The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Itís no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    Banned bjohnso's Avatar
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    Preperation for mountain climbing

    Any experienced climbers in here? I have 2 months to prepare. What would you recommend? I'm dropping weight as fast as I reasonably can.

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  3. #2
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    You dont need to worry too much about your weight, i regulary climb mountains, and have done so for a while, our party consists of people with all levels of fitness.

    Unless you are planning on runnng up and down i would say just get used to walking on the steepest gradient you can.

    A lot of people fall down by going too quick at the bottom and not getting the breathing right and also wearing too much and over heating.

    I dont know how experiences you are but i would suggest a skin tight top (themo top) some leggins or light weight pans, stay like this until you are about half way up then put on jumper or fleece/jacket depending on weather.

    You may be on about actual climbing - i.e rock face stuff, this is a little different, yes lose as much body weight as you can, be as flexible as you can, get a great pair of boots that fit you well so you can get maximum grip and warm up before starting the climb.

    I love climbing rock faces, you need quite a lot of upper body weight, keep your body as close to the wall as possible, try to use your legs at all times when pushing and just use your arms for balence, i used to try and pull myself up the rocks using just my arms but half way you get knackered and want to fall off.


    Whichever way you are doingi am sure you will be alright, get your breathing sorted and have fun with it!

  4. #3
    195 lb. endurance geek Willie's Avatar
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    What mountain are you climbing?
    "This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time."
    -Tyler Durden

  5. #4
    Banned bjohnso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGMan View Post
    You dont need to worry too much about your weight, i regulary climb mountains, and have done so for a while, our party consists of people with all levels of fitness.

    Unless you are planning on runnng up and down i would say just get used to walking on the steepest gradient you can.

    A lot of people fall down by going too quick at the bottom and not getting the breathing right and also wearing too much and over heating.

    I dont know how experiences you are but i would suggest a skin tight top (themo top) some leggins or light weight pans, stay like this until you are about half way up then put on jumper or fleece/jacket depending on weather.

    You may be on about actual climbing - i.e rock face stuff, this is a little different, yes lose as much body weight as you can, be as flexible as you can, get a great pair of boots that fit you well so you can get maximum grip and warm up before starting the climb.

    I love climbing rock faces, you need quite a lot of upper body weight, keep your body as close to the wall as possible, try to use your legs at all times when pushing and just use your arms for balence, i used to try and pull myself up the rocks using just my arms but half way you get knackered and want to fall off.


    Whichever way you are doingi am sure you will be alright, get your breathing sorted and have fun with it!
    Thanks for your response. I won't be doing any rock face stuff, thankfully. I climbed a very tame mountain once when I was 16 and it beat my ass. I'm concerned about my weight now, since the one I'm going to climb is a lot steeper and looks to be a lot higher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie View Post
    What mountain are you climbing?
    I believe it's called "Angel's Landing." It's in Utah.

  6. #5
    195 lb. endurance geek Willie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bjohnso View Post
    I believe it's called "Angel's Landing." It's in Utah.
    I found this:

    Angels Landing at Glance
    Photo Album: Angels Landing Pictures
    Map: Angels Landing Map
    Day Hike: Yes
    Distance: 5 miles
    Average Hiking Time: 5 hours
    Equipment: Map to locate the landmarks surrounding Angels Landing.
    Difficulty: Strenuous uphill hike, but hiking is on a well maintained trail.
    Sun Exposure: Full sun
    Trail Usage: Heavy
    Permits: Not required.
    Trail Conditions: The first 2 miles are paved and well maintained. Most of the path is sunny, but Refrigerator Canyon offers shade and often a cool breeze. This is a good early morning hike. Make sure to allow time to be off the trail by dark if starting late in the day. The last half mile is across a narrow sandstone ridge. Anchored support chains are attached along some sections of the sheer fin.
    Trailhead: Grotto picnic area in Zion Canyon
    Trailend: Same as trailhead
    Trail Access: Year-round, either by the Zion Canyon Shuttle or private vehicle when the shuttle is not running.
    Best Season: March to October, but can be hiked year-round as long as the trail if free of ice and snow.
    Elevation Gain : Long steady climb. 1488'
    Peak: 5785'
    Hazards: Sheer cliffs at high elevations while hiking on a narrow fin. Not suggested for children or those with a fear of heights. Avoid standing near the edge at all times! Do not hike the trail when it is wet, storming, or when high winds are present.
    Restrooms: Scout Lookout (when working) at the Angels Landing junction and at the Grotto Picnic area.



    Sounds like a good hike! Have fun!
    "This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time."
    -Tyler Durden

  7. #6
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGMan View Post
    You dont need to worry too much about your weight, i regulary climb mountains, and have done so for a while, our party consists of people with all levels of fitness.
    What?! Fitness is one of the most important components
    Unless you are planning on runnng up and down i would say just get used to walking on the steepest gradient you can.

    A lot of people fall down by going too quick at the bottom and not getting the breathing right and also wearing too much and over heating.
    Quite erroneous and probably BS
    I dont know how experiences you are but i would suggest a skin tight top (themo top) some leggins or light weight pans, stay like this until you are about half way up then put on jumper or fleece/jacket depending on weather.
    How can you say this without knowing what he is climbing or how high, or where, or what class, or anything. You cannot make this assessment using the prior knowledge you did

    You may be on about actual climbing - i.e rock face stuff, this is a little different, yes lose as much body weight as you can, be as flexible as you can, get a great pair of boots that fit you well so you can get maximum grip and warm up before starting the climb.

    I love climbing rock faces, you need quite a lot of upper body weight, keep your body as close to the wall as possible, try to use your legs at all times when pushing and just use your arms for balence, i used to try and pull myself up the rocks using just my arms but half way you get knackered and want to fall off.

    Upperbody wieght? NO. Rock Climbing is all about leverage and mental strength. (and forearm endurance)
    Whichever way you are doingi am sure you will be alright, get your breathing sorted and have fun with it!
    I dont mean to come off as rude but you don't really know what you are talking about, or just can't articulate it well. The advice you gave is haphazard and unfounded. Don't give advice on mountaineering if you cant do it well.


    OP: I like to think of myself as an avid mountaineer/outdoorsman and as being so I try to train to function best in mountain scenarios. I think crossfit + a strong DL and Squat + solid endurance + HIIT style conditioning + flexability all aid well. That being said, none are necessary. I know many climbers and mountaineers who simply climb and mountaineer to maintain fitness. It is beneficial to be lean for any type of mountaineering and cardio fitness is essential. If you really need some help PM me. I can outfit anyone for any outdoor excursion.
    Last edited by ZenMonkey; 07-07-2008 at 06:35 PM.
    Sarvamangalam!

  8. #7
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    It depends on how you look on this, i believe anyone can get up a mountain with a general level of fitness, if he is climbing with a party of people who like to run up these mountains then yes you will need a high level of fitness, if not then i still maintain you dont need a huge level of fitness to climb a mountain!

    lot of people fall down by going too quick at the bottom and not getting the breathing right and also wearing too much and over heating.
    Quite erroneous and probably BS - Not BS, maybe again this is due to the people you hike with, i have done a lot of hiking with people starting off, first hikes etc and have always got to be careful they do not start off too hot and end up temporarily passing out.

    I went on a hike once, i was not leading i was at the back and the first 3 people all of a sudden collapsed, they had to have a ly down because they were going too fast, it was very hot and they had full kit on. After a few mins, a strip off and a drink of water they were back on their feet.

    I dont know how experienced you are but i would suggest a skin tight top (themo top) some leggins or light weight pans, stay like this until you are about half way up then put on jumper or fleece/jacket depending on weather.
    How can you say this without knowing what he is climbing or how high, or where, or what class, or anything. You cannot make this assessment using the prior knowledge you did

    Agree to some extent although thermo top and light weight pants can be used on any hike, all i was emplying here is not to start off wearing everything as some inexperiencd people do (as i stated i do not know how experienced he is)

    Upperbody wieght? NO. Rock Climbing is all about leverage and mental strength. (and forearm endurance) - Yes leverage, yes mental strength, this should have said upper body strength - again a lot of climbers i know like to use the rock doing different work outs and will sometimes climb with their arms - obviously not on the very strenuous rocks.


    I do know what i am talking about, some points i have made you have obviously taken a different way, in short my advise would be not to start off too quick, keep well hydrated, start off not wearing an awful lot and you will be absolutely fine.

    The climb looks like a good one, nice steady pathways - good luck with the climb!
    Last edited by TheGMan; 07-08-2008 at 02:11 AM.

  9. #8
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    I have never heard of people falling for the reasons you sited. It sounds like BS or you and those you climb with need to be better prepared and informed of conditions

    The climbers you know sound like amateurs. All of the climbers I know, including the professionals, disagree with you about upper body strength and focus more on core strength. One of the guys I used to climb with who could flash a 511d had no left pec or lat ergo little upper body strength.

    As far as fitness goes... if we are really talking about Class 4 and 5 of the NARS of UIAA then fitness is crucial and necessary. It sounds like the OP will be on a class 3 though.
    Sarvamangalam!

  10. #9
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    You obviously are the dude when it comes to this stuff then! I lead newer climbers up mountains in the UK, i dont know what your gradings are in the USA, yes as i said a lot of them are amatures, i was thinking that bjohnso may not be all that experienced in this field??

    Your mate with one pec, what a guy!!

    All i can say is make sure you enjoy it, it is not a race, enjoy the scenery, take some good photos and some nice food for the top!

    There is nothing better than cooking some bacon butties on the top of a mountain with brown sauce and tomatos!!

    Just want to add, the points i am raising are not BS, just because you have never been up with people who have pushed themselves too much too soon doesnt mean i am talking BS.

    I will leave this poost here right know, Bjohnso, enjoy, if you want any info on gear etc and zen doesnt get back to you feel free to PM me.

    Zen - Enjoy your climbing, if you are ever in the UK and fancy a good climb try this one!!

    http://images.google.co.uk/images?hl...AZa92YEE&gbv=1

    It is called Crib Goch, not a particulary difficult climb but it is dangerous, at one point you walk along the ridge, sheer drop on both sides, it follows its way around to Snowdon (which i am sure you have heard off) a good climb but definately not for beginners or people who are unfit!!

  11. #10
    Banned bjohnso's Avatar
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    Thanks guys. As I said before, I am dropping weight (hopefully fat) and leaning out as fast as I can, and I'm going to have to start running again, and blasting my calves.

    Also, I am a complete amateur. Would you guys recommend carrying a little bit of dextrose with me? Couldn't hurt, right?
    Last edited by bjohnso; 07-08-2008 at 10:18 AM.

  12. #11
    195 lb. endurance geek Willie's Avatar
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    I wouldn't really classify that hike he's going to do as "mountain climbing." When you say "mountain climbing" to me, I envision ropes, harnesses, crampons and ice axes. Think K-2 or Everest. I'm not saying his hike is not going to be strenuous, but it's not going to require Alpine climbing skills. A base level of cardiovascular fitness will be enough.
    "This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time."
    -Tyler Durden

  13. #12
    Banned bjohnso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Willie View Post
    I found this:

    Angels Landing at Glance
    Photo Album: Angels Landing Pictures
    Map: Angels Landing Map
    Day Hike: Yes
    Distance: 5 miles
    Average Hiking Time: 5 hours
    Equipment: Map to locate the landmarks surrounding Angels Landing.
    Difficulty: Strenuous uphill hike, but hiking is on a well maintained trail.
    Sun Exposure: Full sun
    Trail Usage: Heavy
    Permits: Not required.
    Trail Conditions: The first 2 miles are paved and well maintained. Most of the path is sunny, but Refrigerator Canyon offers shade and often a cool breeze. This is a good early morning hike. Make sure to allow time to be off the trail by dark if starting late in the day. The last half mile is across a narrow sandstone ridge. Anchored support chains are attached along some sections of the sheer fin.
    Trailhead: Grotto picnic area in Zion Canyon
    Trailend: Same as trailhead
    Trail Access: Year-round, either by the Zion Canyon Shuttle or private vehicle when the shuttle is not running.
    Best Season: March to October, but can be hiked year-round as long as the trail if free of ice and snow.
    Elevation Gain : Long steady climb. 1488'
    Peak: 5785'
    Hazards: Sheer cliffs at high elevations while hiking on a narrow fin. Not suggested for children or those with a fear of heights. Avoid standing near the edge at all times! Do not hike the trail when it is wet, storming, or when high winds are present.
    Restrooms: Scout Lookout (when working) at the Angels Landing junction and at the Grotto Picnic area.



    Sounds like a good hike! Have fun!
    Also, educate me on the lingo. It says the peak is 5785' high. Does that mean that I'm climbing 5785' (Jesus), or that when I get to the top I'll be 5785' above sea level (<I'm hoping it's this one)?

  14. #13
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    5785 above sea level.

    For example, Everest, while the tallest is not the longest.


    As far as food goes... go with something that produces little refuse and weighs little. I like to take a loaf of French bread, a brick of meat, maybe some cheese and eat on it as I hike. Also foods such as granola work great too. Just keep macros, sodium and H2O at a high intake level.

    According to the North American Rating System you will be on a Class 2-3 hike/climb. This can mean two things. One the level of danger is mediocre, if you fall then you most likely wont die but will have some scars as proof. Second, if it is a class 3 then there may be some places where you need hands and feet to make your way. If this is the case I would recommend that you invest in a PAIR of trekking poles, a daypack that can hold the trekking poles out of the way, a 3 liter bladder filled, and really good footwear.
    Sarvamangalam!

  15. #14
    195 lb. endurance geek Willie's Avatar
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    Right, your climb is only going to be 1488 feet, and at the end of that you'll be 5785 feet above sea level.

    1488 feet is how much elevation you will gain over the course of the trek.

    As for food, I like to pack calorie dense foods. I usually use a trail-mix of my own making with raisins and peanuts. A bladder of water is a good idea, but I hate plain water and usually end up mixing in sugar free Kool-aid.


    Oh, sunscreen!

    Sun Exposure: Full sun
    "This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time."
    -Tyler Durden

  16. #15
    Banned bjohnso's Avatar
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    Thanks guys. Longevity is a lifelong goal of mine (always has been).

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