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View Full Version : I am worried about the amount of cholesterol and sodium I intake



TRITON
05-29-2006, 03:14 PM
Been bulking for about a month now, and more or less it has been very clean aside from the couple fast food indulgences the past month. I'm putting down about 4000 calories a day with an emphasis on chicken and ground turkey, nuts, cottage cheese, peanut butter, the usual. Yet I can't help but notice from reading these labels that I'm putting in a ton of cholesterol and sodium into my body as well. Is this pretty typical and do you guys worry at all about it now or down the line?

arya202
05-29-2006, 03:17 PM
Well as long it's cholestrol from the foods you mentioned. And sodium is actually good for you.

What part of socal you from?

RedSpikeyThing
05-29-2006, 03:26 PM
If you are concerned, get tested! From my understanding, unless you have cholesterol problems are have hypertension, there shouldn't be a problem.

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-29-2006, 03:39 PM
Yet I can't help but notice from reading these labels that I'm putting in a ton of cholesterol and sodium into my bodyHow much is a ton?

Built
05-29-2006, 03:44 PM
How's your blood pressure?

If it's normal, you're fine.

TRITON
05-29-2006, 04:25 PM
How much is a ton?

I'll make a note to track the exact amount, but it seems like a couple servings here and there puts me at like 50% of the RDA.

TRITON
05-29-2006, 04:26 PM
How's your blood pressure?

If it's normal, you're fine.

Thanks Built. I was at 126/78 last time I checked but I believe high BP runs in my family so you can understand my concern. I'm also a medical student so I see a lot of it in the clinics, albeit usually in older individuals. Just something I need to monitor, I guess.

Built
05-29-2006, 04:29 PM
There's a BIG difference between folks with pre-existing high BP and folks when it comes to sodium consumption. I've not read anything that suggests high sodium consumption CAUSES high BP. I have, however, recently read that potassium may need to be increased when sodium goes high.

You'll likely know more about that than I do.

ihaveapigyo
05-29-2006, 08:32 PM
And sodium is actually good for you.
Sodium is good for you? Hmm, I didn't think so cuz I thought sodium is salt... and salt is bad for you

Built
05-29-2006, 09:31 PM
You need sodium to live.

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-29-2006, 10:13 PM
You need sodium to live.:withstupi



Sodium is good for you? Hmm, I didn't think so cuz I thought sodium is salt... and salt is bad for youNo. Sodium is a vital substance for your body. TOO MUCH sodium can be bad if it starts affecting your blood pressure...among other things. That's like saying oxygen is bad for you. Don't believe everything you hear.



I'll make a note to track the exact amount, but it seems like a couple servings here and there puts me at like 50% of the RDA.Then what's the problem? There's nothing wrong with 50% of the RDA.

GrumpyFlex
05-30-2006, 10:11 AM
Read this post before meeting with my nutritionist this morning and brought it up to her, because I had a slight concern as well.

As stated above it is a vital mineral for the body; but like everything, in excess can be harmful....

High BP, Water retention, etc .....

TRITON
05-30-2006, 11:21 AM
Then what's the problem? There's nothing wrong with 50% of the RDA.


Well I'm at 50% of my RDA at like meal 2-3 with 3 more meals to go.....

Teufelhund
05-30-2006, 11:52 AM
The RDA is a MINIMUM ALLOWANCE REQUIRED TO PREVENT DISEASE, not a maximum beyond which anything more is going to kill you.

It is also based upon a bodyweight that is ridiculously low for an average American, and assumes a sedentary lifestyle.

So, in other words, screw the RDA. It is not applicable to you.

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-30-2006, 12:03 PM
Well I'm at 50% of my RDA at like meal 2-3 with 3 more meals to go.....The RDA is basically a safe range guideline. If you're at 50%, that isn't bad. Don't sweat it.



It is also based upon a bodyweight that is ridiculously low for an average American, and assumes a sedentary lifestyle.Actually, it applies to a wide range of different people. There is actual science behind some of the RDA numbers. If you say screw the RDA and start consuming 70 grams of sodium, you're probably going to have some issues. But different things affect different people in different ways. You'll have to learn how your body reacts to different intake levels of different substances.

f=ma
05-30-2006, 12:06 PM
plus RDA's are based on a 2,000 calorie diet. if you're eating 4,000 calories isnt it pretty much safe to double the personal RDA?

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-30-2006, 12:08 PM
That depends on your reaction to whatever it is you're eating. Some things like sodium should probably stay in a certain range, regardless of your calories. If you can handle more and it isn't causing serious problems, then by all means, go ahead. It's still a good idea to test these types of things out. Like...if you're consuming 6,000 calories, it'd probably be a good idea to go get occasional check-ups at the doc...just to see how what you're eating is affecting you.

Teufelhund
05-30-2006, 12:15 PM
The RDA is basically a safe range guideline. If you're at 50%, that isn't bad. Don't sweat it.

This is incorrect, 50% of the RDA would be 50% less than a "normal" (small and sedentary) person needs to stay healthy.



Actually, it applies to a wide range of different people. There is actual science behind some of the RDA numbers. If you say screw the RDA and start consuming 70 grams of sodium, you're probably going to have some issues. But different things affect different people in different ways. You'll have to learn how your body reacts to different intake levels of different substances.


I think everyone was clear that my message was not "eat 70grams of sodium a day."

http://fermat.nap.edu/books/0309071836/html/24.html

Here is an excerpt showing a little about the RDA. You're right. There is science. They take a large group of people (of which we are NOT representative), then they find the lowest possible amount of each nutrient that can be eaten while still maintaining a reasonable chance of not developing diseases like scurvy and osteoporosis.

The problem is that the vast majority of people think the RDA is actually the Upper Limit. Take the time to look at the graph and understand it. As someone who actually uses their body, day in and day out, breaking it down and building it back up, all while processing very large quantities of food (and thus increasing our intake of free radicals), where do you think your nutritional requirements fall on the line as compared to someone who sits on the couch all day long?

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-30-2006, 12:20 PM
I think everyone was clear that my message was not "eat 70grams of sodium a day."Don't take me literally on that.



The problem is that the vast majority of people think the RDA is actually the Upper Limit.There is an Upper Limit and it has nothing to do with the RDA. Sometimes they are close, and sometimes the Upper Limit is WAY higher than the RDA. But you're right...sometimes people confuse the two...and they shouldn't.


As someone who actually uses their body, day in and day out, breaking it down and building it back up, all while processing very large quantities of food (and thus increasing our intake of free radicals), where do you think your nutritional requirements fall on the line as compared to someone who sits on the couch all day long?Bodybuilders get saturated with plenty of nutrients. With the amount of food we all eat, we are very "nourished". We actually give a damn about what we eat. Anti-oxidant foods can help reduce free radicals by quite a bit.

Teufelhund
05-30-2006, 12:40 PM
Bodybuilders get saturated with plenty of nutrients. With the amount of food we all eat, we are very "nourished". We actually give a damn about what we eat. Anti-oxidant foods can help reduce free radicals by quite a bit.

right... the antioxidants like vitamin c and vitamin e have RDA's. A "food" is not anti-oxidant, the nutrients within that food are. Let's take vitamin c. 1 cup of Orange sections (Thats less than 1 large orange) contains 160% of the RDA for vitamin c. WOW! 1 orange, 160%!!!

That amount is not 160% for a 200lb active guy in his youth. Its based on a standard that includes every 70 year old, every woman, every fat lazy couch potato, and every 5 year old. The bodybuilder clearly has very different nutritional requirements than probably 99.5% of the population.

It should also be noted that there are more than a few bodbuilders out there who get their carbs from weightgainer shakes, protein from whey, and fats from flaxseed and fish oils. Its not wise, but not everyone gets their macronutrients and micronutrients from their diet, some depend on supplements.

The OP was concerned that his sodium intake was at 50% of the RDA, halfway through the day. I say to him - if he is active and larger than the average guy, he should probably be worried that his sodium intake is too low, not too high...

KingWilder
05-30-2006, 12:43 PM
I think Built posted this article on sodium a little bit ago:

http://lonestar.texas.net/~czubeck/sodium-.htm

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-30-2006, 12:46 PM
A "food" is not anti-oxidant, the nutrients within that food are.Please refrain from nitpicking. I am fully aware of that. "Foods containing anti-oxidants"...is that better?



That amount is not 160% for a 200lb active guy in his youth. Its based on a standard that includes every 70 year old, every woman, every fat lazy couch potato, and every 5 year old. The bodybuilder clearly has very different nutritional requirements than probably 99.5% of the population.And I agree. I believe the UL for Vitamin C is around 2000-3000mg, if I recall.

Teufelhund
05-30-2006, 12:54 PM
Please refrain from nitpicking. I am fully aware of that. "Foods containing anti-oxidants"...is that better?

lol, sorry man. I wasn't nitpicking. I should have been more clear.

My point was that bodybuilders need more than the RDA. You said the RDA is fine, which I heartily disagree with.

here is my logic:


Food itself contains free radicals, as well as those produced by the lifestyle.
Bodybuilders eat a lot of food, and working out creates a lot of free radicals.
Bodybuilders therefore have more free radicals in their systems.
Bodybuilders therefore require more anti-oxidants than your average joe.

hell, look at the daily requirements for protein, lol. That kills the RDA argument right there.

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-30-2006, 01:03 PM
My point was that bodybuilders need more than the RDA. You said the RDA is fine, which I heartily disagree with.

here is my logic:

Food itself contains free radicals.
Bodybuilders eat a lot of food.
Bodybuilders therefore consume more free radicals.
Bodybuilders therefore require more anti-oxidants than your average joe.Yeah, I see what you're saying. I didn't mean every RDA is fine for bodybuilders. I meant there are a few things here and there that apply to everyone, regardless of their current physique/level of fitness. There aren't very many, but there are still a few that you should keep an eye on, especially if you're consuming an insane amount of calories. When you eat that much, you need to be even more aware of what you're putting inside your body. The RDA is just a general rule of thumb for the average joe. They're just trying to stay on the safe side of things. Know what I mean? It doesn't mean you should follow the numbers religiously, especially when you require more nutrients than the average joe.



hell, look at the daily requirements for protein, lol. That kills the RDA argument right there.It's 10%-20% from calories. That's pretty damn low and kind of silly, considering studies have shown that more protein benefits weightlifters.

Teufelhund
05-30-2006, 01:03 PM
Its kind of funny, my mom thinks my liver and kidneys are going to fall out because of all the protein I eat when I go to visit her. The Reader's Digest told her so. :rolleyes:

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-30-2006, 01:08 PM
Studies are inconclusive regarding large intakes of protein and healthy kidneys. The only studies that have shown negative side effects are those with already existing kidney problems. If you're drinking plenty of liquids to keep your kidneys flushed, then I don't see a problem. When I was a little kid, my doctor told my parents that I am very prone to getting kidney stones and that I should drink plenty of fluids to keep this from happening. Now here I am today and I am no longer prone to getting them because I kept drinking plenty of fluids. :)

UrbanSmooth
05-30-2006, 01:21 PM
Thank you, Jesus!

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-30-2006, 01:35 PM
That has nothing to do with anything.

Teufelhund
05-30-2006, 01:35 PM
I read the same thing somewhere. Its only bad if you're already dying of kidney failure or something.

LOL, But my mom, she could give a rat's ass about studies. She found it Reader's Digest!

She'll believe ANYTHING printed in there.

Teufelhund
05-30-2006, 01:36 PM
That has nothing to do with anything.

amen.

rookiebldr
05-30-2006, 02:33 PM
Its kind of funny, my mom thinks my liver and kidneys are going to fall out because of all the protein I eat when I go to visit her. The Reader's Digest told her so. :rolleyes:

I get that all the time from one of my best friends. He's aghast at the amount of protein I consume. Some Berkeley mentioned all I need 60g a day etc and he's standing by it. Yeah, maybe to live but not to grow!

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
05-30-2006, 02:45 PM
Some Berkeley mentioned all I need 60g a day etc and he's standing by it. Yeah, maybe to live but not to grow!Yeah, no kidding.

Davidelmo
05-31-2006, 04:39 PM
Triton, my advice would be to get tests done.

If you're a med student (I am too :D) then i'm sure you'll understand the ins and outs of sodium effect on water balance, electrolytes etc. I know you'll also understand that cholesterol is important for life and it isn't "bad."

Get tested and then take appropriate action. If your cholesterol sucks then you can take adequate steps to change it - taking fish oil, red yeast rice etc.

djreef
06-02-2006, 09:54 AM
If your cholesterol sucks then you can take adequate steps to change it - taking fish oil, red yeast rice etc.


....or, simply learn to use it for what it was intended.

DJ

Keith
06-02-2006, 10:15 AM
If your worried about consuming too much sodium, consume higher amounts of potassium. In simple terms, they work together when being digested. So if you intake a high amount of sodium, as long as your potassium intake is high as well, its fine.

MantiXX
06-02-2006, 11:09 AM
If your worried about consuming too much sodium, consume higher amounts of potassium. In simple terms, they work together when being digested. So if you intake a high amount of sodium, as long as your potassium intake is high as well, its fine.

Which means eat LOTS more banana's... (my fav)...LOL...

peace out..

Sidior
06-02-2006, 12:03 PM
Which means eat LOTS more banana's... (my fav)...LOL...

peace out..

Haha I agree. This has been a great infomative thread, teuf and scars gave some great info, but nothing can top the plain and simple eat more bananas! :thumbup:

Keith
06-02-2006, 12:06 PM
Which means eat LOTS more banana's... (my fav)...LOL...

peace out..

Exactly, dont be afraid to throw those bananas in those shakes guys!

Davidelmo
06-02-2006, 02:45 PM
....or, simply learn to use it for what it was intended.

DJ

??

Teufelhund
06-02-2006, 03:03 PM
Building cell walls and testosterone molecules... duh!


actually I have no idea what he meant, lol. :scratch:

Jordanbcool
06-02-2006, 03:11 PM
Which means eat LOTS more banana's... (my fav)...LOL...

peace out..

Uhhhh these yellow beauties are the only things that make my terrible tasting protein shakes bearable.

Thats why I got some nitrean! :)

Davidelmo
06-02-2006, 06:51 PM
Building cell walls and testosterone molecules... duh!


actually I have no idea what he meant, lol. :scratch:

Yeah, me neither lol.

MantiXX
06-06-2006, 01:20 PM
Uhhhh these yellow beauties are the only things that make my terrible tasting protein shakes bearable.

Thats why I got some nitrean! :)


Yeh, I've got to agree, that Vanilla Nitrean is DA BOMB..... OMFG.. I honestly want to inhale the whole container... LOL...

The chocolate is great too, but I'm getting tired of chocolate all the time....

Peace out..

djreef
06-06-2006, 02:04 PM
Teuf nailed it. Cholesterol is one of your body's ultimate utility players. I think it's gotten a bad rap (predominantly by pharma companies wanting to push statin drugs). If you use your body, your body will use the cholesterol.

DJ

smalls
06-06-2006, 02:32 PM
Teuf nailed it. Cholesterol is one of your body's ultimate utility players. I think it's gotten a bad rap (predominantly by pharma companies wanting to push statin drugs). If you use your body, your body will use the cholesterol.

DJ


I'm sorry bro but that **** is just plain wrong. If your cholesterol levels are in the 400s I dont care if you lifting weights, chances are your going to have problems. I agree that cholesterol is overstated. But there is too much information out there and too much posative corelation to simply think your body will use it all for posative purposes simply because you are "using your body".

And I agree with who ever said get blood tests done. If your really that worried fork out the 25 dollars and find out. I have eaten over 2g/lb of BW pretty much solid for over 4 years. My kidney levels are just fine.

TechMetalMan
06-07-2006, 03:09 AM
Exactly, dont be afraid to throw those bananas in those shakes guys!
What if you hate bananas?

What are other good sources of potassium?

Holto
06-07-2006, 01:12 PM
What if you hate bananas?

What are other good sources of potassium?

Taters.

djreef
06-08-2006, 11:02 AM
smalls -

Probably a little too general a statement, I agree. I was trying to be a little too direct. There are a good many other factors to consider. Genetics - diet -But as far as being just plain wrong..? It bothers me though that someone of your standing doesn't believe that lipid profiles can be improved with frequent intense physical activity. The AMA, and The American Heart Ass., two of the largest medical organizations in the world, both recommend exercise to lower blood lipid profiles. I would think that they would have access to the research to back this. I think the logic falls in line with what we know about cholesterol and its uses within the body. IDK, maybe I'm just biased because I also see it regularly here at the clinic. As far as cholesterol profiles in the 400's, I'm not too sure how many athletes, who train regularly would fall in to this category. Maybe PL'ers (ala Dave Tate, etc), Sumo (who I really don't consider to be athletes), and offensive linemen who frequently stuff themselves full of garbage on a daily basis. Maybe I need to run over to the Med Center library this weekend and do some digging. I'm kind of curious now, to see if anyone has done any studies with these groups.

DJ

Keith
06-08-2006, 11:15 AM
What if you hate bananas?

What are other good sources of potassium?

Like I said, dont be afraid to throw them in your shakes.
You wont taste banana if you throw them into your shakes.:thumbup: