that will *roughly* coindcide with the early phase of a short workout will do that. I could care less how long the response is, nor how intense, as long as it occurs at some point during the workout.

This provides the benefit of not having to saturate the body with high-GI carbs afterwards, which could potentially cause a fat storage reaction.

Severed Ties
01-08-2002, 05:05 PM
CD I was refering to something I read earlier in the post about eating high GI meal before you workout so you have an insulin spike after you workout without consuming more carbs, doesn't work that way.

Gino I mean directly before you workout as well, eating a high GI meal an hour before a workout is a very poor idea to begin with. The only way to get any kind of signifigant insulin responce post workout from a preworkout meal would be if either the duration of the workout was extremely short or the intensity very low. In which case the growth stimulus would not be that great to begin with.

You have to keep in mind that digestion changes dramaticly during intense weight training.

ST

smalls
01-08-2002, 05:16 PM
EAT....






















STEAK.........






















AND............




















SQUAT......:D

PowerManDL
01-08-2002, 05:17 PM
Originally posted by Severed Ties
CD I was refering to something I read earlier in the post about eating high GI meal before you workout so you have an insulin spike after you workout without consuming more carbs, doesn't work that way.

Like I said, the idea isn't to create a spike post-lift. Sorry if we gave that impression. The idea is to drive glycogen into the muscles so that you don't need to have a spike afterwards.


Gino I mean directly before you workout as well, eating a high GI meal an hour before a workout is a very poor idea to begin with. The only way to get any kind of signifigant insulin responce post workout from a preworkout meal would be if either the duration of the workout was extremely short or the intensity very low. In which case the growth stimulus would not be that great to begin with.

Again, the idea isn't for a post-workout response. The way I did it yesterday was to drink whey + orange juice about 45 minutes before hand. My workout lasted about 45 minutes, and I was fine. Today, I plan to eat a little more a little closer to the session, and go a bit longer with it. I don't expect any difficulties.

Severed Ties
01-08-2002, 05:34 PM
OK PowerMan I see, I was under the impression you were trying to create a spike post lift. Thanks for clearing that up.

You do intend to keep carbs as part of your post workout meal/drink however correct?



The way I did it yesterday was to drink whey + orange juice about 45 minutes before hand. My workout lasted about 45 minutes, and I was fine. Today, I plan to eat a little more a little closer to the session

You would be much better served to drink this before an throughout your workout.

ST

PowerManDL
01-08-2002, 05:40 PM
Oh, certainly-- I wasn't going to leave them out entirely. It just seems more tidy to do it beforehand, and not dump sugar into your blood when it may well not reach the bloodstream for up to 60 minutes.

And yeah, I actually have been toying with moving the meal closer to the workout, or with adding some liquid carbs like gatorade to the mix for during the session. We'll see how it goes.

Severed Ties
01-08-2002, 11:09 PM
Just checking, otherwise you would lose a bulk of your post workout protein to glucogenesis. Your bodies primary concern after a workout it to replenish it's glycogen stores, so if you don't feed it carbs it will simply make them from your protein but this will severly delay recovery.

Try moving your meal right before you workout and adding the gatorade during the workout. This makes a huge difference in recovery and I find it reduces DOM the next day.

This small change can have a dramatic effect on bulking since your body is hardly going to store fat during a bout of intense weight training so I used to move about 1/6 my daily caloric intake around my workout. Cutting is trickier but like any diet in general a few simple tricks can have a profound effect.

ST

Marcel
01-08-2002, 11:45 PM
interesting!:cool:

body
01-13-2002, 07:04 AM
also a problem with eating straight after your work out.
scernio 1
Squating heavy and hard on a hot hummid summers day.
I turn into a pool of sweat, so my my body will draw water from non-vital areas(my stomach). This will lead to my stomach being dehydrated. a dehydrated stomach will lead to food passing through it a slower rate. The longer it takes to pass through the stomach, will decrease the rate of which the nutrients get to the intestine to be absorbed. This will means it will take longer for me to recover than the same routine done on a cold dry winter trianing session.
So another reason to have the nutrients before you trian in your system.

the doc
01-13-2002, 09:42 AM
how have i missed this one?

:confused:

Wizard
01-13-2002, 09:43 AM
Hahaha!!! :evillaugh

the doc
01-13-2002, 09:46 AM
well, also, there is an issue of the practicality of what power is proposing. For myself anyway, i drink a lot of water during my workout. If i eat enough carbs or a big enough meal for an insulin spike i would most likely vomit during my workout. The bloating from the water and carbs would not be pleasant. Also, digestion slows greatly whilst performing strenuous activity thus the spike might be delayed for some additional time.

Wizard
01-13-2002, 09:59 AM
An isotonic drink can improve your workout.

WilliamX
01-13-2002, 12:29 PM
Originally posted by unev_en
Where did you find the fact that insulin takes 30-45 minutes to be released even in response to high-GI carbs?

I have a book here it shows an average curve for BLOOD SUGAR level within 2 hours after people were given 50g of pure glucose.
It reaches its maximum point at about 45 mins and then goes down. I guess for INSULIN to reach its maximum it'll take even longer.

body
01-13-2002, 01:43 PM
insulin does not get released instanly after eating as the food has to be digested. it takes time for this to happen.

body
04-16-2002, 01:22 PM
bump for hulk.

heres the thread I mentioned about not to bother with 50 g dextrose post training.

Silverback
03-19-2003, 02:25 PM
So in summary whats the answer?

To have your post workout gatorade and whey before and during? when should you next eat after training then?

I always thought that post workout was the ideal time?

B-R= Mega confused

Ironman8
03-19-2003, 06:15 PM
Originally posted by the doc
The bloating from the water and carbs would not be pleasant. Also, digestion slows greatly whilst performing strenuous activity thus the spike might be delayed for some additional time.

Does that mean Gatorade won't spike my insulin while, let's say, cardio? I never really ran before, but I'm gonna soon. That's why I'm asking.

bradley
03-20-2003, 02:28 AM
Originally posted by Ironman8


Does that mean Gatorade won't spike my insulin while, let's say, cardio? I never really ran before, but I'm gonna soon. That's why I'm asking.

I believe he is referring more to whole food meals, where gatorade would be absorbed at a faster rate seeing as how it is liquid. If you drank the whole thing at once you would probably get an insulin spike but if you sipped it throughout your workout I wouldn't think you would get an insulin spike.