The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness
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The Five Biggest Contradictions in Fitness

Its no secret that when people contradict themselves, it has the effect of making the flaws in their actions or statements seem glaringly obvious. But what about when WE ourselves get caught contradicting ourselves by someone else?

By: Nick Tumminello Added: January 6th, 2014
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  1. #1
    Senior Member scrawnybastard's Avatar
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    I thought this was a bodybuilding forum?

    I read threads here that are so against lifting for physique reasons. Why, isn't that the goal of bodybuilding?
    And why so anti-curl? I'm no expert, but if someone is doing a program based on heavy compounds, I don't see how throwing in a few sets of curls will hurt, they can only help. Please enlighten me.
    I'll have to gain a bunch of weight just to be skinny, and then a bunch more to even look like I lift weights.
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  3. #2
    Senior Member Sidior's Avatar
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    The main issue I think many members have is novice lifters stressing about bicep programs when they should be focusing on eating and adding weight to the bar.

    The initial training for a bodybuilder or a powerlifter is the same. Build a strong strength and muscular base then worry about the program specific details like ME work or bicep training.
    Last edited by Sidior; 11-25-2008 at 10:57 PM.
    PRs: 655/525/645 = 1825 Total
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  4. #3
    Into the night.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidior View Post
    The main issue I think many members have is novice lifters stressing about bicep programs when they should be focusing on eating and adding weight to the bar.

    The initial training for a bodybuilder or a powerlifter is the same. Build a strong strength and muscular base then worry about the program specific details like ME work or bicep training.
    There's complete truth in what Sidior has said.

    Also, though, I think while this forum may have a bodybuilding side, it's predominantly composed of powerlifters. Powerlifters and bodybuilders have different goals. So when it comes to throwing curls into compound based routines, some powerlifters don't want to waste time/energy/fatigue on curls when they're going to need all their power for ME compounds.

  5. #4
    All Natural Power Lunar Effect's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scrawnybastard View Post
    And why so anti-curl? I'm no expert, but if someone is doing a program based on heavy compounds, I don't see how throwing in a few sets of curls will hurt, they can only help. Please enlighten me.
    Because a curl is a highly isolated exercise that will have minimum impact on forcing your muscles to grow. For example, take a chin-up with a palms facing grip. That will hammer your biceps every bit as much as a curl, but it is also a major compound movement that will work your body systematically. So I don't think "anti-curl" is necessarily the way to look at it, but people will typically suggest better alternatives for muscular and strength development (especially to newcomers).
    Last edited by Lunar Effect; 11-26-2008 at 11:11 AM.

  6. #5
    student of the game Runty's Avatar
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    It has a lot do to with the fact that most people asking questions about how to get huge arms with there 7-7-7 or whatever routines or bench/curl days 3-4x a week only weigh 140lbs.
    "Fine, if I'm not allowed to light it on fire, can my imaginary friend?"

  7. #6
    Senior Member brihead301's Avatar
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    Ya, most new guys that want to be "bodybuilders" think that they have to train like the bodybuilders that have already been in the game for many many years. It makes logical sense to think that you have to train every individual muscle group with several different isolation exercises in order to hit each muscle from all different angles and what not. It's understandable why many people would think this way.

    It's kind of hard to really accept the fact that a solid strength base (which comes along with lots of muscle mass as well) is necessary to build before getting into the finer details of specific training (bringing up lagging bodyparts w/ isolation exercises) if you have always been told that bodybuilders train a certain way (via word of mouth at the gym, in bodybuilding magazines, on bodybuilding websites, etc...).

    I never really knew about that whole thing until I read the book called 'the new rules of lifting', which basically disproved every myth that I had currently thought was the truth. I gave it a shot, and I quickly realized that I had been missing out on serious gains for YEARS by wasting my time on bodypart splits with tons of isolation exercises (and not doing any leg work either like most typical gym guys).

    So after doing the "all compounds" thing for about 2 1/2 years now, it's all starting to make much more sense to me. Everyone should basically start out the same way whether they want to be a bodybuilder, powerlifter, strongman, oly lifter or whatever. Everyone should get as strong as they can using only the major compound lifts. That type of training could last several years, before switching it up. After a few years of training like that, then they should choose what they want to focus on and train specifically for that. If it is bodybuilding, then high volume, heavy workouts composed primarily of compound lifts, mixed with a few isolations for each bodypart with hypertrophy as the specific goal would seem like a good idea. If powerlifting, then a "powerlifting specific" routine such as a westside split would then be a good idea. If strongman, then heavy circuit training (like Tom M's stuff) focusing on both strength and endurance would be the route to go.

    But everyone should all probably start out doing generally the same thing, IMO. Most people on here realize that, which is why this site is a pretty damn good resource of information. So a lot of "bodybuilders" look at the way I train as powerlifting training, when in reality I'm still just working on the foundation.
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  8. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Runty View Post
    It has a lot do to with the fact that most people asking questions about how to get huge arms with there 7-7-7 or whatever routines or bench/curl days 3-4x a week only weigh 140lbs.
    This man speaks the truth.

  9. #8
    The Flyfisher rbtrout's Avatar
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    It's all been said too well, already.
    Give chalk a chance.


    49 years old

    665 squat
    700 deadlift
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  10. #9
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    There is nothing wrong with a couple of sets of curls, or other isolation exercise. There is a problem if they are done at a priority to compound lifts, or have entire days devoted to them.

  11. #10
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    I have had my best results with a split that has absolutely no "isolation" movements. 4 compounds 3 days a week + 1 snatch/cnj day. I can barely handle that. Im sure if I wanted some curls there would be no problem but I have a hard time finding the energy to walk out of the gym as is
    Sarvamangalam!

  12. #11
    Senior Member bass slayer's Avatar
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    ive been kind of confused with this also... im looking for a good physique but i am looking to build strength also. is more reps for a endurance/physique and less than 8 reps more for power lifting? powerlifting vs bodybuilding ?
    age: 21

    height: 6'3

    weight: 175

    short term goal: 200

    Long term goal: Lean 225

  13. #12
    All Natural Power Lunar Effect's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bass slayer View Post
    ive been kind of confused with this also... im looking for a good physique but i am looking to build strength also. is more reps for a endurance/physique and less than 8 reps more for power lifting? powerlifting vs bodybuilding ?
    Read this:

    http://www.gain-weight-muscle-fast.com/rep-ranges.html

  14. #13
    TJW jed's Avatar
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    zen what program was/is that?

    OP - its all been said already.
    22 - 5'11'' - 190 lb
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  15. #14
    Moderator joey54's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jed View Post
    zen what program was/is that?

    OP - its all been said already.
    Just click on Whomp There it is.


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  16. #15
    SchModerator ZenMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joey54 View Post
    Just click on Whomp There it is.
    What he said^^
    Sarvamangalam!

  17. #16
    Senior Member bass slayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lunar Effect View Post
    thanks Lunar, thats exactly what im looking for...
    age: 21

    height: 6'3

    weight: 175

    short term goal: 200

    Long term goal: Lean 225

  18. #17
    Senior Member 12u$$eLL-'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Irish Pilot View Post
    English please
    Learn the principle, abide by the principle, and dissolve the principle. In short, enter a mold without being caged in it. Obey the principle without being bound by it. LEARN, MASTER AND ACHIEVE!!! - Bruce Lee

    http://www.wannabebigforums.com/showthread.php?t=118182

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  19. #18
    Getting There... Irish Pilot's Avatar
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    Disregard. I edited something out instead of just deleting it. As you were.
    - Slave & Master At The Same Damn Time -
    Hoping To Compete Natty Early 2011

  20. #19
    All Natural Power Lunar Effect's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bass slayer View Post
    thanks Lunar, thats exactly what im looking for...
    No problem. It should definitely help you clear up any confusion between powerlifting and bodybuilding (strength vs hypertrophy).

    There is a happy medium known as "powerbuilding" where lifters will train for strength (1-5 reps) with the squats, bench, and deads, but then focus on hypertrophy (6-12 reps) for all other exercises.

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