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View Full Version : What Kind Of Carbs To CARB-UP With.. ?



MonStar1023
02-07-2002, 03:30 PM
I was thinking about when Natural Hormonal Enhancement (NHE) was written and how much more research there has been in the past few years on the effects of "refeed" periods. Anyway the author of NHE, Rob Faigin, recommends primarily starchy carbs, and some simple carbs during the refeed carb-up meal. I was wondering though if primarily starchy carbs is the way to go. From what I understand starchy carbs produce a longer more sustained increase in insulin levels compared to simple sugars. For example a 32 oz. of Gatorade would produce a more immmediate insulin rush etc. compared to 10 oz. of potatoes. Bad comparison but I think that many of you understand my point.

The bottom line is, what is the IDEAL food to carb-load with? Right now I am eating a huge bowl of spaghetti and ice-cream.

:cool::cool:

irish mike
02-07-2002, 07:44 PM
for the carb up on my ckd i eat whatever i want.since you have only 1 carb up i'm not sure what to tell you.since youre not sure which is better(starchy carbs or sugar carbs)what you're eating has both so i'd stick with what you've been eating

MonStar1023
02-07-2002, 10:07 PM
Yeah so maybe my spaghetti and ice-cream combo really IS the way to go...

:cool::cool:

MonStar1023
02-07-2002, 10:19 PM
I am thinking about it and when it comes right down to it NHE isnt all about muscle glycogen replenishment etc. I mean it IS but its more about the sudden rush of insulin that your pancreas secretes I think. So I am not sure why dextrose or maltodextrin or something along those lines wouldnt be a better idea.

Oh well... what do you guys think? I mean honestly whats my best bet for refeeding purposes for ONE meal?

:cool::cool:

MonStar1023
02-07-2002, 10:21 PM
BUMP for the doc , Wizard , YatesNightBlade

:cool::cool:

MonStar1023
02-08-2002, 12:09 PM
...

:help::help:

MonStar1023
02-08-2002, 12:09 PM
All you diet gurus what do you think is the best to carb-up with. I still want it to be psycologically gratifying.. sugars etc.

:cool::cool:

breeze
02-08-2002, 12:13 PM
I would suggest rice.

The_Chicken_Daddy
02-08-2002, 01:14 PM
MS, if there was a way of improving the diet i think Rob would have updated his website with it by now. I think you should just stick to what you're doing that works and that rob has suggested.

Prelude
02-08-2002, 02:42 PM
Hey Monstar,

Just curious about this NHE diet you're doing. I'm trying to buy the book but can't find it in the bookstores that I went to. Anyways, just got a couple of questions for you.

1. Do you carb up a day or night before your workout?
2. What do you eat pre/post?
3. On non workout days, do you mainly eat fats and protein
with low carbs? But what %?
4. Are you gaining lean muscle by doing this.

Thanks!!!

MonStar1023
02-08-2002, 09:41 PM
Prelude-
Hey how are you doing bro... going to answer your questions that you posted..

1. Do you carb up a day or night before your workout?

I carb-up POSTworkout. Afterwards. I usually wait around 2 hours then have my huge carb feast.

2. What do you eat pre/post?

I am assuming that you are talking about PRE and POST workout right.. now pre and post carb-up meal.. I dont eat anything preworkout, maybe a 0-3g carb protein bar.. then postworkout Ill have some whey protein, glutamine peptides, creatine, and some flax oil.

3. On non workout days, do you mainly eat fats and protein
with low carbs? But what %?

First of all check out my journal bro. I carb-up every OTHER workout. Not every workout day. I workout 4x a week now. Just started a new program designed by chris mason. Anyway.. yeah fats and protein when I am NOT carbing up. I dont count calories or grams of anything.. but I just try and keep it moderate in protein and moderate in fat. Not too much of either.

4. Are you gaining lean muscle by doing this.

I am not really sure bro sorry. I AM getting stronger. Thats for damn sure! So its all good. Again just post in my journal.

Good luck..
:cool::cool:

By the way NHE will not be found in bookstores.. it will mainly be found on the web or through a friend.. check @ www.bodybuilding.com.

Prelude
02-11-2002, 07:33 AM
Thanks! Can't wait to read the book and try it.

MonStar1023
02-11-2002, 08:32 PM
Prelude-
Yeah bro I recommend the NHE Eating Plan 100%. Worked great for me. I am doing around 25-27 lbs. right now. Strength is way up and everything is looking good!

:thumbup::thumbup:

Par Deus
02-12-2002, 08:44 AM
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
MS, if there was a way of improving the diet i think Rob would have updated his website with it by now.


If he has not addressed leptin -- and it appears he has not -- then, you would be mistaken.

MonStar1023
02-12-2002, 08:46 AM
Par Deus-
Whats your opinion of NHE? The entire eating plan in itself and the 2 carb-up meals a week etc.

:cool::cool:

Par Deus
02-12-2002, 08:47 AM
Monstar,

The type of carb on your refeed is not going to be hugely important, other than if it is fructose (and even that is questionable, IMO) -- just eat whatever you want, while not overindulging your fat intake.

MonStar1023
02-12-2002, 08:49 AM
Par Deus-
Yeah thats kind of what I was thinking. As long as its not fructose or fat gererally I am okay...

Again what is your opinion of NHE?

:cool::cool:

The_Chicken_Daddy
02-12-2002, 09:40 AM
hahaha

I wanna join Par Deus in the choir for the church of Leptin. If only the head Priest would let me...

Par Deus
02-12-2002, 10:22 PM
Originally posted by MonStar1023

Again what is your opinion of NHE?



I have not read the book, but from what I gather from your posts, it seems to place to much emphasis on manipulating GH -- which will have close to zero physiological effect (the increases in cortisol and decreases in insulin that go along with the recommendations used to achieve increases in GH are likely a different story.) I particularly disagree with the post-workout recommendations.

And, as mentioned, a diet meant to enhance natural hormones, that is built without an understanding of leptin (the most important one) is almost certainly doomed to be less than ideal.

MonStar1023
02-13-2002, 06:14 AM
Par Deus-
Yeah after reading NHE and skimming through it every now and then, I dont think that Rob mentions leptin once.. I am wondernig though because I thought that the carb-up meal with a surplus, for me at least, of around 2000 calories and 300-400g of carbs would stimulate leptin to an extent wouldnt it?

Also yeah Rob does focus a lot of hGH. Whether he is valid or not in his argument, the diet itself I feel still works great, and is very realistic to stick to. Not couting calories, etc. I mean just eating low-carb, mod-fat, and mod-protein, then carbing up with a huge carb-feast twice a week. What dont you agree with about his post-workout recommendations. Its basically like an Atkin's postworkout shake, etc.

:cool::cool:

I think that the diet itself, maybe not all of the knowledge backing it up, is excellent. Low-carbs and mod-fat keep your test levels up and insulin down, glucagon up, hGH elevated (even though this may not make a drastic difference), and during the carb-up meal the huge rush of carbs blasts up your insulin levels to promote a highly anabolic state.

MonStar1023
02-13-2002, 06:16 AM
Also even though theres only a big rush of carbs twice a week, when youre training and dieting primarily for fat-loss thats all that's necessary I think.. if I was trying to gain a little bit of mass I might extend the carb-meal from postworkout, until I go to bed. For example if I were doing HST trying to put on size, starting postworkout Mon, Wed, and Fri, I would pack in the carbs for around 6-7 hours.

:cool::cool:

Par Deus
02-13-2002, 09:51 AM
Originally posted by MonStar1023
Par Deus-
Yeah after reading NHE and skimming through it every now and then, I dont think that Rob mentions leptin once.. I am wondernig though because I thought that the carb-up meal with a surplus, for me at least, of around 2000 calories and 300-400g of carbs would stimulate leptin to an extent wouldnt it?



Certainly. And, I do not think it is a terrible diet by any means (with the exception of the post workout recommendations) -- it is just that it is not particularly special or novel.

MonStar1023
02-13-2002, 04:15 PM
Par Deus-
Yeah I understand your perspective completely. Thanks for the input bro.

:cool::cool: