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Steele
09-17-2006, 09:45 AM
Hiyas, been drinking a load recently and going to uni in a week or so - The beer situation is not gonna get any better.

Few questions -

I know that the body produces it's own proteins, 14 of the 22 to be precise - can these be converted from alchohol calories? I.e, If is it a simple case of energy in = protein conversion? Or are these proteins derived from specific sources such as veggies, fruit etc?

Low carb beers/wines - are these a gimick and not to be fallen for? Surely the calories must come from somewhere?

It has been shown in a few studies that alchohol can reduce testosterone production + release. Bearing in mind that alchohol is a poison and anethmatic to the human body, is there such a thing as a 'safe' guideline, or is this individual for every person? Is two times a week too much?

If i am hitting protein/fat/healthy carb macros, is there a problem spending the remaining calories on beer?

Would it be ok for a person that is bulking on 2400kcal a day, to consume only 2000 the day before he drinks, and consume 2800 on that day, so long as he is hitting macros?

Maybe few more coming up, will keep you posted. Ideally while bodybuilding, one should not be drinking alchohol at all. But i'll be a student too, don't forget! =)

-Steele

Holto
09-17-2006, 10:51 AM
General advice. Dedicaton is admirable but you only get to be a freshman once. Live it up. Go nuts for the first few weeks. Then pick a few days a week that you are allowed to drink and do it up. For me Beer = Cardio.

Steele
09-17-2006, 12:44 PM
Good point! =) Might just ramp up some HIIT. Have modified my goals to deal with my inherent hate of fat gain -

Instead of

- I fear gaining fat

..it's -

- I fear gaining fat from overeating/eating unhealthy food combined with a sedentary lifestyle.

It's helping me bulk! =)

-Steele

Steele
09-17-2006, 12:49 PM
The problem is, i stick on weight *so* easily. Another reason why HIIT cardio sounds like an awsome plan!

-Steele

Mercuryblade
09-17-2006, 12:55 PM
There are alot of threads about alcohol use.

Steele
09-17-2006, 01:11 PM
This reply is 100% veracious. You have my congratulations.

-Steele


There are alot of threads about alcohol use.

whiteman90909
09-17-2006, 01:58 PM
I would reply, but I dont know what veracious means.

Steele
09-17-2006, 02:28 PM
Truthful, from vera.

-Steele

f=ma
09-17-2006, 02:40 PM
i think you know the answer to your questions already

don't expect to lose any BF if youre drinking heavily twice a week. if anything expect to gain BF in your gut and lose strength.

sCaRz*Of*PaiN
09-17-2006, 02:55 PM
Low carb beers/wines - are these a gimick and not to be fallen for? Surely the calories must come from somewhere?There are 7 calories per gram of alcohol.



If i am hitting protein/fat/healthy carb macros, is there a problem spending the remaining calories on beer?Beer isn't calories. It's alcohol and calories. You shouldn't think of beer as a calorie source. The choice is up to you whether or not you want to endure the consequences of heavy alcohol consumption and how it affects your progress.



Would it be ok for a person that is bulking on 2400kcal a day, to consume only 2000 the day before he drinks, and consume 2800 on that day, so long as he is hitting macros?:scratch: Why would you consume less the day before and then consume MORE on the day that you drink?

f=ma
09-17-2006, 03:02 PM
well, anecdotally speaking, skinny guys consuming lots of calories from alcohol tend to have a gut while having flimsy little limbs despite undereating. in addition, everyone knows that when one gets really drunk, you eat dirty in large quantities

also, in advance, its not like you or i can prove for or against but generally know, for the most part, the above is true.

Steele
09-18-2006, 01:13 AM
You are generalising here.

-Steele


well, anecdotally speaking, skinny guys consuming lots of calories from alcohol tend to have a gut while having flimsy little limbs despite undereating. in addition, everyone knows that when one gets really drunk, you eat dirty in large quantities

also, in advance, its not like you or i can prove for or against but generally know, for the most part, the above is true.

Steele
09-18-2006, 01:15 AM
Evening out the calorie balance by eating less on non drinking days and yet further less on drinking days would reduce the chances of a gut, so long as macronutrient targets are being hit, imo.

-Steele


There are 7 calories per gram of alcohol.


Beer isn't calories. It's alcohol and calories. You shouldn't think of beer as a calorie source. The choice is up to you whether or not you want to endure the consequences of heavy alcohol consumption and how it affects your progress.


:scratch: Why would you consume less the day before and then consume MORE on the day that you drink?

f=ma
09-18-2006, 06:58 AM
You are generalising here.

-Steele
what makes you think you'll be an exception to the generalization? stereotypes come about for a reason

Steele
09-18-2006, 07:06 AM
Can you please substantiate the generalisation with some proof?

-Steele


what makes you think you'll be an exception to the generalization? stereotypes come about for a reason

f=ma
09-18-2006, 07:32 AM
drink up

Steele
09-18-2006, 08:25 AM
So in effect, you have no evidence/proof to back up your argument, but clutch at straws so as not to look like a fool to the rest of the boards.

Guess you're kidding no one, heh.

-Steele

Unreal
09-18-2006, 08:34 AM
Search and read about alcohol on here. If you still want to drink that much after learning what it does, then your only kidding yourself. F=MA is correct, people get "beer guts" for a reason.

RickTheDestroyer
09-18-2006, 08:50 AM
Beer is yummy.

RedSpikeyThing
09-18-2006, 09:02 AM
I'm in college. I limit my drinking to a few binges here and there. We're looking at 2 nights or so per month. I've set up my routine so I don't work out on fridays or saturdays. It sounds bad, but I tend not to drink only 1 or 2. I limit my drinking to those couple of binges I have - I feel like it gets it out of my system. I also think that it is, arguably, better because I get alcohol in my system twice per month, rather than a little bit every day.
Sorry to all you anti-alcohol types out there, but I'm enjoying my stay. I eat very well the rest of the time, bust my ass in the gym and I'm consistently making gains.

MixmasterNash
09-18-2006, 09:12 AM
Don't drink beer because it is low carb. Drink good beer because it is proof that god loves us and wants us to be happy. Thanks, Ben!

MixmasterNash
09-18-2006, 09:14 AM
I'm in college. I limit my drinking to a few binges here and there. We're looking at 2 nights or so per month. I've set up my routine so I don't work out on fridays or saturdays. It sounds bad, but I tend not to drink only 1 or 2. I limit my drinking to those couple of binges I have - I feel like it gets it out of my system. I also think that it is, arguably, better because I get alcohol in my system twice per month, rather than a little bit every day.
Sorry to all you anti-alcohol types out there, but I'm enjoying my stay. I eat very well the rest of the time, bust my ass in the gym and I'm consistently making gains.
The problem with binging isn't the calories in the alcohol, but the after effects if you don't feel well the next day. As long as you can eat properly the next day, you'll be okay, from a dietary perspective.

A little bit of beer everyday is fine too. Alcohol in moderation is good for the heart. But save that for when you're old and don't have coeds to party with.

Steele
09-18-2006, 09:15 AM
To my understanding, excessive alchohol abuse has negative impacts on general health, training too. But there again, the human body is designed to cope with varying levels of toxicity; being young + fit is even better.

Everything in moderation. Just my £0.02 =)

-Steele

Sidior
09-18-2006, 11:22 AM
Drink beer, enjoy university. Do your best to keep everything on track the rest of the time. As mentioned beer is a yummy source of delciousness which proves god loves us (thanks to rick and nash for bringing these points up).

Steele
09-18-2006, 11:23 AM
Yeah. I'm weird with hangovers, sometimes i get them really bad. Since i started lifting though, they seem to have stopped. Hurrah! =)

-Steele

Holto
09-18-2006, 11:26 AM
People get "beer guts" for a reason.

Answer: Insulin Resistance

This is why Alchohol is the leading cause of diabetes.

Steele
09-18-2006, 11:37 AM
Man knows his shizzle! =) What's your take on my OP in this thread Holto?

-Steele


Answer: Insulin Resistance

This is why Alchohol is the leading cause of diabetes.

manowar669
09-18-2006, 11:37 AM
Answer: Insulin Resistance

This is why Alchohol is the leading cause of diabetes.

I don't know about that. A sedentary lifestyle and a crappy diet of sugars and processed carbs would be more likely the leading cause. Bradley once posted a study indicating alcohol increases insulin sensitivity (very slightly). In any case, chronic alcohol use is not good for anything, especially your wallet.

RedSpikeyThing
09-18-2006, 06:20 PM
The problem with binging isn't the calories in the alcohol, but the after effects if you don't feel well the next day. As long as you can eat properly the next day, you'll be okay, from a dietary perspective.


Yeah that's true. I tend not to have that problem, unless I go *way* overboard. Again, that's just me.

Holto
09-18-2006, 09:33 PM
I don't know about that.

It's a documented fact in Canada. Not sure about the US.

The ironic part is that the "Beer Store" is the leading contributor to Diabetes Research here in Canada.

You are absolutely right in that it's not the ONLY factor. It's not like the people that are being diagnosed with Type I Diabetes work out or have a clue about nutrition.

Vapour Trails
09-19-2006, 03:38 PM
As far as alcohol and diabetes
Moderate drinkers may have a lower risk of diabetes than non-drinkers. "Alcohol intake increases insulin sensitivity and may partly explain both the J-shaped relationship between the prevalence of diabetes and the amount of alcohol consumption and the decreased mortality for myocardial infarction."[65] "Compared with abstainers men who drank 30.0-49.9 g of alcohol daily had a relative risk of diabetes of 0.61."[66] "Consumption of 30 g/d of alcohol (2 drinks per day) has beneficial effects on insulin and triglyceride concentrations and insulin sensitivity in nondiabetic postmenopausal women."[67] After adjustment for age, randomized treatment assignment, smoking, physical activity, and body mass index, the relative risk estimates of diabetes for those reporting alcohol use of rarely/never were 1.00 (referent), 1 to 3 drinks per month 1.03, 1 drink per week 0.89, 2 to 4 drinks per week 0.74, 5 to 6 drinks per week 0.67, and 1 or more drinks per day 0.57.[68] "The results of this study suggested that moderate alcohol consumption may reduce the risk of type 2 diabetes. On the other hand, binge drinking and high alcohol consumption may increase the risk of type 2 diabetes in women."[69]

Alcohol is not the leading cause of diabetes, in fact, it helps prevent it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_consumption_and_health

Holto
09-19-2006, 04:23 PM
To me it looks like you are supporting my point:


"The results of this study suggested that moderate alcohol consumption may reduce the risk of type 2 diabetes. On the other hand, binge drinking and high alcohol consumption may increase the risk of type 2 diabetes in women."[69]

So is there a group represented anywhere in this data that drinks excessively?

From your data the heaviest drinkers are at 1+ day. That could mean anything. It certainly doesn't show heavy drinking.

If you had some data for people that drink 10-20/day you *might* have a point. There are people that pour rye into their coffee in the morning. Good luck quantifying how many drinks they have in a day.

manowar669
09-20-2006, 05:11 AM
To me it looks like you are supporting my point:



So is there a group represented anywhere in this data that drinks excessively?

From your data the heaviest drinkers are at 1+ day. That could mean anything. It certainly doesn't show heavy drinking.

If you had some data for people that drink 10-20/day you *might* have a point. There are people that pour rye into their coffee in the morning. Good luck quantifying how many drinks they have in a day.

It's possible that chronic heavy drinking may increase risk of diabetes. However, It's probably difficult to form a study with chronic alcoholics, because something else kills them first (cyrrhosis, car crashes, etc.), they get arrested (DUIs), they get on the wagon, or they just don't participate in studies (they're too busy drinking). Lots of heavy drinkers are also smokers (and/or spend many hours a week in smoke filled bars), and eat crap (when you spend $800 a month on booze, cheap bar specials and cheap garbage are all you can afford). I would be interested in such a study, but rats seems to be the only test subjects so far.

Vapour Trails
09-20-2006, 08:24 AM
Holto, you said "Alcohol is a leading cause of diabetes", you didn't mention anything about excessive drinking/alcoholism. In moderate quantities, which represents the majority of the population, it clearly reduces the odds of getting diabetes. Besides, ppl who drink 10-20 drinks a day have far greater concerns.

Holto
09-20-2006, 12:55 PM
Holto, you said "Alcohol is a leading cause of diabetes"

Actually I said its the leading cause of diabetes.

So is smoking a leading cause of lung cancer?

Hold on a minute. What if they only smoke 1 cigarette a day?



Besides, ppl who drink 10-20 drinks a day have far greater concerns.

Agreed.