Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 26 to 43 of 43

Thread: The Ten Keys to Old School Success for New School Beginners

  1. #26
    Who is John Galt? CrazyK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    0
    Damn it. Why do you have to be a nice guy about it and make me feel bad for being a dick?
    "You shall invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and kind enlightenment, and debate with them in the best possible manner. Your Lord knows best who has strayed from His path, and He knows best who are the guided ones."- Quran 16:25

    "A life unexamined is not worth living"- Socrates

  2. #27
    Nuttin to it but to do it Chalky Palms's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    516
    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyK View Post
    Same amino acid profile as whey...
    LOL are you serious?
    "Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser."

    Best Raw Lifts- B 315 S 405 D 555
    Workout Journal

  3. #28
    Who is John Galt? CrazyK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Chalky Palms View Post
    LOL are you serious?
    Yes. A protein is either complete or it's not complete. Whey has a full amino acid profile and so does beef protein. There are no more amino acids in beef protein then whey.
    "You shall invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and kind enlightenment, and debate with them in the best possible manner. Your Lord knows best who has strayed from His path, and He knows best who are the guided ones."- Quran 16:25

    "A life unexamined is not worth living"- Socrates

  4. #29
    Nuttin to it but to do it Chalky Palms's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    516
    They have different amounts, different amounts of each amino = different profile, the fact that they are all there doesn't mean they have the same profile.
    "Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser."

    Best Raw Lifts- B 315 S 405 D 555
    Workout Journal

  5. #30
    Who is John Galt? CrazyK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Chalky Palms View Post
    They have different amounts, different amounts of each amino = different profile, the fact that they are all there doesn't mean they have the same profile.
    Uh, no. In fact beef was actually found to be of less quality due to its tougher digestion.
    http://www.fao.org/docrep/U5900t/u5900t07.htm
    A PDCAAS value of 1 is the highest, and 0 the lowest as the table demonstrates the ratings of commons foods below.

    whey (1.0)
    egg white (1.0)
    casein (1.0)
    milk (1.0)
    soy protein isolate (1.00)
    beef (0.92)
    soybean (0.91)
    kidney beans (0.68)
    rye (0.68)
    whole wheat (0.54)
    lentils (0.52)
    peanuts (0.52)
    seitan (0.25)
    "You shall invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and kind enlightenment, and debate with them in the best possible manner. Your Lord knows best who has strayed from His path, and He knows best who are the guided ones."- Quran 16:25

    "A life unexamined is not worth living"- Socrates

  6. #31
    Nuttin to it but to do it Chalky Palms's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    516
    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyK View Post
    Uh, no. In fact beef was actually found to be of less quality due to its tougher digestion.
    http://www.fao.org/docrep/U5900t/u5900t07.htm
    A PDCAAS value of 1 is the highest, and 0 the lowest as the table demonstrates the ratings of commons foods below.

    whey (1.0)
    egg white (1.0)
    casein (1.0)
    milk (1.0)
    soy protein isolate (1.00)
    beef (0.92)
    soybean (0.91)
    kidney beans (0.68)
    rye (0.68)
    whole wheat (0.54)
    lentils (0.52)
    peanuts (0.52)
    seitan (0.25)
    Show me where I said beef was higher quality smart guy, I said they have different profiles, now why don't you learn how to read. Your post above proves the fact that they have different amino profiles. HAHA I love when the person I am arguing with wins the argument for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyK View Post
    Glad to see another wannabe e-guru go down
    Me too.
    "Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser."

    Best Raw Lifts- B 315 S 405 D 555
    Workout Journal

  7. #32
    Who is John Galt? CrazyK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Chalky Palms View Post
    Show me where I said beef was higher quality smart guy, I said they have different profiles, now why don't you learn how to read. Your post above proves the fact that they have different amino profiles. HAHA I love when the person I am arguing with wins the argument for me.
    That was a quality index...if you read the article it said that all complete proteins have the same AA profile. Beef was lower quality not because of its AA profile but because of its tough digestion.
    "You shall invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and kind enlightenment, and debate with them in the best possible manner. Your Lord knows best who has strayed from His path, and He knows best who are the guided ones."- Quran 16:25

    "A life unexamined is not worth living"- Socrates

  8. #33
    Nuttin to it but to do it Chalky Palms's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    516
    Dude just stop arguing, I don't need to read your articles to know that you are wrong. Not even all kinds of beef have the same amino profile, beef from Texas longhorns has a different profile than Pennsylvania cattle. They might all have the IAA's but they aren't the same amount and that makes them different profiles. I don't care what your article says, a profile deals with amounts not just types of aminos. They all serve different purposes and they should all be consumed, not just whey. Instead of flaming a guy who made a well thought a post to help the forum why don't you just thank him and not make yourself look dumb in the process.
    "Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser."

    Best Raw Lifts- B 315 S 405 D 555
    Workout Journal

  9. #34
    Bodybuilding Mythbuster
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Location
    Yeongsan. South Korea
    Posts
    5,907
    Quote Originally Posted by Bango Skank View Post
    The Ten Keys to Old School Success for New School Beginners
    by Bango Skank

    1. Eat Like a King
    And one more thing; if it's not something that your grandparents would recognize as food, it ain't food! This immediately nullifies many things you'd get out of a bag, box or can.

    [b6. Supplement, Don't Substitute

    3) Whey Protein. This will ensure you're getting the requisite amount of protein that your body needs to grow, but it is not a substitute for food. Drink 1 shake post workout and that's probably as much as you'll need. If you're drinking more than 2 per day, you're literally pissing money away.
    If you want to spend your money on extra sups, well that's up to you. I think it's a waste, but as long as you're getting plenty to eat and you're already taking these 3, then feel free to be a lab rat.

    7. Overtraining = Underrecovering
    . There is no amount of training that will put you into an overtrained state, there is only a deficit of recovery that will. ]
    Just a few things.

    I doubt one's grandparents would recognize whey protein shakes as food. They more then likely got their whey in different forms. But just being nit-pickey here.


    And part seven is not entirely correct. Overtraining puts you in a overtrained state. Recovery enables you to recover from that 'tis true. But you can definitely overtrain. If you are training so hard that you require 5-6 days of recovery then you will be sliding backwards. Because even if you are FULLY recovered when you go to the gym, you will (a) be putting yourself right back in a severe catabolic state which by the time you have recovered from it has inhibited your progress. (b) Only training once a week or less.

    Were that not true a natural and genetically average person could profit off Arnold's 20+ sets per bodyparts 2x a day routine, by simply waiting long enough to recover each time.


    Overall a decent post though. And a welcome break from posts like "how do I get my upper chest bigger"
    Last edited by Songsangnim; 12-15-2008 at 10:28 PM.

  10. #35
    Who is John Galt? CrazyK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Chalky Palms View Post
    Dude just stop arguing, I don't need to read your articles to know that you are wrong. Not even all kinds of beef have the same amino profile, beef from Texas longhorns has a different profile than Pennsylvania cattle. They might all have the IAA's but they aren't the same amount and that makes them different profiles. I don't care what your article says, a profile deals with amounts not just types of aminos. They all serve different purposes and they should all be consumed, not just whey. Instead of flaming a guy who made a well thought a post to help the forum why don't you just thank him and not make yourself look dumb in the process.
    Science > Broscience. You lose
    "You shall invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and kind enlightenment, and debate with them in the best possible manner. Your Lord knows best who has strayed from His path, and He knows best who are the guided ones."- Quran 16:25

    "A life unexamined is not worth living"- Socrates

  11. #36
    The Dude Abides Bango Skank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    127
    I was gonna stay out of it, I really was... but...

    Here is the protein/amino acid profile from 3 grams of milk protein:



    Here is the protein/amino acid profile from 3 grams on egg protein:



    (courtesy of nutritiondata.com)

    Feel free to draw your own conclusions.
    Last edited by Bango Skank; 12-15-2008 at 10:29 PM.
    Starting Strength Wiki

    Best Lifts
    Squat: 350x5
    Mil. Press: 165x5
    Deadlift: 455x1

    BW: 177

  12. #37
    The Dude Abides Bango Skank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    127
    Quote Originally Posted by Songsangnim View Post
    Overall a decent post though. And a welcome break from posts like "how do I get my upper chest bigger"
    Thank you.
    Starting Strength Wiki

    Best Lifts
    Squat: 350x5
    Mil. Press: 165x5
    Deadlift: 455x1

    BW: 177

  13. #38
    Who is John Galt? CrazyK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Bango Skank View Post
    I was gonna stay out of it, I really was... but...

    Here is the protein/amino acid profile from 3 grams of milk protein:



    Here is the protein/amino acid profile from 3 grams on egg protein:



    (courtesy of nutritiondata.com)

    Feel free to draw your own conclusions.
    Good post. Yeah the amounts are different, but the profile is the same. (Meaning which AA's are represented) Overall though you were right with your last post, focus on the big stuff. Get your food in.
    "You shall invite to the path of your Lord with wisdom and kind enlightenment, and debate with them in the best possible manner. Your Lord knows best who has strayed from His path, and He knows best who are the guided ones."- Quran 16:25

    "A life unexamined is not worth living"- Socrates

  14. #39
    Nuttin to it but to do it Chalky Palms's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    516
    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyK View Post
    Yeah the amounts are different, but the profile is the same. (Meaning which AA's are represented)
    LOL, that is not what a profile is, but you can keep thinking that. You back up what you say with silly articles and stupid little remarks like science > broscience. Learn what you are talking about, you are very ignorant. Think of it like a recipe, two things can have the same ingredients but with varied amounts of each they would not end up the same. That is what a profile is, you lose.
    "Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser."

    Best Raw Lifts- B 315 S 405 D 555
    Workout Journal

  15. #40
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    963
    I don't know about the rest of you, but this isn't bb.com and I'd rather not have silly "broscience" retorts become commonplace here.

  16. #41
    Senior Member Jorge Sanchez's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    6,607
    I think it was a good and useful article overall. Nothing groundbreaking, but I don't think it was intended to be.

    The only issue I have is that you're recommending not to eat too much protein because it will be stored as fat. Well duh, any source of calories will be stored as fat if you eat more than your body needs, but that is just a necessary evil of gaining muscle. In no way does that mean you shouldn't eat a lot of protein. Especially, since I'd rather err on the side of eating too much, rather than too little protein.

  17. #42
    The Dude Abides Bango Skank's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    127
    Quote Originally Posted by Jorge Sanchez View Post
    I think it was a good and useful article overall. Nothing groundbreaking, but I don't think it was intended to be.

    The only issue I have is that you're recommending not to eat too much protein because it will be stored as fat. Well duh, any source of calories will be stored as fat if you eat more than your body needs, but that is just a necessary evil of gaining muscle. In no way does that mean you shouldn't eat a lot of protein. Especially, since I'd rather err on the side of eating too much, rather than too little protein.
    I agree with every aspect of what you said. I absolutely advocate a high protein diet, I too would rather get a little too much protein than than a lot too little. Perhaps you've overestimated my stance on this. It is common sense knowledge to you and I that too many calories (fat, carbs, or protein) will be added as fat, but my concern is the 15 year old kid who thinks drinking nothing but gainer or whey shakes is somehow gonna make him into a frothing beast overnight. My concern is that they are neglecting a more balanced diet and a diverse protein intake because they have been sold on the notion that GNC is a grocery store and not a Nutritional Supplement Store. The feedback I've gotten in this thread only underscores that suspicion.

    Anyhow, I think for the most part we are on the same page as to how beginners should train. Indeed as you said nothing in my article was groundbreaking; it's just good common sense approaches that any beginner would do well to abide by. There's a lot of gimmicks and a lot of misinformation out there and I think it's crucial that beginners learn to keep it simple, prioritize what's most important in their training, and never take their eyes away from meeting their goals.

    Thanks for reading.
    Starting Strength Wiki

    Best Lifts
    Squat: 350x5
    Mil. Press: 165x5
    Deadlift: 455x1

    BW: 177

  18. #43
    Determined View 1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Space...
    Posts
    1,962
    Good article, people could learn alot from reg park.
    Success is achieved by doing a little more than you thought you could, and a lot more than anyone else.

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 09-19-2005, 08:24 AM
  2. Hoop Dreams
    By dualman7 in forum General Chat
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 05-31-2005, 11:05 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •