PDA

View Full Version : Interesting finding in Monkeys



Vapour Trails
06-14-2006, 03:15 PM
Now and then a debate arises, is a calorie just a calorie, or does it matter what it comes from? (fat, carbs, protein)

For the record, I don't believe a calorie is a calorie.

Today I picked up the newspaper and read something interesting I thought I would share.

Globe and Mail (Major Canadian Newspaper) June 14, 2006

Of monkeys and midriff bulge

Monkeys fed a diet high in trans fats gained much more weight that those fed the same number of calories but healthier types of fat, a new study has found.

What's more, the extra pounds were deposited around the belly in "dramatic levels," according to researchers.

"Diets rich in trans fat cause a redistribution of fat tissue into the abdomen and led to higher body weight even when total dietary calories are controlled," said Lawrence Rudel, head of the lipid sciences research program at Wake Forest University in Winston-Salem, N.C.

"What it says is that trans fat is worse than anticipated," he said.

The research was presented this week at the scientific sessions of the American Diabetes Association conference in Washington.

Canadians are the world's biggest consumers of trans-fatty acids, ingesting about 10 grams a day on average.

For the study, researchers fed two groups of male monkeys a Western-style human diet, with carefully controlled caloric intake, and 35 per cent of calories from fat.

The only difference between the two groups is that one group of monkeys got 8 per cent of its calories from trans fats, while the other group got those calories from monounsaturated fats (these so-called good fats come from natural products such as olive oil).

After six years, the monkeys who had trans fats in their diet had an average 7.2 per cent increase in body weight; the monkeys who did not consume trans fats saw their weight increase on average by only 1.8 per cent"

ddegroff
06-14-2006, 03:38 PM
Canadians are the world's biggest consumers of trans-fatty acids, ingesting about 10 grams a day on average.

What, they beat us Americans!

Thats a very interesting study. Yet another reason not to consume Trans-fat.

CrazyK
06-14-2006, 06:04 PM
What, they beat us Americans!

Thats a very interesting study. Yet another reason not to consume Trans-fat.And another reason to tell those "omggg calorieee=calorieee dudeee, in verse outttt" to drink a big cup of STFU :)

Built
06-14-2006, 06:06 PM
To be fair, synthetic trans fats aren't really food - it's more like plasticized oil, right? As I understand it, the body doesn't quite know how to deal with them.

CrazyK
06-14-2006, 06:07 PM
Which is why all calories aren't created equal

Bruise Brubaker
06-14-2006, 07:13 PM
Of course, things like trans fats will cause problems in the body, probably slowing down the metabolism in some way or another...

Also, not all fats are 9 calories. The smaller chains ones have less, such as "medium chain triglycerides" and coconut oil (from which it is often derived I believe). The nutrition label will always identify them as having 9 calories though.

Jordanbcool
06-14-2006, 07:30 PM
Im really glad to know that I'm not the only person that disagree's with the whole "a calorie is a calorie" type mindset.

Anyways, what people fail too realize is that fats, carbs and protein are all processed differently in the body. Meaing that a calorie is not a calorie. And as time goes on I'm slowly realizing that more and more.

-jordan

CrazyK
06-14-2006, 08:47 PM
Also, not all fats are 9 calories. The smaller chains ones have less, such as "medium chain triglycerides" and coconut oil (from which it is often derived I believe). The nutrition label will always identify them as having 9 calories though.Yeah but the total amount of calories in the diet was controlled so that is a moot point.

Vapour Trails
06-15-2006, 12:01 PM
I think this also lends support for the clean diet when bulking. Clearly, eating 2000 cals worth of say, McDonalds food (high in trans fats), will lead to more fat gain than eating 2000 cals of chicken, salad and rice.

Isaac Wilkins
06-15-2006, 01:00 PM
Not that I'm in support of trans fat, but look at the numbers more carefully. These monkeys were fed 8% of their total diet in trans fat.

Say 2500 calories (for a human, obviously different for a monkey): 8% of 2500 is 200 calories which is a bit over 22g.

Canadians lead the pack and average 10g. Of course that means that there are plenty that take in 20 or 30g plus and plenty that don't. Regardless the proportion is much higher. Monkeys also tend towards a lower fat diet by virtue of a mostly vegetarian diet for generations. Humans have been more omnivorous for a longer time and will probably do a bit better with fat.

I'm certainly not supporting trans fats and I don't believe that a calorie is a calorie. I AM saying that animal studies need to be looked at with a grain of salt when applied to humans.

Anthony
06-15-2006, 01:16 PM
Calorie = Calorie. It's just a measurement of energy.

Isaac Wilkins
06-15-2006, 01:58 PM
Touche.

Let me rephrase: I do not believe that all macronutrient calories result in a similar physiological response.

Don't try to get into nutrition with me, MetCon-boy. ;)

Jordanbcool
06-15-2006, 02:31 PM
Calorie = Calorie. It's just a measurement of energy.

True but that is only "skin deep" if you will. This kind of rhetoric does not take into consideration any of the macronutrients or what there vital roles in such things as fat loss/gain, muscle loss/gain and a variety of other health issues. For example: Protein, is widely known to require more energy to digest then fats or carbs. Fats are more easily stored as....fat because they are already converted. Yes calories have a large say in everything I described (like when some people lose 10 lbs on the micky D's diet) but if your serious about your health, well being and bodybuilding you should realize that a "calorie is a calorie" is only the surface of this complex process which our bodies use to store/burn energy.

-jordan

If a calorie is a calorie reasoning is true. I would bulk on ice cream, and cookies alone. I'm sure everyone gets tired of eating so much chicken, eggs, beef and milk that are common foodstuffs for bodybuilding....

CrazyK
06-15-2006, 03:35 PM
Calorie = Calorie. It's just a measurement of energy.I'm with borris.

Anthony
06-15-2006, 05:10 PM
A calorie is a calorie, just like a pound is a pound, just like a mile is a mile, just like an hour is an hour. It's a way to measure something.

I know you guys are saying that not all macronutrients are equal, I just felt like breaking your balls.

:D

Jordanbcool
06-15-2006, 05:21 PM
A calorie is a calorie, just like a pound is a pound, just like a mile is a mile, just like an hour is an hour. It's a way to measure something.

I know you guys are saying that not all macronutrients are equal, I just felt like breaking your balls.

:D

lol.

On a lighter side. I have no testicals...they have shrunken so much because of all the juice i've been taking.

No i dont mean minute made.....

Turnip
06-15-2006, 06:05 PM
Are you serious? Like have they gone from plumbs to marbels or how dramatic is it?

MantiXX
06-15-2006, 06:15 PM
Are you serious? Like have they gone from plumbs to marbels or how dramatic is it?

Dried green peas?.:omg:

Jordanbcool
06-15-2006, 07:59 PM
I wouldnt say THAT small but they are pretty darned tiny....dont know how to describe it though. Not as small as a marble but.....yea

lol. For the record I'm not taking steroids. I simply thought it was funny...

Holto
06-16-2006, 08:22 AM
How much LBM did the monkeys gain?

Beast
06-16-2006, 08:27 AM
Trans fat -> Abdominal (Visceral) fat -> Cardiovascular disease

End of story!

MixmasterNash
06-16-2006, 08:39 AM
Damn, I misread this thread title as "Interested in finding monkeys."

Vapour Trails
08-18-2006, 10:48 AM
Not that I'm in support of trans fat, but look at the numbers more carefully. These monkeys were fed 8% of their total diet in trans fat.

Say 2500 calories (for a human, obviously different for a monkey): 8% of 2500 is 200 calories which is a bit over 22g.

Canadians lead the pack and average 10g. Of course that means that there are plenty that take in 20 or 30g plus and plenty that don't. Regardless the proportion is much higher. Monkeys also tend towards a lower fat diet by virtue of a mostly vegetarian diet for generations. Humans have been more omnivorous for a longer time and will probably do a bit better with fat.

I'm certainly not supporting trans fats and I don't believe that a calorie is a calorie. I AM saying that animal studies need to be looked at with a grain of salt when applied to humans.

Well, there is a huge experiment being performed right now in society at large. As trans fats worked there way into our food, our collective waistlines have exploded. I have no doubts that the same results would be obtained from a human experiement of the same kind. The biochemcial pathways in humans and monkeys are 90% similar, as is our DNA.

gator
08-18-2006, 04:23 PM
Damn, I misread this thread title as "Interested in finding monkeys."

lmao

Steele
08-19-2006, 07:56 AM
Transfats, having only been invented in the past 30 years are completely un-natural and cannot be metabolised by the human body. So in effect, transfats can't be used for energy, merely converted into a paunch. Which means that a transfat calorie is not equal to a calorie from another source. I'm not wicked with nutrition, but i'm 100% on this :rolleyes:

-Steele

Goodwinm
08-19-2006, 08:05 AM
Damn, I misread this thread title as "Interested in finding monkeys."
lmao shows what ur thinkin about....... :p

Ricochet_kid
08-22-2006, 06:44 PM
Transfats, having only been invented in the past 30 years are completely un-natural and cannot be metabolised by the human body. So in effect, transfats can't be used for energy, merely converted into a paunch. Which means that a transfat calorie is not equal to a calorie from another source. I'm not wicked with nutrition, but i'm 100% on this :rolleyes:

-Steele

I heard something similar to this on CBC radio a couple weeks ago. The person they interviewed. (some kind of nutritionist or something) said that trans-fats are physiologically more like poison than food.

Steele
08-22-2006, 08:17 PM
Damn straight man, you won't find many natural foodstuffs containing hydrogenated vegetable oil.

edit: Many = Any

-Steele


I heard something similar to this on CBC radio a couple weeks ago. The person they interviewed. (some kind of nutritionist or something) said that trans-fats are physiologically more like poison than food.