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Stumprrp
03-06-2007, 08:41 PM
Hey guys, ive said to myself that i will never use a belt for anything but i noticed that when i had it on doing rack pulls the other day the belt allowed me to really force my abs into the lift and help me lift more weight.

What im getting to is i might start using a belt for deadlifts only, do you think i will benefit and gain some LBS? it seemed to give me some on the rack pulls (675 x 1 to 725 x 3!)

Random question..
Ive been talking around and i hear that wide grip (index on ring) is not very good for a raw bencher and that shirter lifters get away with it, should i stick with a more narrow grip? seems like i missed 335 the other day from the grip being to wide.

SFTS
03-06-2007, 09:18 PM
Well I'm not close to being the most knowledgeble on the subject but I belive pinkies just inside the rings or there about is most peoples strongest raw grip as for the belt I use them for heavy squats but on DL's I tend not to becuase I feel like it cramps my ROM but thats just me.

I can really feel the diffrerence in squat the belt on a couiple of occasions has given me what I needed for those last 1 or 2 reps

vdizenzo
03-06-2007, 09:19 PM
I actually bench more with a belt on with and without a shirt. Having something to force my ab into helps me push harder. But then again I pulled 800 on the trap bar with no belt. Play with it and see what works best.

The index fingers being on the rings is bad for raw bench is not true. It all depends on where your strength is. It clearly decreases the range of motion. I am stronger with my index fingers on the rings.

SFTS
03-06-2007, 09:20 PM
Trap bar=Hex bar?

vdizenzo
03-06-2007, 09:22 PM
Trap bar=Hex bar?

Yes, I believe so.

vrizzle
03-06-2007, 09:50 PM
I heard that too (Wide grip = bad for raw benchers). I'm skinny and have long arms, would this affect where my grip is? Where exactly should it be?

Big o Boy
03-07-2007, 01:43 AM
Stump... I'd suspect index on the ring for you is bit too wide of a grip. Although we may be different, I lose a lot of tricep strength moving my hands out that far. It's going to be a R&D experience to find the grip that's right for you. For the longest time I'd been benching with my pinkies just inside the rings. Now I've switched to having my ring finger on the rings with a tight arch, and it's helped immensily. This is all raw, mind you.

btw... belt is definitely going to help you on the deadlift (if not in poundage, stability and control). I think it helps me most at the bottom of the lift.

Stumprrp
03-07-2007, 02:03 AM
thx guys i will experiment

Guido
03-07-2007, 11:23 AM
No shame in using the belt for some things, man. If it helps you lift more weight, that's only going to help you get stronger. I always use the belt for my heaviest squat, DL, and good morning sets.

As for bench grip width, I put my ring fingers on the rings and it works well. Since we are about the same size, I'd think it should work well for you, too. Try it for a few weeks and see how it works for you.

smokinHawk
03-07-2007, 11:44 AM
ive noticed some of the top 165lb benchers (raw) are putting the ring finger on the ring, compared to me were i only put my pinky on it and their getting about 80lbs more then me.
im trying to move it out slowly

RhodeHouse
03-07-2007, 01:57 PM
Here is a trend that has been bothering me for awhile. Everyone wants to do all their heavy squat/dl work without a belt to build ab strength. If you're squatting or dling, the point is to lift as much weight as possible in those lifts, not to get ab work. Work your abs when it's time to work abs. Not when it's squat/dl time. Remember why your squatting and dling. Don't lose sight of the big picture as a powerlifter. SBD more. SFW!

Uncle Fester
03-07-2007, 02:06 PM
I bench with my ring fingers on the rings, and I am a raw bencher. As for a belt, I've been using it for my heavy sets on squats and deadlifts. Like people have said, it gives you something to push your abs against.

Stumprrp
03-07-2007, 02:23 PM
ok everyone i will do so. but i still hate squats with a belt lol, ill try em.

Guido
03-07-2007, 03:10 PM
ok everyone i will do so. but i still hate squats with a belt lol, ill try em.I actually find that a belt gives me more on squats than DL's. I think I get a good 20 lbs extra with a belt on squats as opposed to DL where I maybe get 10 lbs out of it.

Oh, and I agree with what RhodeHouse said. When the big man speaks, listen!

RhodeHouse
03-07-2007, 03:39 PM
Guido, I like you man. You have seen the dim light that I emit. I don't care what your shrink says about you. You're a good dude. :shoot:

vrizzle
03-07-2007, 04:30 PM
I tried squatting w/ a belt, it seemed like it only got in the way and was an annoyance. I didn't feel a difference as far as strength.

SaVvY
03-07-2007, 04:44 PM
Here is a trend that has been bothering me for awhile. Everyone wants to do all their heavy squat/dl work without a belt to build ab strength. If you're squatting or dling, the point is to lift as much weight as possible in those lifts, not to get ab work. Work your abs when it's time to work abs. Not when it's squat/dl time. Remember why your squatting and dling. Don't lose sight of the big picture as a powerlifter. SBD more. SFW!
i cant say anything for other people, but for me this is not the case, its not the case at all

all the equipment for me is just not needed, if something is injured maybe some extra supports a good idea, but not for anything else - i think its only came into being because of ego

when romans needed to lift something heavy, they didnt say 'WHOA! hold on here, ive no suit, ive no belt, ive no wraps, i cant possibly lift that!' or today, when my boss says a rack move is needed, with each carpet weighing over 600lbs, do i go home an get my belt?? course not, thats rediculous

since these things are allowed in comp an they do increase the numbers, an since i cant really do anything to change that, maybe i should learn to use a belt for when im in a comp, but for training, what reason do i have to use one? i need to have a very strong core for the career in strongman i want, i need it so i dont get injured all the time, an i need it to be strong in the events

i train without a belt because wearing a belt would only give me a weaker core, it would be less than pointless

vdizenzo
03-07-2007, 06:09 PM
i cant say anything for other people, but for me this is not the case, its not the case at all

all the equipment for me is just not needed, if something is injured maybe some extra supports a good idea, but not for anything else - i think its only came into being because of ego

when romans needed to lift something heavy, they didnt say 'WHOA! hold on here, ive no suit, ive no belt, ive no wraps, i cant possibly lift that!' or today, when my boss says a rack move is needed, with each carpet weighing over 600lbs, do i go home an get my belt?? course not, thats rediculous

since these things are allowed in comp an they do increase the numbers, an since i cant really do anything to change that, maybe i should learn to use a belt for when im in a comp, but for training, what reason do i have to use one? i need to have a very strong core for the career in strongman i want, i need it so i dont get injured all the time, an i need it to be strong in the events

i train without a belt because wearing a belt would only give me a weaker core, it would be less than pointless

Holy shiznit Savvy are you serious about the strongman thing? Dude, they are some of the biggest equipment users in the world. Some of them won't roll out of bed without rehband elbow and knee sleeves. Let's not forget two belts. They also throw on supersuits any chance they get.

I have spent the vast majority of my strength training days in a belt and I have no problem picking anything up because I have worked for a strong core. So a 600lb roll of whatever will not cause me to go home an get my belt. As a matter of fact I was able to pick up a 365lb stone the first day I tried it. Strong is strong end of story.

Stumprrp
03-07-2007, 07:54 PM
i squatted with a belt today and well, i take it back, i loved it and smashed my old PR getting 405 x 10, lol.

RhodeHouse
03-07-2007, 07:56 PM
Whatever works for you. If you wanna be a pro strongman you better learn to use the gear. You're still young and think you're indestructable. More power to you, but vdizenzo is right. Strongmen are gear whores just like powerlifters. Strength is about the long haul, not the sprint. If you don't take care of your body, you'll fade out in no time. Seen it too many times. If the gear didn't make everyone stronger, they wouldn't use it. It's really that simple. Good lifting to you. SFW!

SaVvY
03-08-2007, 07:44 AM
great squatting stump!

theres no point in telling someone who doesn't agree with any gear (unless of injury or something needs rest etc) that loads of gear is used in strongman, i already know that, but what can i do about it? im not against powerlifting, im against equipment, an like i said, learning to use is something i should probably do, an i will, but the gear does not actually make 'you' stronger, it just allows more weight to be lifted

i know im unstoppable, i dont think im indestructable > i do everything i can to make my core as strong as possible because i know that if i dont, ill end up with a load of injuries - if making my core strong is thought of as not taking care of my body, then im more than happy to not take care of it, an we'll see just how quick i 'fade out' :evillaugh

vdizenzo
03-08-2007, 04:26 PM
great squatting stump!

theres no point in telling someone who doesn't agree with any gear (unless of injury or something needs rest etc) that loads of gear is used in strongman, i already know that, but what can i do about it? im not against powerlifting, im against equipment, an like i said, learning to use is something i should probably do, an i will, but the gear does not actually make 'you' stronger, it just allows more weight to be lifted

i know im unstoppable, i dont think im indestructable > i do everything i can to make my core as strong as possible because i know that if i dont, ill end up with a load of injuries - if making my core strong is thought of as not taking care of my body, then im more than happy to not take care of it, an we'll see just how quick i 'fade out' :evillaugh

Did anyone here say you should not strengthen your core? Clearly you just like to argue. Frankly I don't care what you do. I just offer my advice based on my experience and success in strength training.

SaVvY
03-08-2007, 05:07 PM
Did anyone here say you should not strengthen your core? Clearly you just like to argue. Frankly I don't care what you do. I just offer my advice based on my experience and success in strength training.
i was giving my opinion, do you think the rest of the forum just posts cuss they like to argue? there would be no point in forums period if this didnt happen, we cant always agree

Natetaco
03-08-2007, 06:12 PM
i was giving my opinion, do you think the rest of the forum just posts cuss they like to argue? there would be no point in forums period if this didnt happen, we cant always agree

yeah but you definatly try to show dominance over alot of people, i have seen your posts in many threads and your ego is way to big. And if the competitions let you use belts then why wouldnt you train with one? Thats like saying im going to train only raw bench for shirted competitions.

SaVvY
03-09-2007, 08:05 AM
yeah but you definatly try to show dominance over alot of people, i have seen your posts in many threads and your ego is way to big. And if the competitions let you use belts then why wouldnt you train with one? Thats like saying im going to train only raw bench for shirted competitions.
being sure, or feeling strongly about what i say, does not mean i have an ego, if i had an ego id go around talking about how i rule an stupid ***** like that, which i dont, cuss i dont think like that, i dont consider myself any better than anybody else, why would i?

an i have already said, maybe you didnt read my posts in this thread? learning to use the gear yes, but not for training, because not using a belt gives a stronger core than using a belt, so i dont train with one unless i have an injury or my core needs rest

bill
03-09-2007, 08:31 AM
Since it's sort of being discussed. Do the WSM use squats suits in competition?

Bohizzle
03-09-2007, 08:57 AM
yes, at least i'm pretty sure Mariusz uses em, so I assume others do as well.

Guido
03-09-2007, 09:14 AM
They definitely use wraps. Not so sure about the squat suits. I'm thinking they would limit mobility too much for what those guys are doing.

Bohizzle
03-09-2007, 09:23 AM
I've seen them do it for deadlift/squat events, not medley type stuff.

vdizenzo
03-09-2007, 10:27 AM
They definitely wear suits. I am currently hooking up a pro strongman that I know with Inzer.