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View Full Version : Fat loss diets for someone with almost no physical activity.



Clifford Gillmore
04-03-2006, 04:11 AM
Here's the skinny, my mother would like to loose weight. She is about 5'5", 170lbs (more than likely more), has undergone hormone replacement therapy and also undergone kemotherapy - She has very weak joints and a herniated disc in her spine, she is limited to water aerobics of sorts.

Advice? Would Lyle McDonalds book "Guide to flexable dieting" be of any help? I'm lost on this here.

WildCard
04-03-2006, 07:18 AM
atkins

Bob
04-03-2006, 07:25 AM
Dieting alone is not a long term solution...
She really has to increase the movement of the body...
Even if it is water activities.. then add 5 minutes more time per day..
Add more water strength activities.. they have those great resistance water weights for the pool.. I've seen some amazing old women, who never exercised and were restricted to beds and wheelchairs start with water activites and be up and walking and enlighted after a few months...

Good luck.. but tell her to do more.

ShadyRensch
04-06-2006, 01:41 PM
I know many friends and family members that have had great success with Weight Watchers.

seK
04-06-2006, 01:46 PM
My suggestion before starting any diet would be to ask Physical therapists or if she dosn't have one she should. They can develop a plan for her and you can work out a diet from there.

Built
04-06-2006, 02:19 PM
My vote is for "by the book" atkins, since it was such a great start for me.

Maki Riddington
04-06-2006, 02:25 PM
Learn how to eat. It's all about the food. Have your mom focus on eating certain foods on a consistant basis and she will see changes to her body. Having her follow a diet is not the right approach.

People shouldn't get caught up in eating to look better. They should focus on eating to feel better. When this happens they'll look better as a result.

This statement is based on the general population who doesn't exercise or does so at a low intensity.

Built
04-06-2006, 05:15 PM
Maki, I respectfully disagree.

I ate and trained carefully for my health for YEARS. It got me nowhere. When I started to eat and train for my appearance, I got off type II diabetes meds, avoided Lipitor, stopped getting migraines, and lost and kept off a crap load of fat.

My feeling is that eating and training "healthy" is too amorphous, too vague. It concentrates too much on the inputs, when really it's the outcome that matters. I mean, let's face it - if it isn't working, it's not a good plan, right?

Perricone noticed this effect in his patients - came up with a diet that made them look younger. They stuck to it. In concentrating on looking better, they ended up reaping the reward of improved health: the skin, after all, is a pretty good mirror of general health.

Speaking from experience, many of us need some sort of a feedback mechanism to tell us that it's working. I know I did.

Holto
04-06-2006, 05:52 PM
The skin, after all, is a pretty good mirror of general health.

It's believed in Natural Medicine that the skin is only used to detoxify the body if the liver and colon can't handle the workload. So if your liver and/or colon are underperforming your skin is passing junk to the surface.

brickt.
04-06-2006, 07:00 PM
Yeah, I agree with Built on this one.

How you 'feel' is very ambiguous, and can be altered by a huge number of variables. Sure, you're 'diet' might be making you feel great, but what happens when your dog gets run over and feel grief? Is it the diet's fault?

How you 'look,' essentially, is altered by what you eat and what you do. Much easier to assess the outcome.

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
04-06-2006, 07:35 PM
Um...she should find a proper diet and I suggest swimming for now as a healthy activity to do because won't put so much stress on her body, but will help her stay active.

Maki Riddington
04-07-2006, 02:18 PM
Maki, I respectfully disagree.

I ate and trained carefully for my health for YEARS. It got me nowhere. When I started to eat and train for my appearance, I got off type II diabetes meds, avoided Lipitor, stopped getting migraines, and lost and kept off a crap load of fat.

My feeling is that eating and training "healthy" is too amorphous, too vague. It concentrates too much on the inputs, when really it's the outcome that matters. I mean, let's face it - if it isn't working, it's not a good plan, right?

Perricone noticed this effect in his patients - came up with a diet that made them look younger. They stuck to it. In concentrating on looking better, they ended up reaping the reward of improved health: the skin, after all, is a pretty good mirror of general health.

Speaking from experience, many of us need some sort of a feedback mechanism to tell us that it's working. I know I did.

Bear in mind your opinion is based off your experience and mine is off of others. Eating to look better tends to make people join places like Jenny Craig, Weight Watchers or follow the Atkins diet. None of these programs instruct them on the principles involved in eating for optimal health and changes in body composition. Essentially it's a temporary fix for these people until they decide to stop. If you learn how to eat to feel better by understanding what certain foods do in relation to exercise then the rest will fall into place.

"Teach a man to fish; and you have fed him for a lifetime." The same applies to food. Teach them how, when and what to eat and it will stick with them for life.

Built
04-07-2006, 03:26 PM
I used Atkins, and it was the best thing I ever did.

Started my understanding of eating healthy - my health improved so much on that diet I was in shock.

I don't see your point.

Maki Riddington
04-07-2006, 04:28 PM
Built you're talking about yourself. That's good but it does not relate to everyone else. What you do and what works for you is totally different from the approach you'd want to take with the general population.

If it were a bodybuilder or someone who was into lifting weights, counting calories and eating meals based on varying macronutrients then I'd say my staement is off base.

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
04-07-2006, 04:48 PM
Built you're talking about yourself. That's good but it does not relate to everyone else. What you do and what works for you is totally different from the approach you'd want to take with the general population.Yeah...what works for one person may not work for another.

ArchAngel777
04-07-2006, 04:53 PM
You both are wrong! Actually, you two always get into it I have found...

Let me put it this way... Both Maki's and Built's advice will work. Sometimes we need to step back and take a look at the bigger picture. I know we get wrapped up in what is "best" and seem to argue over very minor things. Both Maki and Built have given great advice and both have use it on others and themselves. Maki isn't going to be able to disprove what Built has been able to accomplish with herself and others and Built isn'g going to be able to discredit Maki, because he clearly gets the job done too...

However, I want to throw in my opinion.

Maki's "Feeling" better is somewhat vague. The reason I think this is because, if I eat two cookies I feel awesome! Wow, my taste buds love me! But, later on I don't feel so good in other ways. When people say they feel better, you have to be specific. What feels better? I just think feeling better is vague.

Built's advice is great, but it is only SKIN deep... Yes, I love puns... In many cases the drive to want to look better ends when the fork in the road tells them COOKIES NOW or THREE MONTHS OF EXERCISE AND DIET. Most people take the COOKIES NOW! So that doesn't go very well either in the long run. Basically I think we all agree that each person is different and it make take a few different approaches to breed success.

Gosh darnit, you both have great advice and with all good advice, it does have some drawbacks.

Built
04-07-2006, 05:31 PM
There's really no one approach that fits all people, it's true.

Maki, I think you know I didn't start out wanting to be a bodybuilder - I was a fat, middle-aged woman who jogged. My doctor put me on Atkins, and it worked well because I could do it without thinking. He suggested it for the same reasons you suggest your approach - it worked for many of his patients and he trusted the result. It worked on me in exactly the way he described. I lost weight and improved my health and appearance.

You base your opinion on your observation of others.

I base my opinion on my personal experience as a formerly overweight person, which led me to be made a moderator for a board full of people (mostly middle-aged women) with similar health issues who have all stumbled into this lifestyle for the same reason - it produced results we could see.

Nothing like seeing your abs for the first time to seal the deal, lemme tell you!

tholian8
04-07-2006, 05:46 PM
There's really no one approach that fits all people, it's true.
Nothing like seeing your abs for the first time to seal the deal, lemme tell you!

I don't much care about seeing my abs, but hitting a competition weigh-in on target, with the least possible stress to my body, is priceless.

Built's approach works very well for me, I don't do BGB, but I do carb cycle in more or less the same fashion.

Then again, I'm a middle-aged woman. I just happen to be a powerlifter also. ;)

Built
04-07-2006, 05:51 PM
Whatever the result, it's extremely effective (for me, anyway) to have a metric. In my case, % bodyfat, for Tholian, a competitive weight-class. Besides, it's too easy to mislead people with health claims <makes mental note to invent a new panacea and get rich>

Maki Riddington
04-07-2006, 06:40 PM
Maki's "Feeling" better is somewhat vague. The reason I think this is because, if I eat two cookies I feel awesome! Wow, my taste buds love me! But, later on I don't feel so good in other ways. When people say they feel better, you have to be specific. What feels better? I just think feeling better is vague.



Note that I said that by teaching people how to eat to feel better you will as a result look better. If I teach someone how to incorperate simple principles that if applied will change the way they feel, and they apply these guidelines consistently their body will change.

Maki Riddington
04-07-2006, 06:55 PM
Maki, I think you know I didn't start out wanting to be a bodybuilder - I was a fat, middle-aged woman who jogged. My doctor put me on Atkins, and it worked well because I could do it without thinking. He suggested it for the same reasons you suggest your approach - it worked for many of his patients and he trusted the result. It worked on me in exactly the way he described. I lost weight and improved my health and appearance.

You didn't stay on the diet, so what happened next?


You base your opinion on your observation of others.

I base my opinion on my work with people, not just observing them.


I base my opinion on my personal experience as a formerly overweight person, which led me to be made a moderator for a board full of people (mostly middle-aged women) with similar health issues who have all stumbled into this lifestyle for the same reason - it produced results we could see.

I'm not discrediting that personal experience plays an important role in shaping how your body works in relation to exercise and nutrition. What I'm saying is that observing and working with others will teach you a lot of valuable information. It helps you understand how you will have to vary your approach according to the person (personality) and their situation.

This viewpoint can not be understood until one actually places themself in this position. Giving advice over the Internet is a lot different from applying what you know on people face to face everyday. There's a lot more at stake and many variables that you have to learn to control in order for results to occur.

Built
04-07-2006, 08:51 PM
Maki,

I've helped my coworkers with this, neighbours all up and down my block, my friends, people at the gym ... I've had the PTs at my gym ask me how to cut. I'm currently helping half the staff at my gym with their diets and their training. Just because I don't charge for my help doesn't mean I haven't helped people in person.

I'm also the victim of many failed attempts by people in the industry.

I had a girlfriend who had a degree in dietetics working on my "healthy diet" and "healthy exercise" program. I ended up on type II diabetes meds following her advice.

And you're saying I "went off" the diet. Hmnmmm... not really. More of an evolution into carb cycling. I started to realize I could "get away" with more carb because I was lifting. What I started to realize from the reading I did was that not only could I "get away" with it, there were actually others doing this: CKD, TKD, NHE, and other carb-cycling strategies take advantage of this. I've never been able to feel comfort with the traditional low-fat, high complex carb approach, even now - although I can comfortably eat a LOT more carb now than I could have a few years ago. Thank God for muscle!

I'm not trying to be argumentative with you - I'm sharing with you that some of us need this appearance-based/comfort-based approach to make it stick. Perricone realized that and it made him a very rich man. It's something YOU can put into your back pocket as one of many tools to use on your clients.

Yanno, the whiny, fat, middle-aged ones. ;)

Maki Riddington
04-10-2006, 08:22 AM
I'm just trying to explain my reasons behind my statement. I understand that you can take different approaches. You were the one who disagreed with my statement.

I also think that there is a huge difference between helping people and accepting money for your help. When people come to you because they want you to help them and it involves money, it changes the whole dynamics. There is a lot more on the line.

ddegroff
04-10-2006, 10:13 AM
I just read the atkins book (class project). The philosophy makes sense. The different phases really help one get to know how much CHO's one can take. You slowing up you CHO's till you stop losing weight. The book states at the end that people who regulary exercise can get more than 90g/day of CHO. For a sedentary individual Atkins would be a good way to go, because they don't need as much CHO's. I also feel Atkins can be a good way to learn about portion sizes and what foods to eat and so on.