Why are there still hungry people on this planet?

I thought it was a Catholic virtue to give to charity...

http://www.catholicnews.com/data/sto...ns/0603949.htm

Here are some quotes:

"He said the Vatican's investment sector closed with a profit of $55 million compared to a profit of only $7.7 million in 2004."

Sounds like a nice increase.

"One major jump in the Vatican expenses was in the sector of personnel costs, which rose from $129.3 million in 2004 to $154.3 million in 2005."

They have enough money to be paying off 150 million dollar expenses? wtf! And that's just in the personnel sector...
Of course no one really knows how much the vatican makes per year other than the guys in charge... but I think we all know it's A LOT. No one actually knows how much they have invested and in banks. Not to mention the massive amount of priceless artifacts they own from the constant pillaging and raping of the world back in the Dark Ages. They did more than kill Muslims when they "marched" to the middle east that's for sure.

I don't doubt that the catholic church does give donations, but if they are dealing with this much money they could easily feed a HUGE majority of the planet. Why am I not seeing "This year the Catholic Church has donated 500 million dollars to feed children in Africa" on the news? We all know they have the money and we all know if they did do it that's all we would see on the news. It actually sickens me.

hey.. the pope has to eat, ok? catering is expensive

Because religion isn't all that it's cracked up to be. Maybe someday people will take off their blindfolds and see the greedy man behind the scenes running the show instead of "god".

Originally Posted by Invain

Because religion isn't all that it's cracked up to be. Maybe someday people will take off their blindfolds and see the greedy man behind the scenes running the show instead of "god".

It does a good job keeping people scared and trained to believe in an imaginary being.

Some times you have to stand back in awe at the all time heavy weight champion of false claims and exaggerated promises, Religion.

There is no contest in the Bull**** department

Originally Posted by Invain

Because religion isn't all that it's cracked up to be. Maybe someday people will take off their blindfolds and see the greedy man behind the scenes running the show instead of "god".

YAAA. Religiionzzzz causeee str@rvation1!!!@1'''

/end sarcasm.

Originally Posted by CrazyK

YAAA. Religiionzzzz causeee str@rvation1!!!@1'''

/end sarcasm.

well.. the argument isnt that they cause starvation. seems like it is that they aren't doing enough to prevent it with a $150m yearly payroll.

Originally Posted by CrazyK

YAAA. Religiionzzzz causeee str@rvation1!!!@1'''

/end sarcasm.

That is not what I said, nor what I implied.

I figured you'd have something to say about my post though. I do not mean to offend those who are religious, I was a very strong Christian for 20 years.

Should the church also fund health care to those who can't afford it? The church I went to back home would feed the homeless every week not to mention all the other good things they do for the community. Bill Gates has billions upon billions of dollars so why not blame him?

People who criticize others for not helping the needy better be doing it themselves.

Originally Posted by Southern Beast

People who criticize others for not helping the needy better be doing it themselves.

Well said....

Christians give more money to charities than non-Christians. Fact.

And wasn't it Bill Gates who was letting the media suck his dick after his wife whipped him into giving his money away?

Also, the "Global Community" gives aid to poor countries in the form of $ and food on a daily basis, and the numbers are staggering. Problem is, the same "Global Community" put dictators in there who were cool with us mining/deforesting the **** out of their country, but they want a kickback in the form of 95% of the aid we send, because there is no oversight.

It's kinda like:

U.N. helicopter drops off package --> Guys with AK47s seize load --> AK47 guys sell food to starving locals for money ---> PROFIT

Edit: To solve this problem, we could take .01% of the TARP budget and solve world hunger. Instead of giving money, we would buy land and efficient farming equipment for hundreds of thousands of people. We'd also supply them with AK47s. Not a bad idea, methinks.

Originally Posted by ncsuLuke

Should the church also fund health care to those who can't afford it? The church I went to back home would feed the homeless every week not to mention all the other good things they do for the community. Bill Gates has billions upon billions of dollars so why not blame him?

Because he got it through his own hard work. He can do what he wants with it, but of course it would be nicer if he gave some away. The Catholic Church preach charity but aren't giving as much as they should. They aren't following their own doctrine.

Originally Posted by BFGUITAR

Because he got it through his own hard work.

I'd say 10% hard work, 90% buying competitors before they could challenge him.

As for the Vatican not giving away their profits, i can't really disagree with you there bro.

Originally Posted by MonsterZero

I'd say 10% hard work, 90% buying competitors before they could challenge him.

As for the Vatican not giving away their profits, i can't really disagree with you there bro.

Business is business.

Why do you care what an organization does with its money? The Catholic Church gives away TONS of money. So do many other churches. How about instead of everyone on here eating like pigs to gain a few pounds they give that extra food to shelters, the extra money saved to charities. Instead of lifting go and help someone on the street.

I can't believe someone would even bring this up.

I wouldn't harp on Gates BTW. He's donating the bulk of his fortune to some sort of super charitable fund he set up. He might actually do more against hunger than almost any ever has.

And I am not a fan of Microsoft software btw.

Originally Posted by nejar462

I wouldn't harp on Gates BTW. He's donating the bulk of his fortune to some sort of super charitable fund he set up. He might actually do more against hunger than almost any ever has.

And I am not a fan of Microsoft software btw.

That was my point. The church still does a lot for hunger and help people elsewhere.

I am assuming your an Atheist, but of Jewish descent - I can't remember to be exact. Do you really think the hungry and the starving would be better off without the Catholic church and with only Ahteists around to take care of them?

I'm a Catholic and I know what we do in our community. I guarantee we feed a hell of a lot more people in my community then whatever it is that you are doing. Why you sit on your high horse condeming there are people out there actually doing something. No religion is perfect and no one running a group is perfect but at least they try, they make an attempt, unlike billions and millions of people that sit around and point fingers. There is nothing more disgusting to me then someone who sits on their butt and points fingers at a group that is trying to help others - especially when it is an Atheist pointing their high brow, superior intellect at us lowly, unintelligent Catholics who pray to our imaginary God. All we do is donate our own time and own money to try and better the world the best we can - I don't see the Atheists banning together to donate their time and money as a group under the Atheist banner. I am not a super religious zealot who tries to get people to come and pray on Sunday, do what you want to do, but don't you dare accuse Catholics of not doing their fair share. Whats the Atheist motto? Sit on the sidelines with a thumb up your arse, while people starve in your city streets, while you sip coffee and eat bascotti snubbing your nose at the world, espousing on all the problems in the world and why those trying to help are scum b/c they aren't doing more. What a joke. You are mocking a religion b/c they aren't doing more, while your group does absolutely nothing. This is just an appalling and disgusting way to attack the Catholic church and you should be ashamed.

We get it, you don't like religion. You don't believe. But lets look at society the last 30 years, with the deterioration of religious beliefs and more people moving toward Atheism. You can't honestly say that people are placing more value on human life - the way people treat one another is terrible. The way our kids treat other kids and adults is terrible. I know most on this board will mock me for this, but I truly believe it is a result of more people not going to church. It brought a set of values and respect that just seems to have disappeared over the last few decades.

Originally Posted by BilltheButcher

I am assuming your an Atheist, but of Jewish descent - I can't remember to be exact. Do you really think the hungry and the starving would be better off without the Catholic church and with only Ahteists around to take care of them?

I'm a Catholic and I know what we do in our community. I guarantee we feed a hell of a lot more people in my community then whatever it is that you are doing. Why you sit on your high horse condeming there are people out there actually doing something. No religion is perfect and no one running a group is perfect but at least they try, they make an attempt, unlike billions and millions of people that sit around and point fingers. There is nothing more disgusting to me then someone who sits on their butt and points fingers at a group that is trying to help others - especially when it is an Atheist pointing their high brow, superior intellect at us lowly, unintelligent Catholics who pray to our imaginary God. All we do is donate our own time and own money to try and better the world the best we can - I don't see the Atheists banning together to donate their time and money as a group under the Atheist banner. I am not a super religious zealot who tries to get people to come and pray on Sunday, do what you want to do, but don't you dare accuse Catholics of not doing their fair share. Whats the Atheist motto? Sit on the sidelines with a thumb up your arse, while people starve in your city streets, while you sip coffee and eat bascotti snubbing your nose at the world, espousing on all the problems in the world and why those trying to help are scum b/c they aren't doing more. What a joke. You are mocking a religion b/c they aren't doing more, while your group does absolutely nothing. This is just an appalling and disgusting way to attack the Catholic church and you should be ashamed.

We get it, you don't like religion. You don't believe. But lets look at society the last 30 years, with the deterioration of religious beliefs and more people moving toward Atheism. You can't honestly say that people are placing more value on human life - the way people treat one another is terrible. The way our kids treat other kids and adults is terrible. I know most on this board will mock me for this, but I truly believe it is a result of more people not going to church. It brought a set of values and respect that just seems to have disappeared over the last few decades.

I couldn't agree with you more, Bill. I'm Atheist and I go to Church EVERY Sunday. Sure, religion might be a load of crap, but what's taught at Church is not. I have never been at a mass/service that even though of not helping the community in some way. The vast majority of religions ARE GOOD.

It really bothers me that all the Atheists on the board can talk all this crap about religion like it's not good at all. Religion does help. Religion does have its downfalls, but who the hell are all these people to say that the Church doesn't help others. Out of the BILLIONS of dollars the Church receives each year it does a hell of a lot with it.

I don't believe in "god", but I sure as hell follow the tenants of be good to others, give a helping hand, give to the poor, etc. etc.

Originally Posted by sharkall2003

Why do you care what an organization does with its money? The Catholic Church gives away TONS of money. So do many other churches. How about instead of everyone on here eating like pigs to gain a few pounds they give that extra food to shelters, the extra money saved to charities. Instead of lifting go and help someone on the street.

I can't believe someone would even bring this up.

It's not any organization its a religious institution. If the Catholic Church actually cared about charity they would be giving a lot more money than they do currently. How can you justify a religious institution's wealth when the whole goal of the religion is to give to charity? They shouldn't be rich according to their own doctrine.

Originally Posted by BilltheButcher

I am assuming your an Atheist, but of Jewish descent - I can't remember to be exact. Do you really think the hungry and the starving would be better off without the Catholic church and with only Ahteists around to take care of them?

I'm a Catholic and I know what we do in our community. I guarantee we feed a hell of a lot more people in my community then whatever it is that you are doing. Why you sit on your high horse condeming there are people out there actually doing something. No religion is perfect and no one running a group is perfect but at least they try, they make an attempt, unlike billions and millions of people that sit around and point fingers. There is nothing more disgusting to me then someone who sits on their butt and points fingers at a group that is trying to help others - especially when it is an Atheist pointing their high brow, superior intellect at us lowly, unintelligent Catholics who pray to our imaginary God. All we do is donate our own time and own money to try and better the world the best we can - I don't see the Atheists banning together to donate their time and money as a group under the Atheist banner. I am not a super religious zealot who tries to get people to come and pray on Sunday, do what you want to do, but don't you dare accuse Catholics of not doing their fair share. Whats the Atheist motto? Sit on the sidelines with a thumb up your arse, while people starve in your city streets, while you sip coffee and eat bascotti snubbing your nose at the world, espousing on all the problems in the world and why those trying to help are scum b/c they aren't doing more. What a joke. You are mocking a religion b/c they aren't doing more, while your group does absolutely nothing. This is just an appalling and disgusting way to attack the Catholic church and you should be ashamed.

We get it, you don't like religion. You don't believe. But lets look at society the last 30 years, with the deterioration of religious beliefs and more people moving toward Atheism. You can't honestly say that people are placing more value on human life - the way people treat one another is terrible. The way our kids treat other kids and adults is terrible. I know most on this board will mock me for this, but I truly believe it is a result of more people not going to church. It brought a set of values and respect that just seems to have disappeared over the last few decades.

Do you not realize that the Church wants you to think like this way? It seems like you combine the whole godless=evil concept. You have been brain washed well.

I do what a busy student can. I give when ever I have the opportunity. What more can I do? I would prefer to help the planet with technology rather than go to Africa itself and give my time. Doing that is great, but someone needs to help develop the technology needed to survive. One field of study I am very interested in is water purification. Doing it cheaply and efficiently is an art. To do so I need an education.

Ok, this is a very important point I must make. I am not criticizing you but rather the institution itself. I am sure you have issues with the American government but that isn't a reflection on you personally. My criticism of the Catholic Church is no different. What scares me is that you accept no religion is perfect but you still don't voice your opinions on why it's not perfect. Your obviously a devout Catholic yet don't appear to be criticizing your own Church for the many flaws that are there. I am sure you can agree that the Church is responsible for horrible atrocities but I see no effort for them to atone for their sins. I guess all you need to do is confess your sins believe in Jesus and your forgiven? That's not easy to take advantage of . You have no problem criticizing your government though, which is fantastic. Your church should be no different and I don't know why it isn't.
If you had the money the Catholic Church had would you give away a massive chunk of it? I am sure you would do something of the sort... the question is, why aren't they? Why are bishops allowed to sit on mountains of wealth DONATED to them by people like you? I am sure you give your share to the Church.
Do you really think the Catholic Church is making an attempt given how much money they have?

You use the term atheist as if atheists are an organized institution. I don't know what you think the atheist community is like but I have a feeling you don't know. Atheists don't have an institution where people donate money to them, it's simply a belief system. There are not atheist "meeting places" like in Churches. There is no "atheist doctrine" passed down from one generation to another. You can compare an atheist to a catholic, but you cannot compare the Catholic institution to an "atheist institution".

That being said, a group of people where a large portion of the group are atheists are scientists. There are plenty of scientists who develop technology to help starving people. This can range from genetically altered seeds to grow in bad conditions to cheap efficient water purification methods. But the money scientists have to do this pale in comparison to how much the Catholic Church makes so the resources to do so are limited. My prof is working on cheap bio-sensors to detect the AIDs virus. It's small, cheap, affordable, and works instantly. This can easily be geared towards in impoverished Africans. Of course it's not as accurate as a real blood test but it's moving towards that. Catching people with AIDs may help treat them and prevent the spread.
My other prof who I worked for is developing organic solar cells. It's basically a solar cell as thin as paper, flexible, and dirt cheap. This can be used to gather the Sun's energy to help produce electricity in a very cheap way. They are a few of the many scientists and inventors doing such things. If you were to ask the Catholic Church if AIDs was a problem, they would say yes. If you were to ask them if they would like AIDs to be cured, they would say yes. If you were to ask them for 200 000 000 dollars for AIDs research (which really, isn't a lot of money for the Church) they would obviously say no. If this was Bill Gates it would be understandable, hes a cheap bastard. But the Catholic Church isn't just a wealthy institution, it's a religious institution with doctrine that clearly says helping the poor is a great thing.

Its actually quite surpising how easily we as a society could probably eliminate hunger. Some stats.

http://www.ecosalon.com/could_just_4..._world_hunger/

Lets assume they're off, and it actually costs 60 billion dollars a year total to end world hunger.

http://www.funtrivia.com/askft/Question27247.html

If every American took the money they spend on ice cream and donate it to ending world hunger, 10% of the problem would be fixed.

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/ks?s=PM

If everyone who simply bought Philip Morris Tobacco products stopped, and instead put that money towards world hunger, 50% of the problem would be solved. If everyone who smoked tobacco stopped (I could'nt find the number) we'd have more than enough.

America spends approximately 500 billion dollars a year on its defense, if it reduced its defense budget by 10%, there would be approximately enough to end world hunger.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=mlb

IF every American who spent money on pro baseball instead spent it on world hunger, thats about 10% of the problem.

I'd think if world wide, everyone stopped spending money on say, soccer (I couldn't find the number), that would probably be about 20% of it.

I didn't mean to harp on Americans so much in general, its just for some reason, American figures were the easiest to find. I'm not suggestign a government action or anything, its just that world wide, 60 billion is not a lot of money. TARP is like 10-20 times as much.

Quite frankly, its hard to give a real reason why this problem isn't taken care of. I'm not Hobbes, so I think the problem of World Hunger is, in general, not really important to most people because it seems like a distant problem.

I'm not getting involved in the whole Atheist vs. Religion thing, its really cyclical and I've probably made my point on this forum many times in different ways.

Originally Posted by nejar462

Its actually quite surpising how easily we as a society could probably eliminate hunger. Some stats.

http://www.ecosalon.com/could_just_4..._world_hunger/

Lets assume they're off, and it actually costs 60 billion dollars a year total to end world hunger.

http://www.funtrivia.com/askft/Question27247.html

If every American took the money they spend on ice cream and donate it to ending world hunger, 10% of the problem would be fixed.

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/ks?s=PM

If everyone who simply bought Philip Morris Tobacco products stopped, and instead put that money towards world hunger, 50% of the problem would be solved. If everyone who smoked tobacco stopped (I could'nt find the number) we'd have more than enough.

America spends approximately 500 billion dollars a year on its defense, if it reduced its defense budget by 10%, there would be approximately enough to end world hunger.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=mlb

IF every American who spent money on pro baseball instead spent it on world hunger, thats about 10% of the problem.

I'd think if world wide, everyone stopped spending money on say, soccer (I couldn't find the number), that would probably be about 20% of it.

I didn't mean to harp on Americans so much in general, its just for some reason, American figures were the easiest to find. I'm not suggestign a government action or anything, its just that world wide, 60 billion is not a lot of money. TARP is like 10-20 times as much.

Quite frankly, its hard to give a real reason why this problem isn't taken care of. I'm not Hobbes, so I think the problem of World Hunger is, in general, not really important to most people because it seems like a distant problem.

I'm not getting involved in the whole Atheist vs. Religion thing, its really cyclical and I've probably made my point on this forum many times in different ways.

agreed, the entire world hunger issue is more than just throwing money at the problem. Like someone mentioned earlier alot of hungry people live in nations of no government or dictatorships and its hard getting the proper items in.

**** its even hard to feed every person in America let alone the world, its a much bigger issue than just money and distribution....

Why not blame Oprah, Bill Gates, or any other rich bastard. You cant call religion corrupt for not donating enough money. There are hungary people on this planet because thier country leaders suck, they are poor, and the economy/ecosystem sucks. God and Religion has nothing to do about it. You cant expect every rich person or organization to fix the planet and do the right things

Why are there so many homeless people?

Originally Posted by BFGUITAR

I do what a busy student can. I give when ever I have the opportunity. What more can I do? I would prefer to help the planet with technology rather than go to Africa itself and give my time. Doing that is great, but someone needs to help develop the technology needed to survive. One field of study I am very interested in is water purification. Doing it cheaply and efficiently is an art. To do so I need an education.

Ok, this is a very important point I must make. I am not criticizing you but rather the institution itself. I am sure you have issues with the American government but that isn't a reflection on you personally. My criticism of the Catholic Church is no different. What scares me is that you accept no religion is perfect but you still don't voice your opinions on why it's not perfect. Your obviously a devout Catholic yet don't appear to be criticizing your own Church for the many flaws that are there. I am sure you can agree that the Church is responsible for horrible atrocities but I see no effort for them to atone for their sins. I guess all you need to do is confess your sins believe in Jesus and your forgiven? That's not easy to take advantage of . You have no problem criticizing your government though, which is fantastic. Your church should be no different and I don't know why it isn't.
If you had the money the Catholic Church had would you give away a massive chunk of it? I am sure you would do something of the sort... the question is, why aren't they? Why are bishops allowed to sit on mountains of wealth DONATED to them by people like you? I am sure you give your share to the Church.
Do you really think the Catholic Church is making an attempt given how much money they have?

You use the term atheist as if atheists are an organized institution. I don't know what you think the atheist community is like but I have a feeling you don't know. Atheists don't have an institution where people donate money to them, it's simply a belief system. There are not atheist "meeting places" like in Churches. There is no "atheist doctrine" passed down from one generation to another. You can compare an atheist to a catholic, but you cannot compare the Catholic institution to an "atheist institution".

That being said, a group of people where a large portion of the group are atheists are scientists. There are plenty of scientists who develop technology to help starving people. This can range from genetically altered seeds to grow in bad conditions to cheap efficient water purification methods. But the money scientists have to do this pale in comparison to how much the Catholic Church makes so the resources to do so are limited. My prof is working on cheap bio-sensors to detect the AIDs virus. It's small, cheap, affordable, and works instantly. This can easily be geared towards in impoverished Africans. Of course it's not as accurate as a real blood test but it's moving towards that. Catching people with AIDs may help treat them and prevent the spread.
My other prof who I worked for is developing organic solar cells. It's basically a solar cell as thin as paper, flexible, and dirt cheap. This can be used to gather the Sun's energy to help produce electricity in a very cheap way. They are a few of the many scientists and inventors doing such things. If you were to ask the Catholic Church if AIDs was a problem, they would say yes. If you were to ask them if they would like AIDs to be cured, they would say yes. If you were to ask them for 200 000 000 dollars for AIDs research (which really, isn't a lot of money for the Church) they would obviously say no. If this was Bill Gates it would be understandable, hes a cheap bastard. But the Catholic Church isn't just a wealthy institution, it's a religious institution with doctrine that clearly says helping the poor is a great thing.

Not all groups are perfect and I believe in acting locally and thinking globally. My local parish works in a variety of way to help the poor, as does our entire diocese. To be honest with you I have lived here for 4 years and not once have I ever heard of or seen a muslim church, a jewish synagogue, baptist, penacostal etc. etc. at the soup kitchen, meals on wheels. All of those groups tend to ONLY help our their partitioners and those with similar religious beliefs. My local church does not discriminate.

I don't agree with everything the Catholic church believes in, I am pro-choice, pro-stem cell, pro-condom, pro-birth control. But instead of focusing on the negatives of which there are many, I focus on the good and focus on helping people, which my local parish is passionate about.

Also I run two businesses about 90hrs + a week, have a wife and 2 young kids and we all still find time to volunteer. I was in college and never in my life did I have more free time, so not trying to call you out, but for someone who likes to talk the talk, you really aren't walking the walk.

Originally Posted by BFGUITAR

I Not to mention the massive amount of priceless artifacts they own from the constant pillaging and raping of the world back in the Dark Ages. They did more than kill Muslims when they "marched" to the middle east that's for sure.

.

The Vatican did none of this stuff. And if you are talking about the Catholic church, the people in charge today are not the people in charge back then.