Still not completely understanding the hip drive in Rippetoe's Squat

[xstalkrx]

When you watch this video...and you drive the hip up like he is talking about...I dont understand at what point you actually stand up straight and erect. When I do the hip drive it causes me to be bent over at the top of the lift and it just seems awkward?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yha2XAc2qu8

[Counterweight]

I think a lot of people bend too far forward when trying to initiate hip drive. Just a slight bend, not even CLOSE to a good morning like some people say. I break my hips first, then knees follow. Hard to explain, but once you get it you'll know. You just get into a groove.

[xstalkrx]

I think a lot of people bend too far forward when trying to initiate hip drive. Just a slight bend, not even CLOSE to a good morning like some people say. I break my hips first, then knees follow. Hard to explain, but once you get it you'll know. You just get into a groove.

a good morning would be back parallel to the floor right? so i know its not supposed to be like that for sure.

ummm...yea i feel like its just a big series of awkward little muscle movements when I come up out of the hip drive to stand up erect... ugh...

[Kastro]

a good morning would be back parallel to the floor right? so i know its not supposed to be like that for sure.

No, a good morning would be shoving your ass up while allowing the back angle the collapse. How parallel you are at the bottom has nothing to do with it.

"Hip drive" in the sense Rippetoe uses really means nothing more than extending the knees and hips out of the hole without changing the back angle, as opposed to lifting the chest too soon which will kill hamstring tension (as explained in the video).

[rbtrout]

^^^Well said. It's not as difficult as it seems. Think about the mechanics of the lift as you come up out of the whole. Instead of thinking of several independant, mechanical moves, think of them as seemless moves together.

[xstalkrx]

^^^Well said. It's not as difficult as it seems. Think about the mechanics of the lift as you come up out of the whole. Instead of thinking of several independant, mechanical moves, think of them as seemless moves together.

my main confusion is.... when can I straighten my back all the way?

[Kastro]

my main confusion is.... when can I straighten my back all the way?

About halfway or 2/3 of the way up your back angle will start to become more vertical. This isn't really something anybody thinks about though.

[Rugby Dad]

I hear what Ripptoe is saying about hip drive, and how going chest up takes tension off the hips when coming out the hole,
BUT the idea of keeping the head tilted downward, looking down just bugs me.

when that weight gets heavy as in powerlifting type singles and doubles, I see guy falling forward face to the ground with that head position.

[Sensei]

IMO, people overthink the cues. It will probably come around if you squat consistently and mindfully. I realize that I'm part of the problem when it comes to squat form naziism, but cues are simply cues/tips to prod you closer to optimal technique. Cues are not dogma and not actual technique.

[NordicMan]

I hear what Ripptoe is saying about hip drive, and how going chest up takes tension off the hips when coming out the hole,
BUT the idea of keeping the head tilted downward, looking down just bugs me.

when that weight gets heavy as in powerlifting type singles and doubles, I see guy falling forward face to the ground with that head position.

What you said about looking down bugging you, I understand that. Looking more upward seems to help to keep the back flat. I had a misstep one time, I was looking downward, wearing some Nike running shoes(wrong shoes to wear, I never wore them again for lifting) I just got off balance, not enough good contact with the floor, and it got me a compressed disc due to this misstep, and I almost toppled over forward from the pain, but recovered. That took a while to recover from.

However, this was a beneficial video to watch, as Rippetoe has coached the young fellow about keeping his back, and elbows up. And his remarks about the chest coming up too soon, and taking the stress from the hamstrings makes a lot of good sense. This is a good video.

[Decent]

IMO, people overthink the cues. It will probably come around if you squat consistently and mindfully. I realize that I'm part of the problem when it comes to squat form naziism, but cues are simply cues/tips to prod you closer to optimal technique. Cues are not dogma and not actual technique.

You're definitely not part of the problem. Your SquatRX videos were amazing for me, and I think you have to get a bit nazi to analyze bad form, dissect the root, and fix it. I think once form gets okay, you realize to use the body as a whole and common sense takes over. Now I just focus on keeping the weight above the heels, and the rest sort of works itself out.

You can't really get from A to Z without over thinking the cues though imo, because so many of us start out with bad form, and terrible advice that we have to unlearn (knees shouldn't go past toes, going past parallel is unsafe, etc. etc.).