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Thread: Raw Squat Vs. Equipped Squat

  1. #1
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    Raw Squat Vs. Equipped Squat

    What are your guys' max raw squat versus full-equipped (squat suit, briefs, knee wraps)?

    As you can see in my signature, I'm training my raw squat max hard and I was wondering how much you guys' think I can put up fully equipped (once I reach my raw goal).

    For example, when I raw squat 600, what should I be able to expect to put up fully equipped?

    Addison K.
    Last edited by Addison K.; 04-01-2008 at 06:52 PM.

  2. #2
    Administrator chris mason's Avatar
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    That is kind of a tricky question. You have to learn how to use the equipment, but assuming you had a raw squat of 600 lbs and had some practice under your belt with equipment, I would think you would be good for 750 lbs + depending on type of gear and so on.


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    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    hey man, welcome to the board!

    equipment varies for almost everyone. Some will get more out of the gear than others especially in the bench shirts.

    For squat suits though, when guys get on briefs and a good squat suit, they can work up to 200 over their squat. Like I say though, some will be more, others less.

    Its difficult to compare directly the raw numbers to equipped numbers. When I'm training my raw bench, I don't know what my shirted bench is and vice versa is true. You can't really train both. I know what you mean though, you're just trying to get an idea.

    Equipped lifting is different technique and training than raw lifting though (for the most part) so it is difficult to compare the two
    Last edited by Travis Bell; 04-01-2008 at 07:07 PM.

  4. #4
    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    none of us can let you know exactly what your gonna hit man. you just gotta see what happens.

    ediy: chris and travis both beat me to it!
    Last edited by Lones Green; 04-01-2008 at 07:04 PM.
    23 years old
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  5. #5
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    See above, but to give you an idea. I've squatted 600 in just belt/wraps, 725 in Viking Briefs, and 875 in full gear. It's hard to determine the transition though because there are so many factors that go into it.

  6. #6
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    on a side note, I'd really encourage you to try gear out. Its alot of fun man.

    haha Ben can testify to that

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    yep, it's a good time.

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    Gaglione Strength Chris Rodgers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bell View Post
    hey man, welcome to the board!

    equipment varies for almost everyone. Some will get more out of the gear than others especially in the bench shirts.

    For squat suits though, when guys get on briefs and a good squat suit, they can work up to 200 over their squat. Like I say though, some will be more, others less.

    Its difficult to compare directly the raw numbers to equipped numbers. When I'm training my raw bench, I don't know what my shirted bench is and vice versa is true. You can't really train both. I know what you mean though, you're just trying to get an idea.

    Equipped lifting is different technique and training than raw lifting though (for the most part) so it is difficult to compare the two
    I concur. I don't even consider raw squatting and gear squatting the same movement. I don't know what the hell to push with without gear on and my form is all over the place. When I get in gear my form is very tight and it actually looks like I know what I'm doing.
    Best Meet Lifts(Raw w/wraps):
    @165- 435 SQ 270 BE 560 DL.....1255 total
    @181- 535 SQ 300 BE 570 DL.....1400 total
    Best Meet Lifts(Multi-ply):
    @148- 575 SQ 315 BE 515 DL.....1400 total
    @165- 680 SQ 380 BE 540 DL.....1555 total
    @181- 700 SQ 375 BE 535 DL.....1605 total
    Best Gym Lifts(Raw w/wraps)
    545 SQ 305 BE 585 DL

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    Thanks for the responses.

    I see the consensus is full gear adds 150-300 lbs.

    I do understand raw and equipped squatting are quite different.

    Also, I'm walking my raw squats out of the rack, so I assume using a Monolift will also affect my equipped squat #s.

    I just wanted to have a ballpark estimate in my mind.

    Once I hit a raw 600# squat and deadlift in a meet, I'll put on a single-ply suit and knee wraps and see what I can do.

    Addison K.

  10. #10
    Who me? Chubrock's Avatar
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    You're also going to have to learn to use the monolift, so keep that in mind.

    Fuck, fight, or hold the light.

  11. #11
    Hulk Smash! LouPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chubrock View Post
    You're also going to have to learn to use the monolift, so keep that in mind.
    Isn't it easier than a rack?

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    GFH Lones Green's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LouPac View Post
    Isn't it easier than a rack?
    in the sense that you don't have to walk out the weight, but there is a whole different technique when using a monolift.
    23 years old
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chubrock View Post
    You're also going to have to learn to use the monolift, so keep that in mind.
    I feel you, brother.

    When I competed in the APF years ago, I walked-out after the hooks pulled back from the Monolift.

    I think I'm to do USPF meets this year, so I'll have to walk out for those.

    The main reason I don't use a Monolift is because I don't have enough training partners to have back and side spotters, and a guy to operate the Monolift.

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  14. #14
    Senior Member Ryan Celli's Avatar
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    My experience

    I just competed RAW (raw unity meet)and then 3 weeks later competed with single ply USPF, this should be a good example.

    Here where my numbers, keep in mind I never actually squatted in my squat suit prior to the USPF meet. I squatted in it for the first time at the competition. The bench shirt I used about 3 times, and deadlifted with the DL suit once. So, with some more training in gear I may have done better. My total was 204 lbs different.

    Raw meet
    squat. 601
    bench. 518
    deadlift. 640 (opener)
    total 1758

    USPF
    squat 705
    bench 584
    deadlift 672
    total 1962

  15. #15
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    geeze, those are great numbers Ryan! I forget, but what weight class did you lift in?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Celli View Post
    I just competed RAW (raw unity meet)and then 3 weeks later competed with single ply USPF, this should be a good example.

    Here where my numbers, keep in mind I never actually squatted in my squat suit prior to the USPF meet. I squatted in it for the first time at the competition. The bench shirt I used about 3 times, and deadlifted with the DL suit once. So, with some more training in gear I may have done better. My total was 204 lbs different.

    Raw meet
    squat. 601
    bench. 518
    deadlift. 640 (opener)
    total 1758

    USPF
    squat 705
    bench 584
    deadlift 672
    total 1962
    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bell View Post
    geeze, those are great numbers Ryan! I forget, but what weight class did you lift in?
    Ditto.

    Great job, brother.

    In His Name,

    Addison K.

  17. #17
    Senior Member Ryan Celli's Avatar
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    thanks

    i was in the 198's. I weighed in light at both, 193, and 192.
    you can see all my lifts on youtube under bigiron20.

  18. #18
    Westside Bencher Travis Bell's Avatar
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    Wow, that bench is just ridiculous! haha awesome, just awesome. When's your next meet?

  19. #19
    Breaker of Skulls Guido's Avatar
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    Those are very impressive numbers, Ryan, especially at 198. Your raw lifts especially put mine to shame.
    5'9" 195 lbs
    DL 600x1
    SQ 490x1 (raw)
    BP 430x1 (shirted), 320x1 (raw)
    SN 209x1 C+J 250x1


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  20. #20
    THE FRIDGE! thewicked's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris mason View Post
    That is kind of a tricky question. You have to learn how to use the equipment, but assuming you had a raw squat of 600 lbs and had some practice under your belt with equipment, I would think you would be good for 750 lbs + depending on type of gear and so on.


    yep... this is right on. Training raw vs training with gear are two completely different things. You have to learn how to use the gear and break it in..it's not as easy and putting on a suit. It becomes a science for most. I know a guy that benches 615 raw and put on a a single ply f6 and is just a few more practices away from putting up 805. For some it's magic and for others not so much.
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    I disagree with you guys on the Raw v. Gear training, to some extent. I think the raw squat really translates over to geared squatting. The technique is the same, or at least it should be.

    The big difference in my mind is the supra-maximal load the body has to handle on top of the technique work that has to be done with gear.

    The other issue with raw training is that your hips and groin get a little more banged up. Rehab/prehab needs to be a priority. Not that it doesn't matter with gear, but it really needs to be taken into account. The joints take a whole butload of stress.

    In my opinion, the training should be identical, just modified for the gear.

    Take a look at this.

    http://www.elitefts.com/documents/raw_squatting.htm

  22. #22
    T.J.W. nhlfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Celli View Post
    Raw meet
    squat. 601
    bench. 518
    deadlift. 640 (opener)
    total 1758
    damn! those are some serious numbers for the 198s.
    -Matt
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    Quote Originally Posted by RhodeHouse View Post
    I disagree with you guys on the Raw v. Gear training, to some extent. I think the raw squat really translates over to geared squatting. The technique is the same, or at least it should be.

    The big difference in my mind is the supra-maximal load the body has to handle on top of the technique work that has to be done with gear.

    The other issue with raw training is that your hips and groin get a little more banged up. Rehab/prehab needs to be a priority. Not that it doesn't matter with gear, but it really needs to be taken into account. The joints take a whole butload of stress.

    In my opinion, the training should be identical, just modified for the gear.

    Take a look at this.

    http://www.elitefts.com/documents/raw_squatting.htm
    I looked through that article yesterday. Good stuff Matt. I see where you are coming from. I'm still very new to the gear so it seems very strange right now.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Moore View Post
    I looked through that article yesterday. Good stuff Matt. I see where you are coming from. I'm still very new to the gear so it seems very strange right now.
    Thanks for reading it. I appreciate it.

    This is what I do when I'm training in the gear. I always work up to 505x1 with just a belt. Then I put on the briefs. I'll use my numbers from my last full training cycle to give you an idea of what I did each week.

    600x5
    650x5
    705x5
    825x1 w/ suit on straps down
    Deload/DE Work
    750x3
    805x2
    905x1 Full gear

    It went something like that. I like to train raw even if I'm heading into a meet. I really think it has awesome carryover.

  25. #25
    Team Stocky Member. Killa Kurt's Avatar
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    Rhodes do you think a cycle like that would work if a person is squatting multiple times a week?
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